Blue point

[eschoendorff]

it's so funny how you guys care so much about made in USA but tell me you don't own anything that isn't made here?
I support mom and pops stores in my area when I can but I tell you what when it comes to my money it's best bang for buck no matter where it's made.
How can a thread about blue point tools turn so political?

Case in point: myself. I care about buying American-made goods, and I am one of those people who checks where something is made before I buy it. That being said, I also own imported tools. There are a lot of things that i have purchased from HF that I would not have been able to afford if I had to buy them from Snap On and the like.

That being said, I live in a tiny town... we don't even have a stoplight! The businesses are struggling here and my wife and I try to support the local businesses any chance we get. Being a schoolteacher, many of my students depend on the local economy for survival. So, in my mind, even if I have to pay a little more to get something locally, I am supporting my own kids! I do try to buy locally as often as I can afford to.


It really comes down to balance. Sure we all care about keeping jobs in this country! But at the end of the day, each one of us has to do what we feel is best for out families and ourselves.

 

[Lyaec350]

but I tell you what when it comes to my money it's best bang for buck no matter where it's made.

Haha, and you bought BluePoint? I think the consensus in this thread is that BluePoint is just relabeled Chaiwanese stuff where you are paying near Snap-on prices for mid level tools--thats basically the worst "bang for your buck" that you can get. You realize that the exact same sockets you got from the Snappy truck can probably be bought for 1/2 to 1/3 the price from any tool website?

As for how-much-a-monthing tools, it's like anything else, if you can't afford it don't buy it. I don't understand why financing is such a draw. At least youre making the Snappy guy some money.

 

[reversegear]

I said top line Taiwanese tools. I have not seen much nicer coming out of Taiwan. On what information do you claim that they are not top line Taiwanese tools????

Much nicer tools coming out of Taiwan are the ones sold to Snap-On, Facom, SK, and Stanley Proto. The Taiwanese stuff made for the Gearwrench brand are made by a company called Lea Way Hand Tool Corporation. It's not garbage, but it's unlikely that Lea Way could ever meet the quality standards of Snap On, much less Facom. We've done testing where certain Taiwanese tools are beating Craftsman every single time, every parameter. No Gearwrench product is going to do that. At any rate, a lot of the Gearwrench stuff is not made in Taiwan, it is made in China. And comparing Taiwan quality with China is like comparing Japan with India.

 

[DavidtheDuke]

Much nicer tools coming out of Taiwan are the ones sold to Snap-On, Facom, SK, and Stanley Proto. The Taiwanese stuff made for the Gearwrench brand are made by a company called Lea Way Hand Tool Corporation. It's not garbage, but it's unlikely that Lea Way could ever meet the quality standards of Snap On, much less Facom. We've done testing where certain Taiwanese tools are beating Craftsman every single time, every parameter. No Gearwrench product is going to do that. At any rate, a lot of the Gearwrench stuff is not made in Taiwan, it is made in China. And comparing Taiwan quality with China is like comparing Japan with India.

Curious, who is "we"?

 

[bman123]

can you show me were I can get the same sockets and such online cheaper?I will then use my credit for an f80 ratchet,some ball hex keys and screwdrivers.
I cannot afford to buy outright from sears so that is not an option.I am supporting the USA by putting money in the snappy guys pocket.
Some of you remind me of the people on glock talk,when it is cheaper else where and this and that.I didn't want this thread going all political and look where it went.

 

[Lyaec350]

can you show me were I can get the same sockets and such online cheaper?I will then use my credit for an f80 ratchet,some ball hex keys and screwdrivers.
I cannot afford to buy outright from sears so that is not an option.I am supporting the USA by putting money in the snappy guys pocket.
Some of you remind me of the people on glock talk,when it is cheaper else where and this and that.I didn't want this thread going all political and look where it went.

This was posted on page 1. Better stuff at a better price. Can't afford it all at once? Why not buy some then next week buy some more, rather than paying interest? I just never understand why someone would want to finance something (how-much-a-month) when they could buy it outright for less if they just saved up, and being able to use what they would have paid in interest towards their next purchase.

