I have couple dull 16" ******* files. New brand name replacements approach $60/ea. I stumbled onto a YT video showing a process of soaking in vinegar for a few days. Can you really get these big ones sharp again or is this just a short lived fix? Anyone try file sharpening methods?
Can you really sharpen a large ******* File?
- Thread starter Davefr
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georgiadave
Well-known member
I tried this once and ended up with a piece of metal that looked like a shriveled file.
If you attempt it check frequently
RoninB4
Well-known member
-I'd find it hard to believe soaking in vinegar would bring it back but I've never done it so I have no qualified opinion on that. A file could be re-sharpened with a surface grinder but what a PITA to do. There are services that do this but I've never used one. I would suggest NOT throwing it out even if you don't sharpen it. Old files were often made from good W-1 tool steel, not so much anymore. Keep it regardless of condition. Ask off list if you want to know what it's good for.
alwaysFlOoReD
Well-known member
The metal that turned to rust will disappear. The good metal will be left. Wether its as good as before depends on the amount of rust in the first place. I use vinegar all the time for cleaning tools. It won't affect good metal. But if the tool is made from a conglomerate of unknown metals it will be swiss cheese.
RTM
Well-known member
I am a Boggs Tool fan for resharpening files. Bastards are easy I hear.
Friends that have tried vinegar and compared them to a Boggs I gave them say no comparison. I’ve never used their vinegar sharpened.
Shipping them back n forth will cost more than the sharpening I imagine. I try to send a bunch to level out the shipping cost.
Friends that have tried vinegar and compared them to a Boggs I gave them say no comparison. I’ve never used their vinegar sharpened.
Shipping them back n forth will cost more than the sharpening I imagine. I try to send a bunch to level out the shipping cost.
RoninB4
Well-known member
-Removing rust isn't the same as dulled, if the teeth are no longer sharp I don't see how removing rust improves the tooth profile past a marginal improvement. JMO from info in the first post from the OP.
nadogail
Well-known member
A diluted acid bath has been a "go to" to freshen files for years, but no amount of acid will replace worn or damaged teeth.
Files are a consumable when working with metal.
The first Buck Knives were made from worn out files purchased from a San Diego aircraft factory.
Files are a consumable when working with metal.
The first Buck Knives were made from worn out files purchased from a San Diego aircraft factory.
Modern Garage
Well-known member
I've been pleased with the results of a vinegar bath. I use ordinary grocery store vinegar and usually eight to twelve hours soak. Most of the "dull" files I've soaked in vinegar were very lightly rusted and VERY dirty so the weak acid dip cleaned them up nicely. I wouldn't leave one soak longer than twelve hours as the acid is inevitably eroding the sharp edge slightly. Are they as good as new? Prolly not but they're pretty close. After a wash and dry I give them a light coat of thin oil to prevent rust on the newly exposed metal.
cody1325
Well-known member
And Anza are still made this way if I'm not mistaken.
RoninB4
Well-known member
-Nobody uses chalk or a brass BBQ brush to keep files clean anymore?
d.mcfarland
Well-known member
Hate to say it but I'd say that the majority of people just consider files to be consumables these days.
Honestly, the Harbor Freight $4 file with handle already attached is perfectly fine for sharpening the lawn mower blade.
Files have always been a consumable
RoninB4
Well-known member
-They've always been considered a perishable/consumable like drills and end mills are but using chalk and/or a brass brush to keep the crud out and removing the "pins" of metal allows them to work a lot longer. My comment was from reading other posts about files that were dirty and rusty. Whatever vinegar will remove could have been kept out/off the file with a bit of effort using chalk and/or a brass brush.
-I'll take your word for it (thanks for contributing) but I don't use my files for lawn mower blades. You do what works for you.
bugzilla46310
Well-known member
I’ve been wanting to send a few here. Prices seem reasonable.
KnurledNut
Well-known member
I’ve done the vinegar thing. It attacks the thinnest metal more quickly so it acid etches the teeth which provides somewhat of a sharpening effect. I have noticed better success on fine teeth. Some file patterns are no longer available or hard to source so any extra longevity can be helpful.
WisJim
Well-known member
I know people who send new files to Boggs and say that they improve even a brand new file. I haven't tried any method yet myself but am sorely tempted to send a bunch to Boggs when I finally get my files sorted out.
RTM
Well-known member
Galoot Steve KNight used to do that, that’s how I heard of Boggs.
Thanks everyone for the feedback and the PM. I looked at these big files under magnification and they are not dirty or clogged. The teeth just no longer have sharp cutting edges and I can't imagine how a vinegar soak will transform them. I'll contact Boggs. The were quality Sandvik and Simmonds 16" USA files so I hate to toss them.
d.mcfarland
Well-known member
Point was that there is no care taken or any kind of love provided to the tool to extend it's useable life.
I'd be VERY curious what any guy or girl under the age of 60 does that requires a $25 file versus the $4 one.
