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Bosch or Dewalt impact driver?

BD1

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I have dewalt 18 volt tools. too many batteries to change now. However AMAZON has the dewalt BARE tools on sale. Bought the 3/8" impact for 86.00 and the 1/4" for 77.00. I did notice their prices changes and one day it was 87, next down to 78. Their site says no price adjustment but their price is lowest at THAT TIME ! nothing worse to buy cheap at 82 and next day see it for 77. So, once you purchase don't look back. I have a older model dewalt radio too thats nice for using it as another charger.
 
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TheGrooveking

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If you feel comfortable with the battery inside the handle i would choose between Bosch or Milwaukee, if you want a slim handle i would wait until Panasonic offers their tools outside of Japan :)

Hitachi quality is "so-so" and Dewalt only offers a limited amount of tools, i also don´t know if a single speed driver is good. So i would wait if Dewalt will offer more tools and maybe offer a 2-speed driver in the future and if Hitachi upgrade the quality without the flimsy left/right switches and chucks/spindles with axial and radial play...maybe the 2nd generation will be better...

Ridgid ("AEG") only offers 3 tools, they´re big, clumsy and heavy, the circumference of the chuck is huge and overall the least attractive offering.


I am still using a 9.6V Panasonic cordless drill that I bought back in 1991 so Panasonic has been available here at some industrial supply houses since at least then. Hitachi's quality has been as good or better than Makita. My Hitachi power tools including 2 18V LiIon 1/2" drive impact wrenches, reciprocating saw and hammerdrill have been abused by me and have had not problems.

TheGrooveking
 

Stuey

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I have dewalt 18 volt tools. too many batteries to change now. However AMAZON has the dewalt BARE tools on sale. Bought the 3/8" impact for 86.00 and the 1/4" for 77.00. I did notice their prices changes and one day it was 87, next down to 78. Their site says no price adjustment but their price is lowest at THAT TIME ! nothing worse to buy cheap at 82 and next day see it for 77. So, once you purchase don't look back. I have a older model dewalt radio too thats nice for using it as another charger.
If an item hasn't shipped yet, you can sometimes ask (beg) for a price adjustment over the phone or chat.

There's nothing worse than seeing something at the same price for 2 months and then dropping by 20% right after you order.
 

Dave.R

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My local lowes has the Bosch 18v Impact and Drill for $199, 2 batteries, and a charger. I have last years model and love it. Great for little projects under the hood.
 

t1r2u3s4t

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That would happen more often that you think at Amazon.com. I think most of the prices are set using a bunch of logic triggers, and a purchase is definitely a trigger. Whether the price would go up or down after an item is purchased often depends on the #items in stock the frequency of purchases. The lower the stock the more likely the price would go up, since Amazon likes to keep at least 1 item in stock. If all of a sudden a bunch of items is sold, then the price would shoot way up to maximize the profit. So on so forth...

If an item hasn't shipped yet, you can sometimes ask (beg) for a price adjustment over the phone or chat.

There's nothing worse than seeing something at the same price for 2 months and then dropping by 20% right after you order.
 

Stuey

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That would happen more often that you think at Amazon.com. I think most of the prices are set using a bunch of logic triggers, and a purchase is definitely a trigger. Whether the price would go up or down after an item is purchased often depends on the #items in stock the frequency of purchases. The lower the stock the more likely the price would go up, since Amazon likes to keep at least 1 item in stock. If all of a sudden a bunch of items is sold, then the price would shoot way up to maximize the profit. So on so forth...
Not in the cases I'm referring to, which involve consumer electronics and what seemed to be specifically timed price drops.

But I have seen cases of the likes you're talking about, where an item will be one price for a while until it gets attention, after which it will either drop further or climb back to normal pricing.
 

Monte

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Hitachi's quality has been as good or better than Makita. My Hitachi power tools including 2 18V LiIon 1/2" drive impact wrenches, reciprocating saw and hammerdrill have been abused by me and have had not problems.
TheGrooveking

subjective quality of their 10.8 Volt tools is not as good as others (imho)
 
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imom

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Correction: Bosch PS21 CAN accept 1" bits. I assume the PS41 might as well, but cannot find it at the moment. Sorry for the confusion!

Removing them is a little slower than w/ the Dewalt since Dewalt has a spring mechanism release.

Now I'm puzzled. I kow I had big issues recently with 1" bits getting stuck in drill/driver impact drivers, but if it's not the Bosch ones, which ones am I thinking of?

