Above 1200 Sq/FT Cleaning Up My Shop

[Vieux]

Looks like I missed a lot of interesting things.

 

[oldironfarmer]

It was a little embarrassing when it was presented to me in front of my peers
as a leader in the industry

Should not have been embarrassing. I never expected my boss to be able to do everything I could, that's why he hired me. And the same with my employees. I suspect, however, that you know a thing or two about automotive finishing which does not involve operating a computer.

I didn't, but I love reading these stories! My dad saved up and bought an HP45 when he was starting out; it similarly cost about what a high-end laptop would cost now. I grew up on TI graphing calculators but have always had a hankering for vintage electronics. I bought an HP35 on eBay (with the case, charger, accessories, and paperwork from the original owner for a little over $100. That calc definitely didn't hold its value, but will probably still be going strong for a couple of decades from now.

The old HP's are bulletproof, except for the batteries. You're right, they were laptop prices before laptops. But it was just amazing to have all the trig functions right under a button, with no interpolation required. Made experts of everyone. I didn't even need to remember pi, which I still do:

3.14159265358979

Excel only knows it to one more digit, but I think it's a 3 or something and has never affected the accuracy of calculating the number of acres in a round field or the volume of a small tank.

How do you get on with Reverse Polish Notation? It is the most logical when you get used to it, and the register that holds the last four numbers is really handy.

Ya'll are way over my head on computers, I know enough to do what I need to do and that is about the limit. The first computer I remember helping to buy had a total storage capacity of 2.1 GB, it replaced a computer that was measured in the MB range. As for what is larger than a TB:
1 Bit = Binary Digit
8 Bits = 1 Byte
1000 Bytes = 1 Kilobyte
1000 Kilobytes = 1 Megabyte
1000 Megabytes = 1 Gigabyte
1000 Gigabytes = 1 Terabyte
1000 Terabytes = 1 Petabyte
1000 Petabytes = 1 Exabyte
1000 Exabytes = 1 Zettabyte
1000 Zettabytes = 1 Yottabyte
1000 Yottabytes = 1 Brontobyte
1000 Brontobytes = 1 Geopbyte

JB

Did you look that up?

I was buying it all til I got to Yottabyte.

Yeah right. I bit.

I'll believe that when Teslas fly.

Looks like I missed a lot of interesting things.

How's the Vieux from Russia? You didn't miss much, just a lot of talk and no action. Glad to have you drop in.

 

[drivesitfar]

Andy: i'm not sure JB's list was a joke, but maybe you're right. like i said i remember when a MEG OF MEMORY for our computer was about $100-200.

that said my youngest son just graduated from a top business school at a big college and he was begging for me to find one of my two HP 12c's. I used to use it all the time to compute client's mortgages and costs and it does so much more. maybe as I GET ORGANIZED i'll find the boxes i put them in and maybe find some unopened computer programs to send you (or Bob).

how long were your teeth missing before you got the implants? did you just get them pulled? I had a couple teeth pulled a few years ago and i've been thinking it might help me chew my food better if i got a couple implants, but your RATCHETING EXPLANATION didn't help my comfort level.

how's the bull? still limping and ******* the herd?

hope you are not feeling the ill effects of the dentist work yesterday and from the posts I've read this AM it looks like you are maybe fed and ready to start another SATURDAY. ENJOY!!

DON: just to chime in I would say you are a PEOPLE'S PERSON and that computer just wasn't listening so it needed your size 15 shoe in it's ear. i'm still smiling and maybe even laughing at that story and with you sending it to the owner and him giving it back to you had to be PRICELESS!! sorry if it was a painful memory and I have to ask do you still have the computer with the shoe in it?

 

[Guster]

So if I install the parallel port PCI I ordered that avoids the USB-DB25 synchronization issue?

Yes as the serial output signals are syncronised to a common timing signal. It will also support and duplex functionality.

One nice feature that you may not have considered is the impact of adding an E-stop and it halting the CAM output when E-stop is sensed. That way

The breakout board is the white box which "breaks out" the signals to each stepper motor?

In this case you have a break out box but yes that is the component that processes the serial outputs and supplies them to the individual stepper drivers. Your box probably also contains the power supply for the break out board and the stepper drivers as well as the individual stepper drivers themselves.

Just thought it would be nice to recover the Mach3 config file for the router from where ever it was used. There are plenty of sample configs available on the internet but you will have to calibrate yours by tweaking the stepper resolution for each axis based on the stepper resolution and the leadscrew pitch. Ie. 200 steps per revolution on the stepper with and 8tpi single start acme screw gives you 1600 steps/inch resolution on this example axis. Mach3 needs to know this to translate g-code instructions into physical travel dimensions. Stepper drivers can also have microstepping so 1/2 step configured on the driver would then need 3200 steps/inch unless the Mach3 recognises a 1/2 step as a parameter in the config for that axis. Unfortunately this is where my experience gets fuzzy regarding Mach3 as I could never afford to use it and thus haven't spent more time with it. Lucky for you there are support groups for this kind of thing.

Once you get the hang of it building a larger router is very simple. Converting an existing machine being a bit harder and more expensive but also very possible.

I would consider using the router for forge patterns too. So much faster and with a little thought and planning you can easily replicate the same detail in less time. What I like about 3D printing however is the potential for real fine detail and then getting into investment casting. A good reason to make a little kiln to flash of the flasks.

Hehehe... talking about memory prices. My first proper job I remember seeing an invoice for an IBM mainframe 16kb memory daughter card - US$30k. That little board was more than double my annual salary at the time I could have bought a very nice house with two of them.

Almost Saturday here.

 

[oldironfarmer]

Andy: i'm not sure JB's list was a joke, but maybe you're right. like i said i remember when a MEG OF MEMORY for our computer was about $100-200.

that said my youngest son just graduated from a top business school at a big college and he was begging for me to find one of my two HP 12c's. I used to use it all the time to compute client's mortgages and costs and it does so much more. maybe as I GET ORGANIZED i'll find the boxes i put them in and maybe find some unopened computer programs to send you (or Bob).

how long were your teeth missing before you got the implants? did you just get them pulled? I had a couple teeth pulled a few years ago and i've been thinking it might help me chew my food better if i got a couple implants, but your RATCHETING EXPLANATION didn't help my comfort level.

how's the bull? still limping and ******* the herd?

hope you are not feeling the ill effects of the dentist work yesterday and from the posts I've read this AM it looks like you are maybe fed and ready to start another SATURDAY. ENJOY!!

