Copper through concrete floor?

[spectre6000]

I have been trying to fix a water potability issue with my well in a ~100 year old house and matching well in the Rocky Mountains. At some point between 1936 (the applicable addition) and now, someone ran a 1" copper pipe from the well up through the floor in the mechanical room in the basement. At the time, this was probably considered perfectly fine, but they just poured concrete right up around the copper.

Fast forward to a few months ago. I was doing some work on the water treatment system, and the pipe sheared off at the foundation when I was attempting to remove a fitting down stream. It was as thin as a piece of paper, and tore about as easily. My baddass wife hammer drilled and dug the pipe out while I made up a replacement manifold, and we had nice hot showers prior to our regular bedtime.

Now it's time to close it back up, and it reads like code requires some sort of sleeve around the copper; probably to prevent the exact problem I experienced. What is this exactly supposed to be? I've read that it's intended to seal in/out water, allow for easier service, prevent corrosion from expansion of either the copper or the concrete, and prevent chemical interactions between the two. Some of these things are mutually exclusive, others aren't, but it's not at all clear what this sleeve is supposed to be or do... Can someone clue me in on how this is supposed to be done and with what?

 

[Red 17]

More info here: https://www.copper.org/applications/plumbing/techcorner/problem_embedding_copper_concrete.html

I used this stuff, which passed CA building inspection in 2003-2006:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/2-in-x-50-ft-20-Mil-Pipe-Wrap-Tape-53550/100179778

Not a plumber or electrician, but I played one briefly on my own house and garage. No leaks or fires yet.

 

[AA7483]

PVC is fine.

 

[finn]

Seems like modern systems use black poly water piper from the well to the inside of the building instead of copper.

Cheaper and more durable, plus frost burst resistant.

 

[spectre6000]

This has been exactly the sort of information I've been trying to figure out. I've seen the PVC + foam recommendation multiple times (among a laundry list of others from arguably less reputable sources), and that seems fairly simple. I'll have to cut the pipe into halves to fit around the pipe, but that seems pretty doable.

Seems like modern systems use black poly water piper from the well to the inside of the building instead of copper.

Cheaper and more durable, plus frost burst resistant.

Modern is not what I'm dealing with for the most part...There's black poly IN the well at the footer/pickup, but somewhere in depths unknown it switches to copper. I hope I don't have an occasion to find out the exact location of that connection any time soon...

 

[Dagny]

1936 I think it did well.

 

[ant.foste]

My entire freshwater plumbing distribution in Ahwatukee and Mesa, AZ was copper through slab in 1988 build's.

As for something I'd build today: It would be sleeved in PVC with a gap between the copper and PVC to allow room for expansion, contraction, and sheer. Fill the gap with foam or caulk and forgetaboutit.

 

[spectre6000]

1936 I think it did well.

That particular part of the house was built ca. 1936 (three bay garage to "fit three Model As" according to an 88 year old man who lived here and was 6 when it was built), but the concrete floor there is clearly not original to the 1936 pouring. No idea when it was done or how long it's been there. I don't believe there was water indoors until after 1944. The septic system, I've been told, looks to be ca. 50s/60s, so it could be contemporary with that... There are five separate additions to the house identified solely by obviously different masons/masonry phases, and there are others visible in woodwork, etc., plus major projects (like indoor plumbing for instance) that I'm still trying to unravel... It's a pretty awesome house that practically BLEEDS character, but getting some of these things sorted is going to take me a few years... at least.

 

[PoorOwner]

I also had a house built in the 80s the copper just come up from the driveway slab, didn't have any issues. I even cut and replaced the main shut off valve, sometimes the pipe will be misaligned and have to be forced back, that is evident the buried portion have moved, but no problem with this one.

What is a problem is the slab homes in 90s were they encased flexible copper roll in the slab. especially the hot water line cause the expansion and eventually a hole will rub through the copper and you get the slab leak issue.

I think they have improved the process with better sleeves and better copper.
The sleeve is supposed to protect the copper. But I have not hear of cold water having a problem. My guess is get a hold of one of these sleeves, use the thicker copper pipe for the portion in the concrete, and it would outlive you.

 

[brownbagg]

concrete loves to eat copper

 

[ZRX61]

Where I live (Ca) the copper through the slab just has some thick orange plastic sheet around it.

 

[Red 17]

The plumber who set up the waste lines and the main water in to my garage told me he wouldn't put the water under the slab. I could do it that way, but he would recommend against it. FWIW.

 

[DFB]

When I needed to put a coil copper line under my basement floor ran it thru black poly pipe (was local code too)

Ya a PVC sleeve is most often used for the opening to run piping thru concrete walls with new construction and I did mine that way

But tapered wood plugs were used many years ago for knockouts too. Like its been pointed out already and at least around here usually well run poly waterlines are brought inside the building line before they terminate and transition over to copper, and the sleeve plugged with hydraulic cement, but I have seen a lot different setups over the years.

 

[Falcon67]

Our house has copper - looks like they used foam insulation wrap for any pipes coming up through the slab.

 

[nh_yota]

My parent's previous house (the one I grew up in) was built in 1975 and portions of the copper piping for the fin tube hot water radiators ran through/under the concrete on the ground floor. The overall construction of the house was shoddy and we figured that the copper piping under the slab would start leaking one day but they sold the house last year.