Hey guys been reading on here for like 4 hours now and I found weldingtipsandtricks.com and Im trying to digest a lot of information. But, Im ready to buy a welder with my first project being my $500 car hauler I just purchased. So Ive decided that a MIG/Flux core is best for me getting started. Im looking at a Lincoln Pro MIG 180 or a Hobart Handler 125. Im excited and want to buy one ASAP but I want to buy the right one. Im going to be doing automotive welding with things like brackets and such and body panels. I want to also graduate up to frame work as well. Will the two options listed above carry me over or should I fork out a bit more $$$. Any Suggestions?
Beginning Welder
- Thread starter rrainey86
- Start date
Go with the bigger one. You can always turn the dial down and it will work better with flux core. I have a little HTP 120 and it only has a 4 position selector. It welds fine up to 3/16" single pass. I like it because its 120V, but even with 4 position selector it goes not go lower than the #1 position and that sometimes makes it hard to weld really thin stuff. A larger welder usually can be set to a lower range as well as a higher and more adjustable range of settings. Believe it or not, just like an Auto Dealer, a good Welding Supply store can be negotiated with on their prices or maybe you can get freebies thrown into the deal... Now, I'm talking about a real Welder Supplier... Not a Big Box store. I'm telling you this because they do give discounts if your good at negotiating. Good Luck!
neonnblack
Well-known member
Hobart 210 mvp or miller 211 mvp. Always a solid choice with either. Im about to buy the Hobart, cant wait.
Do yourself a favor and buy the best you can possibly afford.
Don't worry about Flux Core Get the Gas Stuff and use solid wire.
I also recommend the 210 MVP Hobart or the 211 MVP Miller.
In fact I own the Miller 211 MVP, You CANNOT go wrong with it.
It is probably MORE machine than you need which is GOOD in the case of welders. Had I had more space when I got the 211 I would have gone to a 252. But the 211 is a LOT of machine in a small package. I like the 211 over the 210 for one reason, Full control of voltage not Taps.
The "Autoset" function is OK but you have full control of the settings.
Unfortunately the "Value" on the dials is not true it is a Value and that is it.
You will have to do math to find out what the wire speed and voltage really are.
It is a VERY capable machine.
Also do yourself a favor and get a good helmet and Gloves.
Right now there is a rebate from Miller so take a look at Cyberweld for the cost with discount you can buy some accessory items and get more of a rebate too.
Miller 140 180MVP and 211MVP... are good machines.
More Machine is far easier you will get frustrated trying with too small of a machine.
Don't worry about Flux Core Get the Gas Stuff and use solid wire.
I also recommend the 210 MVP Hobart or the 211 MVP Miller.
In fact I own the Miller 211 MVP, You CANNOT go wrong with it.
It is probably MORE machine than you need which is GOOD in the case of welders. Had I had more space when I got the 211 I would have gone to a 252. But the 211 is a LOT of machine in a small package. I like the 211 over the 210 for one reason, Full control of voltage not Taps.
The "Autoset" function is OK but you have full control of the settings.
Unfortunately the "Value" on the dials is not true it is a Value and that is it.
You will have to do math to find out what the wire speed and voltage really are.
It is a VERY capable machine.
Also do yourself a favor and get a good helmet and Gloves.
Right now there is a rebate from Miller so take a look at Cyberweld for the cost with discount you can buy some accessory items and get more of a rebate too.
Miller 140 180MVP and 211MVP... are good machines.
More Machine is far easier you will get frustrated trying with too small of a machine.
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superspec
Well-known member
My local store was within a hundred dollars of internet prices in my miller tig machine, they wouldn't come down on that price but they threw in enough free stuff to almost make me feel bad. Now I have a great relationship with local people who are also an authorized miller repair center. They go out of their way to make me happy.
I can call them for a bottle refill and a truck is in my driveway an hour later.
In other words give the mom and pops an honest shot at your business.
I can call them for a bottle refill and a truck is in my driveway an hour later.
In other words give the mom and pops an honest shot at your business.
rrainey86;
think about what else you might want to weld.....
as for what to spend.....buy the biggest 220V welder you can get
AutoSet? no thanks, learn to weld
also the larger ones will take big spools and have spot and stitch timers
this place seems to be a Miller fan club
i only know 2 people with Millers and i've been welding for 58 years
think about what else you might want to weld.....
as for what to spend.....buy the biggest 220V welder you can get
AutoSet? no thanks, learn to weld
also the larger ones will take big spools and have spot and stitch timers
this place seems to be a Miller fan club
i only know 2 people with Millers and i've been welding for 58 years
sberry
Banned
Of the 2 the Pro Mig is way better.
ZRX61
Well-known member
There's some good deals on Hobart 187s now they have come out with the 190 replacement.