DON: just to chime in I would say you are a PEOPLE'S PERSON and that computer just wasn't listening so it needed your size 15 shoe in it's ear. i'm still smiling and maybe even laughing at that story and with you sending it to the owner and him giving it back to you had to be PRICELESS!! sorry if it was a painful memory and I have to ask do you still have the computer with the shoe in it?

I used to have (1+i)^n/((1+i)^n-1) memorized and could calculate loan payments before most guys could find it in their chart.

One lower molar was a baby tooth I finally lost about 20 years ago. Full set until then. Had lots of fillings slowly replaced with crowns over the years. Then original teeth started failing under the crowns. You don't have but three molars each side. With my baby tooth gap I had only lost three, leaving only one left and one right. Broke off the one on the right last month. It had had a root canal so no pain. Dentist inspected the left one, which was giving me pain, and said it would fail soon. Had the right one pulled and two weeks later the left one and two implants put in on the left. Once those heal dentist will put in a long crown to replace three teeth, then same thing on the right. Four implants for six teeth. Not a bad plan.

Implants were easier than extraction, as a reference.

Bull is walking ok and sniffing. I assume he's ******* to please but they tend to be shy and go off into the woods on a date.

Yes as the serial output signals are syncronised to a common timing signal. It will also support and duplex functionality.

Good!

One nice feature that you may not have considered is the impact of adding an E-stop and it halting the CAM output when E-stop is sensed. That way

E-stop just being an electronic travel limit set in Mach3 (CAM)?

In this case you have a break out box but yes that is the component that processes the serial outputs and supplies them to the individual stepper drivers. Your box probably also contains the power supply for the break out board and the stepper drivers as well as the individual stepper drivers themselves.

Power supply is in there.

Just thought it would be nice to recover the Mach3 config file for the router from where ever it was used. There are plenty of sample configs available on the internet but you will have to calibrate yours by tweaking the stepper resolution for each axis based on the stepper resolution and the leadscrew pitch. Ie. 200 steps per revolution on the stepper with and 8tpi single start acme screw gives you 1600 steps/inch resolution on this example axis. Mach3 needs to know this to translate g-code instructions into physical travel dimensions. Stepper drivers can also have microstepping so 1/2 step configured on the driver would then need 3200 steps/inch unless the Mach3 recognises a 1/2 step as a parameter in the config for that axis. Unfortunately this is where my experience gets fuzzy regarding Mach3 as I could never afford to use it and thus haven't spent more time with it. Lucky for you there are support groups for this kind of thing.

I think my Mach3 is configured to the router.

Once you get the hang of it building a larger router is very simple. Converting an existing machine being a bit harder and more expensive but also very possible.

Router is 16x30 inches. Probably good for me for a while.

I would consider using the router for forge patterns too. So much faster and with a little thought and planning you can easily replicate the same detail in less time. What I like about 3D printing however is the potential for real fine detail and then getting into investment casting. A good reason to make a little kiln to flash of the flasks.



Hehehe... talking about memory prices. My first proper job I remember seeing an invoice for an IBM mainframe 16kb memory daughter card - US$30k. That little board was more than double my annual salary at the time I could have bought a very nice house with two of them.

Whew!! My first job as a graduate engineer was $885 per month.

Almost Saturday here.

Thanks for the visits, guys! My parallel port card arrived today, before the cord.

 

[Guster]

Good that Mach3 copy you have has the config file for your router. It saves a bit of fuss till next time.

16"x30" is larger than I thought from the look of it. Must be some chunky Nema34 steppers on there.

E-stop and limit switch/sensor behaviour is almost the same. But e-stop is often a dedicated input alongside all the limit sensors. Benefit of an e-stop is if you break a bit or knock something loose you can halt everything and feedback to Mach3 will stop at the last command meaning you can potentially resume. Limits can be configured to report a limit error to Mach3 and halt if I recall but again it depends on your breakout board and configured behaviour.

In my case hitting e-stop will also immediately shut down my spindle via the VFD.

PS. is your cable duplex/bi-directional too?

 

[tym]

The old HP's are bulletproof, except for the batteries. You're right, they were laptop prices before laptops. But it was just amazing to have all the trig functions right under a button, with no interpolation required. Made experts of everyone. I didn't even need to remember pi, which I still do:

3.14159265358979

Excel only knows it to one more digit, but I think it's a 3 or something and has never affected the accuracy of calculating the number of acres in a round field or the volume of a small tank.

How do you get on with Reverse Polish Notation? It is the most logical when you get used to it, and the register that holds the last four numbers is really handy.

There are sellers on eBay that sell pre-built NiCd or NiMH battery packs for these calcs. They last about 2-3 years and then need to be replaced (though my latest one is crapping out after about 6 months ).

I'll readily admit that I'm pretty useless at RPN for anything except basic arithmetic operations. Having been trained on non-RPN TI calcs (and now doing virtually all quantitative work on a computer), I've never really fully invested in learning RPN.

 

[Kev442]

Through firmware rejection. Making it harder for people to harvest old hardware for sensitive information. Not entirely foolproof as I have seen people spoof a firmware handshake with a cheap commercial MPC either set up to pretend to be compatible or a completely hacked printer firmware running open to another interface. Alternatively replacing the firmware ROM on the drive controller with a workable alternative. The drives tend to be locked to a specific printer to even stop you swapping it out to another working printer.

HP has a big drive on printer security at the moment given how it has been recognised worldwide as being one of the largest pieces of IT used in criminal information breaches.

I am familiar with mobos and HDD's being tied to the serial number the last few years, but was not expecting this from 2003-06 drives. It's a bummer to have a few terabytes lying around unusable. My final jab at it was using Spinrite to try to turn on Smart. It couldn't launch the drive either.

Back to Stud E Bakers resurrection!

 

[PelicanPines]

When I was learning Bits, Bytes, (words)... etc

I thought it was funny that a half a Byte is a Nibble or 4 bits...

 

[oldironfarmer]

Good that Mach3 copy you have has the config file for your router. It saves a bit of fuss till next time.

Well, I'm assuming it does, since I had it running before.

16"x30" is larger than I thought from the look of it. Must be some chunky Nema34 steppers on there.

I measured it thinking someone would ask about the size. I think it was intended for sign making. The bed is sagging quite a bit, it is only particle board with the aluminum T slots. I plan to wedge up the middle and after it has set put a metal strip down each side to try to hold it flat. I'll measure the steppers, I know the Z-axis one is smaller.

