Bidirectional OBD2 tools

[LexusLover]

So I’m looking to upgrade to my 3rd (and hopefully final) obd2 reader. I started with a crappy little actron pocket scan then moved to a more advanced craftsman model with live data, battery system testing and some other basic functions and now I want something that’s bidirectional.

I know that a $200-500 scan tool will never come close to a snap on Zeus or solus or whatever they have now but how large can the gap be between those two tiers of tool?

It seems the topdon top scan pro which is just using launch code, is a very capable piece of equipment for $99. But it doesn’t seem topdon has any other bidirectional tools between this and the artidiag model for $379. I think foxwell has an option for $250 but I’ve read some mixed reviews on it.

Im starting to increase my skills working on vehicles and I want to start buying fixing and flipping a few used cars a year to suplement my income. What would be the best tool to add to my mostly harbor freight craftsman and Amazon tool collection I’ve amassed so far. I’ve stretched my pennies as far as they can go. Most would probably call me cheap but I just think I’m frugal. Wether it’s Facebook marketplace haggling or buying power tools and batteries on yearly Black Friday deals. I’ll do whatever it takes to make sure I get the best bang for the buck.

 

[kbeefy]

I think the Topdon, or maybe an autel would be a good 'backyard' tool.

I have the Verus Pro pictured above. They can be had used on Ebay. Looks like they are still getting $1500+. I like it because it has a scope as well, but it is running windows and getting pretty long in the tooth.

 

[spinellib]

I agree with the guys above -- I like the old Snap-On scanners. For me, Snap-On is easy to navigate because that's what I'm used to. These chinese scanners seem to be quite capable...and cheap, but I don't like the "Android" layout and their menus are, to me, weird. But some of these, like the new Otofix, look like a great value.

The learning curve for Scanners is a very deep, time-wasting rabbit hole, and the newer cars' features make the choice even more complicated because of actuator testing capability, ECU coding, customization options, etc. I spent many, many hours reading reviews, forums, and watching youtube to see scanners in action. And, no matter which scanner you choose, it will let you down and not do something you want for a particular car.

 

[Schurkey]

no matter which scanner you choose, it will let you down and not do something you want for a particular car.

The 6.2 and 8.2 software of my MTG2500 and Solus Pro won't auto-bleed the ABS of my '97 K2500. I could get readings from the speed sensors, codes, and other info from the ABS, but no auto-bleed. They would auto-bleed my 2003 Trailblazer, but not my '97.

The 14.2 software WILL auto-bleed the ABS on my '97.

 

[Buckaroo5]

So I’m looking to upgrade to my 3rd (and hopefully final) obd2 reader. I started with a crappy little actron pocket scan then moved to a more advanced craftsman model with live data, battery system testing and some other basic functions and now I want something that’s bidirectional.

I know that a $200-500 scan tool will never come close to a snap on Zeus or solus or whatever they have now but how large can the gap be between those two tiers of tool?

It seems the topdon top scan pro which is just using launch code, is a very capable piece of equipment for $99. But it doesn’t seem topdon has any other bidirectional tools between this and the artidiag model for $379. I think foxwell has an option for $250 but I’ve read some mixed reviews on it.

Im starting to increase my skills working on vehicles and I want to start buying fixing and flipping a few used cars a year to suplement my income. What would be the best tool to add to my mostly harbor freight craftsman and Amazon tool collection I’ve amassed so far. I’ve stretched my pennies as far as they can go. Most would probably call me cheap but I just think I’m frugal. Wether it’s Facebook marketplace haggling or buying power tools and batteries on yearly Black Friday deals. I’ll do whatever it takes to make sure I get the best bang for the buck.

