Can epoxy paint be applied over 2- part epoxy?

[friday88]

So I bought a rustoleum RockSolid 2.5 car garage Epoxy kit, and found that it did not completely cover the floor in my 2 car garage. I could also use a second coat because there are some thin spots, however Rustolum doesn't seem to sell this "Polycuramine" material outside the $200 kit, meaning to finish my floor I have to spend an additional $400 to buy two more kits.

I haven't called rustoleum and asked for more material yet (though I did email them with no response) because I'm considering buying a few gallons of epoxy paint instead, to put a few layers on top of my existing cured epoxy and finish the floor for less than $600.

At this point I have sanded the cured epoxy material and am trying to research how well the epoxy paint will adhere to it. I properly degreased and etched the concrete prior to applying the epoxy, so I believe it is properly and cleanly done, but I don't want to paint it only to find it will peel.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[friday88]

I wanted a nice looking durable floor for an advertised cost of $200, and the more I research this, the more it becomes a rabbit hole of expensive nonsense. For $200 I could have prepped and painted the floor with a couple coats of epoxy paint.

I'll see if rustoleum will sell me just the material, and if not, I guess I'll be buying multiple kits to support their scam.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[Armorpoxy]

Hi All,

One of the problems with Rock Solid's packaging is that while nice and eye-catchy, there is not that much material in the kits which have pouches.

The "2.5 car kit" contains 152 oz total of material per Rustoleum Tech Support. That is slightly more than a gallon for 2.5 cars which can be around 600 sq ft? There is no way to effectively coat over 600 sq ft with slightly over a gallon. We would give for 2.5 cars 4.5 gals of 100% epoxy, or almost 4x what Rock Solid includes.

The "1 car kit" contains 76 oz., or about 3/4 of a gallon. A gallon has 128 oz. That is the reason there are so many posts about the kits not covering.

If the kit costs $200.00, then the effective cost/gal is $168.42 which would be $505.00 equivalent for a traditional 100% solids epoxy kit sold by many vendors for much less on the Forum.

Plus this product is 96% solids which reduces the value of these pouch kits even further.

Seems like Rustoleum would rather send out a few free kits than include what is really necessary, but that is just our opinion.

 

[friday88]

I'm sure rustoleum will send me another package, they must do that all the time. What if I purchase a different epoxy product and use that to apply second coats and finish the coverage?

 

[kd3pc]

I'm sure rustoleum will send me another package, they must do that all the time. What if I purchase a different epoxy product and use that to apply second coats and finish the coverage?

not a good idea to change horses in the middle of the stream...unless you are going to completely remove the product currently in use.

Your best bet, in the current situation - is to contact Rustoleum...and speak with them, per the above posts.

Lesson learned = there is no such thing as a $200 epoxy floor.

 

[Armorpoxy]

We have no experience in coating over this product so we can't recommend one way or another, it would need testing with a small epoxy qty. Most likely if you lightly sand your surface and coat with our epoxy it will be fine, but we are not sure. Small test kits are available from us for a nominal refundable (when you purchase) fee. Please call or email directly to order. Thank you.

 

[friday88]

not a good idea to change horses in the middle of the stream...unless you are going to completely remove the product currently in use.

Your best bet, in the current situation - is to contact Rustoleum...and speak with them, per the above posts.

Lesson learned = there is no such thing as a $200 epoxy floor.

This wouldn't be such an issue if they would just put the compound itself on the shelf instead of making people buy a box of acid and paint chips.

 

[friday88]

We have no experience in coating over this product so we can't recommend one way or another, it would need testing with a small epoxy qty. Most likely if you lightly sand your surface and coat with our epoxy it will be fine, but we are not sure. Small test kits are available from us for a nominal refundable (when you purchase) fee. Please call or email directly to order. Thank you.

I have already fully sanded the floor, but $400 for two more rustoleum kits is roughly the same cost for some of your material. I'm just going to contact them and find out if they can sell me the material seperately

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[cash68]

Call them.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=357759

If you have your receipt, they will cut you a check for $200, so you can buy another kit. They did this twice for me.

My floor didn't turn out perfect, but it is very, very durable. I am happy with the quality of the floor coating, compared to a traditional ****** epoxy kit.

 

[friday88]

Call them.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=357759

If you have your receipt, they will cut you a check for $200, so you can buy another kit. They did this twice for me.

My floor didn't turn out perfect, but it is very, very durable. I am happy with the quality of the floor coating, compared to a traditional ****** epoxy kit.

Thanks, I'm feeling better about it today. I didn't call last night but I will today.

