Bernzomatic Aluminum rod AL-3
- Thread starter Orca
- Start date
Those are NOT welding rods/filler.
They are aluminum soldering rods. Made/marketed by several companies and under several names. Usually a low - melting zinc or zinc alloy.
Step #1 : RTFM, or label/directions in this case.
No flux usually needed. But you do have to clean off the aluminum oxide from the work pieces. Then apply heat to about 750F, give or take, and rubbing the rod on the hot aluminum until the rod starts to melt/flow. Sometimes you can rub a CLEAN stainless steel brush (with your third hand
) on the hot aluminum as the rod melts to brush the solder a across the joint and try to get the solder to flow and stick to the aluminum.
Don't just blast the aluminum work pieces with an intense oxy-fuel welding flame. You will melt the aluminum.
You usually need a broader heating type flame, like from a rosebud tip.
Remember, aluminum melts ~1220F (depending on the alloy). Aluminum oxide melts ~3800F. If you don't remove the oxide layer, you can get molten aluminum inside of an aluminum oxide crust. Kind like a melting Klondike bar with the coating kind of holding it together until it all collapses.
And "plate"? How thick is this 'plate'? And the application or use of this plate and repair attempt?
The aluminum soldering rods can work in some cases. Other times you have to try something else (actual welding, or replacement of the part).
They are aluminum soldering rods. Made/marketed by several companies and under several names. Usually a low - melting zinc or zinc alloy.
Step #1 : RTFM, or label/directions in this case.
No flux usually needed. But you do have to clean off the aluminum oxide from the work pieces. Then apply heat to about 750F, give or take, and rubbing the rod on the hot aluminum until the rod starts to melt/flow. Sometimes you can rub a CLEAN stainless steel brush (with your third hand
) on the hot aluminum as the rod melts to brush the solder a across the joint and try to get the solder to flow and stick to the aluminum. Don't just blast the aluminum work pieces with an intense oxy-fuel welding flame. You will melt the aluminum.
You usually need a broader heating type flame, like from a rosebud tip.
Remember, aluminum melts ~1220F (depending on the alloy). Aluminum oxide melts ~3800F. If you don't remove the oxide layer, you can get molten aluminum inside of an aluminum oxide crust. Kind like a melting Klondike bar with the coating kind of holding it together until it all collapses.
And "plate"? How thick is this 'plate'? And the application or use of this plate and repair attempt?
The aluminum soldering rods can work in some cases. Other times you have to try something else (actual welding, or replacement of the part).
rlitman
Well-known member
+1 to everything said by Moonrise. It's kind of like brazing, and you need to get past the aluminum oxide crust to make it work. Because of this, it is important to clean the aluminum IMMEDIATELY before heating. I'd use an abrasive, then stainless brush dedicated to aluminum, then alcohol wipes.
Keep the rod out of the flame for as long as possible, because a cold rod will scratch through the thin oxide crust, and that helps get you started. If you just melt the rod onto the surface, it will bead up like brazing steel without flux.
Lastly, I like to set the flame with a tiny "feather" so it's just barely reducing. You positively do not want an oxidizing flame.
How thick is the plate? Aluminum is an incredible heat sink, so while it doesn't need to be anywhere near as hot as steel to weld, it takes a surprising amount of heat to get it there.
Keep the rod out of the flame for as long as possible, because a cold rod will scratch through the thin oxide crust, and that helps get you started. If you just melt the rod onto the surface, it will bead up like brazing steel without flux.
Lastly, I like to set the flame with a tiny "feather" so it's just barely reducing. You positively do not want an oxidizing flame.
How thick is the plate? Aluminum is an incredible heat sink, so while it doesn't need to be anywhere near as hot as steel to weld, it takes a surprising amount of heat to get it there.
re: cleaning
Clean grime, dirt, grease, oil, marker, pizza, mustard, whatever using appropriate cleaning methods. I'm partial to using acetone instead of alcohol. Both are flammable, and toxic to varying degrees, so use the appropriate PPE and safety steps and ventilation.
After the 'crud' is removed, then you remove the aluminum oxide layer. Carbide burr grinder, other cutting blade methods (NOT a plasma torch. ), a file, abrasives, chemical oxide removal (usually rather nasty chemicals, but sometimes it is an option), etc.
