Above 1200 Sq/FT Cleaning Up My Shop

[oldironfarmer]

Andy: Do you really still have a 486 computer online and running? WOW and WOW. i bought mine in 1992 for $2,000 and it came with 4 megs and I upgraded to 8 megs which i think was about a $400 upgrade and you had 20 megs? i also remember my HP Laser jet printer was $1,600, but i bought a floor model for half that and if i wanted 2.5 megs of memory to maybe print color it was another $400. now we buy Terabytes for peanuts.

I surely can't say where my old 486 is cause i think i'm on maybe my 5th or more computer since then, but if yours is still running that's even more amazing than you repairing and using tires until the steel tread wore thru.

maybe i should ship you a container of all my old computer stuff cause sounds like if you can't use it Bob can.

good to hear you are back doing Zumba so i'm guessing you are starting to feel a bit better.

cheers

I recall my LaserJet 4 being $1,200 at Sam's club. It started mis-feeding and I had talked my dad into buying one. He always upgraded so by the time mine broke he had his 4+ (not Si) surplus so I brought it home and have used it ever since. I have had to replace the rubber feed roller but that stuff is ridiculously cheap.

No memory and no fonts in my LaserJets. I'm too cheap.

I imagine I bought my 20 meg drive a few years after you bought your drives mentioned. $200 is probably what I paid.

I think this computer is probably a Pentium (586). I don't know where the 486 is, but it is here somewhere

Just ship your extra computer stuff to Bob. I'm going to.

That looks like a PCI-compatible card to me. See if it fits in the new comp and is auto-detected.

I don't think I've seen through-hole-mounted, well, anything, on a computer in the last 10 years!

If it doesn't fit, put it in the computer museum.

Great, I'll try it.

What does "through hole mounted" mean?

When I was looking for a parallel to USB in my junk I was surprised by how many chargers and connection cords I have. They reproduce, don't they? If you leave male and female connectors together in a dark place? Thinking about hanging them on the wall where they can't reach each other.

 

[tym]

What does "through hole mounted" mean?

I was just opining obliquely. Through-hole mounting refers to how components are mounted on the circuit board. The components have discrete leads that go through holes in the board and are soldered in. Common for basically any electronic item with a circuit board from the 80s through the 90s. Now everything is surface-mount, which allows for smaller components and denser population on the circuit board ==> smaller product.

Predecessors of through-hole were wire-wrapped (before my time) but still with circuit boards. Before that was chassis-mount design, usually with tube-based stuff into the 60s.

 

[Farmall450]

Good luck Andy. Glad to see you giving the old tech some love.

 

[drivesitfar]

Andy: I went down the slippery slope with HP black and white printers maybe close to you and tractors cause a client was upgrading his to a color one and he sold me his with 20 toner cartridges i think for $100 when one toner cost $125 in those days. so to use all those toners i ended up picking up a couple more HP III laser jets and when one couldn't work after all the tricks i'd learned it was tossed in a room as a parts printer.

funny thing i bought 2 5 meg chips for these printers for $5 when new they went for $500 each, but it didn't make the printer work any better.

I used to buy a HP all in one fax/scanner/printer machine every 2 years and toss the old one as it quit feeding all the fax pages correctly. do you really still use a FAX?

best of luck with your computer situation and looks like BOB and the boys will have you fixed up pretty soon so you can get back to welding and forming steel again soon.

cheers

 

[TwoBytes]

I store all my sensitive information and backups on an Equifax server.

That's a great idea! Like hiding a needle in a stack of needles!

I remember that image. It is pretty cool in my mind, but had no idea it was Fusion 360. It's a small large world.

I'm not feeling very quick, really having trouble understanding the difference between a component and a body. But I think I will be able to use it. I need a bigger screen and a mouse. It is not track pad friendly.

Definitely not trackpad friendly! A nice mouse and big monitor will be a huge help.

Nice that you remembered that image of my pergola/house, thanks. It sure is a small/large world.

Speaking of small worlds, that reminds me, did you know that Space X (Elon Musk) is sending his red Tesla Roadster to Mars tomorrow (or is it today for you already? Tuesday at 13:30 ET) on top of the biggest rocket in the world (at the moment anyway)...

Not much to do with anything really, I just think it's cool. I'll be getting up at 04:00 tomorrow to watch.

I was being a bit facetious. I would be proud if someone stole my stuff and made money off of it. If you read my post carefully, it is internet interruptions and a slow connection that makes any cloud work tedious. One of the perks of living in the country, but at least I have DSL, even though I'm at he limit of distance from the last hub. The provider is our local phone company, an independent that gets signals from a dish that suffers when there is heavy weather.

I really don't care if anyone steals about any of my 0's and 1's. I'm retired and regaining my identity would give me a purpose in life.

Haha, I knew you were being a bit facetious, but I thought it was a good opportunity to have a rant anyways. Lack of reliable internet connectivity is a good reason not to put your stuff in the cloud.

I've had only upgrades for years, and have installed an old version on a new computer in order to qualify for an upgrade. It might save me some time to call them and install what I have. Bob gave me permission to not go with the latest, and I thank him for that. You've given me some really good food for thought.

What do you think of buying a refurbished computer?

I've never bought a refurbished computer before, and I think it's a great idea, especially if it's been refurbished by the manufacturer and comes with a warranty!

I used to always take a backup to work. I screwed that up when I quit working. But my injet printer died (door is open, according to the computer, needs a switch replaced) and I bought a new one in 2013 while I was living through the week in Houston. Working 12-13 hours per day, flying Monday morning and Friday evening, I was tired and never unboxed it. It's still in the box I need to open it because a scanner would be nice, but I scan with my cell phone. I said all that to say this, all my printing is done on my LaserJet 4Si. Did you know cartridges for them are super cheap now? When I was Church Treasurer I ran several hundred sheets per month, now I'm down to around a hundred. So anything I need to print from the laptop goes on my thumb drive, and anything I need to email from the desk top goes on the thumbnail to this computer. That's my remote backup, in my pocket. It survives welding and plasma arc cutting in close proximity and has been through lots of airport scanners. It holds all my Quicken and Excel files easily. Photographs go on a 1T Passport.

At least you've got backups, that's the main thing. USB keys are so cheap now, you could chuck that one in your pocket in a locked drawer in your shed every so often and buy a new one... sounds like an offsite backup to me.

That printer with the door open error could probably be fixed by cutting the wires off the back of the switch and soldering them together, so it thinks the door is closed all the time.