I don't know which manufacturer makes the exact BluePoint stuff you ordered, but it is safe to assume that it is rebadged and sold elsewhere without the BluePoint name for a lot less.

http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/SK-94559.html
http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/SK-86016.html
http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/SK-86123.html
http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/SK-3866.html

Thats around $358, all USA made, much better quality than Blue Point Taiwan made, and also a lifetime warranty, however, if you use the right tools for the job, you shouldn't need much of a warranty anyway with that set.

There is still time to cancel that order!

I love snap on tools, but most Blue Point stuff is just extremely high markup overseas average stuff, with a good warranty.

 

[Merkava_4]

That reminds me: I hope the Snap-on dealer isn't charging interest because my dealer doesn't charge the guys interest; he just expects them to pay 15% of the total balance each week.

 

[bman123]

there is no interest just pay 10% per week.
also if you all found out snap on was all made overseas but stamped usa would you still buy it?What if it was the same as gearwrench would you still pay for it?Gearwrench owns the patent on the ratcheting wrenches don't they

 

[Lyaec350]

there is no interest just pay 10% per week.
also if you all found out snap on was all made overseas but stamped usa would you still buy it?What if it was the same as gearwrench would you still pay for it?Gearwrench owns the patent on the ratcheting wrenches don't they

If it was the same quality as current Snap-on I'd buy it regardless of the country of origin provided no same price equal or greater quality US made line was available. In my book quality is #1 criteria, US made is an added benefit.

If it were the same quality as Gearwrench stuff? No, I most definitely would not pay Snap-on prices for Gearwrench stuff.

Some Taiwanese company owns the patent for the ratcheting mechanism so, most (all?) ratcheting wrenches are produced there (some--Craftsman for sure, dunno about others--have the wrench blanks produced here and the guts produced there).

 

[bman123]

yeah so the SO ratcheting wrenches have tawainese parts in them but SO is the ebst thing since sliced bread.This thread has totally gone in the garbage.Can a moderator please close this it is getting out of hand

 

[Lyaec350]

yeah so the SO ratcheting wrenches have tawainese parts in them but SO is the ebst thing since sliced bread.This thread has totally gone in the garbage.Can a moderator please close this it is getting out of hand

Clearly you're unable to figure out the idea of comparisons. We're talking about things that are better or worse than other options for the same price. Nobody said your BluePoint stuff was low quality, or that Snap-on ratcheting wrenches were the best thing since sliced bread. The BluePoint is still a worse value (quality vs cost) than other options and the Snap-on ratcheting stuff is some of the best available (since all ratcheting wrench mechanisms are made overseas). You got suckered by a smooth talking high pressure Snap-on driver, deal with it.

 

[chad s]

yeah so the SO ratcheting wrenches have tawainese parts in them but SO is the ebst thing since sliced bread.This thread has totally gone in the garbage.Can a moderator please close this it is getting out of hand

Woah, hold on there man. You started the thread, you came here for our opinions, and I think everyone stated their opinion in a very gentlemanly manner. No one attacked you, they simply stated what they would do in your situation, and also stated the real deal behind the Blue Point line of tools.

It appears that you dont like the answers you got, and (until my comments below) you are the only one getting defensive. Now you want the thread closed?

You come here complaining how little money you make (I dont know too many people who would state their hourly pay publicly on the internet!). Think about it this way: 10+ years ago before we were in such a big problem with the loss of American manufacturing, which equals loss of american jobs, perhaps you would have been able to get a better paying job. There are thousands of skilled American's who are out of work because we have lost our manufacturing to Asia. If you aren't one of those skilled Americans who cant get work because china has taken your job, perhaps you should look into finding a field you can learn, and make more money, instead of complaining about it on the internet.

I think you have gotten a lot of good input here, and If I were you, I'd sit back and just think about what you should do, and not try to prove your point here on a message board.

 

[chad s]

This was posted on page 1. Better stuff at a better price. Can't afford it all at once? Why not buy some then next week buy some more, rather than paying interest? I just never understand why someone would want to finance something (how-much-a-month) when they could buy it outright for less if they just saved up, and being able to use what they would have paid in interest towards their next purchase.

