Compressor Air Cooler Dryer Piping Sizing Question

[cloves]

Hi all, I picked up a 7.5 NorthStar air compressor and want to add an air cooler, technically two. One from the motor (1/2 copper line) to my old truck ac condenser I have lying around. The second to the air coming out the 1/2 ball valve.

I am not sure what size my trucks a/c condenser is as of yet (in and outlet pipes). I started to think about whether there would be any restriction issues if I went with the a/c condenser. The line going from the compressor motor to the tank is 1/2 flexible copper.

The second cooling and drying part I wanted to add was after the 1/2 ball valve. Would it make much sense to up-size the copper piping to 3/4 if the tank only has a 1/2 outlet?

Thinking something similar to this (found on the net), a few copper lines and drop legs for the second portion.

I will be using the compressor eventually for painting but for now air tools. Tips and advice are welcome.

 

[matt_i]

Check tube sizes, I think an AC condenser is going to present a restriction. If you find one with a 5/8" OD tube then I think its probably OK. An AC compressor and air compressor are different sizes and require different HP if you ask me.

Maybe if you went after a part from a Suburban with rear air...

Imo you could get nearly the same effect as the copper snake if you built your pipe system from copper, and then eventually go to drip legs or low point drains. If there's minimal distance between the compressor and point of use then I can see the need for additional length. But take advantage of placing the compressor remotely to save your ears and sanity...

Relative to the 3/4" size, I'd use it for a trunk line if you have a flow path you know is going to be heavily used or its a long way.

Full port ball valves are your friend so you don't have to refill the tank every time you want to use air.

I was working on this back in January before things got weird, summer hit and I got distracted by fifty eleven other projects. Waiting for cool days to return to the attic

 

[cloves]

Matt. thats looking very nice. Is your outlet pipe on that compressor 3/4 or 1/2 inch? I see you also have what looks like a check vavle before your first filter, what is that for?

 

[matt_i]

Cloves,

Thanks, this is a better view of the components.

I am planning to remove the 2" bung from the air compressor tank and put in that bushing, its a 1" premium air hose from McMaster Carr...Goodyear...forget the brand-line for the moment but its the mid grade (not AutoGrip which is highest).

The ball valve is going to be actuated by a Bimba air cylinder for isolation purposes.

Then there's a cyclonic filter and a coalescing filter. I went 1" on those two items to get more flow thru the coalescer. The rest is just manifold for the various parts of the shop. I sent the manifold vertical to try to keep moisture in those two filters.



I have this system gage to report on the line pressure, its overkill but too good of a gage to waste.



Very last part for painting is this Flienco dessicant and Parker micro coalescer, I think it can hit 0.01 micron rating on the last coalescer with the proper media.



My friends in this are ebay for used industrial components (just update filters and media) and supplyhouse for all of the fittings. I have an affinity for Master Pneumatic parts - based out of Detroit Rock City, USA

 

[pcmeiners]

Agree on Ebay for components, especially if you have time, with patience you can get quality and price. The older stuff is of much greater quality, example, the new Parker filters/regulators are half plastic, the older models are all metal, better engineered.

If you build like the picture....
Either chemically darken your copper pipes, or paint them black, bright copper ***** as a radiator of heat. Only use FULL Flow valves

If you want a real heat exchanger, get a Hayden or equal of a DB1290 , this particular size is just right for a 7.5 Hp compressor. High flow, swirl tubes in the core, copper rate to 300psi .


https://www.haydenindustrial.com/products/fin-cool

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000HE6UNK/?tag=atomicindus08-20


Pipe size, 3/4" min

 

[dkmc]

Would it make much sense to up-size the copper piping to 3/4 if the tank only has a 1/2 outlet?

Nope

 

[cloves]

@matt very nice so you got that Flienco filter via ebay. I am trying to figure out the air compressor dryer filter portion now. Budget is already stretched thin. Figure have at least 2 dryers inline with the copper look system I build.

@pcmeiners thanks for the cooler info. I also came across a derale one which is a bit cheaper 1/2 pipe. Apparently these things are plumbed with AN fittings so I need to figure out if AN6 or AN8 is the best fit for my 1/2 inch line coming from the top of the motor to the tank.

You also mentioned 3/4 pipe size as the minimum, my compressor outlet is only 1/2 does upsizing make sense here? So my copper piping drying system would be pipes with 3/4 instead of 1/2.

@dkmc just curious if you knew the reason why? thanks

 

[matt_i]

Instead of -AN my recommendation is to use JIC fittings which are close-enough spec equals and much less expensive. Parker has a whole series. 8 FTX-S is one part number to look up as a #8 JIC female to 1/2" NPT-male in zinc plated steel. Also you can look up Parker 4300 series tube fittings catalog for an entire empire's wealth of information. Study that .pdf and powerful ye shall be

 

[cloves]

@matt never heard of JIC fittings. I am looking at the pdf linked below. So a JIC fitting would work on npt because they are very similar in thread (teflon tape would would work in other words)? These type of fittings aren't sold locally most likely right?