Those old monochrome laser printers print very nicely, they still print text nicer than the best new inkjets IMHO (as an ex-printer/copier technician).

Looks like the parallel port problem has been thoroughly explored. I don't have much to add except that it doesn't look like it's hard to find, or expensive to get a new PCIe DB25 card...
https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-Express-Profile-Parallel-Adapter/dp/B001Q7X0Z8

Or a new refurbishment? I switch between 7 and Vista on my desk top easily but will 10 and Vista play well together through the thumb drive? Windows 7 always wants to clean it up, but I deny it the pleasure of keeping Vista from reading it.

You shouldn't have any issues going between Vista and Win 10. If Win 7 can read it, Win 10 will be able to. There is a chance that formatting a new USB drive on Win 10 (with NTFS) would render it unable to be read by Vista, but if you go the other way you'll be fine (Windows is very good at backward compatibility, but old Windows doesn't do forward compatibility very well!)

Boy oh boy I wish you were closer. All my friends her can help with what's wron gwith a cow but aren't much on the magic boxes. Except JB, but he's busy.

I've got land for sale...

That's pretty tempting mate, your part of the world has a lot going for it! I'm sure the kids would love it if I had some room to get some tractors too.

Andy, when I suggested a refurbished laptop, I meant a machine from the original manufacturer, not a re-seller. As an example, this Dell laptop sold for $2,649. Refurbished, with a 1-year warranty, Dell sells it for $1,498. The memory and solid state drive along with touch screen make this a pretty fancy model. They have $200 machines as well.

• Processor: Intel Core 6th Generation i7-6700HQ Processor (Quad Core, up to 3.50 GHz, 6M Cache, 45W)
• Windows 10 Home 64bit English
• 1TB M.2 PCIe Solid State Drive
• 32GB DDR4 Dual Channel 2133Mhz N-ECC (16GBx2)
• 15.6inch 4K Ultra HD (3840 x 2160) InfinityEdge touch
• NVIDIA GeForce GTX 960 2GB GDDR5
• McAfee LiveSafe 12-month
• Dell Outlet XPS 15 - 9550

http://outlet.us.dell.com/ArbOnline...usXH3dvu0fVMuA+KOG2NT/TsO+3gQzyQFdpRPfIqT//8=

Yes, you should buy that, that is an excellent deal, and an excellent choice of laptop!

I'm looking at refurbished Dells now too, they do the same thing in Australia, I had no idea!

M.

 

[EOC_Jason]

I pulled out the parallel port card

And the hard drive

It says 2557 MB, is that 2-1/2 Gigabytes?

I'd be happy to buy a parallel port if the other computer looks like it will run, but I'm not opposed to donations either. What does the card above look like?

And I see the hard wired parallel port would be easy to install in the other computer. Any chance the ribbon would fit?

1. That parallel port card is for an ISA slot. It will not work in your newer computer, sorry. Don't try shoving it into a PCI slot, it won't fit and you will only damage something.

2. Yes, 2557 MB is about 2.5 GB

3. The parallel port ribon cable won't work in your new PC either as it does not have a place to plug into. Parallel (and serial) ports are considered "legacy" and manufacturers removed them from motherboards years ago to save money and make room for more modern connections.


One more question, what software will you be running the router with? You might need an older PC and older OS to run it. Something I was just thinking about...

I wish I could find an old Laserjet 4si or 5si, those old HP printers were bulletproof! I had a 5P bought new in 1995... A whopping 6 pages per minute... Had it up until 2007 when I finally decided to upgrade to something faster. Gave the 5P to a friend that still uses it. I purchased a HP P2015DN (network & duplex) that prints super fast and will probably have it until it dies.

 

[tym]

1. That parallel port card is for an ISA slot. It will not work in your newer computer, sorry. Don't try shoving it into a PCI slot, it won't fit and you will only damage something.

Oops, my bad. I only saw PCI doors in the old comp, and combined with my hazy memory of legacy PC equipment, made the wrong assumption.

Andy, hope you haven't been spending all of this Saturday trying to hammer that card into the wrong slot with one of your aluminum hammers!

 

[oldironfarmer]

I was just opining obliquely. Through-hole mounting refers to how components are mounted on the circuit board. The components have discrete leads that go through holes in the board and are soldered in. Common for basically any electronic item with a circuit board from the 80s through the 90s. Now everything is surface-mount, which allows for smaller components and denser population on the circuit board ==> smaller product.

Predecessors of through-hole were wire-wrapped (before my time) but still with circuit boards. Before that was chassis-mount design, usually with tube-based stuff into the 60s.

Thanks for the information!

Good luck Andy. Glad to see you giving the old tech some love.

Not sure I love it too much...

Andy: I went down the slippery slope with HP black and white printers maybe close to you and tractors cause a client was upgrading his to a color one and he sold me his with 20 toner cartridges i think for $100 when one toner cost $125 in those days. so to use all those toners i ended up picking up a couple more HP III laser jets and when one couldn't work after all the tricks i'd learned it was tossed in a room as a parts printer.

funny thing i bought 2 5 meg chips for these printers for $5 when new they went for $500 each, but it didn't make the printer work any better.

I used to buy a HP all in one fax/scanner/printer machine every 2 years and toss the old one as it quit feeding all the fax pages correctly. do you really still use a FAX?

best of luck with your computer situation and looks like BOB and the boys will have you fixed up pretty soon so you can get back to welding and forming steel again soon.

cheers

The LaserJet 4 still prints great. Until the wiper on the toner cartridge starts failing.

I regularly have people ask me for a FAX. Generally in real estate transactions. Apparently a signed document faxed is acceptable where a photograph of the same document is not acceptable. ? At least in the minds of some people.

That's a great idea! Like hiding a needle in a stack of needles!



Definitely not trackpad friendly! A nice mouse and big monitor will be a huge help.

Nice that you remembered that image of my pergola/house, thanks. It sure is a small/large world.

Speaking of small worlds, that reminds me, did you know that Space X (Elon Musk) is sending his red Tesla Roadster to Mars tomorrow (or is it today for you already? Tuesday at 13:30 ET) on top of the biggest rocket in the world (at the moment anyway)...

Not much to do with anything really, I just think it's cool. I'll be getting up at 04:00 tomorrow to watch.



Haha, I knew you were being a bit facetious, but I thought it was a good opportunity to have a rant anyways. Lack of reliable internet connectivity is a good reason not to put your stuff in the cloud.

I've never bought a refurbished computer before, and I think it's a great idea, especially if it's been refurbished by the manufacturer and comes with a warranty!

