Bending hard copper pipe?

[jwith68]

NEVER EVER use type "M" copper for compressed air use! The best is black pipe. Don't use galvanized as pieces could flake off and get lodged into orifices or shoot out of an air nozzle. If you must use copper, use type "K" (refrigeration). If you don't want to spend the money on "K" use "L". "M" is used for drains and is not intended for pressure use. Always isolate vibration with a flexible connector between the compressor and the piping. Use dirt legs and pitch the main run to a drain.

You can disagree all you want. I'm a journeyman Steamfitter with 20 years experience. I've seen first hand the damage using the wrong materials brings. I've had to fix a lot of "but the book said..." disasters. Do what you want, I just gave my professional opinion.

I wasn't going to say anything, but on the subject of wrong materials. In your first post you recommend the wrong material yourself: type "K" is not for refrigeration, ACR copper is for refrigeration. Reference the Copper Handbook, table 3e. Dimensionally it is similar, but it is manufactured cleaner inside, and is nitrogen pressurized and capped for shipment, not shipped open. And I myself have been a HVAC-R engineer for over 20 years, and I have seen first hand the effect of using contaminated copper pipe in a system.

 

[mygarageone]

Yes he can anneal it but the cost of the torch gas , will off set any savings he might see.

 

[djjsr]

Just a note - I've never seen annealed type M copper. I'm not sure, but I don't think it exists. Also, annealing will lower the pressure rating significantly. If I was going to use drawn copper and anneal it for the bends, I stick with type L.

jmo.

 

[compressornew]

I suggest check and fix the valve connections of your machine.If the copper pipe doesn't connected with fixed valves then it create interruption while working.

 

[Sneeze357]

I suggest check and fix the valve connections of your machine.If the copper pipe doesn't connected with fixed valves then it create interruption while working.

Huh?

 

[mygarageone]

Outside of trying to bend the copper , if you want some great advice about compressors and piping go to this site.
www.autobody101.com
If you can't find what you need there , quit looking!

 

[grunthos]

Outside of trying to bend the copper , if you want some great advice about compressors and piping go to this site.
www.autobody101.com
If you can't find what you need there , quit looking!

At first I though this was sales pitch spam since that site is an online store. But then I looked a little more, and there is a pretty good set of forums on there at www.autobody101.com/forums with lots of compressor and spray-painting discussion. Thanks for the tip!

 

[chrispitude]

<turns on the lights> Hello, is anybody in here?

In about a month, I'll be running 3/4" hard copper pipe (type L) for my garage. I decided I'd like to bend nice long-sweep 90s into the tubing instead of sweating fittings because... well, just because it's cool.

I purchased a Ridgid 368 ratcheting bender for $100 on craigslist, but now I see that 3/4" copper pipe is 7/8" OD, but the 368 is for 3/4" OD. There is a Ridgid 378 bender for 7/8" OD, which is of course *not* what I bought.

So now I gotta sell this thing off and I'm back to square one. What's a good bender for 3/4" hard copper pipe?

 

[jloehlein]

As an alternative, you could buy a roll of soft copper and use that for the bends. It's a few more joints to solder, but couplers are dirt cheap. I used a cheap bender I found on eBay (like this one) to make bends in soft copper when I did mine.

 

[readhead]

Ridged 378.

 

[DeltaWye]

I purchased a Ridgid 368 ratcheting bender for $100 on craigslist, but now I see that 3/4" copper pipe is 7/8" OD, but the 368 is for 3/4" OD. There is a Ridgid 378 bender for 7/8" OD, which is of course *not* what I bought.

So now I gotta sell this thing off and I'm back to square one. What's a good bender for 3/4" hard copper pipe?

Post #16 on the first page had this link:

http://imperial-tools.com/products/364-fha-lever-type-tube-benders

I have a 5/8" Imperial bender I bought (used) to run some 1/2" soft copper. Haven't used it yet but it is American made and I think cheaper than the Ridgid models.

It would be nice if this manner of sizing soft copper by the O.D. instead of the I.D. was common knowledge. How are you going to join it? I bought a flare tool and fittings from the Plumbing supply where I got the copper from.

 

[glentre]

My father was an old school master plumber who felt copper water piping installed where you could see it should have bends rather than fittings because bends were better looking and showed the expertise of the plumber. This was in the 1950's. He taught me how to use a hand operated bending machine mounted to a 2x6 board to make all kinds of bent ells, offsets, and multiple in-line bends. Don't hold me to it but I think the radius on the bender was 2 3/4". The material we used was always L tubing in both 1/2 and 3/4 sizes. Try to use the same method to bend M tubing and it will break on the outside radius. Soft K tubing in those days came in a roll which was very difficult to straighten. Being thick walled and continuous in length, it was used for water lines from the street to the house.

Sorry for the long response but this thread certainly brought back memories of my teen age years working with Dad in the plumbing business.

