Bending flat bar

[bluedog225]

I’m noodling around with the idea of bending some 4“ x 1/2“ galvanized flat bar to make a custom bracket for a deck.

Several questions. What kind of equipment am I looking at to make this happen? Alternatively, what type of shop do I look for to bend this for me?

And if 1/2” is too ambitous, what‘s a reasonable thickness to bend in a diy setting?

And will 45 degree bend screw up the hot dipped coating? Or is it better to have it made, then have it galvanized?

Thanks

 

[Firebrick43]

A 20 ton HF press and a swag off-road finger rake kit?

It will do it easily.


How many are you doing?

You could use a torch to heat dull red and bend in a vise if your doing a few but galvanize won’t survive that.

Hot dip may not survive a press either in that thickness as there is quite a bit of drawing of the metal on the back side.

Probably better to do the galvanizing afterwards if you can

 

[cannuck]

To bend 1/2" that is 4" wide you need an extremely strong (lower) die and very accurately aligned (upper) punch if you want to do in a shop press. In my 20 ton I stop at 1/4" and 4" would squeek in under limit - but just a bit. You could easily do this in a decent size (50 or 100T) but if you were going to, you would already have the punch, die, press and experience and wouldn't be asking here. This is a 5 minute job in a press brake - and the correct tooling will already likely be in place.

Worth noting: the force to bend depends upon the bend (punch = inner) radius and the die width (usually 8x mtl thickness for an "air" bend. Just did some lookup: 11 tons required in a 4" die (size recommended for 1/2") but 16 tons for 3" (and even THAT would be a large die from Chineseum tools for little brakes).

Are you making one or many? If you are a GJ tool freak it would be a good excuse to set up a 50Ton press to do breaking, as once you are set up you WILL use it a fair bit. If a one off or even 10 or so pieces a very simple and cheap thing to do on a brake. If this is a bracket, we must assume holes need to be drilled. If you want to do this with best protection for outdoor exposure, layout, drill and cut from flat bar and take it to a break operator for the bends - THEN hot dip galvanize so the cuts, holes and bends are all evenly and fully coated.

 

[mike93lx]

Simpson has brackets for deam near anything. Have you looked at their catalog?

 

[manwithtools]

What connection are you making on a deck that requires 1/2" thick material?

 

[bluedog225]

Only need 2-3.

1/2” is overkill. And it will have the look I’m going for.

It’s a roof deck where I probably shouldn’t put one. Have not yet discussed other variables with the engineer.

Thanks all. I’ll post later once the plans firm up a bit.

 

[RPH]

2 or 3, set up all three and bend all at once using heat. I use angle iron as a die to bend against. Look out for spring back as the the metals. Usually, they over bend a bit to offset spring back.

 

[Jim greengo]

Find a welding shop to bend it for ya,1/2" is pretty thick for a bracket.

 

[cvairwerks]

To bend 1/2" that is 4" wide you need an extremely strong (lower) die and very accurately aligned (upper) punch if you want to do in a shop press. In my 20 ton I stop at 1/4" and 4" would squeek in under limit - but just a bit. You could easily do this in a decent size (50 or 100T) but if you were going to, you would already have the punch, die, press and experience and wouldn't be asking here. This is a 5 minute job in a press brake - and the correct tooling will already likely be in place.

1/2" x4" is going to take somewhere in the 85 ton range to bend with a radius less than 2".

 

[cannuck]

1/2" x4" is going to take somewhere in the 85 ton range to bend with a radius less than 2".

Here is my go to ref chart: https://www.americanmachinetools.com/pressure_table.htm

Note: these are numbers PER FOOT of width and "radius" is not 2" but distance between edge of dies' V groove. for 1/2" at recommended 8x is a 4" die but I would not hesitate to go 3" for a 45 bend in HR A36..

 

[Firebrick43]

1/2" x4" is going to take somewhere in the 85 ton range to bend with a radius less than 2".

The heavy duty swag off road will do 6" of 1/2" steel.

SWAG 20 TON Press Brake Heavy Duty DIY Builder Kit

Heavy Duty 20 TON Press Brake DIY Builder Kit Press Brake kit comes unassembled, you do the final assembly and welding.Designed to fit the Harbor Freight 20 ton hydraulic press Item # 32879, 60603 & 70603. Shop Press is not included. Press brake kit includes an adjustable back stop for accurate...

www.swagoffroad.com

SWAG 20 TON Finger Brake Heavy Duty DIY Builder Kit

Heavy Duty 20 TON Finger Brake Press DIY Builder Kit Press Brake kit comes un-assembled, you do the final assembly and welding. Designed to fit the Harbor Freight 20 ton hydraulic press Item # 32879, 60603 & 70603. Press brake kit includes an adjustable back stop for accurate and repeatable...

www.swagoffroad.com

 

[cannuck]

The heavy duty swag off road will do 6" of 1/2" steel.

