Between 705 & 1200 SQ/FT Conrad's Alpine Workshop

[Conrad]

Well, I've been a long time lurker and finally starting a build thread.

I'm in the foothills of Rockies about 30 miles from Denver; wifey and I bought our forever home almost 4 years ago, our lot is 3 acres on a fairly steep hillside, and even though we're in a rural area, our county straddles the suburb/rural area so a lot of our zoning rules are influenced by city area.

I'm a car guy and general tinkerer who wants to spend more time tinkering so I need a bit more space. As much as I would love a 1500 sqft garage-mahal I'm limited to what I can build. Being a little bit outside of the Denver metro means most contractors don't want to make the haul up the mountain for a "small" project like this, so turns out I'll be my own GC here, I've been a gopher on enough building projects in my youth and done enough DIY work over the years to be dangerous but I think this one is a good learning experience for me.

The pics below are from Oct '20 when we started

The before view down onto the build site from the road


First step was to clear some trees, plenty of 80-100' lodgepole pines, fortunately there's no rule against cutting down trees on your own property so me and Mr Stihl went to town.


My Father in Law was a heavy equipment operator in a mine for 30+ years, so he came up and I rented a dozer to handle the rough grade work. The DIY excavating probably saved $20k plus running a dozer its a hell of a lot of fun.


Phase 1 excavation was complete the original plan was to have the driveway come directly off the county road, here's the "after" shot of the built site, basically the same POV as the first photo.

 

[Conrad]

My initial plan was to go big, like 1400-1500sq ft big, but my local county has some pretty limiting regulations, I'll spare you all my rant on suburbanite tinhorn beaurocrats telling rural dwellers what they can and can't build on their own land. Suffice to say I had to get a variance.

I was limited to 695sq ft (their calculation is based on the sqft of the footprint of your house, our house is a tri-level perched on the hillside with a detached garage so we were doubly screwed on this) I asked for 1440, but variance committee didn't want to give that so we compromised on 1000. Again, there's a rant in there I'll keep to myself.



"Plan A" was to put a driveway off the county road, however this proved to be too steep and wouldn't work, so my father in law (let's call him CT) came back up and we implemented "Plan B": coming off the existing driveway, widening the pad, the good news is this means more usable space, a MUCH easier driveway and best of all, more seat time in the dozer and backhoe.

CT and I heading to work.


New driveway approach


Bigger pad


I'm kicking myself for not going this way first, but the $ damage wasn't too bad and at the end of the day we ended up with more usable space and less paperwork to show the county since I'm not coming off their road any longer.

Here's a rending of what I'd like to put there, 25x40 with a 13' lean-to on the side that serves as a carport. I'm going with a single slope to allow for a loft along the high-side wall, the garage door and personnel door will probably swap locations to better allow for this



Next up is having the driveway paved, that should be about 3 weeks out.

 

[captain14]

I’ll be back for updates.
Have you lined up any subs for any of the work ahead of time? Concrete, framers, etc?

 

[PugetDude]

Subscribed for updates; this looks like it's going to be a great thread.
Congratulations on just getting your permit...

 

[Walkers]

Nice! Put on bigger overhangs.

 

[Conrad]

I’ll be back for updates.
Have you lined up any subs for any of the work ahead of time? Concrete, framers, etc?

I had a few concrete guys come out, but I haven't been able to get solid numbers, since I haven't been able to get any quotes on the building itself.

It's the strangest thing, vendors don't answer their phones and don't reply to quote forms or return calls. Maybe 1000sqft is small potatoes and not worth their time, I'm open to recommendations and alternatives if anyone has any.

Nice! Put on bigger overhangs.

Noted the rendering I posted doesn't have it, but I've added 1' on the outer edged.

 

[Walkers]

Add longer if you can, it puts the snow further from the door, rain splash too. Also, the more shade the better.

 

[jbrentd]

I like what you have shown us so far. Any updates?

 

[Conrad]

I like what you have shown us so far. Any updates?

Yes, thanks for the nudge...


The final building design ended up being different from what I showed a few posts back. As much as I love a little abstract design I was giving up some practicality and (more importantly) space for the sake of aesthetics which is a compromise I didn't want to make.