At least you've got backups, that's the main thing. USB keys are so cheap now, you could chuck that one in your pocket in a locked drawer in your shed every so often and buy a new one... sounds like an offsite backup to me.

That printer with the door open error could probably be fixed by cutting the wires off the back of the switch and soldering them together, so it thinks the door is closed all the time.

Those old monochrome laser printers print very nicely, they still print text nicer than the best new inkjets IMHO (as an ex-printer/copier technician).

Looks like the parallel port problem has been thoroughly explored. I don't have much to add except that it doesn't look like it's hard to find, or expensive to get a new PCIe DB25 card...
https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-Express-Profile-Parallel-Adapter/dp/B001Q7X0Z8

You shouldn't have any issues going between Vista and Win 10. If Win 7 can read it, Win 10 will be able to. There is a chance that formatting a new USB drive on Win 10 (with NTFS) would render it unable to be read by Vista, but if you go the other way you'll be fine (Windows is very good at backward compatibility, but old Windows doesn't do forward compatibility very well!)



That's pretty tempting mate, your part of the world has a lot going for it! I'm sure the kids would love it if I had some room to get some tractors too.

Yes, you should buy that, that is an excellent deal, and an excellent choice of laptop!

I'm looking at refurbished Dells now too, they do the same thing in Australia, I had no idea!

M.

I don't really understand launching an automobile into space, other than they just couldn't find a useful payload on a test trip which may very well fail. And I don't think it's his only car...

The LaserJet 4 does still print very well. Old technology. I think I'll try it on my Inkjet film for making masks.

So does this look like a standard PCI? Looks like one long slot and a few short ones.

I'm mulling over the new computer, as this one is working fine and I don't want to screw with trying to get Excel on a new one.

I've got lots of USB drives, most of them 1 gig. I forgot I also backup my financial records regularly on a thumb drive which never leaves my computer. Not lightening safe but hard drive failure safe.

Do we think solid state drives are more reliable than mechanical ones?

1. That parallel port card is for an ISA slot. It will not work in your newer computer, sorry. Don't try shoving it into a PCI slot, it won't fit and you will only damage something.

Thanks!

2. Yes, 2557 MB is about 2.5 GB

I'm learning so much

3. The parallel port ribbon cable won't work in your new PC either as it does not have a place to plug into. Parallel (and serial) ports are considered "legacy" and manufacturers removed them from motherboards years ago to save money and make room for more modern connections.

Now that I've looked in the new box I see. Not even a ribbon in there.

One more question, what software will you be running the router with? You might need an older PC and older OS to run it. Something I was just thinking about...

Mach3. I guess. I tried to transfer it to this computer and it comes up fine. This morning I loaded it on the new (old) computer and it seemed to come up fine. The new computer seems slow sometimes, but it has a 1T hard drive (my laptop it turns out only has 800gig) that is less that 10% used. Here's the computer properties. Another picture, I took a keyboard out but it has no keyboard port, just USD so I need to buy a keyboard. So we have another real screen shot.

I wish I could find an old Laserjet 4si or 5si, those old HP printers were bulletproof! I had a 5P bought new in 1995... A whopping 6 pages per minute... Had it up until 2007 when I finally decided to upgrade to something faster. Gave the 5P to a friend that still uses it. I purchased a HP P2015DN (network & duplex) that prints super fast and will probably have it until it dies.

I'd make you a whale of a deal on my old LaserJet4.

Oops, my bad. I only saw PCI doors in the old comp, and combined with my hazy memory of legacy PC equipment, made the wrong assumption.

Andy, hope you haven't been spending all of this Saturday trying to hammer that card into the wrong slot with one of your aluminum hammers!

I almost had it installed when something broke and there was smoke. Guess I should have turned the computer off first. I can't see any problems though so it's probably ok.

 

[tym]

I almost had it installed when something broke and there was smoke. Guess I should have turned the computer off first. I can't see any problems though so it's probably ok.

You need to light a fire inside to replace the magic smoke that was lost.

 

[EOC_Jason]

Those are all PCI-Express (latest technology), the short ones are x1 slots (for accessories), the long one is probably an x16 (for a video card)...

Here is a Parallel Port, PCI Express x1 card that will fit in the new computer... $19 shipped.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...=1&cm_re=parallel_port-_-15-124-083-_-Product

So does this look like a standard PCI? Looks like one long slot and a few short ones.

 

[oldironfarmer]

Thanks! Card on order.

 

[TwoBytes]

I regularly have people ask me for a FAX. Generally in real estate transactions. Apparently a signed document faxed is acceptable where a photograph of the same document is not acceptable. ? At least in the minds of some people.

Yeah, that makes no sense at all, but I have experienced the same thing.

I don't really understand launching an automobile into space, other than they just couldn't find a useful payload on a test trip which may very well fail. And I don't think it's his only car...

I think that it's really just marketing... it's got him a lot of publicity, and while I agree that it's a waste of a nice car, it's a lot cheaper, and probably more effective than a superbowl ad!

The first test flight of the Dragon spacecraft carried a large wheel of French Le Brouère cheese.



(the cheese is an obscure tribute to Monty Python)

I think he's just got an odd sense of humour.

The LaserJet 4 does still print very well. Old technology. I think I'll try it on my Inkjet film for making masks.

So does this look like a standard PCI? Looks like one long slot and a few short ones.

Jason nailed it, PCIe x1 and x16 slots.

I'm mulling over the new computer, as this one is working fine and I don't want to screw with trying to get Excel on a new one.

I've got lots of USB drives, most of them 1 gig. I forgot I also backup my financial records regularly on a thumb drive which never leaves my computer. Not lightening safe but hard drive failure safe.

Do we think solid state drives are more reliable than mechanical ones?

No rush to get a new one if your current one is working for you, they're only going to get better and cheaper the longer you wait!

Whether SSDs are more reliable than HDDs is actually quite a complex question.

SSDs are definitely more physically durable, there's no moving parts, so they handle being dropped better, and are more resistant to heat, cold and high G forces.

The way that flash NAND works makes it wear out over time though, where the recording medium on a HDD doesn't. There are mechanical components in a HDD that wear out, but not in a practical timeframe.

If a HDD doesn't die, it will work for a very long time, where an SSD might not die, but it's performance will get progressively worse as it wears out (probably not a factor for home use, but definitely a consideration in a datacentre).

In practice, I think SSDs and HDDs fail roughly as often as each other. SSDs tend to fail catastrophically, where HDDs may degrade and get errors before dying completely.

I almost had it installed when something broke and there was smoke. Guess I should have turned the computer off first. I can't see any problems though so it's probably ok.