Thanks for the replies guys. I Stopped by my local airgas and got some good info there as well. He recommended the 211 as well. I dont think I want to drop that $$$ out of the gate So after doing some research, it seems like smaller 115v machines are good on thinner metal but not the thicker metals. So could I opt for the pro mig now and then maybe learn to stick weld for the thicker stuff.
What is your max budget right now? There is always the used market, but welders tend to hold their value pretty well compared to other tools. A welder is one of those tools that it is really best to purchase the most you can up front. It will serve you better in the long run.
I'd look at hobart. They make a no frills, very solid welder at a bit less $ than a miller equivalent.
I'd look at hobart. They make a no frills, very solid welder at a bit less $ than a miller equivalent.
What material thicknesses do you intend to weld on?
You're going to need something with some grunt to make a 1) sound weld and 2) safe weld if you're dealing with structural components. 115v machines, while good for sheet metal fab, are notorious for welding cold on thicker stuff - you do not get enough penetration unless you use various tricks with joint design, wire/gas choice, and lots and lots of preheat on thicker materials. Not always an option with automotive stuff.
If it was up to me, I'd use a more powerful machine to begin with to save myself the trouble of all those additional steps. All of those things are more variables to control and will have an effect on weld consistency. Save up and buy either a hobart 210 or a millermatic 211. Welds all the way from 24ga sheet to 3/8" plate. Unless you start welding 1/2" steel all the time you will likely never have to upgrade.
You're going to need something with some grunt to make a 1) sound weld and 2) safe weld if you're dealing with structural components. 115v machines, while good for sheet metal fab, are notorious for welding cold on thicker stuff - you do not get enough penetration unless you use various tricks with joint design, wire/gas choice, and lots and lots of preheat on thicker materials. Not always an option with automotive stuff.
If it was up to me, I'd use a more powerful machine to begin with to save myself the trouble of all those additional steps. All of those things are more variables to control and will have an effect on weld consistency. Save up and buy either a hobart 210 or a millermatic 211. Welds all the way from 24ga sheet to 3/8" plate. Unless you start welding 1/2" steel all the time you will likely never have to upgrade.
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I would say don't buy the best you can afford, delay your plans a few months save up more money then buy the best you can afford.
I wanted to stick with a 110v machine and now I am already planning on upgrading my less than a year old Millermatic 140. It welds great (I could use more penetration) but the duty cycle is my main complaint.
The problem with a welder is once you learn how to use it you realize how useful a welder actually is and you start wanting to take on bigger projects at a rapid pace.
Do yourself a favor and at least get the Hobart 210 MVP. This will let you use 110/220v and can handle most any job a hobbyist would tackle.
I'm looking at the Ironman 230 and Millermatic 212 now. Those machines should fulfill all my mig needs.
Then I can get a Tig...
Richard D
Well-known member
Make sure you get one you can convert to gas later. Once you have welded with gas, you'll never want even your worst enemy to use flux core. Truly nasty looking welds.
Richard D
Well-known member
Read this:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=207985
First sentence,"First of all, I'll say I really like my Hobart Handler 140, but MAN I wish I would have got something with a little more juice!"
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=207985
First sentence,"First of all, I'll say I really like my Hobart Handler 140, but MAN I wish I would have got something with a little more juice!"
When I first learned how to mig weld, I picked up a Miller 210 from a friend for a pretty decent price. I used it for about 2 years and it was all I ever needed and more. I ended up selling it (got all my money back) to get the Miller 211 just for the MVP capabilities. The duty cycle is about half of the 210, but I only use it for hobbies anyway. I would say learning on a good machine really helps rather than trying to fight a cheap one. I will also say that having a good helmet helps just as much. I started with a harbor freight auto darkening and switched to a Miller Digital Performance helmet.
One of the best machines miller ever made. Right up there with the syncrowave 250 and the millermatic 200. I'm kinda surprised they got rid of it.
koditten
Well-known member
I would have no problem taking a loan out to get the machine I wanted. They will last you and your kids lifetimes.
I wish I knew now that I would still be using the same Miller 250 that I bought in 1995 (I think). Ten years ago I bought another new Miller 250 (?) unit. I was worried that I was going to wear out the first machine and had better have a back up. I haven't seen it for 5 years, its still in storage among the rest of the **** I don't use.
I get numerous offers to buy that extra rig, I just can't bring myself to do it.
I can't even remember what model it is,all i know is it was comparable to the 250 unit I am presently using.
Writing this, I'm pathetic. Sorry about the long post.
KO
I wish I knew now that I would still be using the same Miller 250 that I bought in 1995 (I think). Ten years ago I bought another new Miller 250 (?) unit. I was worried that I was going to wear out the first machine and had better have a back up. I haven't seen it for 5 years, its still in storage among the rest of the **** I don't use.