Ultimately I went with a traditional gable with a lean-to that's flush with the roof line. There's also a 12' wide mezzanine that runs along the back interior wall. The garage door is centered and a bit wider than pictured but this is the basic idea.



I ordered the building and sent the permit application to the county the first week of August, and it came back this week with some issues; seems the mezzanine doesn't clearly state the max load and the rated wind load is lower than allowed, I sent this back to the vendor, hopefully the engineer can turn around these updates quickly and I can get the rubber stamp.

It's a race against the weather here, fall is starting to make its presence known, and I still don't have a clear date as to when the building will arrive from the manufacturer. I need some global warming to keep the snow off the ground until Thanksgiving.

 

[Kevkx125]

Looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Good luck with it.

 

[Conrad]

Well, more than a month later and literally zero progress has been made. I must say this is the must frustrating and annoying experience of anything I've ever purchased.

The engineering company did a substandard job by providing an incorrect specification, and due to miscommunication between the vendor and manufacturer, it took a month to get the corrected plans.

Based on the timelines I was told by the vendor when I placed my order, the building should have been delivered by now, but it turns out the manufacturing order hasn't even been placed, and there is no chance of getting my building before the weather turns this season.

I've waited a long time to build this shop, so I can wait another 6 months, but it's f%!$#*@ discouraging when other peoples stupidity or lies screw up your plans.

 

[j p smith]

Welcome to GJ but Dang it on the delay

 

[jbrentd]

Well, more than a month later and literally zero progress has been made. I must say this is the must frustrating and annoying experience of anything I've ever purchased.

The engineering company did a substandard job by providing an incorrect specification, and due to miscommunication between the vendor and manufacturer, it took a month to get the corrected plans.

Based on the timelines I was told by the vendor when I placed my order, the building should have been delivered by now, but it turns out the manufacturing order hasn't even been placed, and there is no chance of getting my building before the weather turns this season.

I've waited a long time to build this shop, so I can wait another 6 months, but it's f%!$#*@ discouraging when other peoples stupidity or lies screw up your plans.

I feel your pain, having put 1/3rd down with my GC exactly 3 months ago.

 

[jar944]

Welcome to the new normal..

 

[jollygreengiant]

Well, more than a month later and literally zero progress has been made. I must say this is the must frustrating and annoying experience of anything I've ever purchased.

The engineering company did a substandard job by providing an incorrect specification, and due to miscommunication between the vendor and manufacturer, it took a month to get the corrected plans.

Based on the timelines I was told by the vendor when I placed my order, the building should have been delivered by now, but it turns out the manufacturing order hasn't even been placed, and there is no chance of getting my building before the weather turns this season.

I've waited a long time to build this shop, so I can wait another 6 months, but it's f%!$#*@ discouraging when other peoples stupidity or lies screw up your plans.

There aren't many things that will make me upset, but people's incompetence and stupid government bureaucracy are on the short list.

Sorry to hear about your troubles. Hopefully you don't have too many more problems along the way.

 

[PugetDude]

Good luck going forward. Based on ToolFool’s experience this seems to be a common problem with building suppliers.

 

[Conrad]

Well despite the troubles with the building I've been able to make progress on the foundation. The concrete crew was great, they knocked out all the prep work in a little over a week.



Up here, there's snow on the ground 5 months out of the year here, so I went a bit overkill with 2" foam board insulation under the slab, I briefly considered radiant heat but figured that money would be better spent on Race Deck or similar and a bigger Hot Dawg heater.

The purpose of the shop will be to store and work on cars, and I want to maximize my space so I've opted for the recessed scissor lift, I kinda dropped the ball and didn't order the lift early enough so I had to pull measurements from this post (shout out JCTaylor!), the lift did arrive the day before the pour but I didn't think there was much need to unpack it, since I don't really have anything to move it with and its not getting installed for a while. There's a good chance it will sit under a tarp and (eventually) 3' of snow till May.



Today was pour day, honestly I felt like a kid on Christmas, and I'm really impressed with how well it came out. The crew did a great job and the split finish is a nice touch, broom finish under the carport, trowel finish for the interior. The final tally was 56 yards

From here the next job is backfilling and leveling the area in front of this first slab, the plan there is pour a 40x~40 apron which serves as a parking/outdoor work area for the garage. And then 180' asphalt driveway. This winter has been very warm and dry, we got lucky with the concrete but its only a matter before we're shut down till spring

 

[PugetDude]

Progress! Glad to see you’re finally getting started on the actual build.