E-stop and limit switch/sensor behaviour is almost the same. But e-stop is often a dedicated input alongside all the limit sensors. Benefit of an e-stop is if you break a bit or knock something loose you can halt everything and feedback to Mach3 will stop at the last command meaning you can potentially resume. Limits can be configured to report a limit error to Mach3 and halt if I recall but again it depends on your breakout board and configured behaviour.

I keep thinking you are expecting some feedback from the router to Mach3. I'm pretty sure the router is completely dumb. The wires only go to the steppers. Remember I'm at the edge of my knowledge.

In my case hitting e-stop will also immediately shut down my spindle via the VFD.

So do you have a physical limit switch at the end of travel for each axis? Or a DRO position sensor?

PS. is your cable duplex/bi-directional too?

I don't have a clue on my cable's capability.

There are sellers on eBay that sell pre-built NiCd or NiMH battery packs for these calcs. They last about 2-3 years and then need to be replaced (though my latest one is crapping out after about 6 months ).

I'll readily admit that I'm pretty useless at RPN for anything except basic arithmetic operations. Having been trained on non-RPN TI calcs (and now doing virtually all quantitative work on a computer), I've never really fully invested in learning RPN.

After I bought my HP 41C I retired my 29C. But I was moving more into management and never really used the 41C. Not sure where it and the thermal printer even are. Lack of use killed the batteries in the 41C and I had no incentive to replace them. Then I kept a Casio fx-300v on my desk, and eventually a Sharp EL-326A. I had several of the Casio's: Office, home, shop, travel bag, etc and a few Sharps. Then I migrated to Excel at the office and at home because it avoids writing stuff down and having to redo do what you just did. I use a Sharp in the machine shop and have a Casio for trig. They were cheap, light powered, and I don't think I've ever had one fail. I don't like using my phone in the machine shop because my hands are usually greasy. The phone is superior, but real buttons are nice too.

I am familiar with mobos and HDD's being tied to the serial number the last few years, but was not expecting this from 2003-06 drives. It's a bummer to have a few terabytes lying around unusable. My final jab at it was using Spinrite to try to turn on Smart. It couldn't launch the drive either.

Back to Stud E Bakers resurrection!

And I'm surprised that printers have hard drives. Really?

Back to the Stud

When I was learning Bits, Bytes, (words)... etc

I thought it was funny that a half a Byte is a Nibble or 4 bits...

This is so educational.

 

[tym]

After I bought my HP 41C I retired my 29C. But I was moving more into management and never really used the 41C. Not sure where it and the thermal printer even are. Lack of use killed the batteries in the 41C and I had no incentive to replace them. Then I kept a Casio fx-300v on my desk, and eventually a Sharp EL-326A. I had several of the Casio's: Office, home, shop, travel bag, etc and a few Sharps. Then I migrated to Excel at the office and at home because it avoids writing stuff down and having to redo do what you just did. I use a Sharp in the machine shop and have a Casio for trig. They were cheap, light powered, and I don't think I've ever had one fail. I don't like using my phone in the machine shop because my hands are usually greasy. The phone is superior, but real buttons are nice too.

If you turn up that 41C, there's an avid collector market out there and it would likely find a good home.

When I was doing data analysis in the lab, I bit the bullet and started using Matlab. Don't think I've needed anything beyond a basic scientific calculator since.

And I'm surprised that printers have hard drives. Really?

Photocopiers too. You can imagine the field day identity theft folks were having prying them out of discarded machines from offices, hospitals, etc... I think people have gotten wise, but one never knows these days...

 

[Guster]

I measured it thinking someone would ask about the size. I think it was intended for sign making. The bed is sagging quite a bit, it is only particle board with the aluminum T slots. I plan to wedge up the middle and after it has set put a metal strip down each side to try to hold it flat. I'll measure the steppers, I know the Z-axis one is smaller.

...

I keep thinking you are expecting some feedback from the router to Mach3. I'm pretty sure the router is completely dumb. The wires only go to the steppers. Remember I'm at the edge of my knowledge.

...

So do you have a physical limit switch at the end of travel for each axis? Or a DRO position sensor?

Always good to have a cheap waste board on your router table. Either particle board or MDF are good. No reason you couldn't salvage the motion control parts and rebuild it using some 2040 or 4080 v-slot extrusion commonly available these days.

No it does not have to have limit switches. That means the operator has to be smart enough to set the home position(0,0,0 coordinate) and have the work oriented correctly and well within the work envelope. Overshooting your axis length also should not do much damage on that machine as the stepper will just sit there buzzing locked up on the end of travel.

The features I mention are ones that Mach3 support and ones you may consider later. Servos do have rotary encoders that provide active feedback on travel. Almost like having a DRO for the controller to compensate for any errors. You can do the same by adding rotary encoders to steppers but few will do on budget, home use oriented machines. In your case if the controller send a signal to the driver to step 200 steps there is no way of telling if the stepper has done that which can be annoying but a fairly acceptable risk given the benefits.

Same not having limit switches. If the controller signals 200 steps and there is only room for a 100 it will lock up at end of travel after a 100 and once it has skipped the remaining 100 it will carry on running with the next instruction. Whereas with the limit error detected it will halt the operation and wait for you to do something. Which can be handy depending on what you are doing.

That concludes the lessons for this week. I will give you the weekend of.

 

[oldironfarmer]

If you turn up that 41C, there's an avid collector market out there and it would likely find a good home.

When I was doing data analysis in the lab, I bit the bullet and started using Matlab. Don't think I've needed anything beyond a basic scientific calculator since.

Photocopiers too. You can imagine the field day identity theft folks were having prying them out of discarded machines from offices, hospitals, etc... I think people have gotten wise, but one never knows these days...

The 41C may just have to find a new home. It seems like I have plenty of stuff, and one way of disposing of it is to ask myself whether I would miss it had it been lost or stolen. 41C - nope!

Always good to have a cheap waste board on your router table. Either particle board or MDF are good. No reason you couldn't salvage the motion control parts and rebuild it using some 2040 or 4080 v-slot extrusion commonly available these days.

No it does not have to have limit switches. That means the operator has to be smart enough to set the home position(0,0,0 coordinate) and have the work oriented correctly and well within the work envelope. Overshooting your axis length also should not do much damage on that machine as the stepper will just sit there buzzing locked up on the end of travel.

The features I mention are ones that Mach3 support and ones you may consider later. Servos do have rotary encoders that provide active feedback on travel. Almost like having a DRO for the controller to compensate for any errors. You can do the same by adding rotary encoders to steppers but few will do on budget, home use oriented machines. In your case if the controller send a signal to the driver to step 200 steps there is no way of telling if the stepper has done that which can be annoying but a fairly acceptable risk given the benefits.

