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Broken, tilted garage floor slab: alternative solutions

gfmucci

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Nov 27, 2016
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I have a 45 year old detached wood frame 2-car garage (20 x 20) on a concrete slab. Not sure what kind if any footers or rebar are in the slab.

The slab is cracked/broken across its width about half way back likely due to erosion toward the rear of the garage under the slab. The back side of the garage is 1.5 to 2" below the point of the crack.

Assuming I take measures to correct the soil erosion to minimize or stop additional settlement and movement, I have several options:

Leave it as is and live with it.
Hire a concrete leveler - the surface pour on type
Hire a mud-or foam jacker to raise and stabilize the slab.

Ram Jack and similar steel jacking firms are prohibitively expensive for this application to the point they suggested a tear down and rebuild. They said 4 or more jacks might be required at over $1,500 per jack. Ain't goin' to happen.

Also, a tear down and rebuild is not in my budget and will not be considered.

Does anyone have similar experiences with the need to stabilize and re-level a broken concrete garage floor? What were the costs? What worked for you?
 
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matt_i

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They said 4 or more jacks might be required at over $1,500 per jack. Ain't goin' to happen.

Also, a tear down and rebuild is not in my budget and will not be considered.

I would live with it. 2" thick is a lot of self-leveling filler to be buying with no guarantee that its stabilized.
 

Kaizen

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ayuh. I would jack the whole thing and remove and repour before trying to do any of those ideas.
 
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gfmucci

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I would live with it. 2" thick is a lot of self-leveling filler to be buying with no guarantee that its stabilized.

I guess the first issue needs to be assuring I can stabilize the slab. It needs to be stabilized at the rear.

Here's the method that comes to mind:

Dig a trench and holes deep enough to accommodate several horizontal 4 x 4s, concrete piers and bottle jacks. Place the 3 or 4 bottle jacks across the rear under the 4x4's with 1/2" steel plate between the top of the jack and the 4x4s. Raise up the slab a 1/4" or so every couple of days, placing solid concrete blocks and shims under the raised portions each time there is space available.

Actually, I'm making all this up. I have no idea how to make this work :Help:

I've seen mudjacking demos and they look pretty effective - with only a couple hour process. So I would also like to know if anyone has experience with mudjacking, its costs and effectiveness. At 70 years of age, I'm not seeking a "lifetime warranty" If it settles again in another 40 years, the next owner can worry about it.

Here is a question and answer about mud jacking from another web site that I found informative:

QUESTION -- I read your column faithfully and always find it very informative. Could you please comment on mudjacking. I spoke to a contractor who felt this process wasn't durable and I'd be better off getting the concrete slab of my garage re-poured. What do you think?
-- Neal Lerner, e-mail

ANSWER -- Mudjacking is a process where heavy concrete slabs are lifted and moved using a complex hydraulic system. Small holes are drilled in the surface of the slab through which a slurry is pumped into the area below the slab. This slurry normally contains Bentonite clay as well as other components that swell when they are wet. This material can be pumped in to fill any voids that have developed under the concrete slab, preventing further settlement. The semi-liquid, which is under pressure, can also be used to lift sagging sections of concrete that may require levelling to their original position. After lifting, the small holes are patched with concrete and are often the only visible evidence of any repairs.

I don't agree with your contractor that the process is not durable, as I have seen sidewalks and garage pads that have remained fairly stable for many years after mudjacking. I too was skeptical about the lasting effects when this process was starting to be used in our area more than a decade ago, but have seen the favourable results. The process does, however, have a couple of drawbacks and these should be strongly considered before contracting the service.

The first and most important consideration is the condition of the original concrete slab to be repaired. If the surface and overall integrity of the concrete is still in good condition, then mud-jacking is an option. This favourable condition can include cracks where individual sections of the slab have settled. Even large cracks can be closed considerably when lifting the heavy concrete pads. If the surface of the concrete is damaged or spalling or the concrete is crumbling, then mud-jacking may not be possible or simply a waste of money. In this case, I would agree that removal and replacement is the only practical option.

The second drawback of this process is the cost. It is not inexpensive to hire a mud-jacking company, as much equipment and expertise is required to properly move the heavy concrete. The fees may often be up to 50% of the cost of newly poured concrete. Again, the condition of the original concrete must be looked at. If the concrete can be expected to last 10 to 15 years after the repairs, then the option may be viable. If the concrete is in moderate condition and in a high traffic area and subject to much deterioration from weather and moisture, it may not last as long as the warranty on the service. It is not practical, in my opinion, to spend significant amounts of money on lifting concrete that is only in fair condition, when it may crumble and fall apart in a few years. In this case, waiting until it is deteriorated beyond practical use before replacement may be a better use of home renovation funds.

