Correct way to rotate tires

[PoorOwner]

What is the correct way to rotate tires without a lift just a hydraulic jack and 4 jackstands?

If you jack from the side rail points where the jackstand is meant to go, wouldn't that crush or fold over the rail there.. see this on older cars alot.

 

[boseefus402]

I put the jackstands where the control arms tie into the body for unibody cars.

 

[metaleltr]

Jack up both ends and place 4 jackstands, but you need to know where it is safe to put them. Do not jack or put jackstands on the pinch welds. What kind of car do you have?

 

[PoorOwner]

so.. on the side where you use a the spare tire scissor jack is not supposed place jackstands?

I was thinking of jacking up the front and place 2 jackstands and then the back and place 2 jackstands, on the side rails as usual. I have done it on my old cars before.

I just have a typical japanese unibody car.

 

[Terry454]

There is a good chance your Owner's Manual will have a diagram of the safe jack points on your car. If the OM is missing or they don't show the jack points look very carefully for sound structurial members. Front and rear suspension can be good points, but one must be careful as the lower suspension will move in an arc as weight is put on them. This can tilt the jack stands and cause hazardous jack stand movement or collapse. Be careful.

Also check you owner's manual for proper tire rotation. FWD will be different than RWD.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=43

 

[PoorOwner]

Owner's manual only showed how to use the scissor jack to put on a spare tire.
It does not have the vehicle and support points circled. I was quite amazed how new cars are assuming you can't do anything at home.

I was only able to find such a diagram in the SERVICE MANUAL which you have to pay for.

 

[metaleltr]

What make and model, i may be able to find something to show you where to jack and support the car.

 

[e-tek]

Just use a 2x4 or something so the jack point is the same as the scissor jack spot. Once you get one corner off the ground, place a JS there and jack the other end, same side, then swap the tires on that side.

 

[Stuart in MN]

What make, model and year is the car?

 

[Kevin54]

I always just jack one side at a time. Find the midpoint and raise the vehicle, loosening the wheels before it goes up. Pull both off, swap them out, snug them up and on to the other side. After all four are swapped, torque all four, run it down the road, then come back and retorque.

 

[sberry]

Not sure how one can rotate correctly with one side at a time?

 

[Gary S]

I use my floor jack. Jack up one corner at a time and replace that tire, and then move on to the next corner.
Remember, you have 5 tires for a vehicle, and only 4 need to be rotated, so the spare takes care of you during rotation.

 

[PoorOwner]

It's a Mitsu Outlander (similar to Lancer platform)

I was able to find this picture in the factory service manual but not owner's manual.

I am only going to rotate front to back because I have had bad experience with noises and wear with cross rotate?

 

[BrokewrenchLS1]

If cross-rotation is causing problems with noise and wear, you've got alignment/suspension issues that need to be dealt with.

Jack the front up at the nose, put jack stands under the front control arms where they mount to the subframe. Jack the rear up at the center spot, then put jack stands under the frame where the picture shows. Don't put jack stands under the trailing arms on the rear wheels - seen that done a few times and it never ends well.

 

[rlitman]

Not sure how one can rotate correctly with one side at a time?

With directional tires, that is the only option.

 

[EOC_Jason]

Even today a lot of places have stopped cross-rotating non-directional tires. Something about the belting in the tire and when you reverse the direction it can cause problems... I guess it's more of chalking it up to cheaper designed tires than the good old tires of yesteryear that would last 100k miles...

 

[PoorOwner]

If cross-rotation is causing problems with noise and wear, you've got alignment/suspension issues that need to be dealt with.

Jack the front up at the nose, put jack stands under the front control arms where they mount to the subframe. Jack the rear up at the center spot, then put jack stands under the frame where the picture shows. Don't put jack stands under the trailing arms on the rear wheels - seen that done a few times and it never ends well.

Why can't I put jackstands on the side on the front?
Sure there is a little of pivoting action when you lift the rear side. But that or you pivot it around the control arm.

I always hated to crawl deep into a bigger vehicles to place jackstands or get them while the thing is held up by the jack.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Personally, I don't care which way you rotate them as long as you stay consistent and do it the same way every time(not counting directional tires). Our vehicles, I rotate front to back and criss cross the rears.

