Craftsman Drill Press

[drokihazan]

Welcome!

The pictures help a lot. It does appear to be in pretty good condition. The motor is much earlier than the drill press tho; ~pre-1950 vs '63-'66.

You haven't disclosed your location... that can make a difference in price.

IF there are no missing parts, and IF runout is acceptable, and IF it meets your needs, IMO, that asking price is not out of line. I'd keep inching up from your offer until he accepts.

Ah, well. I might have even offered him his asking price of $145 for it - I'm in the Bay Area where everything is ludicrously expensive - but it appears the listing is gone, so someone else has snagged it already.

 

[row.inc]

Would the following McMaster Carr spring work for the 150 DP return spring? It seems close to the specs I can find: https://www.mcmaster.com/9654K327/?SrchEntryWebPart_InpBox=spring

 

[FrankLee]

Ah, well. I might have even offered him his asking price of $145 for it - I'm in the Bay Area where everything is ludicrously expensive - but it appears the listing is gone, so someone else has snagged it already.

Bummer.

Would the following McMaster Carr spring work for the 150 DP return spring? It seems close to the specs I can find: https://www.mcmaster.com/9654K327/?SrchEntryWebPart_InpBox=spring

It just might. The diameter is good, the wire gauge is slightly larger, the wind direction looks correct and the length is 1/4" longer.

The drill press spring is a torsion spring with some extension spring properties. I have no idea whether there are any engineering specs that differ between torsion and extension springs.

I believe the extra 1/4" length can be managed with a short tube slipped over the spring pin in the head frame and an o-ring on the pinion shaft abutting the hub.

Those are cheap enough that I'm going to order some and give it a try!


Spring related posts:
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6347474
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=8335195

 

[11b30b4]

Agreed, at 13.00 for six springs, its worth a try and please let us know if they work for you.

 

[Hoorn]

Frank, I have questions about two separate items.
On your keeper drill press with the multi-speed attachment, I assume with all the drill presses you have run across you have had access to the vari-slow, why do you prefer the multi-speed attachment instead?

I noted a picture you had with the linked belts
somewhere along this ever growing thread, and then you had put an addendum that you no longer supported using a linked belt, and stick with a cog. What was your negative experience with a linked belt?

 

[FrankLee]

Frank, I have questions about two separate items.
On your keeper drill press with the multi-speed attachment, I assume with all the drill presses you have run across you have had access to the vari-slow, why do you prefer the multi-speed attachment instead?

I've had three V-S attachments. In my opinion and in my experiences, the V-S is too finicky and too fragile. One of the three I had was broken. They could have been designed much better and more robust. The V-S attachments I had did sell well. Many folks swear by them; I swear at them. YMMV.

I like the simplicity of the MSA. I keep my machine at the slowest possible speed with the MSA and rarely change speeds. It does everything I need.

I noted a picture you had with the linked belts
somewhere along this ever growing thread, and then you had put an addendum that you no longer supported using a linked belt, and stick with a cog. What was your negative experience with a linked belt?

In my preamble ramble in post #1, I stated "Some things I used or did early in my experience have changed.". Linked belts are one of many of those things. I believe the linked belts are a tad wider and more coarse than traditional v-belts. IMO, they are fine for machines/motors with single-step pulleys. With multi-step pulleys, I believe the edge of link belts scrape the larger adjacent pulley step. Because of their coarseness, I believe they can wear on the relatively soft pulleys. Again, YMMV.

 

[Hoorn]

Frank, thank you for your detailed response. You'd be surprised to know how many people I've met via OfferUp that reference you in particular and this thread, as part of our ongoing education with the CDP.

I think part of the allure of this great machine is that it is in fact so simple, and yet just complex enough to give men a sense of accomplishment when they restore or repair it. Since many of today's tools are made so poorly and overseas, men are reaching back to the past when quality mattered; and not just quality, but when as much thought as "what" the tool looks like went into it as how it would perform. It certainly has style. While more modern drill presses come with virtually all the bells and whistles as standard, such as a light, ability to hand crank the table up and down, on/off switch in front, etc, they look downright ugly in comparison. The very next generation Emerson that followed the 150 is absolutely hideous. And of course, these old DPs can perform just as well and in some cases better, than a modern DP.
This is not the case for all "old tools" as I wouldn't dream of using a 1960s corded drill when I can reach for my DeWalt cordless.