I was unaware of it before I read your post but am interested in the Topdon Artidiag. I see Amazon has the 900 Lite for $459 plus a $150 coupon - net $300 and the Pro for $372. What model are you considering? Am a DIYer and work primarily on Toyota's - currently using a Bluedriver. Like you, I am frugal - have been waiting until I reach an impasse before I upgrade to Bidirectional Control. When that time came, I had planned on going Mongoose Plus Toyota 3 cable ($575) plus a short term Techstream subscription when needed which would provide factory tool functionality but limited to Toyota/Lexus. I am anticipating need to reflash and am a little skittish doing it with a knock-off tool, Please let us know what tool you go with and what you think.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I agree with the guys above -- I like the old Snap-On scanners. For me, Snap-On is easy to navigate because that's what I'm used to. These chinese scanners seem to be quite capable...and cheap, but I don't like the "Android" layout and their menus are, to me, weird. But some of these, like the new Otofix, look like a great value.

The learning curve for Scanners is a very deep, time-wasting rabbit hole, and the newer cars' features make the choice even more complicated because of actuator testing capability, ECU coding, customization options, etc. I spent many, many hours reading reviews, forums, and watching youtube to see scanners in action. And, no matter which scanner you choose, it will let you down and not do something you want for a particular car.

Rabbit holes is a good term, I usually use "vertical slope" in terms of learning curve. It's tough, but IMO worth it. Although I normally tell people to stay out of bi-directional 1st and learn generic OBDII function/graphing 1st. Explaining the relationships between the data makes then using bidirectional tools must easier.



OP, what you want to do and the year range you're working on is critical to choosing the right tool. Snap on only makes sense in the used market if you can work on vehicles using the out of date software. Keeping a SO tool updated is not cheap, and in my mind not financially realistic for most people using them at home - it just costs too much. However if you can get a 2020 updated tool, with a labscope in it for service data and pinouts, and you're working to 2010-2015 cars you're going to be in pretty good shape.


You mention flipping cars - are these mechanically totaled cars you can do labor on at a lower rate? Are they cars which have running/driving problems what need diagnosed? What's the primary target here?

 

[LexusLover]

WHAT ARE YOU INTENDING TO WORK ON? HOW NEW would those vehicles be?

When it was my own money I was spending, I bought a used-but-usable Snap-On Solus Pro with 8.2 software (1980 1/2--2007) and the typical accessories--battery, battery charger, various cables 'n' vehicle adapters, OBD2 "personality keys", user manuals on DVD, and so forth. $350 shipped to my door from a seller on eBay. Prices may have gone up in the meantime--Thanks Joe--but there's still bargains to be had.

This replaced a Snappy MTG2500 with cartridges to cover 1980 1/2--2005 domestic that I'd used for ~20 years.

I have access to a Solus Pro with 14.2 software, suitable for the newest vehicle I'm in charge of. Price was about the same as my 8.2 version--around $350, but was sold with a bum battery (which I managed to rejuvenate purely by accident.)

I would MUCH rather have a "good used" genuine Professional-grade scan tool than a brand-new "consumer grade" tool.

There are competing "Pro-grade" products from other manufacturers, but I'm buying Snap-On scan tools.

This chart is dated, but adequate for selecting a used and already-depreciated scan tool.

By scope for that mean oscilloscope? Because I’m planning on getting a power probe knock off that has oscilloscope functionality or maybe just a lower tier power probe and a cheap but capable oscilloscope, I’m not at that skill level yet but I like to be prepared for whatever comes my way. I like working on Toyota vehicles from the early and mid 2000’s but the more capability I have the better.

 

[LexusLover]

Rabbit holes is a good term, I usually use "vertical slope" in terms of learning curve. It's tough, but IMO worth it. Although I normally tell people to stay out of bi-directional 1st and learn generic OBDII function/graphing 1st. Explaining the relationships between the data makes then using bidirectional tools must easier.



OP, what you want to do and the year range you're working on is critical to choosing the right tool. Snap on only makes sense in the used market if you can work on vehicles using the out of date software. Keeping a SO tool updated is not cheap, and in my mind not financially realistic for most people using them at home - it just costs too much. However if you can get a 2020 updated tool, with a labscope in it for service data and pinouts, and you're working to 2010-2015 cars you're going to be in pretty good shape.