 

[djd99]

I don't understand why so many people would suggest putting a jackstand under the front control arm, I will always place my jackstands directly behind the control arm on the engine cradle where your jackstand has a solid flat surface to sit on. If you put the jackstand under the control arm there's more chance for it to slip out if the car is bumped.

Put the rear jackstand either on the traction arm mount or pinch weld witchever your car manual says is best.

Jack up 1 side at a time and do that side then repeat.

I've done framework for the past 15 years and I tie the cars down with there pinch welds, there extremely strong, strong enough I've never destroyed a pinch weld and I've put several thousand pounds of force on them.

Side note I have a 4 post Continental frame machine for sale.......

 

[BrokewrenchLS1]

I don't understand why so many people would suggest putting a jackstand under the front control arm, I will always place my jackstands directly behind the control arm on the engine cradle where your jackstand has a solid flat surface to sit on. If you put the jackstand under the control arm there's more chance for it to slip out if the car is bumped.

Depends on the car when I do it, normally - sometimes going to the base of the control arm is easier/allows more access underneath the car, but I normally try to go to the front subframe close to where the control arms bolt up. On my Sunfire, I go to the front subframe cross-bar instead.

Why can't I put jackstands on the side on the front?
Sure there is a little of pivoting action when you lift the rear side. But that or you pivot it around the control arm.

I always hated to crawl deep into a bigger vehicles to place jackstands or get them while the thing is held up by the jack.

You could put them under the frame on both sides - I like a slightly wider stance between the jack stands, since the car can get a bit wobbly if the car isn't very long and the stands are put inboard of the wheels at the frame.

 

[metaleltr]

I don't understand why so many people would suggest putting a jackstand under the front control arm, I will always place my jackstands directly behind the control arm on the engine cradle where your jackstand has a solid flat surface to sit on. If you put the jackstand under the control arm there's more chance for it to slip out if the car is bumped.

Put the rear jackstand either on the traction arm mount or pinch weld witchever your car manual says is best.

Jack up 1 side at a time and do that side then repeat.

I've done framework for the past 15 years and I tie the cars down with there pinch welds, there extremely strong, strong enough I've never destroyed a pinch weld and I've put several thousand pounds of force on them.

Side note I have a 4 post Continental frame machine for sale.......

Pinch welds are very strong when you use the appropriate clamps to attach to them as found on a frame rack, but they are not designed to support the weight of the car. I have seen many damage pinchwelds from where cars have been lifted by their pinchwelds.

This is the kind of damage that can occur from lifting at the pinchweld.

 

[djd99]

Pinch welds are very strong when you use the appropriate clamps to attach to them as found on a frame rack, but they are not designed to support the weight of the car. I have seen many damage pinchwelds from where cars have been lifted by their pinchwelds.

This is the kind of damage that can occur from lifting at the pinchweld.

Yes you are correct but there are some cars that are designed to jack from the pinch weld, as I recall the jacks that came with these cars had a flat top with a groove in the middle.

Excellent picture by the way I have seen several cars with pushed up rockers and pinch welds because the tech would try to hoist the cars up on then and they caved just like your picture. Also the pic you showed had a very weak pinch from the factory used common sense.

 

[bd8134]

As Jack S has said, why bother with jack stands if you are just rotating tires. You are making more work for yourself, use the spare.

 

[gayler]

Not sure how one can rotate correctly with one side at a time?

Me either. You should always cross the driving wheels and move them to the front or rear depending on where the drivers are.

 

[sberry]

I don't know everything thats for sure but last manual I look at showed move fronts to back, cross the rears put on front. I had one last week act funny when backs went on front, had to put them back, they are on the downside anyway and figured it was an issue with the tire. I would be willing to be educated on directional tires.

Normally wobbles are tires, wear may be alignment or suspension.

 

[luvit]

...I would be willing to be educated on directional tires.

i bought some directional tires as an oversight... they were too good of a price to turn down.
if you move the rear passenger-side wheel to the front driver-side then the grooves go the wrong way... not optimal for this tire's water displacement design.
--You can only move the tires from front to back (same side of the car).

....