Although used primarily for lifting cracked and sunken concrete slabs, mud-jacking can also be used to lift entire buildings that have settled. This is highly risky and sensitive work, and is rarely done in residential buildings. The one area that it may be used is for lifting detached garages that have settled. If your garage is sitting on the slab and the garage is settling in one area more than others, it may be possible to level the entire structure with mud-jacking. This will not only even out the concrete floor, but will improve the entire building. In this situation, if your garage is built on top of the slab, mud-jacking may be a much more economical method for repair as opposed to replacement. To pour new concrete in this style of construction it may be necessary to mechanically jack up and temporarily support the garage, break up and remove the old slab and pour a new floor before replacing the walls on the concrete. This will add to the cost significantly and will be much more labour intensive.

Whatever choice you make, lifting or replacement of the concrete garage slab, obtaining several opinions and quotes (and references) is always a good idea. Costs of various repairs, especially when dealing with concrete, can vary enormously depending on the weather, time of year, and how busy the contractors are at the time of construction. Exploring several options should lead to the best "bang for the buck" in dealing with your damaged garage floor.

Ari Marantz is the owner of Trained Eye Home Inspection Ltd. and the President of the Canadian Association of Home & Property Inspectors - Manitoba (www.cahi.mb.ca). Questions can be e-mailed or sent to: Ask The Inspector, P. O. Box 69021, #110-2025 Corydon Ave., Winnipeg, MB. R3P 2G9. Ari can be reached at (204) 291-5358.

[email protected]
 
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Orionrising

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you need to stop the erosion with a retaining wall or something.

The entire section of slab is sunk 2 inches, or it is cunk 2 inches at the worst point?
 

WickedMainer

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I'm not sure I would do this but I've seen people lift the garage up on cribbing tear out the concrete compact and repour (with a wall on the back in your case) have also seen people put sauno tubes one at a time so the garage is supported then deal with the floor. No clue on permits or code just what I have seen. I am inclined to redo it completely but I am set up for a project that size and have power screeds bull floats and so on. I should mention that this is usually undertaken when you can't rebuild due to set backs... and they are usually garages built for the model t era that most likely didn't have concrete to begin with. I been avoiding an old neighbor who keeps asking me to fix his with this issue. It's lose lose for me because he certainty won't be happy to compensate my machinery rate, will refuse a permit, and I get stuck with a big liability both during the fix and after....just won't take no becsuse it's easy....
 

James-W

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I think the best option for the long term is to tear out the old concrete and pour a new floor. But you need the fix the problem that caused this condition in the first place or you will most likely have the same thing happen again.
 

WickedMainer

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if the back wall is a gable end I wonder if you can't just pour a foundation wall and mud jack the floor. I have never seen mudjacking used I have seen driven piers and not cheap.
 

RVDan

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I would just jack the building up until it's level and shim as necesary, then pour 2" of concrete floor.

Sure maybe you'll have to do it again in ten years, or maybe you won't live there in ten years, or maybe you'll be wanting to build bigger and better in ten years.

Cue the "do it right or do it twice" crowd.
 

WickedMainer

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I would just jack the building up until it's level and shim as necesary, then pour 2" of concrete floor.

Sure maybe you'll have to do it again in ten years, or maybe you won't live there in ten years, or maybe you'll be wanting to build bigger and better in ten years.

Cue the "do it right or do it twice" crowd.

Do as I say not as I do. I'm guilty of not fixing it right the first time so I won't go there.

By any chance is it a big slope behind it? That could be key, a house splitting in two during a land slide comes to mind
 

Dr Stan

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At 45 years old I suspect building codes have changed. In my neck of the woods one must have at least a 2' deep perimeter footing. Yours may well just be a 4" slab W/O any foundation.

BTW, the floor of a garage is suppose to slope from the back to the overhead door. High to low.

I also agree that jacking up the garage & tearing out the slab and any foundation is the best route.
 
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wssix99

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Do you have pictures?

Ram Jack and similar steel jacking firms are prohibitively expensive for this application to the point they suggested a tear down and rebuild. They said 4 or more jacks might be required at over $1,500 per jack. Ain't goin' to happen.

If you are talking about jacking piles, then you have a foundation problem in addition to a slab problem. (They could be related.) I would not invest in anything for the slab until the foundation is fixed and/or stabilized as it could all get worse.

Piles are a really expensive thing - especially for a one story garage. I wonder if a partial - tear-out and rebuild of the foundation is possible? (I'd look at cribbing up the walls, tearing out the foundation in the corner, and then re-pouring it under the existing wall.)
 

kbs2244

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Why doesn't anybody post their location o their first post???
Rant over.

First., I would call a mud jacking guy.
In my experience, they have been pretty honest into if they can fix your problem.