Okay...so in the video on Amazon review...this person gave it 3 stars...and he used a hex drill bit and using only one hand and letting the drill bit spin on it's own, the driver was wobbling like crazy and he mentioned that it was because it didn't take the hex end all the way in... so I wonder if the Dewalt 12Vmax version would not wobble as much as the hex drill bit would be set more inside the driver.

So Stuey... do you know or does anyone with PS21 confirm this? I'm really confused now from Stuey's comments of not accepting 1" bits to accepting them.
 

Stuey

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Okay...so in the video on Amazon review...this person gave it 3 stars...and he used a hex drill bit and using only one hand and letting the drill bit spin on it's own, the driver was wobbling like crazy and he mentioned that it was because it didn't take the hex end all the way in... so I wonder if the Dewalt 12Vmax version would not wobble as much as the hex drill bit would be set more inside the driver.

So Stuey... do you know or does anyone with PS21 confirm this? I'm really confused now from Stuey's comments of not accepting 1" bits to accepting them.
My saying that it didn't take 1" bits was a mistake, hence my updated statement. I have no idea which tool I was referring to, maybe an 18V version?

The PS21 ***** with drill bits. They all do. There's too much play in the hex chuck. Has nothing to do with depth of bit, it's the walls.

Let me see what I can come up with.
 

Danglerb

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I would only drill with an impact driver on very rare occasions and then just deal with a little wobble until the bit goes in enough to keep it straight.
 

Stuey

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Okay...so in the video on Amazon review...this person gave it 3 stars...and he used a hex drill bit and using only one hand and letting the drill bit spin on it's own, the driver was wobbling like crazy and he mentioned that it was because it didn't take the hex end all the way in... so I wonder if the Dewalt 12Vmax version would not wobble as much as the hex drill bit would be set more inside the driver.

So Stuey... do you know or does anyone with PS21 confirm this? I'm really confused now from Stuey's comments of not accepting 1" bits to accepting them.
This quick video should help clear things up. I hope it doesn't make things worse!
 
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imom

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Stuey, Thank you so much for the video and the demonstration...made everything clear. I definitely want an impact driver for big screws, but PS21 will not work for me... I for sure want a regular cordless drill. You the man!!! Thank you!

Also great to see the dewalt one hand action with the hex chuck... wish more people would do reviews... I saw a youtube review on the bosch and it was just a testimony of a carpenter saying how he likes it...not video of the product in action. Your video is awesome.
 

Stuey

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Stuey, Thank you so much for the video and the demonstration...made everything clear. I definitely want an impact driver for big screws, but PS21 will not work for me... I for sure want a regular cordless drill. You the man!!! Thank you!

Also great to see the dewalt one hand action with the hex chuck... wish more people would do reviews... I saw a youtube review on the bosch and it was just a testimony of a carpenter saying how he likes it...not video of the product in action. Your video is awesome.
Glad to help! I regretfully only had time to put things together quickly using a FLIP, but figured a video right away is better than a promise that gets put off for a month.

Strangely, the Dewalt 20V Max impact driver doesn't have as much ejection range as the 12V Max.

Impact is great for longer and fatter fasteners, with the PS21 versatile across the lower range. I smoked up my Dewalt 12V Max screwdriver trying to drive in lags. It then kept chugging along like nothing happened.

And yes, a cordless drill is really the best way to go for making holes. Those with larger budgets will be well off with one of each, but if one has to choose two, a drill/driver plus impact driver is a great combo.

I have a Bosch PS41 around here somewhere and might be able to squeeze out a comparison. But really, they're both great models. I prefer the Dewalt since its svelter handle is a little bit more comfortable for me to hold.
 

Greatbear

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Okay, since I have so damn many of these Bosch drivers and impactors, here's a side-by-side comparison with each one chucking a 1" Milwaukee Phillips #2 bit, fully seated in the tool.

PS20 vs. PS21
bits1.jpg


PS40 vs. PS41
bits2.jpg


25618 (18V Li Impactor) vs. 26618 (18V Li combo 2-speed drill/driver and Impactor)​
bits3.jpg


PS10 vs. 26618
bits4.jpg



Note that all of these tools lock the bit in place with various success. All but the PS21 keep the bit in place mainly with the friction of the locking ball in the chuck. If the bit sticks in the screw, it will pull out of the chuck fairly easily. The PS21 has a similar mechanism, but with a slightly smaller ball and a tighter locking action against the slight groove in the bit. With the bit locked in the PS21 chuck, it won't come out with pliers. Releasing the chuck on the PS 21 lets the bit come out with fingertip grip. On all the rest, the bit is too far back, you need pliers to withdraw the bit, or if the chuck is not too dirty, shaking and tapping the tool with the chuck pointing down will let the bit drop out.