Same not having limit switches. If the controller signals 200 steps and there is only room for a 100 it will lock up at end of travel after a 100 and once it has skipped the remaining 100 it will carry on running with the next instruction. Whereas with the limit error detected it will halt the operation and wait for you to do something. Which can be handy depending on what you are doing.

That concludes the lessons for this week. I will give you the weekend of.

Thanks for the insightful comments. Is it reasonable to assume a stepper will step per signal if there is not outside impediment (end of travel, tool bind, etc) or are they prone to slipping a step or two now and then?

Enjoy your weekend. I'll try to get my tuition in order.

 

[jbmatth]

Andy,
I did have to look that up, I didn't even know what was above a Terabyte, but now I know. As for Pi, I never had any reason to know more than 3.14, but a teacher asked once if anyone knew the digits past 3.14159. I ended up memorizing the first 25 digits and later 50 but they aren't in my head now. 3.1415926535897932384626433 (from memory) My older brother is a math teacher and saw that as a challenge, he ended up going to 512 digits for reasons I won't explain here. That was a surprise as he never mentioned it until he started to rattle them off while we were running one day, obviously I had no way to tell if he was pulling my leg or not. Nerds I tell you what. Also looking forward to the 3D printer and the CNC router table.

JB

 

[EOC_Jason]

I've had a few stubborn hard drives over the years that I thought were either firmware locked or bad, but it just turned out wiping the partition info was a little more difficult than the normal routine.

I originally found this info about window's diskpart when I was doing a bunch of images on CF cards, but it works just as great on hard drives. I don't know what is so special about this program that none of the others could do but if you have some free time its worth giving a shot.

Be careful choosing the disk to wipe, there is no going back and no "are you sure?" prompts.

1. Open a command window as administrator ("cmd")
2. Type "diskpart" and hit enter.
3. Type "list disk" and hit enter to find out the number of your drive.
4. Type "select disk X" (where you replace X with the number of your drive) and hit enter.
5. Type "clean" and hit enter.

Then just type exit or quit once its done. Now you can go to the Windows disk management and should be able to create some new partitions.

I am familiar with mobos and HDD's being tied to the serial number the last few years, but was not expecting this from 2003-06 drives. It's a bummer to have a few terabytes lying around unusable. My final jab at it was using Spinrite to try to turn on Smart. It couldn't launch the drive either.

 

[Guster]

Thanks for the insightful comments. Is it reasonable to assume a stepper will step per signal if there is not outside impediment (end of travel, tool bind, etc) or are they prone to slipping a step or two now and then?

Only hope some of it is useful.

Yes. A stepper will normally step as powered by the stepper driver on every step signal provided to the stepper driver. Otherwise provided you have enough power, not too much power to cause it to overheat and burn. Taken into consideration axis inertia and momentum, tool pressure the stepper should also perform based on the size and torque/force the stepper is capable of.

Stepper drivers are simple on face value provided 2 logic inputs other than power supply. One is direction,the other is the step pulse. Inside they can be more complex. In the old days they were just chopper(PWM) circuits but today they have some fancy's for compensating stepper acceleration/deaccelleration, drive and PWM harmonics and of course microstepping providing 1/2 step, 1/4 step, 1/8 step and 1/16 step in cases. Steppers are unusual in that they have more power when they are stopped and loose torque the faster you run them - complete opposite of a servo motor. So microstepping may increase your stepper resolution incredibly but torque dissipates at and even greater ratio in relation. Meaning your overall accuracy may suffer thanks to skipped steps due to loss in torque.

So in short, greater resolution is best achieved through choice of drive mechanism with a balance between speed and resolution designed to the stepper and stepper driver configuration.

It is a tightrope! So plunge that routerbit at your own peril... thankfully for CNC you can take light cuts all day and still not crank a leadscrew handle.

Aaaaah dangit... did I just ramble on and give you a free lesson on a Saturday?

 

[oldironfarmer]

Andy,
I did have to look that up, I didn't even know what was above a Terabyte, but now I know. As for Pi, I never had any reason to know more than 3.14, but a teacher asked once if anyone knew the digits past 3.14159. I ended up memorizing the first 25 digits and later 50 but they aren't in my head now. 3.1415926535897932384626433 (from memory) My older brother is a math teacher and saw that as a challenge, he ended up going to 512 digits for reasons I won't explain here. That was a surprise as he never mentioned it until he started to rattle them off while we were running one day, obviously I had no way to tell if he was pulling my leg or not. Nerds I tell you what. Also looking forward to the 3D printer and the CNC router table.

JB

512 digits seems like a binarily appropriate number. I'm impressed you know more than me. You may be the first person I've met who is carrying around more in his/her head. Truly an OCD nerdy excess!

Mine are easy, 3.14159 then the Chevy 265 and 35 is just repetitive, then 89 and 79 and we have the first digit in five places which will round down from the next number (3).

Thanks for caring.

I've had a few stubborn hard drives over the years that I thought were either firmware locked or bad, but it just turned out wiping the partition info was a little more difficult than the normal routine.

I originally found this info about window's diskpart when I was doing a bunch of images on CF cards, but it works just as great on hard drives. I don't know what is so special about this program that none of the others could do but if you have some free time its worth giving a shot.

Be careful choosing the disk to wipe, there is no going back and no "are you sure?" prompts.

1. Open a command window as administrator ("cmd")
2. Type "diskpart" and hit enter.
3. Type "list disk" and hit enter to find out the number of your drive.
4. Type "select disk X" (where you replace X with the number of your drive) and hit enter.
5. Type "clean" and hit enter.

Then just type exit or quit once its done. Now you can go to the Windows disk management and should be able to create some new partitions.

I had a hard drive with the ice on the road. Fortunately I've never wiped a partition, they're usually those concrete Jersey barriers around here.

I usually don't wipe a disk but if I do I always use a good solvent that will evaporate clean so the brakes don't pulsate from the oils. I just change the pads and get the wheel back on.

Oh, computer talk?

Only hope some of it is useful.

It is all useful.

Yes. A stepper will normally step as powered by the stepper driver on every step signal provided to the stepper driver. Otherwise provided you have enough power, not too much power to cause it to overheat and burn. Taken into consideration axis inertia and momentum, tool pressure the stepper should also perform based on the size and torque/force the stepper is capable of.

So the goal should be to stay within the stepper's operating parameters. I see no numbers on mine.