Oops! Don't let the magic smoke out!

Most components inside a computer are not hot-swappable

 

[Guster]

You win some you lose some with SSD. For one they are fast and great for running your OS and core apps on. But they don’t like being used for repetitive writing when used for swap space to extend your memory capacity like windows likes to do. So unless you increase your RAM you can see degradation in performance of large programs and processes that traditionally depend on swap space. SSDs are now fairly robust and I see no need to shy away as long as you work with their limits. It is common to run the OS on a smaller SSD with a larger HDD for all your junk.

Another worthy upgrade would be to put in a dedicated graphics card and disable the onboard graphics to improve your performance with MACH3. Even a basic display card can make a difference freeing up onboard cache, RAM and bus allocation for processor to use.

Another would be to swap to LinuxCNC early on. But that latter is a matter of choice.

 

[tym]

Oops! Don't let the magic smoke out!

Most components inside a computer are not hot-swappable

I think Andy was pullin' our legs.

 

[Bob Heine]

I don't really understand launching an automobile into space, other than they just couldn't find a useful payload on a test trip which may very well fail. And I don't think it's his only car...

Andy, they launched from Southern California. I'm pretty sure they couldn't find a parking space for the car. Send it into orbit instead of driving around the block for days on end.

 

[Finallygotit]

Andy, they launched from Southern California......

 

[oldironfarmer]

You need to light a fire inside to replace the magic smoke that was lost.

I have tried to put the smoke back in and I just can't do it. I guess I need a better Vieux of things.

Yeah, that makes no sense at all, but I have experienced the same thing.

I think that it's really just marketing... it's got him a lot of publicity, and while I agree that it's a waste of a nice car, it's a lot cheaper, and probably more effective than a superbowl ad!

The first test flight of the Dragon spacecraft carried a large wheel of French Le Brouère cheese.



(the cheese is an obscure tribute to Monty Python)

I think he's just got an odd sense of humour.

Jason nailed it, PCIe x1 and x16 slots.

No rush to get a new one if your current one is working for you, they're only going to get better and cheaper the longer you wait!

Whether SSDs are more reliable than HDDs is actually quite a complex question.

SSDs are definitely more physically durable, there's no moving parts, so they handle being dropped better, and are more resistant to heat, cold and high G forces.

The way that flash NAND works makes it wear out over time though, where the recording medium on a HDD doesn't. There are mechanical components in a HDD that wear out, but not in a practical timeframe.

If a HDD doesn't die, it will work for a very long time, where an SSD might not die, but it's performance will get progressively worse as it wears out (probably not a factor for home use, but definitely a consideration in a datacentre).

In practice, I think SSDs and HDDs fail roughly as often as each other. SSDs tend to fail catastrophically, where HDDs may degrade and get errors before dying completely.

Oops! Don't let the magic smoke out!

Most components inside a computer are not hot-swappable

I truly admire Elon Musk. Impressive individual and it's not only about profit for him. And he is letting lots of people dream their dreams for real.

I'm a real light user, so I'm not worried, but I appreciate your clear description of the drive differences.

Actually I'm not much for working around hot electronics. As opposed to power which I am comfortable working hot with.

You win some you lose some with SSD. For one they are fast and great for running your OS and core apps on. But they don’t like being used for repetitive writing when used for swap space to extend your memory capacity like windows likes to do. So unless you increase your RAM you can see degradation in performance of large programs and processes that traditionally depend on swap space. SSDs are now fairly robust and I see no need to shy away as long as you work with their limits. It is common to run the OS on a smaller SSD with a larger HDD for all your junk.

Another worthy upgrade would be to put in a dedicated graphics card and disable the onboard graphics to improve your performance with MACH3. Even a basic display card can make a difference freeing up onboard cache, RAM and bus allocation for processor to use.

Another would be to swap to LinuxCNC early on. But that latter is a matter of choice.

If I install a graphics card do I disable the onboard graphics electronically or just jamb it with a screwdriver?

I imagine my use will be light enough that Mach3 will handle it, but I have no idea what LinuxCNC even is and how it compares.

I think Andy was pullin' our legs.

I love it when people give me more credit than I deserve. I'm as innocent as the fresh fallen snow

I did find the screenshot of Fusion360. It's called "Capture Image". I spent a little time today and got my name in raised letters on the wrench cope pattern

And got a "Made in USA" for the cope side. The date should be easy now.

The oblique view to let you see the character depth makes the alignment look offcenter.

It will be interesting to see whether the 3D printer will pick up the letters cleanly. I will try making it with the 3D router too, it lends itself to both machines.

I'm having fun now

 

[oldironfarmer]

Andy, they launched from Southern California. I'm pretty sure they couldn't find a parking space for the car. Send it into orbit instead of driving around the block for days on end.

SpaceX makes it almost cheap enough to be a parking aid. Who would have thought a private company could do space travel?

He's delusional. Just nod politely and he'll go back to sleep soon.

But he did get into my pocket. I ordered the computer he hounded me over. I thought about waiting but my wife pointed out my productive time is now measured in weeks rather than years so just do it.

More dental work tomorrow

 

[1/2 Cup]

Andy, your wrench is way to cool..

I'm as innocent as the fresh fallen snow

 

[oldironfarmer]

Andy, your wrench is way to cool..

I'm as innocent as the fresh fallen snow

Thanks! Wait till I mill a half hex opening in it

It is tempting to put the opening in the pattern, but if I feed hot metal from that end that is where the shrinkage will be, so I plan to mill out all the shrinkage when making the opening. Plan. We'll see.

It's all just an exercise but I want to hang the wrench on the front of my wood lathe to use on the nut to pull the spur. That will free up a valuable Crescent wrench.

I think the phrase you would recognize is "pure as the driven snow".

Thanks for stopping by! Always a pleasure to have friends visit.

 

[Bob Heine]

Andy, they launched from Southern California. I'm pretty sure they couldn't find a parking space for the car. Send it into orbit instead of driving around the block for days on end.

Dan, my bad. I actually watched the Florida launch today. I should have said "With headquarters in Southern California, I'm pretty sure...."

 

[slimpickins]

All this computer talk brings back nostalgic memories. I started programming computers in 1981-1982, on an IBM 360 mainframe - or maybe it was the 370...
My phone is a just a few thousand times faster than the IBM 360.

I still have a legacy 486 runnning at 66 Mhz running Windows 2000. It's more dust collector than useful but the old programs still work. Sits right next to my i7-4790K with 2 TB, my Plex server with 15.5 TB and my FreeNAS server with 32TB. I think this is a bit like comparing a Willys to a Corrolla though????

