Bridgeport M Head DRO Install

[nine4gmc]

Anyone here install a DRO on an old round ram BP? I have the 9x32 table round ram mill and want to install a 3 axis DRO on it and have some questions.

Do you install the Z axis on the knee or quill?

What size linear scales did you use?

I'm looking at the cheap Chinese ebay kits, anyone here have one they can recommend?

Anything I should know or be aware of?

 

[toolchaser]

Not a Bridgeport, I put a 2 axis from CDCO on my Wells- Index . Not too hard , plenty of adjustment on the mount brackets. As far as the Z axis, I've seen them both ways. I have a separate quill reader. I find it handy for drill depth control. You already have a knee travel ring thats pretty accurate due to the knee weight taking up the backlash. The only tip I can give you is use good quality taps & be careful as the cast iron is hard & grabby on small taps

 

[OccupantRJ]

I have not started researching on a future DRO for my Bridgeport yet, so I would also be interested in feedback on a decent quality and reasonably priced setup.

 

[K.Weber]

Stay away from eBay Chinese kits unless they have some what of a reputation. Check out enco supplier or just low level acu-rite.

 

[jmarkwolf]

I installed an X,Y DroPro system on my Bridgeport Series 1 J-Head, and love it.

The knee doesn't have the backlash issue that X & Y axiis do, so I just use the dial on the knee and don't miss the Z-channel on the DRO.

I did put a Mitutoyo readout on the quill however for depth-of-cut indication.

I've had occasion to use the new Igaging DRO scales at work for a non-machining application and was pleasantly surprised at the quality. Check them out.

The DroPro website has pics of hundreds of installations so you can get plenty of ideas there.

Scales need to be longer than the travel of your bed to accommodate bed plus mounting hardware, etc.

 

[dr_clyde]

I have a 3 axis setup on my Bridgeport 2J, and I have the Z on the quill. If I could do it again, I would put the Z on the knee and use a separate quill readout for hole depth. It is much easier to adjust slot and cutter depths with the knee, keeping the quill locked. The only time the quill depth is useful is when drilling holes to specific depths.

I have an accurite, but I'm looking to swap it out with DROPros. The x on my accurite is acting up after 20+ years, and the DROPros is an excellent alternative for not a lot of cash. I have several friends who have one and they all recommend it.

 

[nine4gmc]

All good info, thanks for posting.

You mention get longer scales than needed but I don't want to order some too long either.

My table is 9x32 but the travel is 9x20 so for the 9" axis, would I go 10" travel length or 12"? The scales I'm looking at are measured by travel and are actually 141mm longer than the travel.

Then on the X axis, it travels 20" but the table is 32", do you think the 550mm(21.6") would be good there?

And finally the Y axis, I like the idea of it being on the knee with a separate stand alone quill readout so the knee moves 16" but it's too high to cut when all the way up so would a 15.75" work on the knee or would you go with the 17.7" next size up?

Here is one of the kits I' looking at, the feedback is great on all the DRO units.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-DRO-3-A...087225?hash=item25cd5b1079:g:wuIAAOSw4GVYUPuF

And is there a big difference in 5um and 1um resolution? I'm not making rocket ship parts, I'll probably be making brackets and things that do NOT require much precision, the mill just makes it easier to work.

This is the quill readout I'm looking at.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vertical-Li...845648?hash=item2a77482e90:g:MNIAAOSw44BYUqdM

 

[Willie Makeit]

5 um = 0.0002
1 um = 3.937e-5

... so yes, it is quite a bit of difference in resolution but we're talking a round-ram B'port and you can't work to those resolutions on that machine anyway. go with the cheaper option.

 

[astroracer]

http://www.tpactools.com/2-AXIS-DRO-DIGTAL-READOUT-MILL-PACKAGE-NEW_p_21.html
I saw no real good way to put a Z axis on the FrankenMill so I ordered a 2 axis DRO from Tpac Tools. Tom was quick in getting me the product and in helping get it set up.
The first order of business was getting the display panel hung on the mill. I bent up a piece of .090 thick aluminum and drilled and tapped some 10-24 holes in the head to attach it.

The back side. It is very sturdy and the display is rock steady.

With the display arm atached.

Hanging the X-axis scale.
I drilled and tapped directly into the Y slide for the reader and into the X slide for the scale. There was plenty of adjustment to get the scale leveled up and squared to the reader and slide.

This did shorten up the Y axis travel but there was no other way to mount the scale and keep it out of harms way.

The Y scale took a bit more figuring. I used two of the supplied brackets, modifying one of them to get the positioning I needed.
Drilled and tapped directly into the knee for the right angle bracket. The bar you see sitting on the bracket came with the kit also. I drilled and tapped that on the narrow side for some 10-24's to attach it to the right angle bracket from the bottom.

That bar also got drilled and tapped on the ends so the scale would bolt directly to it.
With the scale hard mounted to the knee I had to modify this kit plate to reach the slide on the underside of the scale.