So thank you again Frank, for helping me and so many others use your detailed explanations and advice to work on these great machines. I dont think you realized, when you started this thread so many years ago, the positive impact it would have on so many. With threads getting washed away so quickly on GJ because of volume, this one faithfully remains near page 1 all the time..

 

[row.inc]

Regarding the McMaster Carr springs. I just received a pack of the springs Frank and 11b30b4: If you haven't already ordered some let me know and I'll send you one to try out. Mine is still so much apart that it will be a while till I can try it.

 

[FrankLee]

Frank, thank you for your detailed response. You'd be surprised to know how many people I've met via OfferUp that reference you in particular and this thread, as part of our ongoing education with the CDP.

I think part of the allure of this great machine is that it is in fact so simple, and yet just complex enough to give men a sense of accomplishment when they restore or repair it. Since many of today's tools are made so poorly and overseas, men are reaching back to the past when quality mattered; and not just quality, but when as much thought as "what" the tool looks like went into it as how it would perform. It certainly has style. While more modern drill presses come with virtually all the bells and whistles as standard, such as a light, ability to hand crank the table up and down, on/off switch in front, etc, they look downright ugly in comparison. The very next generation Emerson that followed the 150 is absolutely hideous. And of course, these old DPs can perform just as well and in some cases better, than a modern DP.
This is not the case for all "old tools" as I wouldn't dream of using a 1960s corded drill when I can reach for my DeWalt cordless.

So thank you again Frank, for helping me and so many others use your detailed explanations and advice to work on these great machines. I dont think you realized, when you started this thread so many years ago, the positive impact it would have on so many. With threads getting washed away so quickly on GJ because of volume, this one faithfully remains near page 1 all the time..

Thanks very much.

No, I had no idea this thread would go this far, but there have been many contributions and lots of participation.

 

[FrankLee]

Regarding the McMaster Carr springs. I just received a pack of the springs Frank and 11b30b4: If you haven't already ordered some let me know and I'll send you one to try out. Mine is still so much apart that it will be a while till I can try it.

Thanks. My springs arrived ~1:00 pm today and I was able to complete some preliminary testing.


I don't have an oe spring to compare, but I do have an earlier spring with the single loop.

​

Everything looks pretty good and as expected, the substitute spring is a bit longer. Below is the spring installed in the hub/pinion.

​

Below is the hub/pinion/spring assembly installed in a head casting. This casting is an Emerson gen 3/gen 4, but the hub/pinion/spring assembly is the same back to the 150 series.

Notice the gap between the hub and head casting. The oe spring draws the hub inward. Not shown is the fiber thrust washer.

​

There are at least two options to address the extra spring length; re-drill the pinion or add a spacer on the pinion.

The pinion shaft is 1-1/4" diameter. I had a couple 1-1/4" plumbing drain compression washers. The narrow washer on the left fit and worked quite well.

​

With a spacer, there is another issue. The spacer causes the teeth of the pinion gear to retract somewhat from the quill gear rack. I'm not sure how much of an issue this could be yet. Maybe more prone to breaking teeth off the pinion gear during high torque feed?

​

A sideways video:

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/v5W49ARdYNs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


I cycled the quill feed several times and did not see any distortion of the loop on the spring.

​

I'll complete more testing tomorrow, but I think this spring is a winner!




3/13/2021

Today's test involved re-drilling the pinion shaft which was pretty straight forward. I drilled a new 9/32" through-hole 1/4" away horizontally from the original hole. I cut the original pin to allow the hub to pass over the pin when installed. If I were doing this for real, I'd drill a 1/4" through hole and cut a new 1/4" diameter pin.

I then then tapped the original holes to 5/16-18. The original through-hole is 9/32" which is over-sized for tapping 5/16-18, but still deep enough threads for a 3/8" long set screw. If I were doing this for real, I'd use a blue thread locker on the set screws. This way, it can all go back to stock if necessary.

​

So now the test.