Stepper drivers are simple on face value provided 2 logic inputs other than power supply. One is direction,the other is the step pulse. Inside they can be more complex. In the old days they were just chopper(PWM) circuits but today they have some fancy's for compensating stepper acceleration/deaccelleration, drive and PWM harmonics and of course microstepping providing 1/2 step, 1/4 step, 1/8 step and 1/16 step in cases. Steppers are unusual in that they have more power when they are stopped and loose torque the faster you run them - complete opposite of a servo motor. So microstepping may increase your stepper resolution incredibly but torque dissipates at and even greater ratio in relation. Meaning your overall accuracy may suffer thanks to skipped steps due to loss in torque.

Mine is set up for 1/8 step. A skipped step just throws everything else off.

So in short, greater resolution is best achieved through choice of drive mechanism with a balance between speed and resolution designed to the stepper and stepper driver configuration.

It is a tightrope! So plunge that routerbit at your own peril... thankfully for CNC you can take light cuts all day and still not crank a leadscrew handle.

First time out (ten years ago, I bought the router in 07) I burned the wood taking too heavy of a cut. Time is on my side now.

Aaaaah dangit... did I just ramble on and give you a free lesson on a Saturday?

Ten thousand apologies Herr Guster. I may have to up my tuition...

I've had a roller coaster two days.

New Dell computer arrived and a sweet voice was trying to guide me through setup. At this age I am very wary of the sweet young lasses which seem to show an interest in me. So I told her she looked fat and that turned her off.

Then it wanted me to sign up for a Microsoft free membership. I'm not much of a joiner and really didn't want join up. I already know where I am and what I like and how to connect with my friends.

So if you don't sign up (not recommended) you HAVE to enter a password to protect your data. And it warns you you'd better remember it or there is no recovery.

[/IMG]

Hmmm, seems like the same thing if the storage file gets corrupted, don't you think? I have no need of password protection. The cows don't have fingers and Hershey can't read. She can talk, so one of those talking "hey you, order some dog treats!" thingys is out for me too. So I got really pissed off when I realized I might, finally, have to have password protection on my home computer because somebody else just is sure I need it.

My WiFi is not password protected. I've had company IT helping me with the company laptop at home and they go ballistic when they take over my computer and see open WiFi and I tell them that's mine and use it. Then I ask why should I password protect it. So nobody else will use it. They'd have to be parked in my driveway, it won't reach the rural road in front of the house. I assure them each time if I see a strange car in my driveway using their computer I take them milk and cookies. That way they will clear the cookies when they're done.

So I called Dell and abused the automated voice lady. I felt some better so I got on chat and asked was there no way to use the computer without a password? Response "why would you want to do that?" She asked me to send her a screen shot. Ummm, I can't get logged on... So I sent her one of my custom screen shots with a phone (above). I know no shame.

I thought of my friend Don Long and decided I could pay for another laptop and took off my shoe. My foot was cold so I put it back on.

I then let Microsoft beat me and I signed up for them to be my nanny in case I forget my password.

Than it had important downloads. Very important. 3 gig. 7 hours. I timed it.

So I tried to work on the CNC router setup. Mach3 runs fine but the steppers just sit there or buzz and get hot. Called my grandson "where's the paperwork I sent with you?" You didn't send any, grandpa. Are you sure? Half hour later I found it in my office. Read through some of it, and realized Mach3 is not a simple program; it has to take over the computer's clock and keep anything else from running (my interpretation). And special things you have to do for Vista. Then what about Windows7? Went to their website. Windows7 32 bit only. 64 bit will not work. :WTF?

So the new computer will not work. Went to the house and found this

My dad's old Gatesway my wife used for years. Everything I need, plus it's a Pentium 4, XP, and has two hard drives. I had put a Hitachi 750 gig hard drive in it for my wife to use as backup. I think that drive is 3% full.

It even has a serial output (male pins) and some funky little ports but no HDMI.

With my paperwork was a CD and instructions to copy a driver into the directory after loading from the program from the CD. Both DVD and CD drives seemed to be inoperative. They would close and a light come on, and buzz, but never a drive show up on the directory tree. So I copied the CD to my thumb drive and loaded from a USB port.

Followed the instructions and it loaded like a charm.

Set up some g code and the long sleeping router woke up and behaved flawlessly. Didn't cut anything except air, but it is working.







Turned out just right!!

 

[Guster]

Shame there are not markings on the steppers. Would help you know what you are working with.

If they are set up for 1/8th step and you have a standard 200step/rotation bipolar stepper then missing one step running 1/8th step is 1/1600 of a rotation. Even with a coarse 5tpi leadscrew it is only 1/8000". I think you can miss a step or two dozen with minimal consequence.

Not a bad idea to have a Microsoft account. Lets you recover your license and password details kept against your account in the cloud. The kind folks there will help reset things now and then. Saved me a lot of trouble when a 2 year old custom PC destroyed itself when the motherboard packed up. I bought all the parts for a new one and managed to recover most of my personal stuff from the old hard drive but a full reinstall would mean re-using the OS license. I already used the second license for a media PC so they released it for me.

Good job getting it all running. Looking forward to see what mischief you create this week!

My stuff is all protected as much as practical. Too many smart and bored school kids with nothing better to do then mess your stuff up from the comfort of their bedroom. Since they have more time to break things than I have time to waste fixing stuff it is worth me spending a little time on it. Furthermore I have two young kids to protect from idiots out there till I can teach them more about what they should protect themselves from.

 

[bj383ss]

Andy I have been away from your thread for a few days and I had to back read several pages back trying to figure out what you are up to. I have a headache now . I am interested to see your cnc and 3D router.

Bret

 

[oldironfarmer]

Shame there are not markings on the steppers. Would help you know what you are working with.

If they are set up for 1/8th step and you have a standard 200step/rotation bipolar stepper then missing one step running 1/8th step is 1/1600 of a rotation. Even with a coarse 5tpi leadscrew it is only 1/8000". I think you can miss a step or two dozen with minimal consequence.

I need to reread what I got from the seller. It was pretty minimal but there are tidbits in text files I may not have reviewed yet. I say 1/8th step because the board in the controller has switches set to 1/8th, and 1/16th is available. I have no idea whether the motors would be suitable for 1/16th steps. I'll measure my lead screws, 5 tpi sounds about right.