I don't know which manufacturer makes the exact BluePoint stuff you ordered, but it is safe to assume that it is rebadged and sold elsewhere without the BluePoint name for a lot less.

Exactly!!!

Clearly you're unable to figure out the idea of comparisons. We're talking about things that are better or worse than other options for the same price. Nobody said your BluePoint stuff was low quality, or that Snap-on ratcheting wrenches were the best thing since sliced bread. The BluePoint is still a worse value (quality vs cost) than other options and the Snap-on ratcheting stuff is some of the best available (since all ratcheting wrench mechanisms are made overseas). You got suckered by a smooth talking high pressure Snap-on driver, deal with it.

Once again, dead on!

 

[bman123]

I wasn't pressured by the snap on guy at all, it was my decision to get the set I wanted.I wanted the opinions from people here about blue point and I got them,Thank you.I am sure I could have done better for less but it is convenient with the SO guy coming to my job every weds.I will admit I have trouble with money in my pocket,I tend to spend instead of save.So me being able to give SO money every week instead of me driving to Kmart and paying lay away is a plus,also with me having to pay weekly I know I'll have the money and not blow it.
I'll also admit I am young and dumb,I have no problem saying this.I have made a mistake and so what I am sure are more to be made by me.I can try to avoid them but it will happen.Part of growing old is learning off of mistakes and I learned from this one.
I appreciate everyones opinion here Thankyou once again.
I am gonna use my credit of $200 and get my F80,hex keys and screwdrivers then look where you guys have pointed me to get wrenches,ext,sockets.
So thankyou all for learning the new guy something I do appreciate it Thanks Alot.

 

[DavidtheDuke]

I wasn't pressured by the snap on guy at all, it was my decision to get the set I wanted.I wanted the opinions from people here about blue point and I got them,Thank you.I am sure I could have done better for less but it is convenient with the SO guy coming to my job every weds.I will admit I have trouble with money in my pocket,I tend to spend instead of save.So me being able to give SO money every week instead of me driving to Kmart and paying lay away is a plus,also with me having to pay weekly I know I'll have the money and not blow it.
I'll also admit I am young and dumb,I have no problem saying this.I have made a mistake and so what I am sure are more to be made by me.I can try to avoid them but it will happen.Part of growing old is learning off of mistakes and I learned from this one.
I appreciate everyones opinion here Thankyou once again.
I am gonna use my credit of $200 and get my F80,hex keys and screwdrivers then look where you guys have pointed me to get wrenches,ext,sockets.
So thankyou all for learning the new guy something I do appreciate it Thanks Alot.

I bought a $1100 BP set when I just started out. You're ahead of me I've upgraded to the big names, mostly SO, yes. I made a mistake but I can't say the sell was a ripoff.

 

[krusty the clown]

gear wrench maufacturer is.......

http://cens.com/censv1/en/company_profile.jsp?SUP_ID=7753

 

[Lyaec350]

I am gonna use my credit of $200 and get my F80,hex keys and screwdrivers then look where you guys have pointed me to get wrenches,ext,sockets.
So thankyou all for learning the new guy something I do appreciate it Thanks Alot.

Good call, you'll love the F80 and the screwdrivers. Best of luck...

 

[eschoendorff]

Much nicer tools coming out of Taiwan are the ones sold to Snap-On, Facom, SK, and Stanley Proto. The Taiwanese stuff made for the Gearwrench brand are made by a company called Lea Way Hand Tool Corporation. It's not garbage, but it's unlikely that Lea Way could ever meet the quality standards of Snap On, much less Facom.

Sounds like marketing has been bending you over...

We've done testing where certain Taiwanese tools are beating Craftsman every single time, every parameter. No Gearwrench product is going to do that. At any rate, a lot of the Gearwrench stuff is not made in Taiwan, it is made in China.

Sorry dude... not buying it. You're gonna have to back this stuff up...

And comparing Taiwan quality with China is like comparing Japan with India.

See... and this is one of those things that people say that's just dumb. China is capable of manufacturing top-quality goods. The goods that they export are not always be the best quality... but it is simply what the initial buyer is willing to put up with/pay for. And it is that **** that is passed long to the American consumer.