You mention flipping cars - are these mechanically totaled cars you can do labor on at a lower rate? Are they cars which have running/driving problems what need diagnosed? What's the primary target here?

My plan is to find cars that have bad engines and start doing rebuilds or engine swaps, I’ve done several engine swaps before and it’s a lot of work but it’s worth it. However easier fix and flips would be good too. Like just brake work and some suspension even though I think suspension diag is worse than engine and electrical repair in my opinion. But the range of years I’m looking at repairing are probably 2012 and earlier but I would not say no to newer vehicles

 

[theoldwizard1]

Any decent bidirectional scan tool will likely require a software update service, especially if you want to scan 2-3 yo vehicles.

 

[LexusLover]

WHAT ARE YOU INTENDING TO WORK ON? HOW NEW would those vehicles be?

When it was my own money I was spending, I bought a used-but-usable Snap-On Solus Pro with 8.2 software (1980 1/2--2007) and the typical accessories--battery, battery charger, various cables 'n' vehicle adapters, OBD2 "personality keys", user manuals on DVD, and so forth. $350 shipped to my door from a seller on eBay. Prices may have gone up in the meantime--Thanks Joe--but there's still bargains to be had.

This replaced a Snappy MTG2500 with cartridges to cover 1980 1/2--2005 domestic that I'd used for ~20 years.

I have access to a Solus Pro with 14.2 software, suitable for the newest vehicle I'm in charge of. Price was about the same as my 8.2 version--around $350, but was sold with a bum battery (which I managed to rejuvenate purely by accident.)

I would MUCH rather have a "good used" genuine Professional-grade scan tool than a brand-new "consumer grade" tool.

There are competing "Pro-grade" products from other manufacturers, but I'm buying Snap-On scan tools.

This chart is dated, but adequate for selecting a used and already-depreciated scan tool.

Also to elaborate are more advanced scanner functions including bi directionality or are there other things besides that functionality they can do? Maybe besides resets and winding back electric motor brake calipers and vin changes and key coding? I’m not too too worried about vin and key issues. But if the snap on and Mac and top don phoenix only offer oscilloscope functionality on top of bi directional scanning , live data, and reset features then how much less capable would the top scan pro be in comparison to the best scan tool that doesn’t include oscilloscope functionality? Like how much would I be missing if I just got the top scan pro and an independent oscilloscope? I know some vehicle manufactures sell their own software and there are ways to download those systems into a laptop and use a blue tooth dongle to interface and pirate your own scan tool but this is complicated and for $100 the topscab pro seems pretty nice but it’s curious to me why top don would have a bidirectional blue tooth dongle for $100 but not have something slightly better in a tablet format for $150-250z the foxwell scanner o saw that was bi was about $260 but as I said the reviews were pretty ******.

 

[LexusLover]

Any decent bidirectional scan tool will likely require a software update service, especially if you want to scan 2-3 yo vehicles.

Well it should maintain the functionality of whatever year I purchase it I. Correct? So if I buy it today I should be able to use it on a vast majority of makes and models manufactured on or before 2024? And if I don’t upgrade the software I should still be able to use the tool from what I gather?

 

[theoldwizard1]

Well it should maintain the functionality of whatever year I purchase it I. Correct? So if I buy it today I should be able to use it on a vast majority of makes and models manufactured on or before 2024? And if I don’t upgrade the software I should still be able to use the tool from what I gather?

More likely 2023.

 

[LexusLover]

More likely 2023.

Should be 2024 since 2025 models hit the market in mid to late 2024 but 2023 should be more than adequate for my needs. Lol

 

[theoldwizard1]

Should be 2024 since 2025 models hit the market in mid to late 2024 but 2023 should be more than adequate for my needs. Lol

You are being LOGICAL !

When was it built ? That is, when did the factory install the software !