Not a bad idea to have a Microsoft account. Lets you recover your license and password details kept against your account in the cloud. The kind folks there will help reset things now and then. Saved me a lot of trouble when a 2 year old custom PC destroyed itself when the motherboard packed up. I bought all the parts for a new one and managed to recover most of my personal stuff from the old hard drive but a full reinstall would mean re-using the OS license. I already used the second license for a media PC so they released it for me.

You can probably tell I get dragged kicking and screaming into each new phase of technology. My 100 year old forge blower still works just fine without a VFD on a motor. But I'm hoping the router will save me a lot of time doing wood carving. I certainly understood the value of the account. The new computer is sitting there waiting for me to love it. And this one had one of three USB ports fail yesterday. I need to get it in the mail to Vieux so he can replace it for me.

After inspection I see it has three. I need to do a full backup and start trying to get passwords transferred to the new computer. I'm sure there's an easier way to do that than the way I'm going to (log on, forgot password, reset, change on this computer too). Perhaps I should open my cloud account from this computer.

Good job getting it all running. Looking forward to see what mischief you create this week!

It was gratifying to luck into it. Mach3 has some user created wizards built in, and I need to join a Mach3 users group. I tried one designed to mill a circle and it was slick; the actual circle command uses the g code circle and the whole g code was only about ten lines long.

My stuff is all protected as much as practical. Too many smart and bored school kids with nothing better to do then mess your stuff up from the comfort of their bedroom. Since they have more time to break things than I have time to waste fixing stuff it is worth me spending a little time on it. Furthermore I have two young kids to protect from idiots out there till I can teach them more about what they should protect themselves from.

Having other people in your house is worthy of password protection. My wife, on the other hand, will not try to read a text I send her, and can't retrieve voice mail so we do it like in the olden days. If I call and don't get her, I call back. An amazing system.

Those smart bored school kids are actually getting an education trying to hack into someone else' computer. Notice how the word "hack" has involved recently? If you cut a plastic container to make a scoop its a hack.

Andy I have been away from your thread for a few days and I had to back read several pages back trying to figure out what you are up to. I have a headache now . I am interested to see your cnc and 3D router.

Bret

Well, walk on over, it's not that far. I like visitors.

I've decided to cast trivets with custom logos (Like her initials) in the center, and carving something that is mostly open spaces was going to be a challenge but I think I have that figured out.

 

[Farmall450]

Glad to see you got everything sorted out; let's see what you make.

 

[Kev442]

The gold content of those older PC circuit boards is quite high. A 5 gallon pail of those paid me around $40, and that was about 6 years ago.
I'm glad to see a P4 go back to work.

 

[oldironfarmer]

Glad to see you got everything sorted out; let's see what you make.

Boy me too! It's going to be dead here for a few days. I've been putting off my taxes and y Zumba teacher wants everything 2/15. Last year she didn't want stuff until after corporate taxes were filed on 3/15 but I will accommodate her best I can. Probably full time for a few days.

And I saw three or four cows making bag and springing this morning so I'm going to check on them while they're calving.

The gold content of those older PC circuit boards is quite high. A 5 gallon pail of those paid me around $40, and that was about 6 years ago.
I'm glad to see a P4 go back to work.

I was just thinking about putting my older computer back together to see if it will run. Since the P4 has 750 gig of hard drive it should store all the g code I can produce for several years.

I'll see you guys when I get a break from taxes.

 

[jbmatth]

Good to hear on the CNC router, hopefully you'll be making chips from your easy chair soon enough. Good luck with the taxes, I always dread going over mine and they are much simpler than yours are I'm sure.
JB

 

[gtabasso]

I have to start with the kitchen before I can get to the garage. Last weekend I spent more than two hours taking everything out of the pantry, purging it and reorganizing it. Next? My freezer. Then, my perfume collection. Then the garage! I want the inside of the house to be in order where I can get to things without stuff falling out and hurting me.

 

[xtremek]

I wish I could have as much fun as you do, Andy. I've been kind of busy, so I apologize for not contributing to one of the best threads at this joint. Keep on pushing, I enjoy the motivation.,

 

[drivesitfar]

Andy: we've had the same accountant for 31 years and he's still sharp and I hope he outlives us. good luck with yours and hopefully some of the effort you and time and sweat you put into all those property sales pays off.

speaking of which has the new Realtor sold anything yet or did you maybe price it a bit on the optimistic side to start?

a member just posted a 3d model of a Wilton bullet on the big vise thread you might want to take a peek at and here's the link and it's post 61966 and the red one in case you couldn't tell: https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44782

he's also talking of making it or a smaller one the model cause he gets free aluminum cans and has a forge so he can make vises out of aluminum. maybe he's one of your students?

cheers and hope the bull isn't just taking the girls back in the weeds for a foot massage.

 

[oldironfarmer]

Good to hear on the CNC router, hopefully you'll be making chips from your easy chair soon enough. Good luck with the taxes, I always dread going over mine and they are much simpler than yours are I'm sure.
JB

Chips from my easy chair? I'm eating them already.

My taxes are a self inflicted injury. If I would quit some of my activities I would have less to do. But I got almost through the organizer supplied by the Zumba Teacher this afternoon. About 20 hours of intense work. Feels really good to just have to go back through about 60 sheets and tidy things up.

I have to start with the kitchen before I can get to the garage. Last weekend I spent more than two hours taking everything out of the pantry, purging it and reorganizing it. Next? My freezer. Then, my perfume collection. Then the garage! I want the inside of the house to be in order where I can get to things without stuff falling out and hurting me.

Sounds like good progress on the pantry. I just can't bring myself to tackle my perfume collection. Keep us updated.

I wish I could have as much fun as you do, Andy. I've been kind of busy, so I apologize for not contributing to one of the best threads at this joint. Keep on pushing, I enjoy the motivation.,

Thanks for the kind words! I need the motivation.

Andy: we've had the same accountant for 31 years and he's still sharp and I hope he outlives us. good luck with yours and hopefully some of the effort you and time and sweat you put into all those property sales pays off.

I have changed accountants every time they started having their assistants do my taxes, then the more I checked the more errors I would find. They all got a second chance and things were always worse the next year. This one has promised to always do my taxes herself. If not, I quit Zumba

speaking of which has the new Realtor sold anything yet or did you maybe price it a bit on the optimistic side to start?

You know their tricks, eh? Why didn't you warn me?

He pulled up several comparisons and I reviewed them with him. Priced higher than I would have, but may not be out of line for the market.