As Stuey shows, all of these tools have at least some wobble in the chuck. This will eventually get worse over time as the inside of the chuck wears, bit even with the mileage on some of these tools of mine, I haven't noticed any increase. The reason why the PS21 seems to have more wobble is because the chuck itself is shallower, for one, simple geometry will show this is inevitable. Depending on the type of bit, if the locking groove is too wide or cut too far forward, part of the groove will extend outside the chuck, leaving only the heel end to maintain radial integrity. Most often this isn't a problem, except for long bits. Even the best fitting drill bits will wobble in a 1/4 hex chuck. The best solution I have come up with is a conversion chuck, particularly this one made by DeWalt:

chuck1.jpg

This particular chuck has an unusual hand tightening method in the collar actually "impacts" to loosen or tighten. Insert the bit, tighten the chuck by hand, then hold the black outer collar while pulling the trigger. The collar strikes internal ramped anvils to tighten the chuck, much the same way a typical impactor functions. The same process works in reverse. If you pull the collar toward the tool, you make the hits harder. The hidden beauty is that if you push the collar toward the bit, the impacting stops and the collar lets the rest of the chuck free-spin smoothly in hand. Holding the chuck in this way stops all wobble, and it's very easy to precisely place the spinning bit. I keep this with the 26618 combo driver since this is my go-to tool to carry when I want only one tool to handle impacting, drilling and driving, and I don't need to use hex-shanked bits. I have yet to find some really good hex drill bits, most I have come across have pot metal shanks molded onto (at best fair quality) drill bits, and the runout on some of those things is atrocious.

And, yes, I do have way too many power tools of all kinds. This is a mere fraction. I should do some reviews. ;) :thumbup:
 
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imom

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Greatbear ... a review would benefit a lot of people... I wonder if maybe a moderator or someone can create a new section for reviews with sub categories or Stuey allows for user reviews on his website for a database for power tools.... think it would come in handy for the shopper to a new technology or product.

As in this case, I think the dewalt is a better combo kit because it comes with an impact and then a regular cordless drill. I never had dewalt before... I hope it is reliable product...My old makita has lasted for a long time...but I don't use it everyday.

Thanks again everyone for commenting and helping.
 
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Stuey

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Greatbear, great demo and examples!

Ah, I remember about the impact conversion chuck now that you mention it:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000KKWLE8/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I remember reading about it a while ago and thinking that it looked neat. Not sure if I would use something like that though, but then again if I need to drill holes I have a drill easily within reach. If I had to lug two tools around everywhere, I might be much more willing to give this a try.
 

BD1

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hi, why not use a magnetic adapter for tips ??? they are available in numerous lengths too. they even have a telescopic model !
 
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98TJ

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I was in Lowe's a couple of days ago and saw a DeWalt 12V Drill/Driver, Impact, and Driver 3-tool kit with two batteries for $199 if I remember correctly.

*EDIT*

Just found it on the website. Shows $224 in my area.

DCF610 12 volt MAX* screwdriver features 1/4" one hand loading hex chuck
DCF815 12 volt MAX* 1/4" impact driver features 3 LED lights to provide visibility without shadows
DCD710 12 volt MAX* 3/8" drill/driver features two speed transmission (0-400 / 0-1500)

http://www.lowes.com/pd_364888-70-D...tt=dewalt+kit&Ns=p_product_price|1&facetInfo=
 
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Monte

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Thank you for posting, I lvoes me Bosch 10.8 volt stuff, along with me Milwaukee M12 stuff.

TheGrooveking

To own both is the best option :thumbup:

Noticed that the other day as well. I'm REALLY eager to see if it's released in the USA. Might give Milwaukee some nice competition.

But in reality, I don't see many tradesmen going for these small hammer drills. I'm a fan though, they're great for quick 1/4" holes.

i guess they will release it because Milwaukee has one.

There is a discussion about this tool in the german Bosch forum, some say they buy it anyway, some don´t need it, some say it´s a nice universal tool for every household, some say it´s good for kitchen assembly, IKEA assembly, fast small holes like 6 or 8mm for wall plugs for storage shelves etc. in soft stone etc.
 