If anyone is interested, I still have a Toshiba laptop running Windows for Workgroups that has a built in parallel port. Accepting offers????? Still works perfectly!

Andy, lovely work on the wrench!

Cheers!

 

[tym]

All this computer talk brings back nostalgic memories. I started programming computers in 1981-1982, on an IBM 360 mainframe - or maybe it was the 370...
My phone is a just a few thousand times faster than the IBM 360.

I still have a legacy 486 runnning at 66 Mhz running Windows 2000. It's more dust collector than useful but the old programs still work. Sits right next to my i7-4790K with 2 TB, my Plex server with 15.5 TB and my FreeNAS server with 32TB. I think this is a bit like comparing a Willys to a Corrolla though????

If anyone is interested, I still have a Toshiba laptop running Windows for Workgroups that has a built in parallel port. Accepting offers????? Still works perfectly!

Andy, lovely work on the wrench!

Cheers!

I still have my IBM ThinkPad T42. Lot of good memories ******* in that machine...it carried me through grad school!

 

[Guster]

If I install a graphics card do I disable the onboard graphics electronically or just jamb it with a screwdriver?

I imagine my use will be light enough that Mach3 will handle it, but I have no idea what LinuxCNC even is and how it compares.

Disable/Enable Onboard graphics in the BIOS settings.

LinuxCNC is like Mach3 but runs on a different OS ie. Linux. It is free and has some better capability ie. threading control on a lathe if you provide axial position feedback as an input. But it means getting intimate with another OS and figuring some stuff out yourself. An intimidating proposition for people in an already intimidating situation. It was mentioned lightheartedly to get you ready for hearing it often. It is a CNC experts' mention of solving all ails but you'll need to invest a lot of Saturdays to get to the stage where you will agree with them. Your time is best spent becoming friends with Fusion360 for now.

I love it when people give me more credit than I deserve. I'm as innocent as the fresh fallen snow

Tsssskkk... innocent as the fresh fallen snow?!? Only thing you said that's not true!

You are giving it a go... that is more than most people do. You don't see may blacksmith farmer types getting their ankles wet with CNC stuff. Rarely see any retirees willing to step up to give it a go at all. I will say this Andy... you get my credit!(not all of it though... I need to do more renovation with the rest)

I did find the screenshot of Fusion360. It's called "Capture Image". I spent a little time today and got my name in raised letters on the wrench cope pattern

I know an Andy... but who is this Martin fella?

Keep going Andy Martin. You are doing great!

 

[oldironfarmer]

Dan, my bad. I actually watched the Florida launch today. I should have said "With headquarters in Southern California, I'm pretty sure...."

Liane helped you with that save, didn't she? Good save though. I bought it.

All this computer talk brings back nostalgic memories. I started programming computers in 1981-1982, on an IBM 360 mainframe - or maybe it was the 370...
My phone is a just a few thousand times faster than the IBM 360.

I still have a legacy 486 runnning at 66 Mhz running Windows 2000. It's more dust collector than useful but the old programs still work. Sits right next to my i7-4790K with 2 TB, my Plex server with 15.5 TB and my FreeNAS server with 32TB. I think this is a bit like comparing a Willys to a Corrolla though????

If anyone is interested, I still have a Toshiba laptop running Windows for Workgroups that has a built in parallel port. Accepting offers????? Still works perfectly!

Andy, lovely work on the wrench!

Cheers!

Well, no, it's more like comparing a windup toy car with a Tesla.

My first programming was with an IBM 1620. Card reader with patch wires which would to a lot if you took the time. It also had an electric typewriter for output and you could input if you set the switches right. Front of that computer was great, right out of 1940's sci fi, lots of lights blinking and lots of switches.

We had twin 360's at school but all I ever did on them was Fortran 4. Ha! Spellcheck does not recognize Fortran. My computer ignores it's own heritage.

32TB, that's like more storage than everything I could do in my lifetime. Does it rattle when you drop something into it? Like putting an ear of corn in an empty 100,000 bushel grain bin?

Guess I'd better learn, what's 1,000 terabytes?

Glad to see you crawling around GJ!!

I still have my IBM ThinkPad T42. Lot of good memories ******* in that machine...it carried me through grad school!

I still have my HP 29C. Know what that is?

Disable/Enable Onboard graphics in the BIOS settings.

Thanks. Now I have to actually know what BIOS means. Screwdriver sounds like more fun.

LinuxCNC is like Mach3 but runs on a different OS ie. Linux. It is free and has some better capability ie. threading control on a lathe if you provide axial position feedback as an input. But it means getting intimate with another OS and figuring some stuff out yourself. An intimidating proposition for people in an already intimidating situation. It was mentioned lightheartedly to get you ready for hearing it often. It is a CNC experts' mention of solving all ails but you'll need to invest a lot of Saturdays to get to the stage where you will agree with them. Your time is best spent becoming friends with Fusion360 for now.

Fusion360 is making more sense. My next models will hopefully be more robust. I do know what Linux is, but have never tried it. I'm guessing that the USB to parallel port cord I bought may serve the router will since the router has no feedback. We're just assuming the stepper motors are perfect once you manually set the tool to a home position. Am I making sense?

Tsssskkk... innocent as the fresh fallen snow?!? Only thing you said that's not true!



You are giving it a go... that is more than most people do. You don't see many blacksmith farmer types getting their ankles wet with CNC stuff. Rarely see any retirees willing to step up to give it a go at all. I will say this Andy... you get my credit!(not all of it though... I need to do more renovation with the rest)

Once again, more credit than I deserve. I'm just desperately trying to make stuff I can't afford to buy. My goal for the printer is foundry patterns, and my goal for the router is patterns as well as molds for clay for embossed pottery. The two platforms are interestingly similar but each has it's unique capability. The router can rout wood, plastic, aluminum and maybe brass and steel. I can see the value of a small CNC mill at some point.

I'm still wanting to make the missing Stude half of the hood nose trim. Probably will want to make both sides so the parts match even if they're not original. I need to follow up with the guy on here who makes auto logos.

I know an Andy... but who is this Martin fella?

Keep going Andy Martin. You are doing great!

I'm no longer Mr. Hide...

I've been Andy Martin on Yesterday's Tractors for 18 years and oldironfarmer on eBay over 20 years. I have an identity crisis but it's still mine.

 

[EOC_Jason]

I find it's more practical to have old operating system as virtual images. I have a VMWare server and just fire up whatever I need when I need it rather than have a bunch of old computers laying around. Some days I miss DOS and good old Norton Commander...