Glen

 

[chrispitude]

Post #16 on the first page had this link:

http://imperial-tools.com/products/364-fha-lever-type-tube-benders

I have a 5/8" Imperial bender I bought (used) to run some 1/2" soft copper. Haven't used it yet but it is American made and I think cheaper than the Ridgid models.

They have a bunch of different benders listed on their site. I will call them tomorrow and ask for their recommendation for a homeowner bending 3/4" type L hard copper pipe.

My father was an old school master plumber who felt copper water piping installed where you could see it should have bends rather than fittings because bends were better looking and showed the expertise of the plumber. This was in the 1950's. He taught me how to use a hand operated bending machine mounted to a 2x6 board to make all kinds of bent ells, offsets, and multiple in-line bends. Don't hold me to it but I think the radius on the bender was 2 3/4". The material we used was always L tubing in both 1/2 and 3/4 sizes.

This is EXACTLY why I want to do it. I believe in craftsmanship. I tend to overdo things when it doesn't matter, because it's good practice for when it does. I'll be looking at this for many years, so it may as well be elegant. Plus, I want to learn something new.

Thank you for sharing this.

 

[1953mercury]

[/QUOTE]

Maybe I'm missing something here, but why not go horizontal with the runs and just have a single drain valve on the end of the bottom run? Mike

 

[Firebrick43]

I use the ridgid 358/368/378 to bend hard copper/larger steel tubing and imperial and swagelock roller benders for smaller steel/ss tubing. You can Not bend M tubing hard (will kink) at all nor should you bend it annealed. All tubing has elongation when bending. M will work (barely) when unmolested but stretch the wall thinner will make its pressure capacity to close with no safety cushion. Therefore only L and K should be used. This is why you won't find M soft copper. I would not try to use a non ratchet bender on copper pipe. A bench bender would work as well but they are expensive. Using a non lever bender in anything hard over 1/2" OD is just to hard unless you are a gorilla. Never use a conduit bender. It doesn't have to proper roller/shoe and even if you can get the bend done without kinking it will collapse the cross section to much.

As someone has sort of slides to, tubing is listed by OD. Example 1/2" tube is 1/2 OD. Pipe is "nominal" ID. 1/2" pipe is .840 OD. So when comparing prices remember this as 1/2" tube has much less capacity than 1/2 pipe. Also annealed rolled tubing looks like **** as it's very difficult to get it strait.

 

[Firebrick43]

They have a bunch of different benders listed on their site. I will call them tomorrow and ask for their recommendation for a homeowner bending 3/4" type L hard copper pipe.

You do NOT want an imperial hand bender for 3/4" hard copper pipe. Their 364-FHA-14 bender is also only recommended for aluminum and soft copper. Now there geared bench benders are the berries but you will find them very expensive and can do hard copper and steel tubing.

I bought all my ridgid ratchet benders on fleabay for under 120$. Get the 378 for 3/4 copper. I do all my water lines with one and it even needs some muscle

 

[Ironhorse74]

Horizontal like this?

 

[kbs2244]

Has anyone ever thought of why they call it "ridged" or "hard" tube?
Maybe because it is?
If you want to bend it, get "soft."
That is what it is made for.

 

[GYPSY400]

I figured it would be, but the concept if the way it's made is more what I was sort of getting at. Thanks for posting though that it is way too thin. I didn't know for sure, so I'd hate for someone to do it and get hurt. That would be like using PVC for an airline

It might have been mine you were referring too.. mine is basically a ladder made with 3/4" verticals and 4 1/2" horizontal with a drain on the lower part of the output tube.

I have yet to drain a drop of water out of it.. most of the water is in the tank with a little from the filter/regulator... never anything at the air tool.

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk

 

[theoldwizard1]

Ridged 378.

Video This looks like the best tool for the job !

 

[59 wagon man]

m copper can be used for water or hydronic heating .dwv copper is for waste lines.
you can buy the finned tubing you are referring to with a steel tube and much larger and thicker fins. haven't bought any in yrs but I think it was available up to 1-1/2"

 

[btdobie]

Agreed , M copper has been used for yrs as a pressure pipe . It will be plenty safe for a air piping.

A plumber once told me: If you plumb your house with type M, then replacing it will be your great grand childrens' problem. If you plumb your house with type L, then replacing it will be your great great grand childrens' problem.

 

[chrispitude]

Video This looks like the best tool for the job !

Just scored a new-in-box 378 on Ebay for $187.50 + $9.95 shipping! Now I gotta clean up this 368 and see what I can sell it for.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

What is it that makes soft copper tubing so soft anyway? Is it a different material or is it just annealed differently?

Soft copper is annealed. Rigid is not. The OP should just get a short roll of 1/2" soft and be done with it. Much easier than trying to anneal and bend a stick of rigid.

Tommy

 

[Showkey]

Or stick copper and $10 worth of fittings.