Greatbear

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hi, why not use a magnetic adapter for tips ??? they are available in numerous lengths too. they even have a telescopic model !

I use magnetic bit holders often. The only problems are the bit holders add length to the tool, which makes getting into tight spots harder, and the holder absorbs some of the impact force. Unless I am in need of maximum power or have to poke the tool into a tight spot, I use a holder.
 

Stuey

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To own both is the best option :thumbup:



i guess they will release it because Milwaukee has one.

There is a discussion about this tool in the german Bosch forum, some say they buy it anyway, some don´t need it, some say it´s a nice universal tool for every household, some say it´s good for kitchen assembly, IKEA assembly, fast small holes like 6 or 8mm for wall plugs for storage shelves etc. in soft stone etc.
IKEA assembly?! I made the mistake of using a power driver on IKEA furniture before. Overtorqued the fastener and made for a sloppy fit. =(
 

a***nc83

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I have two 18 volt Dewalt Impacts, DW056 (that came with the 1/4" slip in connection, but i converted it to 3/8 anvil) and the DC825KA (a more recent purchase). While i haven't had much time with the DC825KA, it seems just as smooth and tough as the DW056. The DW056 is an absolute workhorse, i have built a stone patio (used it to drill out 1 1/2" holes in 2' think stones for lights), renovated 3 bathrooms with it, and put in over 1500 sq. ft. of plywood subfloor with it, as well as install an entirely new set of kitchen cabinets.

Not sure about the battery comment earlier, my original NiCad batteries are still going, although now i have a set of Li-ions, which i use primarily.

My uncle has a Milwaukee impact driver, that i used on several occasions, and to be honest, it didn't seem as well balanced as the Dewalt. That probably sounds silly, but the Dewalt feels perfectly balanced in my hand compared to the Milwaukee, and that comes in handy, when i am driving in a fastener with one hand.
 
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imom

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Well I returned my Bosch I got for $109...and I got the DEWALT DCK211S2 kit instead with the extra battery for $128.25... Not sure if Bosch or Dewalt is better, but I like this kit because it comes with an impact driver and then with cordless drill...so no wobble hopefully. I also picked up the clutch tip from dewalt for the impact driver...all this from amazon.... think it's the cheapest it's been right now. It's not as good as the home depot makita 4 pc set, but this will do...
 

BD1

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hi, AMAZON has select Dewalt tools and accessories at great prices right now. When you spend 100.00 or more you get a instant 25.00 discount! I order the 1/4 18 volt bare tool and accessory kit and total was around $103 then got $25 bucks off! awesome!!! Then ordered 3/8 impact 18 volt and another impact kit with sockets and got $25 bucks off that order too. I am set now. You gotta monitor prices. They change daily !
 

Stuey

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hi, AMAZON has select Dewalt tools and accessories at great prices right now. When you spend 100.00 or more you get a instant 25.00 discount! I order the 1/4 18 volt bare tool and accessory kit and total was around $103 then got $25 bucks off! awesome!!! Then ordered 3/8 impact 18 volt and another impact kit with sockets and got $25 bucks off that order too. I am set now. You gotta monitor prices. They change daily !
You're a little late, but I'm sure some people benefited from the reminder.

http://toolguyd.com/2011/11/dewalt-coupon-save-25-off-100-tools-and-accessories/

Those ebay prices are TERRIBLE! That Dewalt is $20 cheaper on Amazon AND eligible for $25 off $100 extra discount.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002RT7K4Q/?tag=atomicindus08-20

And that Makita set is also much cheaper on Amazon, not even including the extra $20 coupon at checkout!

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001DISXWU/?tag=atomicindus08-20
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001LNN2R8/?tag=atomicindus08-20

In any case, the Dewalt 20V impact can accept 1" bits, not sure if that 18V version can.
 

stickshift

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Stuey or anyone else, any thoughts as to whether we are going to see lower than BF prices for impact drivers and combo kits before the holiday season is over?
 

Stuey

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Stuey or anyone else, any thoughts as to whether we are going to see lower than BF prices for impact drivers and combo kits before the holiday season is over?
I don't think so.

imho, this is prime time. Later on in the season, consumers' shopping money runs out. Bigger ticket items like drills and impacts might not be discounted as much. Stores are going to be more likely to try to get you in the door with cheaper incentives.

Amazon makes up their own rules, but they usually don't stray too far away from MSRP when it comes to power tools.

