Correcting Ridge Board + Rafter Separation

[FortuneFavorsTheBruin]

Hi Y'all,

Closing on a house here in TX and in our contract, we specified that the roof be repaired and the frame be fixed. You'll notice the ridge board cracked and there is some rafter separation.

To verify this is fixed, what would be the correct method to ensure the roof stops sagging? Below is a picture from my inspector's report; I know that the roof has already been replaced, but now I need evidence that the ridge and rafters have been corrected.

 

[DennisK59]

Walls are bowed, collar tie is too high up to do any good.

 

[DGersic]

It looks like somebody installed more wood. Has a “qualified professional“ been involved? A work order specifying repairs to be done, a receipt for payment, are probably the best you can hope for.

 

[jack stand]

Have your original inspector re inspect.
To correct it 100% would be too much for the seller and they'll wait for some other offer.
They put the "icing" on a shifty cake. (Shingles/roof framing)
It appears that the shingles and sheathing has to come off and the majority of the roof framing replaced with new and larger rafters. Then as mentioned above the "settling" roof usually results with the top plate of the walls spreading that may need further corrections.
Is this priced accordingly as a fixer upper?

 

[mike93lx]

Walls are bowed, collar tie is too high up to do any good.

Collar ties don't do anything for the walls. They are solely for preventing spreading at the ridge from uplift and need to be in the upper third of the rafter span. Looks like they are there but installed after the fact, so the problem likely already existed.

Rafter ties keep the walls from spreading and need to be in the bottom third

 

[BobnCO]

Put some Simpson hangers on them and move on. Glue and screw some plywood on each side of the ridge board if it makes you feel better where it is cracked, but it is not going anywhere. I would not expect them to fully rebuild the roof to Garage Journal engineers standards. Homes sell with old less than ideal framing all the time (probably ever framed roof prior to the mid 60’s).

 

[Bert_]

The ridge board should serve no structural purpose once it's built. Just makes it easier during the build.

There's no reason for that gap to open up. There's no force pulling it that way. Could have been that way since day 1.

There might be other real issues causing what these pictures show. This stuff by itself would not worry me.

 

[WNYflyer]

The ridge board should serve no structural purpose once it's built. Just makes it easier during the build.

There's no reason for that gap to open up. There's no force pulling it that way. Could have been that way since day 1.

There might be other real issues causing what these pictures show. This stuff by itself would not worry me.

Wind uplift can cause that thus code requirements of either collar ties within the upper third or metal straps over top tying rafters to each other.

 

[firebirdparts]

The root problem is not clear to me. I think you might be able to get some visual band-aid activity around that, but I don't think anybody is going to unsag that roof. I kinda suspect Dennis K is correct, but of course we can't see that here.

It's possible the root cause could be stopped if somebody could figure out what happened.

 

[FortuneFavorsTheBruin]

I know that everybody on the internet is a certified structural engineer (The walls are not bowed, I've literally been in the house and had inspectors check) but it is a 1952 build so I figure there is a happy medium for me to feel good about the repairs done.

The roof ridge does sag in 2 places, and it has been sagging for as long as google street view has been around (11 years) so I am leaning more towards needing legal advice than structural at this point, but I do appreciate the garage journal input (For the most part).

 

[mike93lx]

I know that everybody on the internet is a certified structural engineer (The walls are not bowed, I've literally been in the house and had inspectors check) but it is a 1952 build so I figure there is a happy medium for me to feel good about the repairs done.

The roof ridge does sag in 2 places, and it has been sagging for as long as google street view has been around (11 years) so I am leaning more towards needing legal advice than structural at this point, but I do appreciate the garage journal input (For the most part).

Legal advice for an exisiting issue on a house you don't own?

We got you!

 

[FortuneFavorsTheBruin]

Hahaha fair enough, i should delete this thread anyways.

 

[mike93lx]

Hahaha fair enough, i should delete this thread anyways.

If you report it, a mod can help

 

[larry4406]

Hahaha fair enough, i should delete this thread anyways.

If you report it, a mod can help

Don't delete the thread.

Its like burning a library after the initial reader is satisfied. I hate this.

Plenty of good info to help someone another day.

OP - I hope the purchase goes thru ok!

 

[mike93lx]

Don't delete the thread.

Its like burning a library after the initial reader is satisfied. I hate this.

Plenty of good info to help someone another day.

OP - I hope the purchase goes thru ok!