Actually, we've had cold weather so I'm not getting excited until late March early April. Actually he's had some interest and so far nobody's been kicking about the price, but no offers either. But he and other Realtors have been showing both of them. You have ot have traffic to have sales.

a member just posted a 3d model of a Wilton bullet on the big vise thread you might want to take a peek at and here's the link and it's post 61966 and the red one in case you couldn't tell: https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44782

he's also talking of making it or a smaller one the model cause he gets free aluminum cans and has a forge so he can make vises out of aluminum. maybe he's one of your students?

Ha ha ha! I'll have to check that out. Sounds like I should be his student.

cheers and hope the bull isn't just taking the girls back in the weeds for a foot massage.

He may be a podiatrist, hmmm...

I've got so many springing I can't keep track. Six or eight. I haven't really tried, but it is several. So if they calve in February he nailed them as soon as he got out of the trailer last May. Good boy!

 

[jimreed2160]

You gotta love a bull who does not keep the ladies waiting...

 

[drivesitfar]

Andy: i was typing too fast cause still TRYING TO GET ORGANIZED and what i meant to say was that your bull was getting HIS FOOT RUBBED. I guess the gals in your herd decided he needed something else rubbed instead.

sure glad he didn't end up as hamburger if he's still got some good kids on their way to maybe give you his successor.

I'm not trying to dampen all this 20 and 30 year old computer conversation, but wouldn't it be easier if you just bought a new computer and maybe it would run your 3d printer a bit quicker?

I seem to recall that we are thinking in WEEKS now at our age and not YEARS so if we only have so little time left here and we have the cash why not buy the best. or save the cash and use the old computers if there really isn't a difference.

BTW that red wilton 3d bullet the other member made on his 3d printer he said it almost took a full week to build it. does it really take that long or is he using a SLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW computer or 3d printer?

 

[oldironfarmer]

You gotta love a bull who does not keep the ladies waiting...

I do love him, just don't want him to take a liking to me.

Andy: i was typing too fast cause still TRYING TO GET ORGANIZED and what i meant to say was that your bull was getting HIS FOOT RUBBED. I guess the gals in your herd decided he needed something else rubbed instead.

sure glad he didn't end up as hamburger if he's still got some good kids on their way to maybe give you his successor.

I'm not trying to dampen all this 20 and 30 year old computer conversation, but wouldn't it be easier if you just bought a new computer and maybe it would run your 3d printer a bit quicker?

I seem to recall that we are thinking in WEEKS now at our age and not YEARS so if we only have so little time left here and we have the cash why not buy the best. or save the cash and use the old computers if there really isn't a difference.

BTW that red wilton 3d bullet the other member made on his 3d printer he said it almost took a full week to build it. does it really take that long or is he using a SLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW computer or 3d printer?

He does need a leg and foot massage. It is still leaking white stuff and is swollen but is slowly going down. I think it needs exercise so I chase him when I get the chance.

The issue is my ten year old 3D router table. It takes a computer to drive it, and it seems the free software I can use is only good for Windows XP, 95, and Vista. Has to be a 32 bit system. And that computer needs to be in a dirty environment. The used one my grandson gave me was too new. I spent time trying to get a parallel port for it and that did not do the trick. My wife's old Gateway hums perfectly along with the router. Now if I like the router and it works out I may upgrade the controls to a HDMI controller. But if I have the stuff here to make it work, why spend a thousand or more? You might have noticed I get a kick out of using up old stuff. I even like making stuff I could buy.

3D printer takes a card with the gcode and it is self contained. So the new computer Bob harassed me into buying will provide the grunt work for the printer. It will also provide the gcode for the router, just take a stick out to the router computer and plug it in, then load it into the router software and get to cutting.

3D printers do have to print in small steps, and a vise has lots of parts, so I can see it taking 4 hours for a base, 6 hours for a moveable jaw, 8 or 10 hours for a body, two hours for a screw. One a day would look like a week, but I'm just a dreamer here.

Going to let the taxes rest tomorrow so I plan to weld on the Studebaker and try to route something in a board with the 3D router.

Thanks for the visits!

 

[1/2 Cup]

Andy, good to see you take a break from your taxes..

That's called prioritizing..

 

[Guster]

20 hours... gosh. Was going to say taxes might be a good break from this computer malarkey but from the sounds of it it may be the lesser evil of the two.

Typical 3D printers, the kind that is like a mini hot glue gun are inherently slow unless you forgo quality or strength. You can extrude thicker layers but the surface will look terrible. You can decrease infill but it will be mostly a hollow plastic shell. Or you can decrease you vertex/nurb/polyline count and end up with a cubist angular/planar polygonal surface rather than nice lofty curves. Then you have to realise that you are printing within a work envelope that may limit the size and this have to slice it in chunks to join later. It has it's place otherwise... Meh!

Andy, 64bit Windows will run older 32bit apps just fine. You can even run them in compatibility mode if it is specific to the XP specific runtime environment. It is a matter of where you run it from and how it is configured unless there is something in the hardware/driver config prohibiting it. I won't fuss anymore if it works.

 

[Craptain]

3D printers do have to print in small steps, and a vise has lots of parts, so I can see it taking 4 hours for a base, 6 hours for a moveable jaw, 8 or 10 hours for a body, two hours for a screw. One a day would look like a week, but I'm just a dreamer here.

I think you may be overestimating the print speed. The parts you are describing could take days, rather than hours to complete.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

 

[oldironfarmer]

Andy, good to see you take a break from your taxes..

That's called prioritizing..

Hmmm, or it's called sanity. Actually it's just good business practice. Any job needs to be set aside and other activities pursued before a final review and shipping it out the door. Otherwise, for me at least, I'm more likely to gloss over errors/omissions because I've just looked at it too much. Working alone it helps me give myself an independent review.

It is GREAT to get through the first draft. I measured just for fun, the organizer they send me to fill out is just right at 5 mm and the backup I'm adding for reference (includes W-2's, 1099's, etc., government forms from third parties) is just a hair shy of 15 mm. So not as much as I thought.

20 hours... gosh. Was going to say taxes might be a good break from this computer malarkey but from the sounds of it it may be the lesser evil of the two.

Well, that includes preparation time, getting my categories cleaned up in the financial software. Things like making sure Hershey's vet bills are not listed as Farm expenses, la la la. I still have to retrieve my log books from the farm vehicles and calculate actual farm/development/rental/charity mileage.

Typical 3D printers, the kind that is like a mini hot glue gun are inherently slow unless you forgo quality or strength. You can extrude thicker layers but the surface will look terrible. You can decrease infill but it will be mostly a hollow plastic shell. Or you can decrease your vertex/nurb/polyline count and end up with a cubist angular/planar polygonal surface rather than nice lofty curves. Then you have to realise that you are printing within a work envelope that may limit the size and this have to slice it in chunks to join later. It has it's place otherwise... Meh!

