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Bobcat or Bobcat Mini for Garage Foundation

kmacht

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Apr 12, 2010
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I need to excavate an area for my garage slab. This requires digging down about 12" to remove the soil and then back filling with about 10 yards of 3/4" stone. I started to dig it out by hand this weekend and found that the soil is full of rocks. So I am going to rent a machine. The local rental center has a choice of a regular Bobcat S175 for $250 for the day. The price is high because I have to pay for delivery. The other obtion is a mini bobcat with tracks. It is a MT52 with a toothed bucket. They want $155 for the day but it is light enough to pick up with a trailer so I don't have to pay delivery. So my question is, has anyone ever used one of the mini-bobcats before? Will they dig ok? Will the tracks destroy the lawn any more than the wheels of the S175? Any advice you can offer is appreciated.

Keith
 
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Cuda

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Unless you are limited by space I always say bigger is better. You can usually get more done quicker, thus maybe save some on rental fees.
I would think either unit is gonna tear up lawn since they both are in essence "skid steers", unless I'm not understanding what a bobcat is.
 

Torque1st

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You need the bucket with teeth no matter which machine you use. Weight = power so get the biggest machine you can.

Do you have somewhere to put the excavated soil?

Good operators make using a machine look easy. It is NOT easy and there is a big learning curve.
 

NUTTSGT

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Have you asked any of the small local contractor what they would charge to come and dig it out ? They may come by for a quick evening jobs to make a few extra bucks. A few phone calls are cheap.
 

bondsman

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Apr 20, 2010
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I used a Bobcat mini excavator for my footer. Everyone is right...there is a learning curve and it would probably be more beneficial to pay someone to operate it for you. I also had a friends bobcat over here.. It was small and I used it to clear the grass and level the area. I got used to driving it but was nowhere near able to operate it efficiently. I would spend all day doing what my experienced buddy did in a half hour.
 

Bjkearns

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If you dont have access to certain equipment, finding someone willing to do some moonlighting can be very useful
All parties involved should walk away happy
 
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kmacht

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I have asked around a few placed for price quotes on what it would cost to do the work. Almost all of them were around $150 an hour with a four hour minimum. That's almost 3x what it would cost to rent either machine. I rented a skid steer last year to put in a pool so I am familiar with how to operate one somewhat efficiently. What I haven't done is use one of the mini walk behind machines like the MT52. My concern is if it will have enough power to do the digging and move the stone. I tried watching a few youtube videos on the machine and it looked like it spent alot of time just spinning the tracks trying to move material.

Keith
 

poppop

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Keedysville,Md
Get the MT52.It will do what you need it to do.I own one and have dug out many small projects.The tracks are easy on the grass as long as you are not turning in a tight area.
 
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kmacht

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Do you recommend a bucket with or without teeth on the end? The one parked out in front of the rental shop has one with teeth but they might have a smooth bucket also. It would seem that the teeth might be easier for digging but the smooth blade might be easier for leveling. Thoughts?

Keith
 

bimmer1980

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York, PA
get one of each. I wish I had teeth on my bucket. It has a hard time digging into virgin or packed soil. On the other hand, a smooth bucket is great for smoothing the rock or soil.

Right now I'm in the process of filling the inside of my garage with rock. I usually rough dump with the skid steer and then hand rack to smooth, and then plate pack it with my compactor. So if to hand rack the stone and compact it, you could get by with just the tooth bucket.

so don't forget to rent the plate compactor as well!
 
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kmacht

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Getting one of each isn't an option. They charge an arm and a leg for each attachment you want to rent. I don't mind hand raking if needed. I only have two areas to dig out. One is a 11x25 and the other is 5x14. I haven't forgotten about the compactor. The plan is to rent a jumping jack compactor for 1/2 a day once I start spreading the stone. I have a clay soil so I am told that the jumping jack will get me a better compaction than a vibratory machine.

Keith
 

FiredupF5

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my local john deere dealer has a tractor they rent out (not sure which model but it's got 30+hp and it 4x4) with a loader and choice of backhoe, york rake or brush hog for $275 per day. when I do my garage next year I think that's the route I'm taking.
 
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Cuda

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I rented a skid steer last week and was able to get a "tooth bar" accessery. It just bolts on to your regular bucket. Can't remember what I paid extra for it but it was affordable.... or I wouldn't have gotten it.
 

csp

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If your soil is rocky get a tooth bucket for whatever machine you go with.

A decent operator can get pretty smooth leveling with a tooth bucket by backdragging witht he teeth elevated above the ground.
 

lupinsea

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Mar 30, 2010
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I'm not an expert equipment operator by any means but some questions do crop up from what I'm reading RE your first post:

How big of an area to dig?
How big of an area do you need to dig for your garage expansion? If it's a sizable area then you might consider stepping up to the larger piece of equipment. There is a risk with the smaller equipment that it simply won't get the job done in time.

Digging Power
Also, the larger equpment will have more weight and thus be able to exert more force on the bucket for digging. This is especially true if you have tough soil to dig through (which it sounds like you do).

