Cleaning Concrete Nightmare

[liliceman13300]

This is a house I'm renting. The guy is charging me basically nothing and I work on the house on the weekend. It's from the 50's and is pretty beat up. I'm in college and have limited expertise but an afternoon of google teaches you some basic stuff. Here's the current project...epoxying the floor.. It's giving me several headaches. I have a few questions later. Feel free to **** on me if I'm doing something wrong.

Easy part

Ready to go

Attempting chemical remover (Guys at Lowes told me it's the strongest **** they have...it's Crown strip-sol or something)

Wow that was a waste of $26

This seems to work

Hot towel is useless

Muratic acid did nothing

Diamond cup grinder wheel did the trick(biggest mess possible)

Actually look's okay

So the concrete looks much better. My only concern is I have been spraying water under those walls like 5-6 times...I soaked under there with bleach and used a giant squeegee to get the water out. Then put fans up against it nonstop blowing it. I'm using some **** Quikkrete epoxy setup. It's just going to be getting light foot traffic and occasional vomit/hookah/cigarette spills. Is having a few black spots in the concrete going to make the epoxy not set? I etched it a few times with the muratic acid plus the **** it came with.

 

[dandan111]

Boy this project takes me back about 20 years. Did you paint the walls purple? Anything you can feel sticking up,glue or whatever needs to come off. The black spots I would spray degreaser on and scrub.

 

[Familyof8kids]

You need to get all of the chemical off the floor. It looks like you did not grind that well? You can get a dust shield and hook it to your vacuum.

Muratic Acid reacts with the lime in the concrete. If you had glue or other on the surface the acid did not contact the lime so no reaction happened. If you have black spots what is it? You can use a wire wheel on a drill to get the coating up in the area with small holes.

PREP is the key. Bad prep then you get a bad coating no matter what MFG brand you purchase. Cut some plastic in a 12x12 square. Duct tape it around every edge and make sure it is sealed 100% to the floor around the edges. After 16-24 hours pull up the patch and see if any moisture is present. It will be easy to see. If so wait another 24 hours then put down the 12x12 patch again. You can also install a 8" strip of duct tape on the floor next to base board and take it up after 16-24 hours and see if the slab is wet where the tape was at. If so wait another 24 hours and do it again. Your concrete needs to have a Neutral PH before you install any coating.

 

[liliceman13300]

I painted the walls purple and the epoxy is gold, my school colors. There isn't any glue left and everything has been degreased. There are just some spots that have that nice grit feeling and others that don't feel quite as nice.
If there was asbestos in them it's too late now. There was a lot more concrete smoke than there was glue smoke though. I'll call the town and see what year they got a permit to put in the room since it's on a room that was later added. I'm assuming anything after 1980 should mean I'm okay with asbestos.
I've just dumped so much money into this that I could be using for new tools or groceries. I don't want to screw it up and have to deal with the guilt of wanting to re-do it.

 

[liliceman13300]

You need to get all of the chemical off the floor. It looks like you did not grind that well? You can get a dust shield and hook it to your vacuum.

Muratic Acid reacts with the lime in the concrete. If you had glue or other on the surface the acid did not contact the lime so no reaction happened. If you have black spots what is it? You can use a wire wheel on a drill to get the coating up in the area with small holes.

PREP is the key. Bad prep then you get a bad coating no matter what MFG brand you purchase. Cut some plastic in a 12x12 square. Duct tape it around every edge and make sure it is sealed 100% to the floor around the edges. After 16-24 hours pull up the patch and see if any moisture is present. It will be easy to see. If so wait another 24 hours then put down the 12x12 patch again. You can also install a 8" strip of duct tape on the floor next to base board and take it up after 16-24 hours and see if the slab is wet where the tape was at. If so wait another 24 hours and do it again. Your concrete needs to have a Neutral PH before you install any coating.

I was going to put baking soda all over the place and scrub it in to balance the acidity. I have no idea what the black spots are.. I guess I'll have to find my 3m full face respirator and get fresh cartridges. Sounds like I should do more grinding.

Also, I've read a few places recommending the plastic test so I will have to do that.

 

[930dreamer]

If you don't think the concrete floor will turn out, what's plan B?

 

[liliceman13300]

If you don't think the concrete floor will turn out, what's plan B?

Gonna get a bucket of cement paint and go to town. I'll be long gone before it starts peeling. I would rather try and be a nice guy though.

 

[theoldwizard1]

...Is having a few black spots in the concrete going to make the epoxy not set? I etched it a few times with the muratic acid plus the **** it came with.

I did a similar job last year at my sons house (laundry room) but I used Sentinel 747 cutback (black adhesive) remover.

Grinding is probably better but messier. If you have etched it, just rinse a couple of time with fresh water.

Let it dry AT LEAST 24 HOURS before trying to apply ANY kind of paint.

My sons floor looked like yours (a few black spots) and the Rustoleum brand epoxy covered it great !

 

[dandan111]

Not sure how it would react with the epoxy you are using but a coat of kilz painted as far into the cracks and corners may be a good first step. Even up on the base of the walls a few inches.

 

[MoonRise]

Ohhh dear lord!

Old house from the 50's, eh?

Let's see, the 'vinyl' floor tiles probably had asbestos in them. The adhesive/mastic might have had asbestos in it. The old paint probably had lead in it (or lead paint layers underneath the top layers). The plaster and/or drywall an /or drywall joint compund might have had asbestos in it.

Even if the 'addition' was put on later than the rest of the house, you don't know if the vinyl floor tiles weren't asbestos-containing (job was done with 'leftover' tiles found in basement from the original build, job was done with some free or low-cost tiles from a 'friend' or builder who gave/sold them, etc, etc).

