Black & Decker Workmate
- Thread starter abstamaria
- Start date
Isaiah6113
Well-known member
Hello all,
Here's my Workmate 400, which was a Christmas present from my wife in 1989. It's been a handy helper over the years. Over the last week has helped me hang some doors; a job I dislike for so many reasons.
I'm left handed and so over the years the left back strut has wallowed. The right side is perfect, no slack at all. Any ideas on what a fix might be? Is this a common problem?
https://imgur.com/a/Zb4RPpd
https://imgur.com/a/aDpezxP
Thanks!
Matthew_A
PS How do I embed the vids in the post?
Here's my Workmate 400, which was a Christmas present from my wife in 1989. It's been a handy helper over the years. Over the last week has helped me hang some doors; a job I dislike for so many reasons.
I'm left handed and so over the years the left back strut has wallowed. The right side is perfect, no slack at all. Any ideas on what a fix might be? Is this a common problem?
https://imgur.com/a/Zb4RPpd
https://imgur.com/a/aDpezxP
Thanks!
Matthew_A
PS How do I embed the vids in the post?
Attachments
I've never owned a 400 so I don't have any specific insights; all I can suggest are the basics. Have you done any troubleshooting for the problem? For example, remove both of the struts and compare the two sides. Is the mounting hole on the left enlarged compared to the right? Is the strut riveted on? This may have been one of the ways they cut costs on the later models, and it would make disassembly more of a task. I'm used to the 79-001s where the struts can just be unscrewed.
It's a Big Day—time to celebrate the 10th anniversary of this thread!
On February 17, 2011, Ron Hickman, the inventor of the Workmate died. The next day, abstamaria posted a message starting this thread, probably never imagining that it would grow to almost 2,000 messages. I came across the discussion here in about 2016 and it was a major impetus for the start of my vintage Workmate website just about a year ago now.
Interestingly, it looks as though abstamaria was still participating in the Garage Journal forum as of last summer, but never contributed another message to this thread after the first.
On February 17, 2011, Ron Hickman, the inventor of the Workmate died. The next day, abstamaria posted a message starting this thread, probably never imagining that it would grow to almost 2,000 messages. I came across the discussion here in about 2016 and it was a major impetus for the start of my vintage Workmate website just about a year ago now.
Interestingly, it looks as though abstamaria was still participating in the Garage Journal forum as of last summer, but never contributed another message to this thread after the first.
y'sguy
Well-known member
Yes and it's exactly this thread by abstamaria that I began to follow and soon became obsesssed with finding my first Workmate. And now have two which are great to work with!
Just found this workmate thread. Cool story on the first page. I have a 200 that I made new boards for and new leg clips and orange inserts for. My Dad still has his with the aluminum braces. Not sure which #. Ive seen the prices for some on online are crazy.
I love mine, I have three I picked-up at the curb on trash day, over 20 years. I use mine pretty much specifically for my bench top tools, jointer, planer and router table. They are nice since when clamped down a tool, you can walk completely around them, and are not stuck on one side, like on a bench top.
As requested pictures of my workmate bought in 1974 or 1975 and not only well used but well traveled and still used on a regular basis
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A real classic, with lots of character. Can you check on the bottom of the jaws to see if there's an ink-stamped 5-digit production code there?
From the components I see on it, it was made between February and June 1976, so I expect the code will start with a 6.
From the components I see on it, it was made between February and June 1976, so I expect the code will start with a 6.
I know I bought it before I was transferred to Germany so I would have at least a small workbench . I will check the number for you . Yes well aged but still very useful . Actually one of its uses is to spread the table top , put my push mower on it and thus ver easy to change the oil . All considered a great design that has survived the test of rine
nadogail
Well-known member
IMHO, The inventor of the Work Mate deserves to be rich.
Outlawmws
Well-known member
He was. Not sure about his heirs.
Bazsm
Well-known member
After reading some of this thread I decided I needed to get one of the earlier type aluminium models as my old WM525 weighs a ton and has been heavily used over the years so I found this on eBay:
I think it's a WM325 in pretty good nick but as you can see one of the handles has been bodged and I'm missing 2 feet. However the handles on my WM525 look identical apart from the plastic colour so think I can probably swap these over:
I'm gonna try and restore this to a nicer condition but need to see what aluminium cleaner is best here in the UK
I think it's a WM325 in pretty good nick but as you can see one of the handles has been bodged and I'm missing 2 feet. However the handles on my WM525 look identical apart from the plastic colour so think I can probably swap these over:
I'm gonna try and restore this to a nicer condition but need to see what aluminium cleaner is best here in the UK
Bazsm
Well-known member
I want to try and loosen up the old blue plastic handle and can't see how/if the plastic will come off without breaking or damaging it - anyone managed this previously?