Then remove any swarf or other residue.
Then solvent clean it again. Maybe once more to be sure.
Then you immediately weld or solder or braze the aluminum. Those rods are soldering rods, brazing is 840F or higher IIRC.
Clean grime, dirt, grease, oil, marker, pizza, mustard, whatever using appropriate cleaning methods. I'm partial to using acetone instead of alcohol. Both are flammable, and toxic to varying degrees, so use the appropriate PPE and safety steps and ventilation.
After the 'crud' is removed, then you remove the aluminum oxide layer. Carbide burr grinder, other cutting blade methods (NOT a plasma torch.
), a file, abrasives, chemical oxide removal (usually rather nasty chemicals, but sometimes it is an option), etc. Then remove any swarf or other residue.
Then solvent clean it again. Maybe once more to be sure.
Then you immediately weld or solder or braze the aluminum. Those rods are soldering rods, brazing is 840F or higher IIRC.
Agree to all the above. I used that type of rod to repair a broken ear on a bell housing. It was just for the shield, nothing incredibly important. Prepped with a die grinder and used oxy/acyt torch with a carburizing flame. No way a propane torch could keep up with that heat sink.
)
Thanks for the replies. Working on a vintage sprint car body. Thickness is about .065 thick gauge 16. Did not know if these solder rods would plug up holes or stitch tears in places. Believe I have 1100 series aluminum from 1940-50 era. Was looking for a flux that may help the bonding. Also what series of Aluminum would adhere to it. Called Bernzomatic on this and of course no answer from their technical staff as of yet! Their AL-3 designation does not help on identifying what the rod is. If this rod will not work will just tig weld it standard way. And yes needs to be very clean . Appreciate the help.
Hi O.K. I have a Lincoln Tombstone AC welder with reverse polarity capability. And I purchased a Sears hi freq box to attach to the lincoln. Have the regulator for Argon gas supply. It will be a scratch start system. The torch that came with the hi freq. box is shot. My question is will an air cooled torch be good for Aluminum welding thin panels or should I just but a water cooled torch and build a cooling system for it? And what should I buy for a torch. I see several inexpensive air cooled torches on line but suspect quality issues. I had a Miller Syncrowave 300 when I was working in our Weld lab so got spoiled and understand price and quality. Would like to try this hi freq box set up to see if it will work so do not want to invest in a top shelf torch in case this does not work. Thanks for any help.
laser3kw
Well-known member
rlitman
Well-known member
BTDT (using a home made bridge rectifier). SO glad I eventually bought a real DC TIG welder. Yeah, if that's what you've got, stick with the gas options.
Aluminum TIG is (almost always) done using AC. The alternating polarity (from the AC) helps to 'clean' the aluminum oxide during one half of the cycle and then the other half of the cycle does the majority of the welding/heating.
DC TIG on aluminum is not usually used.
Orca,
You said you had TIG available. Not that you had an AC tombstone that you are trying to cobble together some sort of TIG-ish setup.
A decent air-cooled TIG torch should be able to handle the 65-100-ish amps you would probably be using on 0.065" thick aluminum sheet. No real 'need' for a water-cooled torch at that amperage level.
The high-frequency box is used to help start and maintain the arc on the AC going through the arc.
A brand new TIG torch is about $100-$150 or so in that amperage/size range.
CK17 air-cooled (well, actually argon cooled with additional cooling to the air ), depending on options
www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com
www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com
You probably would want a torch with a separate gas and power connection, and then you have to rig up a power connection from the torch to your welder (DINSE to an adapter, or a lug/ring, or whatever).
All doable.
But so much more doable with a 'real' TIG machine, with amperage control (pedal).
Or go MIG with a spoolgun. Then you need a MIG machine, and a spoolgun. And you'll be doing the usual MIG sheet metal repair welding of a zillion individual weld beads, jumping around so as to not overheat any one area. Again, doable.
Or get some practice pieces of the same alloy and gauge as your body panels, and try practicing soldering with the AL-3 rods (or other aluminum soldering rods, which are actually zinc or zinc-alloy rods used for soldering on aluminum. Unlike bronze brazing rods, which are actually bronze and used for brazing on steel but they don't call them steel brazing rods.