 

[2ndGearRubber]

My plan is to find cars that have bad engines and start doing rebuilds or engine swaps, I’ve done several engine swaps before and it’s a lot of work but it’s worth it. However easier fix and flips would be good too. Like just brake work and some suspension even though I think suspension diag is worse than engine and electrical repair in my opinion. But the range of years I’m looking at repairing are probably 2012 and earlier but I would not say no to newer vehicles

You can buy a used out-of-date scan tool then and be fine. It's all about what you want to do. If you don't pay for service info a snap-on tool with an oscilloscope has guided component tester and can do part of that job. People don't get the massive power of this if you want to do diag work. It's like 50% the total function of real service info, but it's handy, and in the tool forever. But these used snap on tools are still 2X what a basic "scan tool only" Autel/Launch software tool runs on amazon. You're talking ~$1000 for a 2018-ish updated Modis, which will also have a cord.

I would consider just something with very basic graphing for your use, something like an 808 Autel in capability. You just need to know if the problem is internal engine mechanical, or external parts. That's not crazy stuff, you just need to be able to graph several data points at once and potentially set the scales. IMO you don't need bidirectional so much as an ability to talk to all modules, and do relearns like misfire correction, throttle body sweeps, etc., oil lights, TPMS, parking brake stuff.

 

[spinellib]

Am a DIYer and work primarily on Toyota's...I had planned on going Mongoose Plus Toyota 3 cable ($575) plus a short term Techstream subscription...

Techstream is best (and also phased out for cars 2024 and newer). I don't know first-hand because I don't own one, but a very good Techstream alternative for Toyota/Lexus is Launch's Creader Elite 2 unit that is specifically for Toyota. From the reviews I watched, it seems to match Techstream's capabilities, including Immobilizer functions, and sells for less than $150. If I didn't already have Techstream, I'd buy the Toyota-specific Launch C-Reader for my Lexus.

...I normally tell people to stay out of bi-directional 1st and learn generic OBDII function/graphing 1st. Explaining the relationships between the data makes then using bidirectional tools must easier. .

...If you don't pay for service info a snap-on tool with an oscilloscope has guided component tester and can do part of that job. People don't get the massive power of this if you want to do diag work. It's like 50% the total function of real service info, but it's handy, and in the tool forever.

Good advice. Guys are excited because they can make the horn beep, but don't know why an actuator test is helpful in a diagnosis.
Also, as you know but others might not, the "Troubleshooter" in the Scanner part of the Snap-Ons have a lot of information for specific issues that can help someone, get on the right track to solve an issue, or, at least, give a tech ideas. And that's information that will be in the tool forever.

Incidentally, regarding "updates" for the software on any machine: Unless you fix cars for a living as a "real" mechanic, I think buying updates is a waste, whether it's one of these cheap chinese scanners or an older-but-still-updatable Snap-On. Another thing, I think the chinese scanners really like being constantly connected to WiFi, and will keep bothering you if you're not connected, and keep bothering you if your tool needs even a minor update, which is often, from what I've learned.

 

[LexusLover]

would an old snap on or Mac tool with scope be better than getting these?

TopScan

The TopScan is a powerful, pocket-sized tool that transforms your smartphone into a full-featured OBD2 scanner, ideal for diagnosing and clearing fault codes. Compatible with over 70 vehicle makes from American, Asian, and European manufacturers, it’s an essential tool for dealing with check...

www.topdon.us

https://www.amazon.com/FNIRSI-DSO-TC3-Oscilloscope-Transistor-Transistors/dp/B0BV9X733J/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Because this seems like the way I’m inclined to go. I can even throw in this and upgrade my diagnostic capabilities pretty sufficiently.

https://www.amazon.com/Topdiag-P100-Automotive-Circuit-Tester/dp/B07YC621J9/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Granted I’ll have a lot of learning to do to figure out how to use an oscilloscope and power probe properly, I have used an oscilloscope before on bread boards in some college lab courses though so I’m not totally clueless. I guess I can check marketplace to see if there are any pro level options for cheap but for $200 having bidirectional controls, an oscilloscope and a power probe idk how much more a used pro grade tool can provide?