Can you explain why you want to remove the plastic part of the handle?
In the U.S. the WM325 Type 3 was sold as the 79-001 Type E. I have owned four of them, but I never tried to disassemble the handle.
Black & Decker published two part diagrams for the Type E, both of which you can download on the Documents page of my web site.
The diagrams are a little different and slightly ambiguous, but my interpretation is that the replacement part consisted of the aluminum arm and the plastic knob as one assembly. The earlier of the two diagrams shows the steel cap at the end of the handle as a separate part, which might indicate that it could be removable, but it's hard to see how. However, I still think they indicate that the handle was not designed to be disassembled.
On the two Type E's that I have currently, the aluminum arm has a part number of 994903 which doesn't match any of the part numbers on the two diagrams. You can see it in the attached photo. What is the part number on your WM325 arms?
In the U.S. the WM325 Type 3 was sold as the 79-001 Type E. I have owned four of them, but I never tried to disassemble the handle.
Black & Decker published two part diagrams for the Type E, both of which you can download on the Documents page of my web site.
The diagrams are a little different and slightly ambiguous, but my interpretation is that the replacement part consisted of the aluminum arm and the plastic knob as one assembly. The earlier of the two diagrams shows the steel cap at the end of the handle as a separate part, which might indicate that it could be removable, but it's hard to see how. However, I still think they indicate that the handle was not designed to be disassembled.
On the two Type E's that I have currently, the aluminum arm has a part number of 994903 which doesn't match any of the part numbers on the two diagrams. You can see it in the attached photo. What is the part number on your WM325 arms?
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Bazsm
Well-known member
Well the plastic handle is seized up and doesn't twist so I thought it would be good to try and take it apart and remove any corrosion as well as remove the rust from the end cap too. I've included a photo which has the same PN as yours but interestingly mine shows BM3 and doesn't have the extra rib down the middle!
I do have a couple of black handles from my other workmate that twist and would fit but wanted to try and source another blue one to keep it authentic
Do you have the product known as Evapo-Rust available there, or something similar? It works by chelation which means that it has no effect on non-ferrous materials including things such as plastics. I would try soaking the entire handle in it, hoping it would have some effect inside even though you wouldn't actually be able to get at the interior. It might do enough that the handle would loosen up and then by rotating it repeatedly you could take care of more of the internal rust. It should also work on the end cap, where you'll be able to help it along by scrubbing with a non-woven pad.
When there are extra ID's on a cast part like these, it usually identifies the specific mold that was used. If they're making lots of copies of the same part, each mold eventually "wears out" and has to be replaced with a new one. The numbers may help the manufacturer in case they start seeing part failures that they can trace to a particular mold, or something like that. And of course in this case we can see that they changed the design of the part slightly between the two molds, without changing the part number.
My second Type E is in poor condition, almost unusable, and I would be willing to send you one of my handles at no charge if you want it. It has a very rusted end cap, as you can see in this photo, but otherwise works fine. I will have to make sure I can punch out the roll pin that holds it on without breaking anything; I see that the pin is pretty rusted also. Would you be interested in that?
When there are extra ID's on a cast part like these, it usually identifies the specific mold that was used. If they're making lots of copies of the same part, each mold eventually "wears out" and has to be replaced with a new one. The numbers may help the manufacturer in case they start seeing part failures that they can trace to a particular mold, or something like that. And of course in this case we can see that they changed the design of the part slightly between the two molds, without changing the part number.
My second Type E is in poor condition, almost unusable, and I would be willing to send you one of my handles at no charge if you want it. It has a very rusted end cap, as you can see in this photo, but otherwise works fine. I will have to make sure I can punch out the roll pin that holds it on without breaking anything; I see that the pin is pretty rusted also. Would you be interested in that?
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Bazsm
Well-known member
I have a couple of very good rust treatments from Bilt Hamber so will see if one is suitable but also think that cap that rusts on front must pop off so might have a look at that too.