They do have a lenient holiday return policy, so if the price of a tool drops substantially, you can always do a buy + return to get the lower price, but will have to eat the return shipping.
 

stickshift

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I don't think so.

imho, this is prime time. Later on in the season, consumers' shopping money runs out. Bigger ticket items like drills and impacts might not be discounted as much. Stores are going to be more likely to try to get you in the door with cheaper incentives.

Amazon makes up their own rules, but they usually don't stray too far away from MSRP when it comes to power tools.

They do have a lenient holiday return policy, so if the price of a tool drops substantially, you can always do a buy + return to get the lower price, but will have to eat the return shipping.
Thanks for your take.

When do you envision the first big sales take place in 2012? Presidents Weekend? I ask because I bought the Makita 12v 4pc kit ($144), but thinking about returning and waiting for a great deal on a 2pc kit. But if we're not gonna see those kind of prices until late next year, I'll just stand pat with what I've got.
 

Stuey

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Thanks for your take.

When do you envision the first big sales take place in 2012? Presidents Weekend? I ask because I bought the Makita 12v 4pc kit ($144), but thinking about returning and waiting for a great deal on a 2pc kit. But if we're not gonna see those kind of prices until late next year, I'll just stand pat with what I've got.
That's really hard to say. With power tools, there aren't that many big sales. Margins are low, and pro-grade tools are not considered consumer goods.

You can usually count on big promotions around Father's Day and Christmas. Everything else is a bit unpredictable.

If you're talking about this deal - http://toolguyd.com/2011/11/makita-12v-4-tool-combo-for-149/ , I highly doubt you will find a better Makita deal. You might be able to score a Bosch or Dewalt 12V drill/impact deal, but I don't think you'll find a better drill + saw kit for the money.

What are your needs - are all you're looking for is a 12V cordless impact and 12V drill? Even then, you should be able to sell the saw from your kit for maybe $40-50 easy. Throw in the flashlight for $5-10 for good measure if you don't want it.
 
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imom

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I didn't go with the HD makita 4 pc deal because the impact driver was the older model... it had only 1 LED...otherwise it's a pretty awesome deal even with tax
 

cashishift

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Dewalt 12v MAX gets my vote.

I have the kit and rarely take my 18v along unless i know I am going to need a bigger or 2nd drill.
 

stickshift

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That's really hard to say. With power tools, there aren't that many big sales. Margins are low, and pro-grade tools are not considered consumer goods.

You can usually count on big promotions around Father's Day and Christmas. Everything else is a bit unpredictable.

If you're talking about this deal - http://toolguyd.com/2011/11/makita-12v-4-tool-combo-for-149/ , I highly doubt you will find a better Makita deal. You might be able to score a Bosch or Dewalt 12V drill/impact deal, but I don't think you'll find a better drill + saw kit for the money.

What are your needs - are all you're looking for is a 12V cordless impact and 12V drill? Even then, you should be able to sell the saw from your kit for maybe $40-50 easy. Throw in the flashlight for $5-10 for good measure if you don't want it.
Yeah, only really need the drill and impact. Yep, I put up an ad on CL earlier today for the saw and flashlight, so if I can get reasonable prices for those, that gets me the pieces I need at a lower total cost.
 

Stuey

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Yeah, only really need the drill and impact. Yep, I put up an ad on CL earlier today for the saw and flashlight, so if I can get reasonable prices for those, that gets me the pieces I need at a lower total cost.
If you can't sell it, your next best deal would be to return it and buy a Dewalt kit. But that will still run you $150 after coupon, but you'd score an extra battery.
 

stickshift

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If you can't sell it, your next best deal would be to return it and buy a Dewalt kit. But that will still run you $150 after coupon, but you'd score an extra battery.
Decent idea. The Dewalt would get me 19% more torque from the impact driver (assuming Amzn site is wrong about 79 "inch lbs"), but looking at the pics, it seems at the cost of slightly more bulk and potentially less maneuverability in tight spaces since the battery pack sits at the bottom on the Dewalt vs. in the handle for the Makita.

My impression is that Makita, Milwaukee and Bosch are a notch above Dewalt in terms of reputation and quality. I've seen a number of complaints that Dewalt isn't what it used to be. True? In the end, I'm guessing it won't make any difference for a casual DIY'er.
 
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Stuey

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I don't know how Dewalt of 2011 compares to the past, but I'm a fan of their cordless tools. I also had the pleasure of meeting many of their product managers. They're passionate about their tools and don't look to cut any corners.

Torque on the impact is 79 ft-lbs, or 950 in-lbs
 
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