Opening up the slots on the end and drilling and tapping new holes farther down, got me there.

You can see the two screws at the top that attach the slide to the Y cross slide. I drilled and tapped those for some more 10-24's.
I got the chip guards installed and calibrated the DRO. I was pretty impressed with the old FrankenMill. The difference in the readout from the actual dial travel was 0.521mm's over 20.5 inches. I checked this 4 times and that was the nominal I got.
The Y was out 0.250mm's over 6.63 inches of travel. I checked this 4 times also and took the nominal number for calibration. This should make the FrankenMill much more repeatable. I have been using it nearly everyday for two years and have no complaints at all. For the money it is very well made and works like a charm. I have used the bolt pattern feature quite a few times now and am amazed at how much time it saves.
Mark

 

[rsanter]

Typically you put the z axis on the knee. But if you wanted to you could put it on the quill.
You can also get a 4 axis that will look at the position of the knee and the quill and do the math for a direct readout. Those tend to be more expensive.

For sizes, you want the scale to be shorter than the table but longer than the machines travel.
Shift your table from one limit to the other and measure what that travel is. Then add a few inches and go with that. When you are measuring and looking at where you will mount it, it will make scenes

Bob

 

[larry_g]

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=273996

The above link is to a thread I documented on a DRO install on my mill. Not a Bridgeport but you may find some pertinent information. I don't know if your mill has all square edge slides or if rounded like mine and will require some machining of mounts or castings to get things mounted. As for the length of the scale, DRO pros site has a perty good check sheet to determine the length. One thing you have to pay attention to is that the reader head can mount in a position so that an offset scale, if necessary, will still be in the travel range.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Ign]

Dr Clyde nailed it. You want the Z on the knee. Order a Mitutoyo standalone for the quill itself.

I re-fitted a Mitutoyo on my J head and honestly was so glad I was just replacing an older glass scale unit that had gone south. I thought I would have been hard-pressed to figure out mounting on my own (but I know I could have done w help from forums). The Y is the bYtch.

For the X, put it on the backside of the table. When I purchased my BP it was on the front of the table. Dumb, you lose that T-slot.

I can't say enough about Mitutoyo's digital scales - they work just like their calipers. They DO NOT lose position at power off AND they read even if you move the scales (table) while turned off. Awesome. And no contaminants can affect them unlike a glass scale that will "go blind" if it encounters an errant acetal shaving.

Techies will argue they're not as accurate as glass scales but they're still PLENTY accurate - believe me. C'mon, how tight do you really expect to be on an old manual mill anyway??? You'll easily hold a half thou all day long limited only by your tooling, table screws and skill - NOT the DRO.

All future DROs for me will be the Mitutoyo digi system, they're rock solid and simple

 

[nine4gmc]

More great info, thanks for posting guys, I will be making a decision and ordering tonight.

Is there anyone with a 3 axis that wish they would have went with a 2 axis?

And same question for you guys with 2 axis, do you wish you had 3 axis?

I'm a tightwad for sure and would love to save the extra money if the knee axis is not a big deal but I would hate to regret it down the road and wish I had it if it is something that would be useful.

 

[astroracer]

Having it on the knee was an option but, when I am counter boring holes or making shallow slots it would be much more useful having it directly on the quill. Touching off the boring tool, setting zero and then boring to depth with the quill is easier then raising and lowering the knee to do the same job.
Mark

 

[Ign]

Here's the Z on my import mill. Looks like big standoff blocks are your friend, and the top block is much thicker than the bottom to accommodate for column taper.

 

[Ign]

Having it on the knee was an option but, when I am counter boring holes or making shallow slots it would be much more useful having it directly on the quill. Touching off the boring tool, setting zero and then boring to depth with the quill is easier then raising and lowering the knee to do the same job.
Mark

Then BAM! Problem solved for $200. I have this and Z on the knee. No reason not to.

 

[Ign]

Here's the import Y. Note finger indicates where it hits my power feed and cheats me out of ~1/8" I need to drill and tap these channels I make regularly. So close yet so far. I plan to "90" this bracket in to allow for extra TINY bit of travel I need to do these parts in one shot

 

[Ign]

I also regularly make these shafts w .020" flat. But each shaft will often sit a tiny bit differently in its collet block. Having the Z readout is so nice to touch off and then crank the knee up .020".

Most of the time you want your quill locked because 1) end mills will **** down when they hit the work and 2) quills have too much slop for accurate control by hand if you're IN the part. A knee, however, is easily controlled even while cutting. That said, you CAN just use the knee dial. The readout is just a luxury but does allow for less eye strain and greater repeatability. It's kinda like if you're ordering a new truck, why NOT order it w a/c -- it's just DAMN nice to have!

 

[Ign]

This is the Mitutoyo I'd get if starting from zero. I think the "KA COUNTER" is the non-glass scales I love - I really just love that I can turn it off at night and keep position when I fire it up the next morning.