That’s a very kind offer of your spare handle but they do come up on eBay over here from time to time (in fact there are a pair of pretty tired examples available now), so I’ll keep you in mind if I run out of other options.
I’ll update with any progress I make.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
That’s a very kind offer of your spare handle but they do come up on eBay over here from time to time (in fact there are a pair of pretty tired examples available now), so I’ll keep you in mind if I run out of other options.
I’ll update with any progress I make.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Outlawmws
Well-known member
If the handle is aluminum or pot metal (Non Ferrous) don't bother with Evaporust or other rust eating solutions.
I would use some SG (rinse thoroughly after...) and see if you can get it turning, then work it. SG IS somewhat reactive to Aluminum so it may eat the corrosion first, but Hence my caution...
I would use some SG (rinse thoroughly after...) and see if you can get it turning, then work it. SG IS somewhat reactive to Aluminum so it may eat the corrosion first, but Hence my caution...
Can you provide a photo of the broken handle? I can't quite make out the exact damage.
It looks as though you still have two of the press-in feet at the front. You can move them to the upper position where the feet are missing and then get some new M8-1.25 threaded feet to replace them on the legs. You won't find new ones that match the old ones in appearance, but you can find ones that will work well. I discuss this on my web page about feet under the heading Fixed Front Feet for Type E.
Bazsm
Well-known member
Thanks for the suggestion, although I'm not sure what SG is - might be useful in the future so please expand...and I seem to have made some progress as per below
Here's a photo of the broken handle, pretty cut 'n dried I'm afraid and needs to be replaced:
I decided to take a closer look at the metal handle on my 525 and kind of wish I hadn't although I do know how they're put together now!
I figured that the cap must be a press fit on the handle shaft and by using a drift from behind I could most likely just pop it off....well after a fair bit of gentle tapping I got a bit more aggressive and found out that although the cap is a push fit the shaft is solid at the outer end so I simply broke the shaft of the handle body but at least I can see how it works now!
Cap:
Broken shaft (note the top has broken off the handle body and the bottom is solid):
Plastic handle:
Even though I can now see how the cap pops off I'm not sure if it will be easy to get it off in practice and the metal is so thin where rust has taken hold it has some very fine holes in (as I image most of them will).
Didn't imagine I'd find anything similar but just found this on eBay that looks very close size wise so I will order: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10mm-Sta...103095?hash=item1f1a87f1f7:g:fgkAAOSweWVXeUM8
Thanks for your comments about the feet and I've seen your posts about the options and have that on my to do list (as well as one very stubborn foot that has rusted into the aluminium at present).
I'll update as I make progress.
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Outlawmws
Well-known member
I thought you said the handed was frozen but otherwise complete...
SG = Simple Green
SG = Simple Green
Bazsm
Well-known member
The WM325 has a frozen blue handle and one bodged handle, my WM525 had 2 good black handles so I thought I would try and see how they were put together....good learning experience I guess!
Simple Green - so this stuff? https://www.simplegreen.co.uk/
Outlawmws
Well-known member
That's it!
Sorry to hear about the mishap.
However, now that you have it apart I'd like to understand the construction of it, but I'm not quite grasping it yet. Could you explain a little further for my slow mind?
I can't quite make sense of the part you call the shaft. What is it made of? The top looks like blue plastic, but the rest appears black. Is it tapered? The plastic handle must rotate on the shaft and the shaft is somehow attached to the crank arm, correct? What makes that attachment? What does the crank arm look like now with the handle removed?
I'm not even sure what the cap clips onto. Is there another piece of the shaft that broke off that's not shown in your photos?
I just can't put it all together in my head into a working assembly.
Bazsm
Well-known member
OK, hopefully this image of the 3 parts of the handle will help:
The crank arm and shaft are cast as one piece and the plastic handle pops onto the tapered shaft and the cap clips onto the solid end of the handle shaft.
I had figured the cap must be clipped on but hadn't realised the shaft would be solid at the end, as you can of course see a hole in the back of it. I had figured I could probably push the cap off the end of the shaft by knocking a drift in from behind but wasn't making any progress so upped the power and that's how the shaft sheared off the crank part!
Now I've taken one apart I can see that trying to get the end cap off in one piece to re-use will be almost impossible as it is really tight on the shaft but I'm pretty hopeful those parts I've ordered on eBay will be the right size as they seem to measure up pretty closely which would mean I can then remove the rusted end caps without worrying about how they look once I get them off.