As far as coolers stumbled on this Derale transmission cooler and the guy was using it to cool his air compressor, bit smaller then the Hayden @pcmeiners recommended above but also half the cost. The Derale 15300 cooler mentioned has an AN8 fitting and the reviewer (Linked below) said it came with a "1/2" barb fittings" and he was able to connect to it with his copper pipping, not sure how.

https://i.postimg.cc/xjbLvgkM/Air-Cooler-Review-Amazon-Derale-Capture.png


https://i.postimg.cc/ncbB0775/Derale-15300-Air-Cooler-Transmission.png


https://www.parker.com/literature/Tube Fittings Division/4300_Catalog_Cover.pdf

 

[oldmachinenut]

Instead of -AN my recommendation is to use JIC fittings which are close-enough spec equals and much less expensive. Parker has a whole series. 8 FTX-S is one part number to look up as a #8 JIC female to 1/2" NPT-male in zinc plated steel. Also you can look up Parker 4300 series tube fittings catalog for an entire empire's wealth of information. Study that .pdf and powerful ye shall be

I bought my jic fittings from Surplus Center when I built my aftercooler, very reasonably priced and good quality. I only mentioned this to point out another source not to contradict Matt’s recommendation.

Bill

 

[oldmachinenut]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Stainl...21-Length-3-4-Female-JIC-Unused-/222083306099

These are the lines I used on my aftercooler.

Bill

 

[oldmachinenut]

This is my aftercooler, sorry for all the posts.

Bill

 

[matt_i]

@matt never heard of JIC fittings. I am looking at the pdf linked below. So a JIC fitting would work on npt because they are very similar in thread (teflon tape would would work in other words)? These type of fittings aren't sold locally most likely right?

As far as coolers stumbled on this Derale transmission cooler and the guy was using it to cool his air compressor, bit smaller then the Hayden @pcmeiners recommended above but also half the cost. The Derale 15300 cooler mentioned has an AN8 fitting and the reviewer (Linked below) said it came with a "1/2" barb fittings" and he was able to connect to it with his copper pipping, not sure how.

The JIC is based on a 37 degree flare just like the -AN fitting. Theoretically the JIC tolerances are "looser" but JIC is used on industrial high pressure hydraulics all over the world.

To get from JIC to NPT (pipe) you need adapters. Hence the Parker fittings I spoke of above. The -AN8 fitting would cross to a #8 JIC, it appears the cooler has male fittings. One could go to hard pipe in NPT or also have a hydraulic hose built with a #8 JIC female swivel to match it. With the tube nut of JIC its easy to orient and seals reliably with less torque and more certainty than the NPT taper system.

One can buy JIC fittings at a local hydraulic shop, a Parker Store or online its your choice.

@ old machine nut, very nice clean install

 

[oldmachinenut]

Thanks Matt!

 

[sberry]

You mention budget,,, this is a great place to find out if you actually need all that stuff before spending on it????? Sometimes I got to wonder how I ever managed without it?

 

[sberry]

Guys take a well, carefully engineered machine and despite knowing absolutely nothing about it are gonna fix it better before ever using it. Spend hundreds and add a bushel of fittings on top.

 

[sberry]

Tips and advice are welcome.

Mine not so much? But

Would it make much sense to up-size the copper piping to 3/4 if the tank only has a 1/2 outlet?

If it was long enuf and used enuf air it would but doubt it will here. Body tools, sandblast, paint all run fine on 100 ft + of 1/2.
If I was installing a new comp and to a guy sounds somewhat new to this would hake a simple mainifold/air distribution to a fil/reg and then to a hose reel. I could do all this minus a hose reel for not much more than a hundred bucks to get started. The OP didnt mention location, this has some bearing.
My ideal setup today,,, is a stock machine fastened in place wired in and plumbed to a simple manifold after a ball valve disconnect, valve right on tank. I see some air equipment at Walmart even, was some CH and I think a 3/8 ported filter and reg was 35$ maybe. All this buys time for collecting, for figuring out what you need vs simply tossing money at it on speculation. I did a remodel on mine, got the water to absolutely quit with simple design change, no moving no extra parts.
You can always change, can always add, some time spent staring at it makes for better desigh than ordering every part a guy can read about and every fitting they ever invent.

 

[sberry]

I must have 300 ft of pipe, 4 reg and not a single fitting I can think of not common pipe thread. All 1/2 valves. Would never occur to me to use a JIC on air, really the same for 37 degree flare, not that that stuff wouldnt work and might be different if it was a hobby and free but it just wouldnt be something I would use unless I had to unless npt wouldnt work.
When I started this biz my designs were more complicated, had more parts, more turns, some I look back on and compare, would not do it that way again, would simplify, wouldnt have so many left over odd fittings I thought I absolutely had to have.
I did a lot backwards, made the proto too big, too expensive and too complicated,,, today I am a bit the opposite,,, the prototype is simple, featured for convenience, a lot from salvage or stock, as many common parts as possible.