 

[nine4gmc]

Oh man that Mitutoyo is NICE! Way out my price range though and probably more than I paid for the mill.

I'll stick with the cheap Chinese on this first mill, if I upgrade to a newer/better model I will certainly consider a higher end DRO for it.

 

[Ign]

You're typically looking around a grand for the 2-axis and 2 scales.

Have you looked into the tablet based stuff? Can be affordable.

 

[nine4gmc]

I was looking into tablet based with Igaging, I have a Samsung 7" that would be perfect but I would hate to "date" the system. Like I would not want to have to upgrade my tablet every few years just to be able to use the software. IDK if that is a problem or not but it seems a Chinese clone of that Mitutoyo or DRO PRO would not require any upgrades in my lifetime.

 

[nine4gmc]

I forgot about this thread. DRO install complete, piece of cake. It literally took me longer to find the right size/length hardware for the scales needing spacers than it took me to install the DRO.
The DRO came from here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/162359087225?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
The seller accepted my offer and shipped quickly. The scale package was slightly opened but everything was intact and I'm very pleased with the purchase.









I got the Y axis set up and working then realized I needed to put the shield in place and had to take it all back apart, fit the shield and line everything back up straight.

 

[Ign]

Excellent! You'll never know how you ran a machine without one after using it for a couple days.

 

[Rick_Br]

I have been looking at that same DRO - did you encounter any install issues? What size scales did you order versus your table movement?

Thanks
Rick

 

[nine4gmc]

Thanks guys!

Rick, literally the only issues I ran into was not having long enough machine screws to go though the scales that needed spacers. If my hardware drawer was more organized or would have been able to run to Lowes at 3am I would not have had any issues really.

Basically for scale length I took the mill specs of table travel and rounded up to the next Metric size scale available. Like the X axis on my mill moves 20" and 20" is equal to 508mm, so for my X axis I went with the next size up which is 550mm. The Z axis was 16" and that's about 406mm so I went with 450mm Scales there.

 

[Rick_Br]

Thanks for the scale length info - I haven't made a final decision yet. I keep wondering if I really need a DRO for the somewhat limited milling I do but I bet its like the power feed I just installed - you don't know what you are missing until you have used one.

Rick

 

[TheEquineFencer]

Thanks for the scale length info - I haven't made a final decision yet. I keep wondering if I really need a DRO for the somewhat limited milling I do but I bet its like the power feed I just installed - you don't know what you are missing until you have used one.

Rick

Nines I'm starting to look into repairing/replacing the damaged DRO on my BP mill. I may have found something even cheaper than what you have, but may end up going your route. I'm hoping I can use the scales I have and just add a display that's BlueTooth.

Have you checked the accuracy with a Dial Indicator yet? How hard was it to get it put on straight?

Rick, you're right about "you don't know what you are missing until you have used one." My old BP mill had an http://acu-rite.com/site/ DRO. My present mill without a DRO to me is about useless at times because of the slop in the travel. The old mill was worse but with DRO I could do some decent work.

Nine's, when I have time, I'm going through all your threads. RJ suggested it. First about looking at this thread, then as usual, when RJ suggest something, I check it out and end up spending HOURS reading and learning....

Just from reading about some of the cabinets and such you built, you've given me some ideas....much like RJ.

 

[nine4gmc]

Thanks TEF, I have not checked accuracy yet, I just borrowed Merc's tram tool today so maybe this week I can tram it in and check the accuracy.

There's a lot of room for adjustments in the slots for the hardware. If it's off any, it shouldn't be hard to correct.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I've got to tram my mill too. RJ told me how to do it with my HF dial indicator. I think he said for me not to have it set perfect, but to have it a little "off" for chip clearing unless it was really critical mill job.

A buddy just gave me a BIG "plug" of bee's wax. It seems I read somewhere you melt it and kerosene to coat the bare metal to prevent it from rusting. I'm going to pull everything off the mill today and start getting it cleaned back up to coat all the machined surfaces then tram it. I'm going to lay a plate glass panel on the bed so the dial indicator can slide easy around in a circle.

 

[OccupantRJ]

Nines I'm starting to look into repairing/replacing the damaged DRO on my BP mill. I may have found something even cheaper than what you have, but may end up going your route. I'm hoping I can use the scales I have and just add a display that's BlueTooth.

Have you checked the accuracy with a Dial Indicator yet? How hard was it to get it put on straight?

Rick, you're right about "you don't know what you are missing until you have used one." My old BP mill had an http://acu-rite.com/site/ DRO. My present mill without a DRO to me is about useless at times because of the slop in the travel. The old mill was worse but with DRO I could do some decent work.

Nine's, when I have time, I'm going through all your threads. RJ suggested it. First about looking at this thread, then as usual, when RJ suggest something, I check it out and end up spending HOURS reading and learning....

Just from reading about some of the cabinets and such you built, you've given me some ideas....much like RJ.

I have my ways.......

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I have my ways.......

LOL, I know how to build rabbit boxes too....

let me know...