Construction Adhesive

[coe]

Hey all! I have a question about construction adhesives. My dad and I are about to install a 14" LVL beam (22') for my new garage. The beam will be placed at a height of approximately 13 feet. Each of the 3 sections weigh approximately 115 lbs, so we are going to have to place each one individually and join them after they are placed. We would like to apply the construction adhesive to each section before raising it into position but we are not sure if we will have enough "work" time. So, my question is what brand of construction adhesive provides the longest work time? We have used Liquid Nails in the past, but if I recall correctly, it sets relatively fast. I'm aware that temperature and humidity significantly affect drying time (Charleston, SC, low 90's, humidity > 60%), so this will be a bit of a slightly unknown variable. Any suggestions/experiences are greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
~Ron

 

[green.bubbly]

I am confused. Are you cutting the 22' beam into three pieces?

 

[coe]

Sorry for the confusion. No, the beam is in 3 (14" H x 1 3/4" W x 22' L) sections that are to be joined together longitudinally to form one 5 1/4" wide continuous beam (this is the beam that will support the roof).

 

[CTyankee]

I don't see the need for any adhesive. We do this on a regular basis...Mostly we just screw the snot out of them..In some cases we'll thru-bolt them.

 

[ford33]

If you want to use construction adhesive, visit the loctiteproducts website and select construction adhesive. They list multiple products. Go to the technical specifications page and it will state the working time.

The Loctite PowerGrab heavy duty clear products provides 20 minutes of repositioning time.

 

[readhead]

Unless you have plans that indicate glue there is no need. Lots of nails, screws have very little shear value.

 

[temoore55]

Some LVL's are coated with a wax. The ones I just used had a yellow coating. The construction adhesives will not stick to them. As the others have said, screwing or nailing them together will be fine.

 

[slickgt1]

I like a little glue when doing something like this. But if they are coated, your glue is mostly a waste. PL premium is what I like. It sets up quick, but not that quick.

And yes, nails, screws will snap, while nails bend. Or the right screw.

 

[Chris705]

Structural SDS screws are what I would recommend....self drilling and available in various lengths.....
From the GP (Georgia-Pacific) website look at page 16 of the pdf......

http://www.buildgp.com/DocumentViewer.aspx?elementid=9548

 

[coe]

Thanks for the information. Looks like we won't use an adhesive after all.

~Ron

 

[GTO]

Why don't you just use a 5-1/4x14 Parallam ?

 

[Quebeker]

Why don't you just use a 5-1/4x14 Parallam ?

I agree!

I've used a 5-1/4 x 16 Parallam to hold my cottage floor. This thing is stronger than a steel H beam. No flex,and it's also fire resistant!

As for the glue I would use Lepage PL. But I'm not sure if you have that in USA!

Good luck!

 

[coe]

Why don't you just use a 5-1/4x14 Parallam ?

This is what was specified by the structural engineers...and it has already been purchased/delivered.

 

[GTO]

This is what was specified by the structural engineers...and it has already been purchased/delivered.

The engineer is creating more labor for you.

 

[exmaxima1]

The Loctite PowerGrab heavy duty clear products provides 20 minutes of repositioning time.

Not sure which version you refer to, but the regular PowerGrab is the WORST glue I ever used. It peels off most anything: mdf, primed trim, plywood panels. I bought a case a few weeks ago, and returned it all for a refund.

I also tried their special adhesive for gluing bricks and let it cure for a week n the sun. After the first rain, the whole project just fell apart. PowerGrab just *****.

 

[readhead]

GTO, give it a rest. It is him and his dad. It is a lot easier to put up one piece at a time then one 400 pound parallam. Besides he already has the LVL's.
Most places will have LVL in stock. Beams will be a special order.

