Britool (Made in England) thread

[Nigelhirst]

For the advancement of engineering, I bought 7BA X 1/2" as well.
There are a slightly tighter fit, but the heads are a more suitable size, so that's what I am using

 

[B.Boru]

''''

 

[Nigelhirst]

Yes you were right
The originals were as you describe, and with a Pozidriv head. The BA screw supplier said that a lot of screws for this application were 'specials'.

This is the eBay reference for what I bought: 332145599962

N

 

[B.Boru]

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[B.Boru]

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[Nigelhirst]

^^ Thanks again.

Here's another question - Do the screw sizes vary between the various drive sizes of Britool ratchets? I reckon they'd have to, not just in length but also in diameter.

Brian.B.

Good question. Now I will have to look. They may even be different between the A45 and A74. I don't have a 1/4 drive one but they look to have peened fasteners ...

 

[Nigelhirst]

Given how valuable these boxes are, he might 'lose' them.

B.

"Dear Mr Insurance Broker. I would like to insure my (empty) toolbox...."

 

[humber2]

9/32" Square Drive Sockets I'm Seeking

I have a near complete unmolested set in the 8" tin box with 2 socket rows and I seek to fill the "gaps" which are the following sizes.

1BA coded MH365

3/16 W/W MH445

1/2 a/f MH500

3/8 a/f MH375

7/32 a/f MH219

1/4 sq. MQ250

5/16 sq. MQ312

3/8 sq. MQ375

Can anyone post the Catalog page from a pre 1968 issue to identify the set and quantify the Drive accessories please.

Now that my first set has been found I anticipate another might follow to close out the gaps.

 

[dutchgray]

Picked up some Jenbro open ends
View media item 800424 Whitworth 1 inch
They are bare steel, seller has wire wheeled them clean.

 

[B.Boru]

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[B.Boru]

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[winchman]

Sat waiting for Parcel force to deliver another set for my Son's collection!

 

[fanders]

Sat waiting for Parcel force to deliver another set for my Son's collection!

This Set 109A perhaps? Sold yesterday on eBay, had a nice E77 round head ratchet and the box looked in great condition:

View media item 80094
View media item 80093
View media item 80092
Incidentally the red enamel paint in the inlay portion of the handle looks like a standard Britool finish used for a while, I've seen it on other ratchet handles and also the beam-type torque wrenches.

 

[B.Boru]

''''

 

[fanders]

9/32" Square Drive Sockets I'm Seeking

I have a near complete unmolested set in the 8" tin box with 2 socket rows and I seek to fill the "gaps" which are the following sizes.

1BA coded MH365

3/16 W/W MH445

1/2 a/f MH500

3/8 a/f MH375

7/32 a/f MH219

1/4 sq. MQ250

5/16 sq. MQ312

3/8 sq. MQ375

Can anyone post the Catalog page from a pre 1968 issue to identify the set and quantify the Drive accessories please.

Now that my first set has been found I anticipate another might follow to close out the gaps.

Here's the catalogue page from Cat. 104 (circa 1962), which show the sizes supplied in M-series socket sets:

View media item 80114

 

[winchman]

This Set 109A perhaps? Sold yesterday on eBay, had a nice E77 round head ratchet and the box looked in great condition:

View media item 80094
View media item 80093
View media item 80092
Incidentally the red enamel paint in the inlay portion of the handle looks like a standard Britool finish used for a while, I've seen it on other ratchet handles and also the beam-type torque wrenches.

My Son kept an eye on this and was shocked at what it went for but we had never seen one?
A few months ago he bought a set, spoke on the phone, bloke was very nice, paid it arrived and only half of it was Britool! cleverly taken photos or innocent mistake we will never know, he was gutted but yesterday I managed to get the same set in almost unused condition!
I will post a photo later.

 

[winchman]

Heres a picture

 

[fanders]

Nice, is the box paint in good condition?

I think we need to see a 'fleet photo' of all the Britools together!

 

[winchman]

Nice, is the box paint in good condition?

I think we need to see a 'fleet photo' of all the Britools together!