Failing that, figure out how to crib and jack up the whole thing, break out the old, put in any needed retraining walls or slopes, and pour new.
 
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gfmucci

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Why don't people reveal their location period, especially this forum. How can people offer advice if we don't know where you live on the planet. My rant is over too.:cool:

Location of issue in OP: Western North Carolina. I hope that helps. Next request: Soil samples and geologic soundings.:rocker:

BTW: I received a cost estimate (based on photos) from a polyurethane-jacking company of roughly $2,500 with a 3-year guarantee, provided that the initial cause of the problem is eliminated. Unfortunately, the"initial cause of the problem" may or may not be the steep slope 5 to 10 feet from the rear of the slab. If it is, eliminating the "initial cause" would cost more than the poly-jacking.

I need to remember, it took 45 years for the floor to crack and tilt. Not many slabs remain perfect forever.

I've asked the poly-jacking company to clarify their warranty policy given my particular situation. I expect an onsite visit within the next few weeks to get a more definitive read.
 
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kbs2244

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"polyurethane-jacking" ??
Never heard of it.
Maybe less expensive installation equipment and the poly expands?
(Mud jacking takes a pretty powerful pump.But the mud id cheap,)
The cheap mud may become important if the under slab void is big.

When my neighbor did an alongside the garage sidewalk it had chipmunk tunnels under it.
It took two full sized wheelbarrows of mud to fill the void they made.

In you case, either process may cause a "blow out" on the downhill side if not reinforced.
The process assumes lifting is the path of least resistance for the pressurized fill.
 

LBinCanada

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May 13, 2017
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Newbie here.

I also have a slab in a double detached garage that is cracked in a couple of directions. I am not fussy about floor quality, so have been thinking about whether it is possible to get the slab removed and replaced by sand and gravel with smaller, shallower flat paving blocks (2 ft x 2 ft x 2 in) for the surface. Heck, add a bit of fill and some flooring, and it might even look good.

I am thinking about this because erosion, ground shift and underground rivers are a big part of our section of Winnipeg, Manitoba. Since future repair seems inevitable, I figure it might be good to have a floor set up to be easily repaired.


Also, I have geothermal in the yard around the garage, so any digging around it couldn't reach to 3 ft. Is this an issue?
 

matt_i

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If the slab is separated from the stem walls, then only work is holding you back from breaking it out and prepping a new slab with steel reinforcement, packed limestone base, vapor barrier, etc. Crew of garage slab pourers to place and finish. Personally I wouldn't do a 2" paver and expect a car or truck not to tilt it, as I recall its something like a 6-8" gravel pack recommended for a "driveway" plus the sand.
 

BADSIX

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Newbie here.

I also have a slab in a double detached garage that is cracked in a couple of directions. I am not fussy about floor quality, so have been thinking about whether it is possible to get the slab removed and replaced by sand and gravel with smaller, shallower flat paving blocks (2 ft x 2 ft x 2 in) for the surface. Heck, add a bit of fill and some flooring, and it might even look good.

I am thinking about this because erosion, ground shift and underground rivers are a big part of our section of Winnipeg, Manitoba. Since future repair seems inevitable, I figure it might be good to have a floor set up to be easily repaired.


Also, I have geothermal in the yard around the garage, so any digging around it couldn't reach to 3 ft. Is this an issue?

how about a little info on the geothermal?
Jay D.
 

finn

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I had a twenty year old patio slab mud jacked in Illinois.

Slab was still level ten years later when I sold the house, and cost must have been minimal, as it didn't leave a lasting impression on me.

I think the foam jacking is simply a more modern equivalent.
 
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I had the foundation (slab) of a house "stabilized" with the polymer foam method. The foundation had settled in the middle due to excess water under the slab.

As others have said, the first part of the fix was finding the source of the water and eliminating that. That was about $1,500.

The steel foundation jack guys wanted $20,000 to do their thing, but I simply couldn't afford that, although it would have probably been the best long term solution.

So I had the polymer foam method done. Cost about $5,000. In my opinion, I got about a 90% fix. I think the foundation was stabilized, but they could not get a perfect level back. Since there was a two story house sitting on top of the slab, we did not want to damage the structure, so we stopped at about 1 inch of slope still left in the slab. Could of taken that out, but we judged that we would have had some additional repairs in drywall, wall paper, etc. if we had pushed it. So I called it good.

I think this method is OK if your slab is not badly fractured, you can eliminated the source of the problem, and you don't need a "perfect" fix.

As far as durability, I can't comment. The companies tout long term, but the structural engineer i hired to help me with all this was not willing to venture an opinion as he had not seen enough of it for long enough. He WAS confident about the steel piers, but he wasn't having to pay for it!
 
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