Yep, I'm hoping it will run on it's own while I'm goofing around on other stuff. This one is supposed to recover from power failure and running out of filament seamlessly which ideally means I can walk away. We'll see, of course. It is supposed to be quiet. If quiet enough I may set it up in the office. Then when I come in my wife can say "your thing quit". And, I don't expect to try to print big stuff, just small things that are hard to make out of wood. Maybe even pieces to be glued to a wooden pattern, like a logo or raised letters. Or a lug with a flat round base which can be glued into a Forstner drilled shallow hole. I also expect to smooth the parts with sand paper and wood filler to finish the pattern surface. Lot's of plans, so little follow through.

Andy, 64bit Windows will run older 32bit apps just fine. You can even run them in compatibility mode if it is specific to the XP specific runtime environment. It is a matter of where you run it from and how it is configured unless there is something in the hardware/driver config prohibiting it. I won't fuss anymore if it works.

I obviously don't understand, but this app has to be at the lowest level, they say, so it can run on the computer clock and never be buffered by any other program. I am guessing an older system makes it easier for the program to have full priority over other applications. For now, I have it licked with the old computer but when that one lets the smoke out I may be looking again if it is possible to run it on a 64 bit machine.

I think you may be overestimating the print speed. The parts you are describing could take days, rather than hours to complete.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Yeah, I'm guessing. I see guys who have several printers on shelves running away. That's an obvious option, have a group of printers. You've got me ready to buy more.

Maybe I should get the first one first. Still two weeks out. I should have paid more and not ordered from Canada.

Funny how they say "Priority Air" and four week delivery all while smiling confidently. I assume CN is Canada, and not Peoples' Republic of China, or Chief of Navy, or Convergencia Nacional or Consignes de Navigabilite or Cavan, Ireland

Oh oh, I think I found it: Clueless Newbie

 

[oldironfarmer]

A little update,

Two days ago we had a 6F (-14) morning. Cows came with frosting. A word about the hay. Apparently in the bovine world having enough hay to wear it on your back is a sign of plenty and wealth. She did that to herself.

Houston, we have a problem. Apparently Hershey has developed OCD. Or was born that way. She is always berserk while I'm feeding her so we together spill food every morning. The birds clean it up. Or so I thought. This morning she was eating up the spill portion first before she started on the bowl. Sound like anyone we know?

Only 19 head came in to eat this morning. Probably have a new calf. After feeding one cow looked NNW and then headed that way. She ratted out the new momma. About 600 ft (200 m) from the barn in weeds from brush clearing.

Little buggar was standing up and looked good, with Hershey nearby I didn't go closer (either she hadn't noticed or had been chased away earlier).

One down 18 to go (the bull likely will not calve this year).

 

[Guster]

I obviously don't understand, but this app has to be at the lowest level, they say, so it can run on the computer clock and never be buffered by any other program. I am guessing an older system makes it easier for the program to have full priority over other applications. For now, I have it licked with the old computer but when that one lets the smoke out I may be looking again if it is possible to run it on a 64 bit machine.

That may be more likely as Win7 onwards implemented a higher level of software abstraction from the hardware. Similar to mobile OSs which makes sense as that is where MS is heading. This has made it harder to get too the raw hardware control. Likely what Mach3 requires to maintain interruption free interface control for a steady serial output.

Everything computing is going either asynchronous or eventual consistency to support cloud computing principles. On the other hand single-board microcontrollers are abundant and increasingly cheaper and more powerful making it easier to have a dedicated programmable processor based controller for devices.

Your 3D printer by example will likely have something like an Arduino running it. My intended 3D printer controller will be Arduino based. My CNC router controller pendant is an ARM processor based microcontroller. Not to mention that many of these are already more powerful than the old 486 based PC's that were lamented about earlier. To support this the industry have also caught up supplying modularised bluetooth, ethernet, wi-fi, motion controllers, serial and hdmi display interfaces, serial touch screen interfaces etc.

I currently have more solutions than problems.

 

[oldironfarmer]

Yeah, I bet you're right. :LOL

I did understand some of that. The 3D printer is stand alone, so long term I need to be thinking about a stand alone processor. Then one needs software to run on it.

 

[oldironfarmer]

Monday we had 6 (-14) and today we hit 82 (28) so we've had winter, spring, and summer this week.

Went to an auction Saturday, neighbor of my Zumba teacher/CPA. I bought a little stuff just to try to help out. $105.

Pretty good variety of stuff. Starting with 8 storage boxes with 12 lids?

Nice full flow gas can like I like in the back. To the right a paper cutter (Xacto) I've been wanting. Next row new paint brushes and drop cloths, then 40# of new brass fittings, boxes of nails and an ancient 12v belt driven air pump, next box, couple of professional trowels, more stuff under, a good tripod for YouTube videos, next box funnels, tools, next row cheap level and an ancient square, 1-7/8"body, 1" tongue, hand stamped and only marked on the outside edges. May have been for something other than carpentry, 1/8" marking one side, 1/4" back. Small box of Craftsman wrenches and sockets, box of drill bits with an old stand, red handled Crescent adjustable pliers with lots of nut drivers and other pliers. Last box is a 1/4" and 3/8" drive SK Wayne socket sets. Hatchets and hammers, hatchet on top is a Plumb, and lastly some kind of a chemical sump pump, USA GE motor, 1/3 hp, with a stainless steel vertical pump.

My son dropped his tractor off for tire repair. He wanted two new tubes put in. Looks to me like they were tubeless. A new valve core fixed one, used my 1/2 Cup jack (3,000# capacity and so light I grab it first) to jack up the other.

Found two plugs, and they were both leaking. They had not been trimmed off on installation many years ago, so I put in two new plugs and the tires are holding air nicely.

I know my son asked for a loaf of bread and I gave him a stone, but he's OK with the fix. I trimmed the plugs flush and think they will last at 2 mph.

After advising Lyndon on the availability of replacement level vials, I found a Starrett vial which I think is a precision vial. I plan to make a precision level with it to set up machine tools. It was $21 but the level should be worth several hundred IF I do a good job.

Thanks for stopping by!!

 

[1/2 Cup]

Andy,

Help out, you mean you stole all that gear for a $105.00 Great score.

I must go and check to see if MY jack is still here. It is nice to know that it can lift a tractor.

Its great to know that level vials are still available..


Have a good one.