). Practice.
And remember that if you try the aluminum soldering rods on the aluminum sheet metal and then decide later to change to welding (TIG or MIG), you'll have to cut out ALL of the solder and get back to 'clean' aluminum before you can even try welding the aluminum. Zinc solder on top of aluminum would give a horrible witch's brew of metallurgical mayhem if you tried to weld it all together. Probably NOT going to weld well or at all if you tried that.
But those AL-3 rods are rather expensive. I saw some at Home Depot recently. Two skinny rods in the pack for $5.
Your call.
DC TIG on aluminum is not usually used.
Orca,
You said you had TIG available. Not that you had an AC tombstone that you are trying to cobble together some sort of TIG-ish setup.
A decent air-cooled TIG torch should be able to handle the 65-100-ish amps you would probably be using on 0.065" thick aluminum sheet. No real 'need' for a water-cooled torch at that amperage level.
The high-frequency box is used to help start and maintain the arc on the AC going through the arc.
A brand new TIG torch is about $100-$150 or so in that amperage/size range.
CK17 air-cooled (well, actually argon cooled with additional cooling to the air
), depending on options
CK Worldwide 17 Series Superflex TIG Torch with Flex Head (CK17-RSF-FX)
The CK 17 series torches are the best selling torch in the world. Get in touch with us!
www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com
CK Worldwide 17 Series Superflex TIG Torch with Flex Head and Valve (CK17V-RSF-FX)
The CK 17 series torches are the best selling torch in the world. Call today!
www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com
https://bakersgas.com/collections/ck-worldwide/products/ck-worldwide-ck17v-**-rsf-rg
You probably would want a torch with a separate gas and power connection, and then you have to rig up a power connection from the torch to your welder (DINSE to an adapter, or a lug/ring, or whatever).
All doable.
But so much more doable with a 'real' TIG machine, with amperage control (pedal).
Or go MIG with a spoolgun. Then you need a MIG machine, and a spoolgun. And you'll be doing the usual MIG sheet metal repair welding of a zillion individual weld beads, jumping around so as to not overheat any one area. Again, doable.
Or get some practice pieces of the same alloy and gauge as your body panels, and try practicing soldering with the AL-3 rods (or other aluminum soldering rods, which are actually zinc or zinc-alloy rods used for soldering on aluminum. Unlike bronze brazing rods, which are actually bronze and used for brazing on steel but they don't call them steel brazing rods.
). Practice.And remember that if you try the aluminum soldering rods on the aluminum sheet metal and then decide later to change to welding (TIG or MIG), you'll have to cut out ALL of the solder and get back to 'clean' aluminum before you can even try welding the aluminum. Zinc solder on top of aluminum would give a horrible witch's brew of metallurgical mayhem if you tried to weld it all together. Probably NOT going to weld well or at all if you tried that.
But those AL-3 rods are rather expensive. I saw some at Home Depot recently. Two skinny rods in the pack for $5.
Your call.
Hi the Lincoln is AC which I need to weld the Aluminum. I just thought I would tell you I mated a Ranger 8 reverse polarity unit on it when I stick weld. Makes a smoother weld at times. The Sears Hi freq box is set up so I can push a pedal to activate the argon gas ans scratch start the torch. So no pedal control of power and pre set by tap on welder. If I do not need a water cooled torch for this project I will go with the air cooled model you show. Hesitant to buy a junk torch in case this set up works. I would buy a new setup but already have a Daytona MIG tig welder 35 years old and still going strong but limited. Have a nice Miller wire feed mig welder with gas support for steel panel welding. The Lincoln tombstone and OXy / Acet. tanks and torches. If the Daytona welder craps out I will invest in a nice new AC DC tig unit. Thanks for the tip on torches. Will select one and buy it. At my local welding supply store he warned me about odd ball cups, collars and apertures from off shore brands sold on line.
Hi purchased the CK water cooled torch set up as suggested. Waiting for it to come in. I looked over my past post. OOPS yes you are correct Aluminum is AC I somehow got fouled up. I have the hi freq. box all set and made a water cooler to see how this goes. Have been trying to locate 1100 series rod. Most shops around here want me to use 4043 or 4943 as they are readily available. Any thoughts? Thanks.