Seriously, asbestos and lead are not things to 'f' with.

With the proper procedures and safety equipment, they can be dealt with.

But just going in a sanding, scraping, grinding, and/or heating things can easily put the formerly mostly-safe bad-juju **** into the air as dust/vapors and spread them into you and all over the rest of the house.

Yeah, that would be a headache all right.

 

[ivinho]

I'm probably a little late but you might find this info useful on future projects.

I had a similar problem with (black) mastic in my basement. I used a product by Karnak which worked great but way too expensive, then I found a soy based product called Bean-e-Doo by franmar that worked just as well. Completly removed the mastic. I also used it in areas that had a lot of holes and then used a shop vac to clean it out.

I also used a grinder with a cover from Bosch hooked to a hepa vac, which eliminated 99% of the dust. My home is also from the 50's but luckily I don't have asbestos. I mailed some samples to a company in California to get tested.

As for the water getting into the walls, I would recommend leaving a dehumidifier and moving it along side the walls throughout the day.


Karnak
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-100273411/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=karnak&storeId=10051

Bean-e-doo

http://www.norkan.com/Norkan_Store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=20

 

[liliceman13300]

Ohhh dear lord!

Old house from the 50's, eh?

Let's see, the 'vinyl' floor tiles probably had asbestos in them. The adhesive/mastic might have had asbestos in it. The old paint probably had lead in it (or lead paint layers underneath the top layers). The plaster and/or drywall an /or drywall joint compund might have had asbestos in it.

Even if the 'addition' was put on later than the rest of the house, you don't know if the vinyl floor tiles weren't asbestos-containing (job was done with 'leftover' tiles found in basement from the original build, job was done with some free or low-cost tiles from a 'friend' or builder who gave/sold them, etc, etc).

Seriously, asbestos and lead are not things to 'f' with.

With the proper procedures and safety equipment, they can be dealt with.

But just going in a sanding, scraping, grinding, and/or heating things can easily put the formerly mostly-safe bad-juju **** into the air as dust/vapors and spread them into you and all over the rest of the house.

Yeah, that would be a headache all right.

I appreciate the concern/advice. Only issue is I've already done all that so I can't go back in time. When I ripped the tile up there was no dust in the air. When I did the grinding I sealed the room off and cleaned all the dust up before opening the room back up.
I have a cold and ate an entire medium pizza for dinner last night so I'm not sure how the dust is effecting me. I need to go find some documentation for this house to find out about the lead and asbestos.

 

[slickgt1]

I feel so bad for you. College and going though all this mess. Why epoxy anyway? Lots of prep. Is it because you want that specific color?

I would tile that without even grinding. Scrape it flat enough, and go to town.

 

[liliceman13300]

In the future, do some googling to learn about safe handling of materials before you start creating some possibly toxic dust.

This is big on my mind right now, as my girlfriend and I are considering buying a house built in the 1920s, which is virtually guaranteed to contain lead paint.

I knew what I was getting into. I just figured since i used so many chemicals to remove the glue that the concrete dust would be more toxic than the amount of asbestos left at that point.

I did do wallpaper in one room that has lead paint, I didn't scrape any of it off though. Just removed the wallpaper with a steamer and painted over it.

 

[liliceman13300]

I feel so bad for you. College and going though all this mess. Why epoxy anyway? Lots of prep. Is it because you want that specific color?

I would tile that without even grinding. Scrape it flat enough, and go to town.

I think epoxy would be best for its strength. Managing this project with school is a pain but the house is big so it's not like I have no place to sleep.

I think the floor is too uneven for tile. There are 2 parts where the floor dips in. I figured epoxy would go over it without issue.

 

[theoldwizard1]

I think the floor is too uneven for tile. There are 2 parts where the floor dips in. I figured epoxy would go over it without issue.

Go for it !

 

[13Harleyfan]

I'm getting ready to remodel a 50's house and none of this toxic stuff even crossed my mind. I just got into this forum to get some ideas for my garage in my home which I just remodeled.(Built in the 70's). Learn something new everyday.

 

[JimVonBaden]

In the future, do some googling to learn about safe handling of materials before you start creating some possibly toxic dust.

This is big on my mind right now, as my girlfriend and I are considering buying a house built in the 1920s, which is virtually guaranteed to contain lead paint.

Do a little lead paint research. It is nowhere nearly as dangerous (to adults) as asbestos. If you are removing it, just use a little comon sense and don't eat it!

Jim

 

[JimVonBaden]

I have done reading on it.

You're correct that lead paint can be dealt with safely, and it's more dangerous to children.

But if there were lead paints or asbestos present in the tiles/mastic/etc. on the floor, the OP handled it pretty poorly.

I'm just trying to get members here to think about about safety and handling a project like this before they tear into it.

Knowledge is a good thing!

Jim

 

[liliceman13300]

I have done reading on it.

You're correct that lead paint can be dealt with safely, and it's more dangerous to children.

But if there were lead paints or asbestos present in the tiles/mastic/etc. on the floor, the OP handled it pretty poorly.

I'm just trying to get members here to think about about safety and handling a project like this before they tear into it.

I think I took a video of it. I could make an OSHA what not to do video.

 

[liliceman13300]

Nightmare got worse. Was told to go ahead and do it...The floor seemed like it was prepped well enough that I wasn't too afraid. Only issue Quikrete yellow is complete **** and 1 gallon covered about 50sq ft. Owner didn't want to spend any more money on it. Here's a picture of this disaster:

Good thing i dont own this house

 

[slickgt1]

Dude, just tile it. You are in such a mess right now, it is upsetting. As a matter of fact, go find some VCT and glue that down. So what if you have dips, you are willing to settle with the same dips with epoxy.