 

[PoorOwner]

i bought some directional tires as an oversight... they were too good of a price to turn down.
if you move the rear passenger-side wheel to the front driver-side then the grooves go the wrong way... not optimal for this tire's water displacement design.
--You can only move the tires from front to back (same side of the car).

....

Chances are, the directional tires is of performance nature and they wear out fast enough e.g. 10-20k miles before you can rotate them more than a few times, so it's a moot point how exactly you rotated them.

 

[metaleltr]

40K? Wow we usually won't use a tire with less than a 70,000mi rating. But they are also truck tires.

 

[PoorOwner]

Has anyone used this adapter on their jack.
Good or bad? It will simulate the scissor jack's shape.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230741040902

 

[sberry]

Ok, got it, thank you.

 

[BrokewrenchLS1]

Chances are, the directional tires is of performance nature and they wear out fast enough e.g. 10-20k miles before you can rotate them more than a few times, so it's a moot point how exactly you rotated them.

A lot of non-performance tires have directional tread now, since it helps with traction in rain and snow, and even general dry pavement manners. They're normally the more expensive "premium" tires a manufacturer makes, though.

20,000 miles would be a lot out of a set of tires for me - I get 5-6,000 out of a set of drag radials with very minimal burnouts (smoking rubber is just burning money, and those tires are not cheap).

On the daily, I don't buy based on mileage claims. High-mileage tires are normally hard as a rock and ride like ****, so I set my price range and read as many reviews as I can before I buy a set of tires. I've had very good luck with Hankook Mileage Plus H725s, which are "rated" at 50,000 miles but ride and handle well for passenger car rubber.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Has anyone used this adapter on their jack.
Good or bad? It will simulate the scissor jack's shape.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230741040902

That will work fine. A DIY option is to cut a slot in a short chunk of 2x4, put that on the jack pad, and use it to lift the car at the pinchweld.

 

[ra42mario]

I just love all the misinformation on car topics on the forum

 

[signcrafter]

I just love all the misinformation on car topics on the forum

Instead of critisizing and not helping clear up the misinformation why don't you offer correct information to help others out?

 

[Steevo]

I rotate mine by driving up to where I bought them, and waiting for my free rotation.
'nuff said.

And I thought all radial tires were rotated front-to-back on the same side of a vehicle, not across or diagonally?

 

[Lotek]

Put the jackstands at the pinchweld on this car, the points are marked in your diagram. Don't ever use wooden blocks between jackstands and the body, they could slip or split. Don't jack it up in the middle of the sill to lift one side, it isn't strong enough. set it up on all four jackstands and give it a shake before you pull the wheels...just in case. Be safe, if it doesn't look right, it probably isn't.

 

[PoorOwner]

Put the jackstands at the pinchweld on this car, the points are marked in your diagram. Don't ever use wooden blocks between jackstands and the body, they could slip or split. Don't jack it up in the middle of the sill to lift one side, it isn't strong enough. set it up on all four jackstands and give it a shake before you pull the wheels...just in case. Be safe, if it doesn't look right, it probably isn't.

Kind of what I had been doing, on my used cars that have busted pinch welds anyway.. my thinking is the pinch weld area is good for 1/4 of the weight of the vehicle but gets iffy when you try any more weight on it.

 

[Lotek]

In the right place the pinchwelds should be strong enough, supposedly on yours there are a pair of bolts in each corner to help you locate the jack stand. Having had a car fall on me when I was a kid(fortunately the drivetrain was out of it) I take it kind of seriously.

 

[BrokewrenchLS1]

I rotate mine by driving up to where I bought them, and waiting for my free rotation.
'nuff said.

And I thought all radial tires were rotated front-to-back on the same side of a vehicle, not across or diagonally?

I thought it was normally right front to right rear, left front to left front, right rear to left front, and left rear to right front? As long as all the tires are wearing properly, I don't think it would make much difference with non-directional tires all the same size.

 

[AZ Pete]

I thought it was normally right front to right rear, left front to left front, right rear to left front, and left rear to right front? As long as all the tires are wearing properly, I don't think it would make much difference with non-directional tires all the same size.

That would be correct for a front wheel drive vehicle, according to Michelin.