 

[grant00]

Looks good so far! Not great to hear about your Jeffco experience. I live down the hill from you in Jefferson County also (my avatar picture is at Meyer Ranch Park just off highway 285). What was the detail on your foundation with regards to footing depth and style? Is it permitted as a heated structure? Looks like a non-stem wall foundation from the pictures.

 

[Jacko264]

Looking good keep up the great work .
The scenery looks lovely
well jealous
Graham

 

[Conrad]

Looks good so far! Not great to hear about your Jeffco experience. I live down the hill from you in Jefferson County also (my avatar picture is at Meyer Ranch Park just off highway 285). What was the detail on your foundation with regards to footing depth and style? Is it permitted as a heated structure? Looks like a non-stem wall foundation from the pictures.

Hey Neighbor, JeffCo's actually been pretty fair all things considered, I can't say I agree with all their policies but as long as you stay within the lines and be pleasant they're pretty easy to work with, though they are understaffed and (like everything else) running slower than expected.

Footing depth is 36", I don't think JeffCo cares whether something is heated or not, more so if its a "living space", which this is not since it's detached and does not have plumbing; though my wife is already anticipating me basically moving in when it's done

For heat I'm planning on a Hot Dawg 75k fed by a 100lb propane tank, I think that size will last me a winter between fill ups.

Stem walls slipped my mind as part of the design, I think this might be kind of a screw up on my part, but I don't think its a disaster, the drainage from the area will be pretty good and we don't get a ton of rain, but I will be mindful to put extra sealer on the bottom plate when we get to that part.

Looking good keep up the great work .
The scenery looks lovely
well jealous
Graham

Thank you sir, we're quite fortunate up here.

 

[Conrad]

Winter weather has still held off so I figured I would take advantage of that while I could, I ended up pulling the trigger on having the driveway paved.

I've been very fortunate to have all good subcontractors (knock on wood) and the asphalt guys were no exception. Showed up at 8:30am, did their prep and grade work, laid down ~190' of pavement and were driving away just before noon. I'm really happy with how it came out.

 

[turbowoodworker]

Congrats on the progress. Looking forward to the build.

 

[Klokwerk]

Well, this is moving along now!
Too bad you couldn't stick with the shed roof. I love what can be done with them. If I had the space, I'd do something like this.
Sorry about the delays with building. Hopefully that gets sorted out soon.

 

[grant00]

Looking good! The paved driveway will be a nice change, I'm sure.

That 75k heater sound's like it would be more than enough. That's a lot of BTUs!

Would you mind sharing the name of your concrete/foundation contractor if you would recommend them? Private message maybe if you don't feel like posting it. I'm in the search for estimates for myself for next year.

 

[Conrad]

Would you mind sharing the name of your concrete/foundation contractor if you would recommend them?

Elevation Concrete, they were too good to keep private, I dealt with a ton of flakey contractors but these guys were on it, I'm going to have them come back and pour another apron slab between the foundation and the driveway in the spring

 

[grant00]

Much appreciated!! Looking forward to seeing your walls go up!

 

[Conrad]

Mega update
Been a while, but I'm still at it.

The building was delivered in February; transporting it from the road, down the driveway and to the slab was .... a chore, even with the benefit of a forklift. Either way I got everything down to the building site, and under a tarp, awaiting assembly in the spring.




Fast forward to spring
To prep for the build I had CT excavate a bit more of the hillside and we separated the steel in to general piles for their uses



This has been mostly a DIY job but I've had some great help from my father in law, CT (left) as well as my neighbor, KC (right), me in the middle.



I was a bit optimistic as to how fast this would go up; even with the help of the lift, telehandler, and backhoe, and about 5-6 men a day we only got the primary framing done over a Friday - Monday period.

 

[Conrad]

The first 4 days was the big push and while we didn't make as much progress as I would have hoped we still got much the structure of the building up. CT stayed for about a week to run the backhoe and help with the build but had to head back home to New Mexico. Since the initial push I've been chipping away at finishing up the framing and getting it ready for sheeting.