I still have a legacy 486 runnning at 66 Mhz running Windows 2000. It's more dust collector than useful but the old programs still work. Sits right next to my i7-4790K with 2 TB, my Plex server with 15.5 TB and my FreeNAS server with 32TB. I think this is a bit like comparing a Willys to a Corrolla though????

If anyone is interested, I still have a Toshiba laptop running Windows for Workgroups that has a built in parallel port. Accepting offers????? Still works perfectly!

 

[drivesitfar]

Andy: it's so funny all this HIGH TECH improvements have taken us back 20 to 40 years in computers isn't it? i'm liking where your 3D printer and router are headed and isn't it so true that at our age we measure time in WEEKS AND NOT YEARS NOW. keep up the great progress cause i think you want to be a PRO at almost everything before get up to the Pearly Gates.

Mr. Hide is funny (or maybe not so much to me, but i'm rolling with it) cause i had a web site with my full name on it for almost 15 years and my handle here is my Ebay account name. i've also met more members IN PERSON than maybe all of you, but I also tend to go in FREE PARKING and try to organize the HAPPY HOUR CHAT which a lot of you don't venture in to HELP. BTW who's tool is the best and does it really need to be argued about if both work?

you can call me anything you like, but for those of you that missed it a new Russian member from Siberia asked my REAL NAME and I didn't post it hence he gave me the Mr. Hide name. Oh well after having unlimited cell service for years and 5,000 minutes per month just on the cell phones i do GJ for fun and that's my story and i'm sticking to it.

back to TECH TALK. Fortran and C prompt please and I think Norton was responsible for frying my old 486 and maybe another computer before i started using a virus protection service out of North Dakota (forgot the name, but it was run by a bunch of friendly Scandinavians). just recalled it was ZONE ALARM and if they are still in business i might go back instead of using MS's version.

cheers and hope you have a great Saturday while i try to play GARAGE TETRIS.

 

[EOC_Jason]

LOL... I remember Zone Alarm...

I also remember McAfee for DOS. Oh, anyone else spend countless hours watching Norton defrag your hard drive that was only megabytes big and a monochrome monitor?

 

[drivesitfar]

Jason: not watching Norton so much, but remembering it asking me every time i clicked on something if I REALLY WANTED TO OPEN IT or some catchy phrase like that.

I swear Norton was the VIRUS as I think it crashed my PC's

didn't McAffee owner end up in Belize cause he left the USA on a suspected murder charge? and then maybe found dead? I think i used that too before i found ZONE ALARM.

ANDY, BOB & ALL: i've heard from some computer GEEKS that they never used a virus protection and since some of you have computers offline to keep IDIOTS out of your stuff what virus protection do you use?

 

[Guster]

BIOS is basically your low level hardware machine config on your PC. It prepares your machine prior to loading and running an OS and why it needs a little battery on the motherboard to keep the time and hardware settings. The first bit you normally see when you turn on your PC that detects your hardware etc. The one that shows hit F5 or F8 to change BIOS settings.

Based on the breakout board you have you will likely run into issues using the USB-to-DB25 adapter cable. Other than usually being simplex(one-way) as you mentioned it also messes up the timing synchronisation between serial IO lines as USB is inherently an asynchronous interface. To manage this you need a breakout board or motion controller that basically does resynchronised store-and-forward of serial instructions to keep axis in synch. Otherwise you X, Y and Z can start getting out of sync on weird ways.

SmoothStepper is a popular option but there are now others too: https://warp9td.com/index.php/gettingstarted/what-is-a-smoothstepper

Alternatively you can replace the whole mess with a standalone pendant or panel mount motion controller for about the same price and get rid of the need to have a PC run the device. This is what I have done in planning for my CNC router. My pendant controller still has a duplex parallel cable to the break out board but you can load the CAM files onto it from a USB thumbdrive and let it run.

Now one very important thing: That PC in the picture with the break out box on top of it... that doesn't happen to be the original CAM machine running Mach3 does it? Would be really good if it still boots up and you can recover the Mach3 config file on there. It will save you a lot of trouble trying to configure the settings for the breakout board and stepper axis( ie. break out board type, stepper resolution etc.) Not exactly sure where it is kept relevant to the version of Mach3 and OS you have on there but should be able to find that out from the Mach3 doco.

Right... I think I answered most of the questions you asked. Back to my shenanigans.

 

[tym]

I still have my HP 29C. Know what that is?

I'll see your 29C, and raise you one HP35.

 

[Kev442]

I tossed my Timex Sinclair a long time ago. I still have a Toshiba 386 b/w laptop with msdos on it.
I am by no means a computer guy, but I do still monkey around with all the old stuff as I support equipment going back to 1998 or so. SCSI drives along with the IDE.

The thing that has me absolutely perplexed right now is HP printer hard drives. For years I was able to take an old HDD from a obsolete machine and repurpose it. Until I hit HP printers/plotters from around 2002 forward. The Bios,Linux and Windows see them, but Linux will not mount them to format, and Windows will not add them to the partition list. I have a pile of these ghost drives piling up and some of them are SATA 160's or 320's. How the heck are they locking out drives?

 

[Guster]

I tossed my Timex Sinclair a long time ago. I still have a Toshiba 386 b/w laptop with msdos on it.
I am by no means a computer guy, but I do still monkey around with all the old stuff as I support equipment going back to 1998 or so. SCSI drives along with the IDE.

The thing that has me absolutely perplexed right now is HP printer hard drives. For years I was able to take an old HDD from a obsolete machine and repurpose it. Until I hit HP printers/plotters from around 2002 forward. The Bios,Linux and Windows see them, but Linux will not mount them to format, and Windows will not add them to the partition list. I have a pile of these ghost drives piling up and some of them are SATA 160's or 320's. How the heck are they locking out drives?

Through firmware rejection. Making it harder for people to harvest old hardware for sensitive information. Not entirely foolproof as I have seen people spoof a firmware handshake with a cheap commercial MPC either set up to pretend to be compatible or a completely hacked printer firmware running open to another interface. Alternatively replacing the firmware ROM on the drive controller with a workable alternative. The drives tend to be locked to a specific printer to even stop you swapping it out to another working printer.

HP has a big drive on printer security at the moment given how it has been recognised worldwide as being one of the largest pieces of IT used in criminal information breaches.

 

[oldironfarmer]

I find it's more practical to have old operating system as virtual images. I have a VMWare server and just fire up whatever I need when I need it rather than have a bunch of old computers laying around. Some days I miss DOS and good old Norton Commander...