Teeth vs. No Teeth
The teeth will make it significantly easier to dig through tough soil. Instead of distributing the force of the buck across a broad edge, that same force is concentrated at the tip of each tooth. It really helps to break up the soil. Like the difference between digging with a pick ax vs. a squared off transfer shovel. I would imagine that you could get things reasonably smoothed down by back dragging with the toothed bucked. Enough that it shouldn' take much more time with a hand rake before hitting the area with a plate compactor.

Stock piling material?
Someone else asked this already but I didn't see a response. Do you have a place to store the material you're removing from the work site? 12" down x garage foot print would end up being a lot of material for a typical garage. Keep in mind that excavated soil is "fluffier" and takes up a greater volume than the soil in the ground. Anyways, you'll need to first put that soil some place and then dispose of it if you can't reuse it around your site.

Same Day or Separate Day Rentals?
10 cubic yards is a lot of material to move around. That's about a full dump truck load. You sure you want to do that with the little walk-behind, especially if you are trying to do the digging and rock spreading in the same day.

Come to think of that, do you think you can dig and spread within the same rental period? Would it make sense to rent for two days, either consecutively or separated by a few days or so?


Bottom line here, not knowing anything else it's sounding like it will make sense to get the larger Bobcat. I know it ***** to have to spend more than you want on a project (I'm running into that with the need to hire a concrete pump truck for my shed foundtation pour), but sometimes it's the wise thing to do.
 

KMR Construction

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Newport RI
Get the bigger machine with the toothed bucket. I watched the guy behind me f with one of those small ones for 3 days to dig a 12x12 patio. I could have probably done it in 3 hrs with a regular skid steer. Would have offered to help but he screwed a buddy of mine
 

6768rogues

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I have a couple of Bobcats. Teeth on the bucket will help with digging but will **** for backblading to get your fill smooth. A couple of hours in the seat and you will be able to stay out of trouble. After a hundred hours the machine will act as though it were a part of your body, but you don't have that much time. If I were you, I would hire someone to do the job.
 

tfi racing

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I agree with all that recommend to try find someone who will swing by and do the job for a bit extra cash or even do it the legit way,trust us you will save money and aggravation by hiring the experienced pro,unless of course you have several hundred hours experience operating the machine already.Then again you may be the one in a thousand natural talent and breeze through it in record time...

Ask me how I know...:thumbup:
 

ratdoggy

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I agree with all that recommend to try find someone who will swing by and do the job for a bit extra cash or even do it the legit way,trust us you will save money and aggravation by hiring the experienced pro,unless of course you have several hundred hours experience operating the machine already.Then again you may be the one in a thousand natural talent and breeze through it in record time...

Ask me how I know...:thumbup:
I use one at work everyday practically.
It took me a while to get to the point where it was an extension of myself. The other hidden cost is while you are getting used to the machine what if you damage your fence or truck because you rotated the bucket instead of lifting it?
Try Craigslist there has to be someone in your area that is reasonable and even if you can't find a deal it's probably still cheaper in the long run to get someone who knows how to use one
 

southernfriedcj

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Dec 28, 2005
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Athens, GA
I don't have a problem back dragging with a toothed bucket. Set the bucket nice and flat on the fill & drag away.
Every sub that works for me that uses a skid steer uses a toothed bucket.
 

Crusty Nut

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Mar 16, 2008
Messages
475
I just built a tooth bar for my tractor bucket and don't think it will be coming off anytime soon. What a difference in digging ability. The walk behind ones are just big toys and really ideally suited to mucking out animal stalls. You need a real sit in machine.
 
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kmacht

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Connecticut
Just wanted to post a follow-up. I ended up renting the smaller walk behind machine and got a bucket with teeth for it. All in all, this ended up being a really good choice. The smaller machine let me get in and out of places alot easier than a full sized bobcat, didn't tear up my lawn nearly as bad, and dug the ground out easily. It took me about a 1/2 hour to get used to the machine. After that I didn't even really have to think about what lever to push to get it to do what I wanted. Digging out the area took about 3 hours and spreading and tamping the stone took another 2. The dirt that I dug up I used as fill for another part of the yard so there was no problem finding a place for it. There were only two disadvantages to the machine that I could see. The first is that you can't see the front edge of the bucket when trying to dig. At first, until I got the hang of it I had to have someone stand in front of the machine to help me figure out how far to tip the bucket forward when trying to dig. The other disadvantage is when it came to tree roots. Anthing over about 1" in diameter gave the machine some trouble. Without alot of weight, if you got under a root with the bucket you could actually pick up the back end of the machine when trying to break through it. Other than that, it was a good machine for the job and would recommend it to someone with the same type of project.

Keith
 

crewchief888

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NW indiana
glad the mt52 worked out for you :)

sometimes that small of a machine causes you, the operator, to work harder.
that machine dont have a lot of "***" to it, and with the limited lift capacity, it sometimes takes a long time to move material if you have to go very far. too bad they didnt have the ride-on platform for ya

:beer:
 
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