Cinder block wall seeping water

[krisinwast]

This thread is not about a garage or shop , looking for some input about a
cinder block wall seeping water , my problem is the house I live in one of the
basement walls seeps water when we have a heavy rain , digging up outside
the foundation to seal the wall is not a option and if I paint / seal the inside
the water won't be able to escape and the wall will fall apart at a more rapid
rate , thinking about painting / sealing the inside wall about a foot or so from
concrete floor to about 3/4 up the wall , this should allow the water to escape
from the bottom and allow the wall to dry and help with the mold situation ?
any thoughts appreciated

 

[larry4406]

Wish you the best on this.

I detest cinder block walls. Wait, let me refer to them as concrete masonary units (CMU’s) so the masons don’t get upset.

Inspect and fix your adverse grade if present. Pipe downspouts, sump discharges away, and fix any swales. I know you said no exterior digging but that is where the problem starts.

Sump crock with draintile on the interior and exterior? Pump working? Walkout basement or fully buried?

Had a friend with a similar problem with CMU walls and their professional overlayed the leak with a thick plastic plate maybe 1/8x8 centered on the leak. Bottom of slab was chipped open to expose the interior drain tile. Plastic plate was epoxied on edge to the block wall and communicate with the draintile. Their professional chose not to fight it but rather contain it and route it safely away. An interesting approach I thought. I know it worked for the 3-5 years I was in touch with him. No clue on long term.

If it were a poured concrete foundation I would say to have the crack epoxy injected. I am not sure if this technique applies to CMU’s.

 

[Hilltopmasonry]

Wish you the best on this.



I detest cinder block walls. Wait, let me refer to them as concrete masonary units (CMU’s) so the masons don’t get upset.





If it were a poured concrete foundation I would say to have the crack epoxy injected. I am not sure if this technique applies to CMU’s.

I am a mason and I call them cinder blocks as well! Haha

Epoxy injection will not work if the walls are not grouted solid since the epoxy will just ooze into the wall cavity

To the OP, Why is digging from the outside not an option? That is the best solution however a lot of companies around here do an interior drain system that apparently works as well however I do not have first-hand experience or know anybody that has had it done in their home



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[Crossfire05]

New member, but thought I would add my two cents. Nothing you do on the inside will cure the situation. You must both alleviate the water issue and seal the wall from the outside. Sorry but have some experience with this. I assume you have limited access to outside?

 

[850xpeps]

You can put on a drain board or like a dimpled roll of plastic to guide the water into a trench you make around the interior perimeter then have your wheeping tile in and fill with clean rock. Replace chipped out slab. It controls the water. Keep it where it needs to go. Only way to fix properly imo is excavate around exterior.

 

[krisinwast]

Not fixing the problem properly boils down to the fact of not having
the funds or being able to finance it , as far as dealing with the water
its not a lot and I mop it up , there is a drain in the basement for a shower
so its easy to clean the mop and I have a high BTU forced air propane
portable heater to help with the moisture basically what what I'm after
is to " clean up " the walls by painting them , but not seal them so they
don't hold the water and fall apart . attached below a few pictures , the
water leaks at the area at the bottom of the stairs and then spreads ,
the black spot on the floor is suit from a old oil stove heater that I removed
a few days ago , forgot to metion it is a buried basement , the house
( farm house )was built around 1910 then remodeled in the 50s , and
that is when the ( so I was told ) the basement was added , was told it
was dug out by hand , don't know if that is true or not .

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

You can put on a drain board or like a dimpled roll of plastic to guide the water into a trench you make around the interior perimeter then have your wheeling tile in and fill with clean rock. Replace chipped out slab. It controls the water. Keep it’s where it needs to go. Only way to fix properly imo is excavate around exterior.

Great idea. Don’t fight it, let it come in,then direct it where you want it.

There are simple and more complex ways to do this.


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[850xpeps]

Not fixing the problem properly boils down to the fact of not having
the funds or being able to finance it , as far as dealing with the water
its not a lot and I mop it up , there is a drain in the basement for a shower
so its easy to clean the mop and I have a high BTU forced air propane
portable heater to help with the moisture basically what what I'm after
is to " clean up " the walls by painting them , but not seal them so they
don't hold the water and fall apart . attached below a few pictures , the
water leaks at the area at the bottom of the stairs and then spreads ,
the black spot on the floor is suit from a old oil stove heater that I removed
a few days ago , forgot to metion it is a buried basement , the house
( farm house )was built around 1910 then remodeled in the 50s , and
that is when the ( so I was told ) the basement was added , was told it
was dug out by hand , don't know if that is true or not .

It doesn’t cost the world to excavate the wall and put some proper water protection on the outside. Dig it by hand if you can’t afford to rent a small excavator. Excavator would cost $250 ish a day maybe less. Water proofing material and patch is cheap. Don’t use small money as an excuse it does take some work.

Especially if you have kids that constant water causes mould and **** in the air. Constant dampness and bugs an ****. The crack only gets worse.

 

[Crossfire05]

Any tree roots on that side of the house. From the condition of the block, I would guess they are saturated. The white substance is efflorescence (salts) and is from moisture moving through the blocks over a period of time. If the other walls are not having this issue, I would suspect roots.

 

[Moto]

Pictures and/or diagram of the outside would be helpful.

 

[doctordirt]

Sometimes the best thing you can do is redirect the water. Porches, utilities, driveways, sidewalks, ect.
Just break out perimeter concrete. Drill bottom of all bock cores, tile and stone to existing or new sump. I always use s& d pipe it is smooth on the inside and the iron bateria that builds up in our area tend to self clean for longer times. Doesn't heard to put clean outs in as the iron bateria sometimes needs to be flushed or treated.