Those look to be about 3" dies. I would expect it will be capable of 4" of 1/2" at 45 degrees but you had better have your flat bar jigged square and dead center under the single (and not very stiff) point of force from the press. My punches for the 20T are screwed into the top moving beam to try to stay reasonable straight. Doing this kind of work in a shop press with such mickey mouse tooling might seem careless - but it has worked for me including in production jobs for many decades. The secret is in knowing when you are in over your head and move to better tooling.

Wait a minute: did I just admit that anything less than perfect might be "good enough"??? Please mods, don't ban me from GJ!

 

[The Cobbler]

bend all at once using heat.

except he wants to use galvanized . the heat will burn that off

 

[RMERR]

The steel supplier I usually use in Sacramento CA also does bending, rolling, shearing for pretty reasonable rates. They have huge machines with massive upper limits. I bought four pieces for a new project, 3/8" by 5" plate bent to my specs. The steel and the bending was less than $70 bucks for all four.

 

[Imatk]

I'd just cut and weld what you need. If you can't weld I'd highly recommend learning it's fun

If welding is out of the question you could always drill and bolt them together, just have to make sure the bolt heads don't interfere with your deck wood.

 

[cannuck]

I'd just cut and weld what you need. If you can't weld I'd highly recommend learning it's fun

by the time you could make welding jig up to do this I could make all 4 pieces in a brake and to much closer tolerance in bend angle (you WILL distort the **** weld angles as you complete back side.

 

[MongoTA]

Alternative,

If you have a welder, I'd use an angle grinder to score a bend line, then heat and bend it. Then weld up the cut line. Clean it up and use a can of cold galvanized "spray paint", Rustoleum makes one.

You don't want to breath fumes from heated zinc, so clean up those areas to clean metal before using heat.

If you don't have a welder, well here's your excuse!

 

[mike93lx]

No better way to spend 2 grand on a project that could be done for 100!

 

[wssix99]

And will 45 degree bend screw up the hot dipped coating? Or is it better to have it made, then have it galvanized?

Yes, it will screw up the galvanizing. You would need to galvanize it afterwards, which is really expen$ive. It might be easier to use stainless steel.

Even then, I don't think this bracket will work out well for you as designed. There is a reason you won't find this on a shelf with the two 45's. It will not perform well in bending or shear. You would need gussets welded on the inside for the thing to have any strength. It will deform under less pressure than a 90 degree angle would.

Presumably, you have an obstruction you are trying to work around. Instead of making this custom bracket, I would fir out the mounting surface (from the wall) so you can use a stock 90 degree bracket. This should be a lot stronger and less expensive.

 

[Metal-Marc]

No better way to spend 2 grand on a project that could be done for 100!

This.

1. Build a bigger shop.
2. Buy an industrial size metal brake.
3. Buy all the attachement and flat bars you need.
4. Bend at will.
5. ???
6. Profit.

 

[RPH]

except he wants to use galvanized . the heat will burn that off

Cold galvanize paint is available. A cheaper alternative. Nothing more.

 

[bluedog225]

Presumably, you have an obstruction you are trying to work around. Instead of making this custom bracket, I would fir out the mounting surface (from the wall) so you can use a stock 90 degree bracket. This should be a lot stronger and less expensive.

blinding flash of the obvious

This is the answer. I’m just avoiding the drip edge lip on top of the fascia. Thanks!

And having thought it through a little more, I can rest the deck on pedestals directly over a load bearing wall and big joist, so this bracket will only have to resist uplift.

 

[wssix99]

$0.39 firing strip solves $3000 custom galvanizing problem!

Can you share more about your project? We might have some other ideas for you. I have flat roofs and roof top decks.

If you are going to rest any loads on the roof itself, your biggest challenge is going to be the roofing material and the pedestal design. We've had a lot of damaged roofs (from decks) here in the City and I've found some tricks that I think help with preventing leaks.

so this bracket will only have to resist uplift.

You might also consider having a free bracket over the top so the deck "floats" underneath that uplift bracket. (vs. them being firmly attached) Giving your deck freedom to move (expanding and contracting in the cool/heat) should be gentler on everything.

 

[tincanoe]

Consider galvanized dock hardware, various options with pre drilled L brackets used for floating dock corners. Check out 'americanmuscledocks.com' , lots of other sources available including Amazon.

 

[walta]

1/2" x4" is going to take somewhere in the 85 ton range to bend with a radius less than 2".

At room temp yes at 850°f about 85 pounds

Walta

 

[metalmagpie]

Make it then galvanize it.

There are two ways to bend flat bar: the easy way and the hard way. If you're talking about bending it the hard way, I would suggest you make angled cuts and weld it up 100% and then grind the welds until they are just barely proud of the surface and then sand them smooth. Bending it the easy way is quite doable if you have access to a Hossfeld bender.

 

[ez-duzit]

1/2" x4" is going to take somewhere in the 85 ton range to bend with a radius less than 2".

Don't think so.

My ancient 50-ton Carolina hydraulic press can bend 1/2" thick stainless to a small radius without fracture. (40' sailboat auto-pilot tiller arm)