I chose the mocha color and my wife and I aren't huge fans of it. I'm wondering if I do a second coat of the same product but in the gray color, that should cover it right? Its such a thick hard material I imagine I wont have problems with the tan showing through. I may ask rustoleum.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[friday88]

You might need two coats. But keep in mind that if you tell them that you don't like the color, they might see this more as buyer's remorse than a problem with coverage. Meaning, they might not reimburse you for the poor coverage. I don't know. Something to consider. If it were me, I would address the poor coverage and get my check. You can always call back and ask technical support about the gray covering the mocha in one coat. Seems like these are two separate issues and better to not to lose track of the 2.5 kit not covering a 2 car garage issue.

I'll just stick with the mocha color. No need to complicate the issue.

Rustoleum customer support has responded to my email and apologized for the delay. They have asked for photos of the area and dimensions of the garage, so I think they will take care of it.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[JEDDI]

All these retail brands in hardware stores like Home Depot or Lowes or Walmart or Ace Hardware are a rip off compared to "actual coatings vendors" like Carboline or Spray-Lining & Coatings or SPI. For over 14 years my GARAGE AND SHOP floors got abused badly and are still nice. They're not perfect but are fully covered, sealed almost perfect. Why? Because my son who worked at Carboline advised a roll-on version of Spray-Lining & Coatings www.spray-lining.com... I did 2 neighbors also and made a few bucks doing 2 ind'l floors - my business neighbors too. Photos are of a garage and fabricator I just did. Its actually a "Polyurea Hybrid coating", plural component is really top quality.
Aside from Spray-Lining & Coatings DIY deals you can sometimes get a Line-X or Rhino or SLC bedliner dealership to spray it for you. That's expensive however. These pretty cans with nice labeled packages that seem so simple sold retail are much less material, low quality at much higher price!

 

[friday88]

Well, it's too late to choose a different product now. So lesson learned I guess. I'll be doing a second coat of Rustoleums brand regardless of whether they refund my money.

The garage is a small 2 car garage with a back corner area that is a step up above the main floor. I decided to coat the main parking area first, so I've measured the areas individually.

Main floor dimensions:
Width 221" wall to wall
Depth 215" from driveway to the step.
329.9 sq ft

Rear corner area dimensions:
Width 98" wall to wall
Depth 123" Step to back wall
84.4 sq ft

I found that one package of material covered approximately two of the concrete slabs on the main floor. I finished the main area by spreading the material out as much as possible, but this area is 330 square ft using the dimensions I measured, which is under the minimum coverage I expected.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[cash68]

No chips or traction additive?

 

[friday88]

No chips or traction additive?

I had planned on adding the chips in a clearcoat or something, but since it needs a second coat I'm going to just sprinkle the chips onto that.

They haven't responded to my email with the dimensions and pictures yet.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[friday88]

You might want to just call them.

I had to send them pictures of everything anyway.

 

[JEDDI]

Well, it's too late to choose a different product now. So lesson learned I guess. I'll be doing a second coat of Rustoleums brand regardless of whether they refund my money.

The garage is a small 2 car garage with a back corner area that is a step up above the main floor. I decided to coat the main parking area first, so I've measured the areas individually.

Main floor dimensions:
Width 221" wall to wall
Depth 215" from driveway to the step.
329.9 sq ft

Rear corner area dimensions:
Width 98" wall to wall
Depth 123" Step to back wall
84.4 sq ft

I found that one package of material covered approximately two of the concrete slabs on the main floor. I finished the main area by spreading the material out as much as possible, but this area is 330 square ft using the dimensions I measured, which is under the minimum coverage I expected.

THERE IS a Coverage Calculator at www.spray-lining.net/bedliner-calculator/
This formula they gave me tells physical truth: 1 gallon = 1604 sq ft @ 1 mil height. 1 mil = 1/100 inch. 12 mil = a thin coat of paint, not thick enough for real protection. Good coating I've learned is at least 32 mil (1/32 inch). From spray-lining my truck bed I learned 1/8 inch was overkill and 1/16 inch was adequate. Figure that 1/32 will suffice for garage floor because that's much lower stress than a truck bed.

 

[friday88]

After sending them pictures and measurements they didn't respond, and I called this morning and gave them the file number from their email.

They offered a refund or another kit. I accepted another kit, and I plan to re-coat the existing floor and just do something else with the uncoated portion of the garage. Carpet squares maybe.

In conclusion I'm pretty dissatisfied with this Rustoleum product. The coverage is not great, and the thickness and durability of the material with one coat is not really adequate. Since I applied the current coat, I have done work to my wife's Honda Fit, and the floor jack chipped the floor while it was under the pressure of the car. I have also parked my motorcycle (Honda XR650L 346lbs) on it every day and the side stand has scratched the floor every time I set it down. Tires from both the car and the motorcycle have left marks, though these can be cleaned off. These things have happened in one week of working on this flooring surface.