Outside isn't quite as good but still the best we have seen.
Just counted up and he has 7!
We have only just been talking about the day two years ago he was undecided whether to buy the 1/4 drive set in as new condition for £5! Glad he bought it as it started off his collection.
Hoping to go to a local Flea market tomorrow looking for odds and ends, found some Britool bits in the past.
What we need is some one to scan any catalogues so we can date stuff.

 

[winchman]

Nice, is the box paint in good condition?

I think we need to see a 'fleet photo' of all the Britools together!

Problem now is he has started with Britool spanners!
I did get him a job lot of about 20 for £20 so that helped.
Has any one got any catalogues they could scan?

 

[fanders]

Check out the catalogue scans at post #134 onwards on this thread for info on Britool spanners

 

[humber2]

Check out the catalogue scans at post #134 onwards on this thread for info on Britool spanners

That's a good reminder of what's back on pages 7 and 8.

And thanks for the 9/32 drive details.

 

[winchman]

Here's the catalogue page from Cat. 104 (circa 1962), which show the sizes supplied in M-series socket sets:

View media item 80114

Thanks for this I managed to find one for my son, Why did they not come with a ratchet?
Ours came with a Tipco 1/4 ratchet and a Britool adaptor 1/4 to 9/32, the Tipco I suspect is a re branded Britool?
As luck would have it we had a snap on Midget M70m 9/32 ratchet which looks perfect as a set.
Has any one got a correct box for this they would be willing to sell?

 

[Dave455]

Why did they not come with a ratchet?
Ours came with a Tipco 1/4 ratchet and a Britool adaptor 1/4 to 9/32, the Tipco I suspect is a re branded Britool?

A RATCHET! Expensive luxury lad! (Said in Northern accent)!

A lot of sets came without ratchets back then! Mostly they were used with the screwdriver handle. The T handle bring used for leverage, or with the extensions for awkward access!

The Tipco 1/4 inch ratchet I have is different to the Britool of the same era. Definitely not a rebrand!

In this day and age where so many firms do so little, it's hard to get your head around the fact that only a generation back the U.K. had at least 6 or 7 totally different firms all making substantial quantities of socket spanners and accessories, all in house!

 

[winchman]

Thanks Dave
The chap we bought it from told me he bought it from a military surplus place that sold them with the Tipco ratchet, I will have another look but I thought it was the same as a Britool and King **** one I have seen?
I worked for Britool in 1989 and remember the shed stamping out spanners and sockets in Cannock, no doubt all gone aboard now.

 

[fanders]

I worked for Britool in 1989 and remember the shed stamping out spanners and sockets in Cannock, no doubt all gone aboard now.

That sounds interesting, could you describe what working for Britool was like back then? I'm always interested to hear what life was like back in the days when Britool and the like were knocking out tools. Were the jobs specialised or did folk move from department to department as the demand for certain types of tool dictated?

 

[winchman]

That sounds interesting, could you describe what working for Britool was like back then? I'm always interested to hear what life was like back in the days when Britool and the like were knocking out tools. Were the jobs specialised or did folk move from department to department as the demand for certain types of tool dictated?

Not Good!
Basically in 1989 Britool sold the industrial range, but had the idea of manufacturing a high quality range to compete with Snap On, they called it Hallmark.
They sold it just like Snap On, via franchised dealers, I made a big investment to buy the franchise, but sadly Britool had many of the sums wrong and several supply and quality issues and my self and 71 other dealer had a bit of a court case which we won.
Basically they tried to set up the Mobile dealers too quickly with some key elements missing.
Part way through this battle Facom purchased James Neil tools including Britool.
I believe another company now market the Hallmark range and its of good quality and sells well some here.
https://www.chrometrader.co.uk/brands/britool-hallmark.html
I think the other Britool is marketed as Expert range?

The factory was an average tool factory, from memory most people just did the same job, two old dears used to service and build torque wrenches quicker than any machine could whilst talking non stop about last nights tv programme.
The press shop had basically a conveyor that a tool blank either socket or spanner would roll down and hit a pair of electrical contacts which would pass a current causing the steel to get very hot in seconds, almost melting, then it would move under the hammer and be stamped out as a blank, then linished to remove sharp edges etc then heat treated then plated and polished.
The Cannock site only made chrome ware, sockets spanners etc.
From memory Tool boxes where made by Bott, pliers Elliot Lucas, Screwdrivers possibly Wera? Other odds and ends I think came from KD tools who supplied Snap on, Oxford did the welders.
The one thing that stuck in my mind was the rodent house, two old blokes used to pamper Rats kept in hundreds of cages 24/7.
The rats were a vital part of the process so must be well kept and well fed.