 

[tcianci]

For a change, this has been a thread with pretty good advice. The construction adhesive will do no good at all on a coated (and I've never seen one that wasn't) LVL beam. Also a good call on using 3 individual pieces because of the ease of installation. Lastly, you mention that a structural engineer specified the beam. Somewhere in his specification, there should be a fastening schedule, indicating the fasteners required and the spacing and other positioning information. If that information is not on your drawings, call the engineering company. There are screws made specifically for laminating LVL pieces together and they're available in the correct lengths depending on the number of LVL's you're stacking together. They drive easily with a cordless drill or impact driver. This is especially useful if you don't have a nail gun (if it was your plan to nail these buggers together) Nailing into LVL's is like trying to nail pieces of granite together.

 

[nicksnothereman]

Hey all! I have a question about construction adhesives. My dad and I are about to install a 14" LVL beam (22') for my new garage. The beam will be placed at a height of approximately 13 feet. Each of the 3 sections weigh approximately 115 lbs, so we are going to have to place each one individually and join them after they are placed. We would like to apply the construction adhesive to each section before raising it into position but we are not sure if we will have enough "work" time. So, my question is what brand of construction adhesive provides the longest work time? We have used Liquid Nails in the past, but if I recall correctly, it sets relatively fast. I'm aware that temperature and humidity significantly affect drying time (Charleston, SC, low 90's, humidity > 60%), so this will be a bit of a slightly unknown variable. Any suggestions/experiences are greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
~Ron

I'll use loctite over liquid nails any day of the week. As for working time...do it when they're placed. Technically, the simple adhesive tube stuff should still be tacky (i.e. not "dry") up to maybe an hour. Doesn't mean you just apply and leave it there for a while though. Which is why you should do it in place if possible.

 

[coe]

tcianci - I'm waiting on a repsonse from the engineers, thanks. Thanks to all...lots of good advice.

 

[CTyankee]

For a change, this has been a thread with pretty good advice. The construction adhesive will do no good at all on a coated (and I've never seen one that wasn't) LVL beam. Also a good call on using 3 individual pieces because of the ease of installation. Lastly, you mention that a structural engineer specified the beam. Somewhere in his specification, there should be a fastening schedule, indicating the fasteners required and the spacing and other positioning information. If that information is not on your drawings, call the engineering company. There are screws made specifically for laminating LVL pieces together and they're available in the correct lengths depending on the number of LVL's you're stacking together. They drive easily with a cordless drill or impact driver. This is especially useful if you don't have a nail gun (if it was your plan to nail these buggers together) Nailing into LVL's is like trying to nail pieces of granite together.

Even though impact drivers have been commonplace for years now, it's surprising that some folks still think of screws in terms of 3" drywall screws...or even deck screws for that matter...

 

[ozyborn]

When I did my garage. Since it was just a myself. I used LVL 24ft long. Nailed them together, then went back and used stainless bolts.

 

[coe]

Heard back from the engineer...

You should use 3-1/2” 16d common wire nails. 3 Rows across the board (bottom, middle, upper), nails @ 6 inches on center. Top row and bottom row should be 2” from the top and bottom edge of the board. Make sure you nail both sides.

 

[thewatusi]

Buy or rent a nail gun. Your forearms will thank you.

 

[GTO]

The engineer is a joke on this job,he not only has ever heard of a parallam,he has them nailing Lams together.
Ask him if he has ever heard of TrussLOK fasteners for engineered lumber.
and to coe,Parallams are in stock at any decent full service lumber yard,if you have ever been to one,no not HD or Lowes.
but I guess you probably already know that because you are in the business,right...

 

[coe]

I'm not in the business...I'm an embedded engineer...1's and 0's

 

[w33b8t1]

It's irrelevant for the most part. They are trying to keep the lvls together enough so there is no twisting, and a fairly even loading. For instance if one is slightly less than 14" it could, in theory become removed.

Just nail it well and be done. A triple 14" LVL is pretty serious, what are you trying to support?

 

[readhead]

The engineer is hardly a joke just because he didn't spec what you think is the best material.
Do you own stock in the company that makes parallam?
So I guess a GLB, wide flange, solid timber, tube steel, steel truss, wood truss or a log would be bad choices also?

 

[coe]

The LVL beam is supporting the (shed) roof.