In retrospect, I know I didn't do enough research before applying this material. I saw it in the store and thought, "hey my concrete isn't cracked, I'd like to coat the floor". I then read up on floor preparation and application and applied it once I had a free weekend. What I did NOT do, is research the epoxy material and related products. I assumed that Rustoleum being a known quality brand would sell something worth using, but $200 for a single coat of mediocre material is a bit of a scam as far as epoxy flooring goes. I could have spent $500 and got a nicer material in a great enough quantity for 3 coats.

The next house I do this to will go much better.

 

[Armorpoxy]

The problem with the Rustoleum pouches is that they just don't contain enough material. They are very nicely packaged, and certainly well marketed. They don't though disclose on the box, or even on their tech data sheets the actual quantity of material included (you need to call them to get this info).

The effective price/gal of their stuff if you figure $200/kit is $168.42/gal and they are only giving 1.2 gallons of material when mixed.

That is way short of what is required for a reasonably thick coating for their 2.5 car garage advertised coverage.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[friday88]

Great follow through! What was your floor prep again? How long did you let the floor cure before putting stuff on it?

You should give the floor pole sanding, vacuum and then solvent wipe before applying the next coat. Be sure to mix the material throughly. Failing to mix properly is one of the biggest reasons coatings have problems.

Your second coat will go on thicker, since the pores of the concrete are already filled. Try to get it nice and even over each of the sections. Then let it cure up sufficiently before putting anything on it.

Lastly, leave a few pictures here when it's all done.

To prep the floor I first brushed and hosed it out to remove any loose debris, then scrubbed it with concrete degreaser and hosed that out. Then while the floor was still damp, I poured the concrete etching acid down in the ratio instructed on the package and scrubbed the floor down. That was hosed out completely, and dried over night.

I've actually already sanded the floor down. I did that in preparation of painting another coat with floor paint (instead of epoxy) but read everywhere that the paint wont adhere correctly to the epoxy layer, so I abandoned that idea.

The floor cured for a week before I put stuff on it, however I did sand it before putting stuff on it, which may have weakened it? I don't know. I plan to scrub every tire mark clean with degreaser, and remove all remnants of dust before putting the next coat down FOR SURE. I want this to go as nicely as possible. I'll post some finished pictures when its done.

The chips can go right on top of the the wet epoxy right? Or are those supposed to go in a clear coat?

 

[Armorpoxy]

Hi,
Chips/flecks get broadcast onto wet epoxy, then once cured topcoated. This process seals in the millions of potential dirt collecting edges. Never flex onto a topcoat except in rare circumstances.

 

[rburke65]

All this seems, once again, like a chemical nightmare to me.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

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[friday88]

Well a new kit arrived at my door yesterday free of charge, so Rustoleum did in fact send me free material. I used it to re-coat the main floor of the garage after sanding it and cleaning it again with degreaser. This time however, I found that one package of material covered 80% of the floor. I nearly finished the 2nd coat with just one package! Obviously this is due to the material not soaking into the concrete, since I was applying it over a previous coat. I ended up having to open the second bag of material to finish the last 20% of the floor, but whatever, it was "free".

I also applied the flakes. I like how it turned out, though I haven't driven on it or anything because I painted it last night. After I use it for awhile I might come back and report how that's going. Thanks for the information everyone.

 

[Armorpoxy]

Looks great!

What you experienced is totally normal as to the coverage. When a floor is bare, coverage is lower, and often much lower (depending on porosity and texture) than the next coat.

That is why on jobs that may be 'close to the edge' of how we package our standard garage kits, in order to save the customer money from buying another kit, we recommend priming with the proper epoxy primer since priming usually extends coverage of the 100% solids epoxy by 25-30% or more.

Again, priming is always strongly recommended, it helps to eliminate problems, adhesion issues, and uneven sheens from varying absorption rates.

 

[Shea]

Job well done! This is a much better outcome than finishing it up with 1-part epoxy paint. Glad to see you reached out to Rust-Oleum customer service to find a solution.

 

[Remythepug]

As an aside, I too have similar problems w/ my motorcycle kick stand scratching my floor. (yamaha stryker). It's armorpoxy w/ upgraded military top coat.

Glad you got it sorted though!

 

[Armorpoxy]

Hi,
Motorcycle kickstands are notorious for scratching virtually any floor. The heavy weight of the bike leaning on about one square inch of metal, which may not be super smooth, or may have gotten slightly scratched from parking on asphalt and exterior surfaces, could scratch a floor.

Please email us directly your info and we will send you a piece of our thick solid PVC SupraTile to place under the stand to protect your floor at no charge. Thanks.

 

[friday88]

As an aside, I too have similar problems w/ my motorcycle kick stand scratching my floor. (yamaha stryker). It's armorpoxy w/ upgraded military top coat.

Glad you got it sorted though!

I plan to put a rug in there to park the bike on.

If not that, maybe a hockey puck on the floor for the kick stand.