Speaking of quality... what the hell is up with Craftsman raised-panel wrenches? The cut and finish on those things is awful! Makes you wonder what kind of worn out tooling they are using to produce these things... at any rate, I'd rather use a GearWrench standard style combination wrench than a Cman raised-panel. Flame away... but at this point, I wouldn't use them just because they are USA made. I know that makes me the devil, but there is no excuse for that kinda of garbage. USA made stuff is supposed to be better quality... doesn't mean that it is.

 

[reversegear]

Sorry dude... not buying it. You're gonna have to back this stuff up...

Look, I can certainly appreciate being skeptical of the ravings of some anonymous guy on the internet, but I hope you can understand that I can't publish my company's test data here. I'll say again- Taiwanese companies produce wrenches for Facom. I think this can be confirmed with a little digging, but you may have to speak French or something. Now if you want to believe that your Gearwrench branded tool is better quality than its Facom counterpart, then ok. But I'll still say that the companies that can produce for Facom or Proto are the "top line" of the Taiwanese. I personally would buy Taiwanese Blue Point over Gearwrench.

If you can look at a copy of the Japanese "Factory Gear Magazine", they did independent testing of all the ratcheting wrenches sold in Japan. Gearwrench was not close to the top. If necessary, I suppose I can scan the pages and post their results here, but I'm not really that into it. When all is said and done, it's your money- go buy what what you like. And while we're 'backing this stuff up', could you let me know what evidence you have that supports your original claim?

See... and this is one of those things that people say that's just dumb. China is capable of manufacturing top-quality goods. The goods that they export are not always be the best quality... but it is simply what the initial buyer is willing to put up with/pay for. And it is that **** that is passed long to the American consumer.

Absolutely incorrect. And I don't know how to back this up except to point out that I have been to dozens of factories in China and Taiwan, and I'll take a wild guess that you haven't. You can't even get the quality of steel in China that you can get from Taiwan or U.S., and there isn't the technical expertise nor the culture of quality to produce top goods. They are getting better all the time, and in ten (maybe 5?) years your assertion will probably be correct. For now, you could argue that a company could[/] start a factory there and import all of the materials and labor, and produce top quality, and I can only say that this has not been done yet in the tool business. Don't know about other industries.

Some Taiwanese company owns the patent for the ratcheting mechanism so, most (all?) ratcheting wrenches are produced there (some--Craftsman for sure, dunno about others--have the wrench blanks produced here and the guts produced there).

Sort of. There are many patents for the ratcheting mechanisms, different for the single direction and reversing types. Go to Google Patents and search for "ratcheting wrench", "gear wrench", etc. These patents are almost all held by about a dozen Taiwanese firms. There is some licensing, and there have been several lawsuits. Lea Way owned the patent for the original gear wrench, and when Danaher bought Lea Way, it got all of Lea Way's I.P. But there are other designs and patents for the same product, and some of them are improvements over the original.

 

[Merkava_4]

reversegear, you're writing some interesting stuff; I'll be paying close attention to your posts from here on out.

 

[DavidtheDuke]

Sort of. There are many patents for the ratcheting mechanisms, different for the single direction and reversing types. Go to Google Patents and search for "ratcheting wrench", "gear wrench", etc. These patents are almost all held by about a dozen Taiwanese firms. There is some licensing, and there have been several lawsuits. Lea Way owned the patent for the original gear wrench, and when Danaher bought Lea Way, it got all of Lea Way's I.P. But there are other designs and patents for the same product, and some of them are improvements over the original.

Hey reversegear, do you happen to know where these are made? http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=17480&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

Are the gears sent to the USA for them to be assembled in the wrenches? I ask this specifically because it doesn't say USA on the wrenches, however in the SO catalogue it showed an American worker assembling one of the wrenches at one of SO USA hand tool plants.

 

[reversegear]

Hey reversegear, do you happen to know where these are made? http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=17480&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

Are the gears sent to the USA for them to be assembled in the wrenches? I ask this specifically because it doesn't say USA on the wrenches, however in the SO catalogue it showed an American worker assembling one of the wrenches at one of SO USA hand tool plants.