And then today, this happened....


Probably the final snow storm of the season, and these are usually pretty heavy, but we had plenty of notice, I pulled in all the tools and returned the rental equipment. It's basically a forced few days off after working on this basically full time for the last 2 weeks.

 

[Jakey poo]

Those views!

 

[Conrad]

Alright its been a while since I've posted here but progress is being made, although somewhat slower than I thought. Over the last few months I've worked with a rotating cast of friends and neighbors.

And I bought a forklift



It wasn't expected, but by going with 15' sidewalls it's kind of a necessary tool to have.



There was a general work stoppage for a few weeks due to 4th of July travel, work travel and life stuff. However we were able to get the front apron and side walkout done. As well as the trench work and cable laid for electrical, I'm glossing over that story but suffice to say it was a pain in the ****.


Full disclosure: I LOVE watching concrete get poured.



The front apron is 25' long, spans the full width of the building and includes a walkout for accessing the front door and side of the building with the forklift.



I'm trying to think ahead/futureproof this thing as best as possible, For the slab I purchased these Neenah anchors and hit them with a couple coats of Rust-oleum Red and had the concrete guys wet-set them. Apparently their hold down force is over 9000 (!!!!)

There's no specific use for them, but I placed a total of 4 at the corners, I figure they'll present their usefulness when the time comes.

I also got 20' of trench drain with an unfinished cast-iron grate, it didn't take long for the surface rust patina to come in, I think it looks fantastic.




Sheeting next, basically 3 1/2 days to get 3 walls up.



And here we are today, rain has (again) slowed things down but I'm very close to the next inspection.

 

[captain14]

Looking good. Beautiful scenery.

Which direction does the lean-to porch face? You know when you need to take a break to think through a solution to a problem.

 

[jarhead]

Looks great! Hope you are safe from the fires, metal is good up there.

I'm a neighbor to the north of Denver, Fort Collins area.

 

[Conrad]

Which direction does the lean-to porch face? You know when you need to take a break to think through a solution to a problem.

Lean-to faces east, away from the road.

Looks great! Hope you are safe from the fires, metal is good up there.

I'm a neighbor to the north of Denver, Fort Collins area.

Howdy neighbor, yes metal seemed better for up here, and a bit more permanent than wood, and if a fire does come though at least all my stuff will be baked not fried

 

[Conrad]

I had planned to make a big push on getting the shop ready for the pre-roofing inspection this past week but the weather got the last word. Between my day job and just enough rain to screw up my schedule I got much less done than I planned, though that has been a recurring theme on this project, I should be used to it now.

That said, I did manage to finish the lean-to framing and rally my wife to help put on the front paneling. It's actually looking pretty complete (minus the roof).



The kicker is now I have to travel for work back-to-back weeks and wont be able to get back to the shop until labor day weekend.

 

[jollygreengiant]

Your shop is coming along really well! And those views are gorgeous!

What will you be doing with the hill beside your shop, one massive retaining wall?

 

[Conrad]

What will you be doing with the hill beside your shop, one massive retaining wall?

Eventually, but not really a rush on my part, that hillside will erode a bit, and I'll use that dirt as fill for other projects, there's enough space between the hillside and structure for a rockslide to not threaten it.

 

[isonic]

I had planned to make a big push on getting the shop ready for the pre-roofing inspection this past week but the weather got the last word. Between my day job and just enough rain to screw up my schedule I got much less done than I planned, though that has been a recurring theme on this project, I should be used to it now.

That said, I did manage to finish the lean-to framing and rally my wife to help put on the front paneling. It's actually looking pretty complete (minus the roof).



The kicker is now I have to travel for work back-to-back weeks and wont be able to get back to the shop until labor day weekend.

Nice Work! Love the views. The GMT400 looks good too

When you are DIY'ng something like this does the building MFG give you instructions as to which part goes where? I.E. how do you know which piece of sheeting or which beam goes where? Or do you just lay it all out and put it together like a pizzle knowing how it is supposed to end up?

 

[dmittz]

Amazing views from your property. That is a big DIY project! Its coming along very nicely.

 

[PugetDude]

Happy to see the update; you're making progress.