Hope this helps.
Outlawmws
Well-known member
So I see that one as repairable:
drill/Tap as needed the shaft
Clean the busted sections well (like Acetone or MEK...)
get a good metal epoxy in as a thin layer, or maybe if the fit is real clean, super glue.
Screw the shaft onto the crank with a button head screw, and a washer that fills the pocket at that end - grind the washer to fit as needed (before gluing..).
Assemble...
drill/Tap as needed the shaft
Clean the busted sections well (like Acetone or MEK...)
get a good metal epoxy in as a thin layer, or maybe if the fit is real clean, super glue.
Screw the shaft onto the crank with a button head screw, and a washer that fills the pocket at that end - grind the washer to fit as needed (before gluing..).
Assemble...
Bazsm
Well-known member
Quite possibly, and thanks for the suggestion - I'm an araldite fan but apart from that I'm inclined to agree - really hoping the front caps I've ordered are the right size and then I'm in good shape to repair the WM525 at least!
Thanks, that mostly clears it up. So the handle shaft is mostly hollow, only solid for a short distance at one end? In your photos, there's no visible hole in it.
Now that you know the construction, what do you think could be keeping your other handle from rotating?
Now that you know the construction, what do you think could be keeping your other handle from rotating?
Bazsm
Well-known member
If you look at the back side of the handle you’ll see a hole and the handle shaft is hollow except for the last 1 or 2mm where it’s been cast solid at the end (can’t see a good reason why they would have done that)!
On my ‘stuck’ handle I think the rusted cap is seized on the plastic handle and as the cap fits tightly on the shaft that is stopping it from twisting - if the eBay caps fit I’ll remove that rusted cap and we’ll see for sure.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Bazsm
Well-known member
I appreciate this hasn't come up in the previous hundred pages so won't interest many but thought I'd update after receiving the metal caps off eBay, almost identical but they won't clip tight to the shaft but I think they will still be a good substitute.
Comparison:
Dropped onto the end of the plastic handle:
You can't really see it here but the cap 'wings' are a tad too loose to tightly hold the shaft but I think a dab of glue or sealant will hold it tight and as the plastic handle just rotates on the shaft I don't think the cap will be under any great pressure:
This is the description of what I ordered if anyone wants to try and track down something similar: 10mm Starlock Plated Dome End Caps x 4, push on axle hub caps for 10mm dia shaft
I'll post up after I've 'fixed' my handles with the new caps.
Comparison:
Dropped onto the end of the plastic handle:
You can't really see it here but the cap 'wings' are a tad too loose to tightly hold the shaft but I think a dab of glue or sealant will hold it tight and as the plastic handle just rotates on the shaft I don't think the cap will be under any great pressure:
This is the description of what I ordered if anyone wants to try and track down something similar: 10mm Starlock Plated Dome End Caps x 4, push on axle hub caps for 10mm dia shaft
I'll post up after I've 'fixed' my handles with the new caps.
RTM
Well-known member
Can you just bend the wings out a bit more on your new cap?
Or, slower, measure the end of the shaft, and see what size you need, and try ebay again?
Or, slower, measure the end of the shaft, and see what size you need, and try ebay again?
Bazsm
Well-known member
I did try flattening the wings to try and get more grip but there's not enough difference unfortunately, I did measure quite crudely first time around and thought 10mm was near enough but maybe something to fit a 9mm shaft will do the trick but the other dimensions seem to change as the shaft size does. I will probably do some more searching but for now these seem pretty good and tbh I initially thought choice would be very limited but maybe not!
I would think that a good mechanical connection here would be important. When I think about how I use the vise handles, I'm pretty sure that I sometimes unintentionally apply some force that's not purely rotational and which would tend to pull the handle off. One could try to remember to be careful, but I know how that goes for me...
slowtwitch73
Well-known member
slowtwitch73
Well-known member
4521
captain14
Well-known member
You don’t have a problem. You always use them in pairs for a work platform plus one to hold the mitre saw. I hate to bend over for tools and supplies when you are working all day.
Thanks. That's the second that I've documented from that same day of production—December 23, 1974. It's only the 14th Type 1 out of a total of 305 79-001's that I have documented dates for.
If you have the time, could you check your other two for codes like that also? On the 300, the number would be on the metal footrest, probably on the bottom side, and it looks a little different, like 22513TY1. Thanks.