This came up a couple of months ago, and I said that both Snap-On and Blue Point versions were made by the same Taiwan manufacturer. Someone (was it you?) pointed out that is says in the back of the Snap-On catalog that "all Snap-On ratcheting wrenches are forged and machined in the USA". I checked my Snap-On catalog, and sure enough that's what it said. A couple of phone calls later and I learned that they do indeed 'forge and machine' the wrenches in the U.S., and they also assemble them with internal components from the same Taiwan manufacturer that makes the Blue Point wrenches from them.

I probably should have come back and explained that I had been wrong about this, but by then the thread was buried a couple of pages deep, and well, you know.

And even now, I can't really understand why they do that. With all the internal parts being imported, they can't say it is Made in USA. The gear wheel, pawl, spring, etc. can all be produced in the U.S. by Snap-On if they want to, so what is the advantage of selling a half-made in USA tool? I'll just assume they know what they are doing and not overthink it.

 

[DavidtheDuke]

This came up a couple of months ago, and I said that both Snap-On and Blue Point versions were made by the same Taiwan manufacturer. Someone (was it you?) pointed out that is says in the back of the Snap-On catalog that "all Snap-On ratcheting wrenches are forged and machined in the USA". I checked my Snap-On catalog, and sure enough that's what it said. A couple of phone calls later and I learned that they do indeed 'forge and machine' the wrenches in the U.S., and they also assemble them with internal components from the same Taiwan manufacturer that makes the Blue Point wrenches from them.

That's what I thought, the lever looks very similar to the BPs ( I own the SO ones). And yeah, it was me.

I probably should have come back and explained that I had been wrong about this, but by then the thread was buried a couple of pages deep, and well, you know.

And even now, I can't really understand why they do that. With all the internal parts being imported, they can't say it is Made in USA. The gear wheel, pawl, spring, etc. can all be produced in the U.S. by Snap-On if they want to, so what is the advantage of selling a half-made in USA tool? I'll just assume they know what they are doing and not overthink it.

Maybe it's a patent issue, and they can't manufacture it themselves? Maybe they don't want to buy a machine for one kind of tool (which isn't likely considering the lengths SO goes to manufacture something themselves).

 

[eschoendorff]

Look, I can certainly appreciate being skeptical of the ravings of some anonymous guy on the internet, but I hope you can understand that I can't publish my company's test data here. I'll say again- Taiwanese companies produce wrenches for Facom. I think this can be confirmed with a little digging, but you may have to speak French or something. Now if you want to believe that your Gearwrench branded tool is better quality than its Facom counterpart, then ok. But I'll still say that the companies that can produce for Facom or Proto are the "top line" of the Taiwanese. I personally would buy Taiwanese Blue Point over Gearwrench.

I understand that you cannot reveal your company's test data. I also am a huge fan of FACOM stuff. But you're going to have to do a lot more than just rave like some anonymous guy on the internet to get me to believe that Blue Point is a better quality product than GearWrench. I have GearWrench ratcheting wrenches - some are made in Taiwan and others are made in China. You cannot tell the difference. Spec are specs and if a manufacturer is making products to spec, it really shouldn't matter if it is made in China, Taiwan or Timbuktu.

If you can look at a copy of the Japanese "Factory Gear Magazine", they did independent testing of all the ratcheting wrenches sold in Japan. Gearwrench was not close to the top. If necessary, I suppose I can scan the pages and post their results here, but I'm not really that into it. When all is said and done, it's your money- go buy what what you like. And while we're 'backing this stuff up', could you let me know what evidence you have that supports your original claim?

How old are these tests? Chinese quality (while I hate to admit it) is getting better every year. If it wasn't there would be warranty issues up the wazoo with goods from computers to plywood. There are quality issues with many Chinese goods... but Chinese goods from major brands tend to have the east issues. I will also say that the fit and finish on the GearWrench stuff is above the USA-made Craftsman stuff (some Cman Pro stuff notwithstanding). In fact, I have GearWrench stuff that has better fit and finish than my Armstrong wrenches!