I generally agree, but if there is a legit legal issue, then I'd say deleting may be prudent

 

[mm08822]

In 75 years lots of things happen:

• lumber mis-cut during build
• rafters dry out/shrink/warp
• rafters can bow under weight
• joists can separate from top plate
• opposing joists may not be tied adequately
• walls can bow outward
• foundation could settle

To make it look even worse, there appears to be a high spot in the ridge before the depression.

More important that it is done moving.

In much older houses, this is called character.

 

[firebirdparts]

I know that everybody on the internet is a certified structural engineer (The walls are not bowed, I've literally been in the house and had inspectors check) but it is a 1952 build so I figure there is a happy medium for me to feel good about the repairs done.

The roof ridge does sag in 2 places, and it has been sagging for as long as google street view has been around (11 years) so I am leaning more towards needing legal advice than structural at this point, but I do appreciate the garage journal input (For the most part).

it's possible (and I guess not unusual) that the roof sagged without bowing the walls. Attaching rafter ends to the top of a wall is quite difficult to do firmly anyway. Joining wood is really just not easy when you are trying to attach to the board narrow edge. Simpson makes some products for that now, but of course not back then. FWIW.

It's much easier to attach rafter ends to a ceiling joist, flat on flat, with nails in shear. That you can do, and that's what is normally done. In this thread we just have no idea what that part of the building looks like.

 

[bdbecker]

Maybe I haven't had enough coffee yet, but if I'm reading correctly you want to know what a proper repair would entail so you can double-check the work done by the contractor the seller hired? As evidenced by the replies so far, there is more than one way to skin this cat (beyond that, some question whether or not the cat even needs to be skinned, while others think it might actually be a raccoon you want to skin). Other than walking away from the deal, you won't have much recourse if the repairs have already been made, assuming they hired a "qualified professional" to do the work.

Scenarios like this are why I personally prefer to use issues like this as a bargaining chip to lower the price on the front end so I can make the repairs myself (either DIY or through a contractor of my choice), rather than leaving it in the hands of a seller who typically wants to spend as little as possible to resolve the issue. We went through a similar scenario with the house we bought last summer - had to rip off 5 year old shingles to address structural issues underneath. Even though repairing the roof was expensive, we were still able to get the house way under market value because of it. If we decided to sell tomorrow, we'd still make money on the place.

If you really want the house, the only thing you can really do now is to let the deal go through and keep an eye on the repaired area for any changes. If it's still bugging you when it's time to have the shingles replaced, make sure to budget to have the decking pulled and the structure evaluated/repaired at that time.

 

[danfromsyr]

In 75 years lots of things happen:

• lumber mis-cut during build
• rafters dry out/shrink/warp
• rafters can bow under weight
• joists can separate from top plate
• opposing joists may not be tied adequately
• walls can bow outward
• foundation could settle

To make it look even worse, there appears to be a high spot in the ridge before the depression.

More important that it is done moving.

In much older houses, this is called character.

my 1890s kitchun addition has the full list of 'character'
with the added bonus of the floor having a 1-12 pitch
well it does drop 1in over each 3ft anyways.. for the 18ft length..
guy who laid the foundation used a string line but not a level..

the built in cabinets were a masterpiece of funhouse angles to fit and work in a varied slope & height of the ceiling to floor.

I still have wood shingles under the 3layers of ancient asphalt shingle
so do I go after the previous owner of 49yrs.

to fix it right requires taking it to the foundation and adding up onto the 'cobbled and rubble' stone foundation.
I doubt any AHJ would approve any new build on such an old base.

take the roof off and raise the wall plates.. heh..
then the town would want me to bring up to current building codes... double heh..

 

[danfromsyr]

to add in on the fun in my structure.
there are 3 rooms down the 1story 'wing'
1890 Kitchen closest to the main structure.
1930 mudroom next
1958 garage built from the remains of the collapsed 1800s timber barn

from outside the mudroom roof sits higher where it connects to the later added garage.
from inside the garage it's obviously tacked on and set on top of the mudrooms previous roof.

I am not looking forward to trying to correct the century of clapped on phukery
I may just strap it and add a metal roof.
punt the issue to the next owner.
as said it won't pass a finicky owner or inspection anyways..
will be a as is and as it always has been sale.

 

[OldDoItAll]

Judging by that vertical piece of lumber the ridge board was used to remove the sag from the roof. If the current hump is in the same location they went too far, leading to the split in the ridge, the separation of the rafter from the ridge, and the hump in the roof. The ridge board is not a load-bearing member and should not be used as such.
Support under the rafters themselves should have been used to raise them to remove the hump. They should have then been braced with angled braces from the rafters to a load-bearing area of the ceiling joists.