That's an interesting concept. But I don't miss DOS. But I never really knew her.

Andy: it's so funny all this HIGH TECH improvements have taken us back 20 to 40 years in computers isn't it? i'm liking where your 3D printer and router are headed and isn't it so true that at our age we measure time in WEEKS AND NOT YEARS NOW. keep up the great progress cause i think you want to be a PRO at almost everything before get up to the Pearly Gates.

Mr. Hide is funny (or maybe not so much to me, but i'm rolling with it) cause i had a web site with my full name on it for almost 15 years and my handle here is my Ebay account name. i've also met more members IN PERSON than maybe all of you, but I also tend to go in FREE PARKING and try to organize the HAPPY HOUR CHAT which a lot of you don't venture in to HELP. BTW who's tool is the best and does it really need to be argued about if both work?

you can call me anything you like, but for those of you that missed it a new Russian member from Siberia asked my REAL NAME and I didn't post it hence he gave me the Mr. Hide name. Oh well after having unlimited cell service for years and 5,000 minutes per month just on the cell phones i do GJ for fun and that's my story and i'm sticking to it.

back to TECH TALK. Fortran and C prompt please and I think Norton was responsible for frying my old 486 and maybe another computer before i started using a virus protection service out of North Dakota (forgot the name, but it was run by a bunch of friendly Scandinavians). just recalled it was ZONE ALARM and if they are still in business i might go back instead of using MS's version.

cheers and hope you have a great Saturday while i try to play GARAGE TETRIS.

Thanks! I should have elaborated on Guster's comment that I'm "having a go of it". It is so important to pursue the things you like. I like the saying "whether you think you can, or think you can't, you're probably right". If you're interested in something, why not try it? Lot's of gratification with success. And there really is no failure if your attitude is right. Persistence.

Mr. Hide is funny, but not because it was directed at you. It is funny to me because of the accuracy in English with his limited use of the language. And since we knew Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde already it has that wonderful double meaning. If it were negative I would not refer to myself as no longer Mr. Hide.

Interesting, isn't it, that as time goes by we have to be more cautious as the fraudsters get more sophisticated.

What are FREE PARKING and HAPPY HOUR CHAT?

Hmmm, I've only met one person from GJ, JB.

I've never had much luck with anti virus software and use just Windows now.

This Saturday was a little rough. I had another tooth extracted and two implants put in (not there!) so I'm moving a little slow.

Tomorrow is a better day!

LOL... I remember Zone Alarm...

I also remember McAfee for DOS. Oh, anyone else spend countless hours watching Norton defrag your hard drive that was only megabytes big and a monochrome monitor?

Norton did better on their motorcycles.

Jason: not watching Norton so much, but remembering it asking me every time i clicked on something if I REALLY WANTED TO OPEN IT or some catchy phrase like that.

I swear Norton was the VIRUS as I think it crashed my PC's

didn't McAffee owner end up in Belize cause he left the USA on a suspected murder charge? and then maybe found dead? I think i used that too before i found ZONE ALARM.

ANDY, BOB & ALL: i've heard from some computer GEEKS that they never used a virus protection and since some of you have computers offline to keep IDIOTS out of your stuff what virus protection do you use?

I used AVG for a long time, on the recommendation of my son. However one of my customers is the IT manager for a tribe. She recommended that I just use the Windows protection and keep windows updates current. That is my plan now.

My disconnected computer was used for our church records for twenty years while I was church treasurer. I had no excuse for losing any church or personal information and all it takes is just to keep your last computer as an offline one. The current treasurer loves dropbox. Since that computer is really outdated, there is no reason for me to connect it to the internet.

BIOS is basically your low level hardware machine config on your PC. It prepares your machine prior to loading and running an OS and why it needs a little battery on the motherboard to keep the time and hardware settings. The first bit you normally see when you turn on your PC that detects your hardware etc. The one that shows hit F5 or F8 to change BIOS settings.

Based on the breakout board you have you will likely run into issues using the USB-to-DB25 adapter cable. Other than usually being simplex(one-way) as you mentioned it also messes up the timing synchronisation between serial IO lines as USB is inherently an asynchronous interface. To manage this you need a breakout board or motion controller that basically does resynchronised store-and-forward of serial instructions to keep axis in synch. Otherwise your X, Y and Z can start getting out of sync on weird ways.

So if I install the parallel port PCI I ordered that avoids the USB-DB25 synchronization issue?

SmoothStepper is a popular option but there are now others too: https://warp9td.com/index.php/gettingstarted/what-is-a-smoothstepper

Alternatively you can replace the whole mess with a standalone pendant or panel mount motion controller for about the same price and get rid of the need to have a PC run the device. This is what I have done in planning for my CNC router. My pendant controller still has a duplex parallel cable to the break out board but you can load the CAM files onto it from a USB thumbdrive and let it run.

The breakout board is the white box which "breaks out" the signals to each stepper motor?

Now one very important thing: That PC in the picture with the break out box on top of it... that doesn't happen to be the original CAM machine running Mach3 does it? Would be really good if it still boots up and you can recover the Mach3 config file on there. It will save you a lot of trouble trying to configure the settings for the breakout board and stepper axis( ie. break out board type, stepper resolution etc.) Not exactly sure where it is kept relevant to the version of Mach3 and OS you have on there but should be able to find that out from the Mach3 doco.

No, that computer is my son's father-in-law's computer they gave to me to operate the router. The computer I use as my financial computer, not internet connected, is the one I originally bought to run the router. I use it every day and usually keep it on 24/7 but it has no operational issues. I had not run Mach3 on it for several years but the program seems fine. I copied it to a thumb drive and put it on my laptop and it opened fine. Then I put it on the computer in the picture and it opened fine however the text on the base page has a few issues. Basically the font is too large. I'm hoping that's not the tip of the iceberg on an operational issue. I'm going to try it out as soon as I get the parallel port card installed. I think I gave the hard copy information to my grandson who didn't return it. I need to ask him, he is in the age group that does not have much use for paper.

Switching computers still gives me a Word and Excel issue as the inherited computer has neither.

Right... I think I answered most of the questions you asked. Back to my shenanigans.

Thank you very much for your interest and input. Tutoring me keeps you from your shenanigans.

I'll see your 29C, and raise you one HP35.