 

[Dave455]

Great story winchman, really glad you were able to post it!

Yes, the sad truth is that, right from the James Neill takeover in the 70's, the quality was starting to drop. Noticeable in the handles and extensions, though I always felt that the quality of the sockets was maintained in this period. I have some that I purchased new inthe early 80's and they're every bit as good as those from the 60's.

By 1989 it must have been just about 'game over'. I know a lot of folks attribute the trashing of Britool to Facom, but in all honesty, whatever idiots passed for management in that era had already done a pretty good job. I can remember going out to buy some metric sockets in the late 80's, and being so disgusted by what I was offerred from Britool that I stopped by a Snap On truck and bought theirs. Nothing you are saying surprises me.

I never encountered the British made Hallmark stuff. What I've seen pictures of looks superb. The current Hallmark stuff is Taiwanese. O.K. No better or worse than any other Taiwanese stuff. Nowhere near old Britool quality though.

Stanley own Facom so still own the name. Their crappiest range of tools (for the man who makes it to the Mac truck, but can't afford Mac, and can't afford Facom either) is branded internationally as 'Expert'. For a while it was branded in the U.K. as 'Britool Expert' (a crude ploy to cash in on the name) but last time I saw the tools it seems that's been just about abandoned.

I know one of the sites is a housing estate now, with a crappy statue of some spanners outside. The idiot who made it couldn't even be bothered to make them look like Britool spanners. The original Owen Road factory was still there when I last drive past though (probably a decade ago) and remarkably unchanged!

As to the rodent house.... err, no comment!

 

[winchman]

Its a sad end to the company but I feel it just didn't move with the times

 

[fanders]

Thanks for your recollections winchman, very interesting.

I wonder if the Cannock site (Churchbridge Works, Walsall Road) was smaller than the famous Bushbury factory - artist rendering below from the 1949 Catalogue 95:

View media item 80696
What a hive of industry it must have been in its heyday. Looking rather sad after the move to Cannock in (I think) 1990:

View media item 80697
At least the quality tools live on to be appreciated and used today.

 

[winchman]

Cannock was a fraction of the size

 

[winchman]

Well my son has finally found one of the bits he has been looking for.
Can any one help with the missing handle, Key, logo or correct colour?
Or a Catalogue scan?
Thanks in advance

 

[humber2]

Well my son has finally found one of the bits he has been looking for.
Can any one help with the missing handle, Key, logo or correct colour?
Or a Catalogue scan?
Thanks in advance

Fanders posted on page 7 #132 catalog 104 which has this cabinet on the cover.

 

[Dave455]

Well my son has finally found one of the bits he has been looking for.
Can any one help with the missing handle, Key, logo or correct colour?
Or a Catalogue scan?
Thanks in advance

Www.isaydingdong.co.uk offer replacement logo's!

They only offer the foil stickers though.

 

[davy_boy2004]

Decided to look through some of my odd britool sockets and came across this one EB1000 1"A/F with a strange recess inside that i have never seen before.
Anybody seen this before or know what its for ?

 

[winchman]

I think thats the marks left by the tooling when it was stamped out

 

[winchman]

Well my son has finally found one of the bits he has been looking for.
Can any one help with the missing handle, Key, logo or correct colour?
Or a Catalogue scan?
Thanks in advance

Having taken the draw liners out it look to have been painted in a Hammered finish? So any one know of a source of colour matched hammers type paint

 

[davy_boy2004]

I think thats the marks left by the tooling when it was stamped out

Seems the most likely answer never seen one left like that before of any make.

 

[winchman]

When rooting through sockets at Flea markets you often see a small box with imported socket in fro the 1960's they have exactly the same profile internally.

 

[davy_boy2004]

When rooting through sockets at Flea markets you often see a small box with imported socket in fro the 1960's they have exactly the same profile internally.

Thanks for the information i must have only used newer stuff apart from this.
only started looking through my stuff after finding this thread on the forum. mainly spanners that i have and 3/4 sockets i have picked up over the years.