 

[Crossfire05]

Sometimes the best thing you can do is redirect the water. Porches, utilities, driveways, sidewalks, ect.
Just break out perimeter concrete. Drill bottom of all bock cores, tile and stone to existing or new sump. I always use s& d pipe it is smooth on the inside and the iron bateria that builds up in our area tend to self clean for longer times. Doesn't heard to put clean outs in as the iron bateria sometimes needs to be flushed or treated.

Iron Bacteria? You must be in Minnesota. I've heard of the issues they cause.

 

[Bluevista]

Digging up the perimeter is done by hand a lot around here, they use crews of Amish guys.
That block wall can be nearly filled with water, got to get it out of there any way you can.
The other option besides digging it up outside is the interior perimeter drain tile (BDry system)where they cut a trench in out from the wall, drill weep holes in the block that directs the water into drain tile then to a sump. It's major drawback is if you lose power or the pump goes and you have no battery back-up pump or another pump to replace it your basement will flood. I have it in my house, (was in there when I got it), and I've had a couple of real close calls.
My dad had a few leaks in his basement and he had a baseboard type system done just on the walls where the leaks were. They drill holes in the block then put in 1"? PVC pipes to drain out the block that connect with T's to a pipe that goes behind a baseboard cover channel then into a sump, it stopped the leaks..

 

[DTE]

The photos show a hole for a chimney ? is it seeping in from the chimney being open on the top ?

 

[MagKarl]

You can dig that out by hand with a pick and shovel.

Yes it will be a ton of work, but you can do it.

Don't waste money on an interior Band-Aid, do it right.

 

[Hilltopmasonry]

You can dig that out by hand with a pick and shovel.



Yes it will be a ton of work, but you can do it.



Don't waste money on an interior Band-Aid, do it right.

IMO that’s ALOT of digging! Mini excavators are not that expensive to rent and you will that section of wall dug in an hour.


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[joes169]

Normally, I would suggest using an interior "toe board" tied into 3" drain tile and a sump crock, along with holes drilled in the bottom of each core. We've always used "MTI" drainage board, their website has some good details and videos.

BUT, it appears you have a somewhat non-conventional foundation there, either there's an entire course of block buried below the floor, or there's minimal footing under the wall. You'd have to cut/break a little bit of floor out to know how they put it in years ago.....

 

[krisinwast]

Thanks everyone for chiming in , appreciate all the input , have a question about paint ,
want to make it look nice down there , would it be ok to paint the walls that are dry
with a concrete type of paint ?

 

[Blue]

Would be interested to see pics of the outside.

At the risk of stating the obvious, are all of the gutter downspouts routed away from the foundation?

 

[Crossfire05]

I agree with the comment about the "bandaid" on the interior. You will still have water draining through the block in the best scenario which will freeze and thaw causing continuing damage to your wall. The proper way is to fix it from the outside. It very well may be that that wall is partly compromised already and any attempts to drill into it etc. will make a bad situation worse.

 

[s14kev]

It doesn’t cost the world to excavate the wall and put some proper water protection on the outside. Dig it by hand if you can’t afford to rent a small excavator. Excavator would cost $250 ish a day maybe less. Water proofing material and patch is cheap. Don’t use small money as an excuse it does take some work.

I recently had our foundation dug out in a 1300sqft house. A 10 ft deep trench all the way around the house down to the footer, slightly bowed CMU wall pushed straight, cores drilled and filled with rebar and grout, wall waterproofed and Delta drain dimple board attached, perforated 4" PVC drain to daylight at base of trench, trench lined with geotextile fabric and filled with gravel wrapped in fabric. All gutters drain to daylight 40 feet away from the house through buried PVC pipe. Cost was ~$30k and looking at how much work it was (digging under deck etc) they certainly earned every penny of that. Well worth it as the basement is bone dry with humidity down from 80% in summer to now <40-50%. We had some estimates of >$50k for the same type of work.

Doing it properly is not cheap. If trenching is not an option, I would route the drain spouts through flexible pipe temporarily at least 30-40 feet away from the foundation and see if it improves the issue. There is no point in painting the wall. The efflorescence noted in the photos is mineral leaching through the CMU which will peel any paint right off. If you cannot afford to trench outside, an interior drain where the wall and floor meet is an option but not a great one as the basement will always be damp/humid and mold prone.

 

[850xpeps]

I recently had our foundation dug out in a 1300sqft house. A 10 ft deep trench all the way around the house down to the footer, slightly bowed CMU wall pushed straight, cores drilled and filled with rebar and grout, wall waterproofed and Delta drain dimple board attached, perforated 4" PVC drain to daylight at base of trench, trench lined with geotextile fabric and filled with gravel wrapped in fabric. All gutters drain to daylight 40 feet away from the house through buried PVC pipe. Cost was ~$30k and looking at how much work it was (digging under deck etc) they certainly earned every penny of that. Well worth it as the basement is bone dry with humidity down from 80% in summer to now <40-50%. We had some estimates of >$50k for the same type of work.



Doing it properly is not cheap. If trenching is not an option, I would route the drain spouts through flexible pipe temporarily at least 30-40 feet away from the foundation and see if it improves the issue. There is no point in painting the wall. The efflorescence noted in the photos is mineral leaching through the CMU which will peel any paint right off. If you cannot afford to trench outside, an interior drain where the wall and floor meet is an option but not a great one as the basement will always be damp/humid and mold prone.

Dimple board isn’t required. Blue skin or similar would be adequate. Yours is an extreme I would say. If you do the work yourself it can be done for not a fortune. I would still say 30k is higher than it should have been for your work. I would not let my gutters drain into my wheeping system as it isn’t made for that. The land should be sloped and gutters on top to slope from house. But your right it should be done from the exterior.