HP35 was $395 while I was in college making $1.15 per hour. That's about 500 hours of net pay. I really wanted one, but it was out of my league. I finished engineering school with a one sided plastic slide rule my wife had for high school physics. I still have it. After graduation she bought me a Post Versalog. I never had much use for it as we had Marchant back transfer mechanical calculators on my first job. We also had a four unit Toshiba nixie tube calculator but for the most part supervisors kept them on their desks. CRC Handbook for trigonometric functions, of course, because we needed more accuracy than a slide rule for trig. I bought the HP 29C a few years out of school and used it heavily. It had a 49 step keystroke programming function which was very handy. I could also hold it in my right hand and operate it with my thumb while writing results down with my left hand (of course). After a few years I bought an HP41C but it never got the use of the 29C and was awkward for one handed use. Not that you asked.

I tossed my Timex Sinclair a long time ago. I still have a Toshiba 386 b/w laptop with msdos on it.
I am by no means a computer guy, but I do still monkey around with all the old stuff as I support equipment going back to 1998 or so. SCSI drives along with the IDE.

The thing that has me absolutely perplexed right now is HP printer hard drives. For years I was able to take an old HDD from a obsolete machine and repurpose it. Until I hit HP printers/plotters from around 2002 forward. The Bios,Linux and Windows see them, but Linux will not mount them to format, and Windows will not add them to the partition list. I have a pile of these ghost drives piling up and some of them are SATA 160's or 320's. How the heck are they locking out drives?

Through firmware rejection. Making it harder for people to harvest old hardware for sensitive information. Not entirely foolproof as I have seen people spoof a firmware handshake with a cheap commercial MPC either set up to pretend to be compatible or a completely hacked printer firmware running open to another interface. Alternatively replacing the firmware ROM on the drive controller with a workable alternative. The drives tend to be locked to a specific printer to even stop you swapping it out to another working printer.

HP has a big drive on printer security at the moment given how it has been recognised worldwide as being one of the largest pieces of IT used in criminal information breaches.

Thanks guys! Time to nurse my jaw. I had fun in the dentist's chair today. When he started screwing in the implants I could hear the ratchet click, so I mimicked it with my hands. They laughed, so I made my imaginary ratchet slip and grunted "OH CHIT". Dr. said don't even joke about that, that's just a bad day for everyone. So when he was stitching up the damage I made broom stitching moves. After we were done I invited them to have a company trip out to watch broom making. They sounded interested, we'll see.

But the fun is over, the deadening is wearing off.

Thanks for the comments, obviously I need the help.

 

[oldironfarmer]

Oh by the way.

On the way to the dentist I stopped by Home Depot to window shop. We've all been surprised, at least in the US, to buy a set of metric wrenches only to find there were skips in the sizes. While looking I found a set of metric with every size from 10 mm to 19 mm only missing 18 mm.

Not sure I've seen an 18 mm fastener but I have needed 16 mm and only have one and had picked up the set when I saw HD now has individual wrenches.

16 mm wrenches were $2.99 so I now have three new ones, one for each tool board which is missing 16 mm. Next time I'm in I need to buy a dozen 10 mm wrenches. Can't seem to have enough of them.

 

[don long]

It's funny that you guys are all talking about computers.
I know so little about them that I have to ask my wife to turn mine on in the mornings.
Seriously In 1985 I was one of the first bodyshops to convert to a computer management system and in the process of getting all our info into the box so we could get good info out of the box I got so frustrated with it that I actually threw my shoe at the monitor and it broke the glass and stuck in the box.
I loaded the damn thing into a box and shipped it back to the management company. (the company was 3M) A few years later I was the chairman of the national collision association SCRS and that monitor was presented back to me with my shoe still in it.

My company got very good with computers but I personally always had help around so I could stay stupid.

 

[oldironfarmer]

It's funny that you guys are all talking about computers.
I know so little about them that I have to ask my wife to turn mine on in the mornings.
Seriously In 1985 I was one of the first bodyshops to convert to a computer management system and in the process of getting all our info into the box so we could get good info out of the box I got so frustrated with it that I actually threw my shoe at the monitor and it broke the glass and stuck in the box.
I loaded the damn thing into a box and shipped it back to the management company. (the company was 3M) A few years later I was the chairman of the national collision association SCRS and that monitor was presented back to me with my shoe still in it.

My company got very good with computers but I personally always had help around so I could stay stupid.

I've seen the cartoons but I've never known anyone with the balls to actually do it.

My hero!

And I quote the venerable Don Long: "You must keep in mind that I only do what I want to and when I want to so It's all good."

Including throwing a shoe

It must have felt so good

 

[don long]

It was a little embarrassing when it was presented to me in front of my peers
as a leader in the industry

 

[tym]

HP35 was $395 while I was in college making $1.15 per hour. That's about 500 hours of net pay. I really wanted one, but it was out of my league. I finished engineering school with a one sided plastic slide rule my wife had for high school physics. I still have it. After graduation she bought me a Post Versalog. I never had much use for it as we had Marchant back transfer mechanical calculators on my first job. We also had a four unit Toshiba nixie tube calculator but for the most part supervisors kept them on their desks. CRC Handbook for trigonometric functions, of course, because we needed more accuracy than a slide rule for trig. I bought the HP 29C a few years out of school and used it heavily. It had a 49 step keystroke programming function which was very handy. I could also hold it in my right hand and operate it with my thumb while writing results down with my left hand (of course). After a few years I bought an HP41C but it never got the use of the 29C and was awkward for one handed use. Not that you asked.

I didn't, but I love reading these stories! My dad saved up and bought an HP45 when he was starting out; it similarly cost about what a high-end laptop would cost now. I grew up on TI graphing calculators but have always had a hankering for vintage electronics. I bought an HP35 on eBay (with the case, charger, accessories, and paperwork from the original owner for a little over $100. That calc definitely didn't hold its value, but will probably still be going strong for a couple of decades from now.

 

[jbmatth]

Ya'll are way over my head on computers, I know enough to do what I need to do and that is about the limit. The first computer I remember helping to buy had a total storage capacity of 2.1 GB, it replaced a computer that was measured in the MB range. As for what is larger than a TB:
1 Bit = Binary Digit
8 Bits = 1 Byte
1000 Bytes = 1 Kilobyte
1000 Kilobytes = 1 Megabyte
1000 Megabytes = 1 Gigabyte
1000 Gigabytes = 1 Terabyte
1000 Terabytes = 1 Petabyte
1000 Petabytes = 1 Exabyte
1000 Exabytes = 1 Zettabyte
1000 Zettabytes = 1 Yottabyte
1000 Yottabytes = 1 Brontobyte
1000 Brontobytes = 1 Geopbyte

JB