How do I back up my claims? Well, I have been on this board for some time and anecdotal claims actually seem to hold some credence here. And until you can post some objective evidence, your claims are simply anecdotal as well. How do we know that you have been to Chinese and Taiwanese factories? I am not saying that you haven't - I'm just saying that all we have is your word (and I for one actually believe that you have visited those factories). All any of us have is each others' words. But there are a few of us who realize that GearWrench has stepped up its game in the recent past and at this point, I see no reason to buy Blue Point over GearWrench except for the warranty on the Snap On truck. Even then, unless you have a good relationship with your Snap On dealer, you're on you're own....

How 'bout this?

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...&group_ID=1142&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=47257

I know it's not a wrench, but it's a good example of Blue Points marketing strategy... can you tell me (aside from the color of the caliper's face) the difference????

Absolutely incorrect. And I don't know how to back this up except to point out that I have been to dozens of factories in China and Taiwan, and I'll take a wild guess that you haven't. You can't even get the quality of steel in China that you can get from Taiwan or U.S., and there isn't the technical expertise nor the culture of quality to produce top goods. They are getting better all the time, and in ten (maybe 5?) years your assertion will probably be correct. For now, you could argue that a company could[/] start a factory there and import all of the materials and labor, and produce top quality, and I can only say that this has not been done yet in the tool business. Don't know about other industries.

That may have been true in the past... but I just ain't buying it. Anything is available... for a price. Standards are standards... specs are specs and when American tooling is being sent to China to manufacture goods for respected American brands... well, I am sure that with your experience you can figure out the rest.

Sort of. There are many patents for the ratcheting mechanisms, different for the single direction and reversing types. Go to Google Patents and search for "ratcheting wrench", "gear wrench", etc. These patents are almost all held by about a dozen Taiwanese firms. There is some licensing, and there have been several lawsuits. Lea Way owned the patent for the original gear wrench, and when Danaher bought Lea Way, it got all of Lea Way's I.P. But there are other designs and patents for the same product, and some of them are improvements over the original.

This seems completely plausible. Snap On and Blue Point ratcheting wrenches indeed seem to be a slight variation on the original Lea Way theme. But better? Maybe... but for now there are plenty of folks that earn their money with GearWrench and Craftsman, Husky, Blackhawk products and continue to spend less on their wrenches than they would have if they had bought Blue Point or Snap On.

I'll be teh first to admit that Snap On makes a fine product - some of their products are head and shoulders above the rest of the industry - and that is why I buy from them. But in the OP's situation, I FIRMLY believe that he would have been just as well served with GearWrench products - or even Craftsman for the $$$ he spent.

 

[dps]

How 'bout this?

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...&group_ID=1142&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=47257

I know it's not a wrench, but it's a good example of Blue Points marketing strategy... can you tell me (aside from the color of the caliper's face) the difference????

Double the price one more time and change the face to red and you might find it in a Griot's catalogue...

 

[rodm1]

I think you will be very happy with your choice. If you have to replace anything you can do it on the spot. I'm shire they will be happy to upgrade you to Snappy if something brakes, if you pay the difference in price.

I would rather do that then fight with Craftsman or running down to S&K for replacement.

 

[Merkava_4]

I sure as heck wouldn't want one of those Blue-Point ratchets that look like a woman's best friend.

 

[Mike83]

I sure as heck wouldn't want one of those Blue-Point ratchets that look like a woman's best friend.

Seriously, you might end up finding that in the bedstand

 

[bman123]

That's fine with me as long as she brings her hot friend

 

[Merkava_4]

Don't be surprised if that Blue-Point ratchet winds up missing after Joan or Jean was over at the house.

 

[bman123]

No-way it stays locked up in the safe until I get home so I can show em how to use the tool the right way.
It is funny I thought the same thing when I first saw it.I wonder why they made it that way,it must be a dual purpose tool.

 

[wilbilt]

That's fine with me as long as she brings her hot friend

WOOT!

 

[eschoendorff]

Don't be surprised if that Blue-Point ratchet winds up missing after Joan or Jean was over at the house.

That's nasty!