I get numerous offers to buy that extra rig, I just can't bring myself to do it.
I can't even remember what model it is,all i know is it was comparable to the 250 unit I am presently using.
Writing this, I'm pathetic. Sorry about the long post.
KO
koditten
Well-known member
Reading this post and doing some searches. I don't know If I like the newer compact mig units so much. I like the self contained units that are just too much trouble to move around. The less opertunity for the tools to "grow legs" the better.
I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I have too many family members that want to barrow ****. The welders are too costly to loan out. I'm for the heavier the better machines.
Of couse the mobile welding crew bunch, this does not apply.
KO
I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I have too many family members that want to barrow ****. The welders are too costly to loan out. I'm for the heavier the better machines.
Of couse the mobile welding crew bunch, this does not apply.
KO
crewchief888
Well-known member
your choice of welders will depend on how much power you have available.
110v 30a or 220v 40-50a
i've welded everything i've needed to weld with a lincoln promig 140 running .035 flux core.
110v 30a or 220v 40-50a
i've welded everything i've needed to weld with a lincoln promig 140 running .035 flux core.
KO;
fortunately, with all the cousins......I started with 26, none of them make anything or they have their own tools
my brother in law doesn't ask any more
never got my stainless framing squares back....i gave him a ShopSmith and rebuilt his VW Van motor 4 times (600,000mi on it) for freenow if my neighbor (a member here) would stop thinking i want/need to loan tools out
yesterday, 5 calls;
"I need to borrow your big chains, pry bars and a come along for a job Monday"
"Oh, and are you going to weld the tailgate on my truck too? or do I have to get someone else to do it, before Monday? (whine)"
you know after dealing with the city councilman's town meeting today.....i went for a motorcycle ride and am now having a glass of wine....
tomorrow, its trap shooting, another ride and go have a beer with the gals and guys at my local watering hole
don't think i'll have time to any welding on my dime
HaHaHa. Ive noticed not much talk about stick welding on here. Ive seen a few of these second hand pretty cheap. My first project is my trailor Im pulling around and I dont see anything thin like body panels in the near future. But, I do see a few 115V Millermatics and Hobarts around for any thin stuff I might need. So what about stick for thick stuff and 115V for thinner stuff later on....
spooler41
Well-known member
One thing to remember is if you go for the better machine, it's going to be worth more if for any reason you want /need to sell it or trade it off.
Duty cycle is another big thing, nothing worse than having to wait or stop to complete a project.
...................Jack
Duty cycle is another big thing, nothing worse than having to wait or stop to complete a project.
...................Jack
sberry
Banned
You are a poster child for the 180 pro mig you had your eye on in the first place. Don't listen to any ******** about it not being as good as this or that, its just fine and only a pinch from top of the line output of the new 210's (211) The arc is as good all the way to the tip top.
sberry
Banned
Kirk makes a point about bigger machines but they really apply when time and materials add up to real money. I make a lot of welds, put a spool in a year ago on my small machine. But a 250 with 035 has twice the poop as a 210. Its twice as fast which means half the gas and the wire is half the cost.
We did a design and build a while back, built most of the proto with a small machine and when it came time to weld up said whoa and especially since we had 2 men and weld some of it out as we went it reduced the wait time for both men. Cut the welding from 2 hrs a day to a minor chore of 45 minutes or so and 20$ savings in materials, seems small but even over a month was worth turning on a bigger machine.
We did a design and build a while back, built most of the proto with a small machine and when it came time to weld up said whoa and especially since we had 2 men and weld some of it out as we went it reduced the wait time for both men. Cut the welding from 2 hrs a day to a minor chore of 45 minutes or so and 20$ savings in materials, seems small but even over a month was worth turning on a bigger machine.
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sberry
Banned
They have their place and can be usable, the mig is really better suited to the light work of the hobby crowd.
If I could humanly help it unless someone gave me the machine I would be looking to score a little AC/DC unit for stick, they are super good.
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sberry
Banned
sberry
Banned
The bed in the first pic was meant to show the power the small 240V can make. Double the watts of a 140. This one is the HH210, the original model. This is on 1/4, could turn it up hot enough to get the ripples to go away.
You could help all these finishes with some practice and cleaning the plate first.
You could help all these finishes with some practice and cleaning the plate first.
Attachments
your choice of welders will depend on how much power you have available.
110v 30a or 220v 40-50a
220V, 100Amps ......the World is my oyster
it helps to have a neighbor electrician
sberry
Banned
That is a great machine for equipment repair, every complete shop should have one but the mig is still the modern workhorse in a small garage, so much easier and cleaner on todays light material.