There's going to be one machinist that chimes in and that exception is going to always be there. I'm talking 99.9% of homeowners and working class folks.
An employee of almost any company is going to use a powered tool. Air or electric.
Posts about all their tools online
seber
Well-known member
Well, I am definitely not under the age of 60 but I would pay $25 for a Magicut file any day if that is what they cost. Using any other file is an excercise in futility by comparison.
d.mcfarland
Well-known member
You lift the file off the lawn mower blade on the backstroke?
KnurledNut
Well-known member
I know everyone's situation is different, but I come across good old quality files quite often for a couple bucks or so.
They are not in high demand. I even pass on the majority of them since I have acquired plenty. I still grab unusual patterns.
I am not interested in buying cheap files when I can buy good ones cheap.
The last one I paid retail for was a pricey Bahco Oberg I really needed and I ordered it online but it was a style you aren't walking into HF and finding on the shelf.
They are not in high demand. I even pass on the majority of them since I have acquired plenty. I still grab unusual patterns.
I am not interested in buying cheap files when I can buy good ones cheap.
The last one I paid retail for was a pricey Bahco Oberg I really needed and I ordered it online but it was a style you aren't walking into HF and finding on the shelf.
cody1325
Well-known member
I'm mostly rocking Nicholson and Black Diamond files (plus some older Swiss--mostly my small files) from anywhere from the '50s-90s. They all still work great. I mostly use single-cut ******* files (or flat *******)--for axes. Most are still pretty decent, but a few (the big ones) are a little dull--so worth sending those off?
Also--who makes decent ones today? I've always been told to buy Pferd. I've not been impressed by any of the Nicholson or Kobalt files I've bought off the shelf. However, my Nicholson farmer's file is one of the newer Made In Brazil models, and I regularly use it on my axes since it's got a handle built-in.
Also--who makes decent ones today? I've always been told to buy Pferd. I've not been impressed by any of the Nicholson or Kobalt files I've bought off the shelf. However, my Nicholson farmer's file is one of the newer Made In Brazil models, and I regularly use it on my axes since it's got a handle built-in.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
I'm very impressed by the vinegar soak method. Got my files super sharp. Had them soaking for about 4-weeks though. You probably only need 72 hours.
seber
Well-known member
No, I use a flap wheel on an angle grinder for that. Files are only for when power tools are not an option.
neophyte
Well-known member
Cheap files truly **** in some cases.
Back when Nicholson and Simmonds were both USA made, you didn’t really need to worry about “Cheap USA made files” because even the cheap files from both manufacturers were very, very good.
Cheap imported files were sometimes an issue, but even imported files that cost less, might have been fine quality, and simply cheaper because of lower labor costs in Poland, or wherever.
One of the main areas where a difference in “file” quality used to be truly revealed, was rasps.
“Patternmaker” rasps, such as the older #49 and #50 Nicholson rasps, were so much better than the cheaper machine made rasps, I didn’t really understand why anyone would bother with cheaper rasps, except for cost.
The Patternmaker rasps cut both way quicker, and way smoother than the regular machine made rasps.
As for high end metal files, Swish and German made precision files are still used for fine fitting tasks, and also for jewelry making, which is still a major industry involving lots of hand work.
Fine fitting and adjusting of components also requires high quality files, as does locksmithing.
Adjusting musical instruments.
Etc.
neophyte
Well-known member
Decent current file makers.
Tome Feteira of Portugal.
Vallorbe of Switzerland. (They make larger files, but the smaller jewelry and watchmaking sizes are usually what are easily findable in the USA).
Corradi of Italy.
Tsubosan of Japan.
There may be others.
There is also one major conglomerate in India that makes hand files, that may make decent files, especially since a crapload of manufacturing in India likely is still done with files.
The conglomerate is called JK Superdrive, and owns a number of file brands, and slso purchased all the file making equipment from MOB Talabot, the French equivalent of Nicholson, and the manufacturer that had likely been making the files for Facom.
The conglomerate that owns the file works is large, and involved in a number of industries.
The file brands are “Sunflower”, “Three Files”, “Two Tusk”, “Two Files”, “Premium Scissors Steel Files”, “JK Uno”, “MJK”, “Rock”, “JK Cleveland”, “HFL Hindustan Files”, “JK Superdrive”, “JK File & Tool”.
I have no clue if any of the brands are made to a higher standard than others.
Plenty of major tool brands now supply Indian made files, which are quite possibly made by JK.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
There is no backstroke. Only a forward stroke. But then again, I'm the only guy in the world who knows that.
I don't have any by Pferd but have seen them recommended here before. Bahco is another brand to consider; I have a few and they are nicely made and the larger sizes come with nice handles. Here's a set on Amazon
Amazon.com: Bahco 1-478-08-1-2 File Set, 5-Piece : Industrial & Scientific
Buy Bahco 1-478-08-1-2 File Set, 5-Piece: Hand Files - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
www.amazon.com