 

[bman123]

Hey all I gotta say is the more the merrier,that's how it goes right?
I really wonder why they made the ratchets like that it is kinda funny tho.I will have to look at them weds in person when the snappy guy shows up

 

[Monte]

Look, I can certainly appreciate being skeptical of the ravings of some anonymous guy on the internet, but I hope you can understand that I can't publish my company's test data here. I'll say again- Taiwanese companies produce wrenches for Facom. I think this can be confirmed with a little digging, but you may have to speak French or something. Now if you want to believe that your Gearwrench branded tool is better quality than its Facom counterpart, then ok. But I'll still say that the companies that can produce for Facom or Proto are the "top line" of the Taiwanese. I personally would buy Taiwanese Blue Point over Gearwrench.

If you can look at a copy of the Japanese "Factory Gear Magazine", they did independent testing of all the ratcheting wrenches sold in Japan. Gearwrench was not close to the top. If necessary, I suppose I can scan the pages and post their results here, but I'm not really that into it. When all is said and done, it's your money- go buy what what you like. And while we're 'backing this stuff up', could you let me know what evidence you have that supports your original claim?



Absolutely incorrect. And I don't know how to back this up except to point out that I have been to dozens of factories in China and Taiwan, and I'll take a wild guess that you haven't. You can't even get the quality of steel in China that you can get from Taiwan or U.S., and there isn't the technical expertise nor the culture of quality to produce top goods. They are getting better all the time, and in ten (maybe 5?) years your assertion will probably be correct. For now, you could argue that a company could[/] start a factory there and import all of the materials and labor, and produce top quality, and I can only say that this has not been done yet in the tool business. Don't know about other industries.



Sort of. There are many patents for the ratcheting mechanisms, different for the single direction and reversing types. Go to Google Patents and search for "ratcheting wrench", "gear wrench", etc. These patents are almost all held by about a dozen Taiwanese firms. There is some licensing, and there have been several lawsuits. Lea Way owned the patent for the original gear wrench, and when Danaher bought Lea Way, it got all of Lea Way's I.P. But there are other designs and patents for the same product, and some of them are improvements over the original.

@reversegear: could you please tell me in which issue of the "Factory Gear Magazine" the test was in ? Maybe i can get it through the japanese book-store here. (or if you could scan it that would be very helpful too) I`d like to see who won and would like to see some test data so I know which wrenches i should buy. Since most of them should be available here in germany too either under their own name like Hans tool, Force, gearwrench or they`re rebadged Infar/geartech, HiFive etc.
So which brand should I buy ??
Gear wrench ? Reverse gear ? Pro-gear ? Geartech ? Frenway ? Chiao Ba ?Hung Jyeh ? Chang Loon ? Winnic ? ?

 

[reversegear]

Monte, who do you work for? No consumer, European or American, knows all those companies and brands. And even I had to look up Frenway, as I only knew the Ampro brand. I think you must work in this industry. Come on, confess! Wuerth? Berner? Forch? Signet (ha ha ha)?

 

[-B-]

Out sourcing exists with in the main label itself here is one glaring example http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...group_ID=20139&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog it is just a re-labeled Flambeau http://flambeau.thomasnet.com/viewi...s-153-cabinet-infinite-divider-storage-system


http://www.caseclub.com/infinite_divider_storage_system.htm

 

[Vinko]

I can provide translations of Japanese reviews if you scan the pages. French too.

 

[autoace]

bman, don't sweat it, you are young, the deal has been stuck and I am sure the tools will be everything you expect and more. Do not let anyone tell you decent tools only come off the truck though as there are still a good many quality brands not riding on the truck.

Here is my advice, enjoy your new tools and do not be in a real hurry to add much to your pile for now. Read this board and follow the tool topics daily, and the next time you are itchin to buy more tools start a thread and ask for some input regarding brand, cost etc. and see what you get for feedback; you will learn a lot about quality tools in a hurry. Enjoy your new purchase and welcome to the board.

+1

I got some of the Blue Point combo. wrenches as a gift, they are satin finish, made in Taiwan............I noticed I grab them alot, like the feel etc...

The Blue Point tools will be fine! You can add some other favorites in the long run.

Don't forget about Cornwell for future add-ons, some of their tools cannot be beat, even by Snap-on

 

[autoace]

Damn..........this is an old thread, hate it when that sucker punches me.