The installation was the same as any other hub/pinion/spring assembly. I installed the quill assembly and tensioned the spring. IIRC, it took 2-1/2 to 3 hub revolutions to get the spring tensioned correctly. It took another ~1-1/2 revolutions to fully extend the quill. So that's about 4-1/2 revolutions total. After several cycles of extending the quill, I'm pleased with these results. It's looking very good.


So, the next test. How many revolutions can the spring tolerate before failure?

I removed the quill and with the spring at rest, I rotated the hub 5 times before the loop over the roll pin failed. The other loop inside the pinion shaft was still intact. Five revolutions is too close to the 4-1/2 revolutions needed for normal installation and use.

​

Next, I bent the loop back and tucked the end behind the crook of the original bend at the barrel.

​

I reinstalled the assembly and was able to rotate the hub 7 times before failure. This time, though, the loops of the spring did not fail, the loop simply slipped off of the roll pin.

The diameter of the spring wire is 0.080. Every revolution of the spring lengthens the barrel of the spring by 0.080. After 7 revolutions, the spring was 0.560" longer than at rest. That's more than 1/2" ! So, it's not surprising that the loop slipped off the pin.

I'm calling this a win.

Another factor to consider is that quill feed on 2nd gen Emerson machines is ~6". That is probably close to another full hub revolution to fully extend the quill over other machines.

 

[Outlawmws]

Frank, maybe try a sacrificial spring and cut the unneeded loops off and bend one or two up?

 

[Indexmill]

Frank, maybe try a sacrificial spring and cut the unneeded loops off and bend one or two up?

Exactly what I was thinking.

 

[FrankLee]

Frank, maybe try a sacrificial spring and cut the unneeded loops off and bend one or two up?

Exactly what I was thinking.

I've always found it difficult to bend springs in that direction, but that might work too. I posted more testing results above and may try that.

 

[AtlasRearden]

Is the flat surface of these two rings (the column hole and chuck wrench holder) typically painted or left bare metal?

 

[FrankLee]

Is the flat surface of these two rings (the column hole and chuck wrench holder) typically painted or left bare metal?

I believe they were painted from the factory. I always sand them bare on that style table. That ring on tilt tables were not milled, so I leave that painted.

 

[Moonshine78]

Hi everyone,

I’m new here and just yesterday picked up a craftsman 150 after reading many posts on this site. It seems I am in thigh to place for expertise on these machines and would greatly appreciate any advise.

I came across a very clean machine with the multi speed spindle. I paid 300, which I know is a bit above market, but I really liked the machine, I live in an expensive part of the country, and the seller was a nice guy who collects classic craftsman tools.

When I arrived, I did some basic checks of the machine. Unfortunately it was not original motor, and it was missing one of the two belts needed for the multi speed. The motor has no markings so I have absolutely no idea what hp or even rpm (hopefully 1750). Seems to run well though.

So now to my questions. This evening I unloaded and reassembled everything. The first thing I noticed was that the spring force on the handle seems to push down instead of up. I thought maybe it was the weight, but it really seems like a spring force. Is it possible it could be installed backward somehow?

Issue/question number 2: the multispeed spindle seems to have a completely shot bearing. There is resistance when turning it and it has sort of a backlash feel when I change rotation directions. Assuming I need to replace the bearing(s), could anyone let me know the size (and a quality supplier), as well as a good way to remove the current one? I took it apart as well as could already (see pics).

Any help would be hugely appreciated. I’m really excited about this machine and I love the classic American quality.

Edit: for the return spring I realized that the adjustment knob was completely untightened. I dialed it up several turns and locked it. Seems good now.

 

[Cruzan80]

Re: The Classic Craftsman 100/150 Drill Press

Try wiping off the outside of the bearing and see if there are numbers there. Probably a 620# bearing. ZZ means shielded, 2RS means sealed. I usually just get Nachi off Amazon for a one-off.

Sent from my IN2015 using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[Moonshine78]

Re: The Classic Craftsman 100/150 Drill Press

I will see if i can figure out how to get it out. Thanks for the info.

 

[Cruzan80]

Re: The Classic Craftsman 100/150 Drill Press

Have you tried tapping the shaft out, and seeing if the bearing comes out with it?

Sent from my IN2015 using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[Moonshine78]

Re: The Classic Craftsman 100/150 Drill Press

Ok, so it’s a 2x stack of Hoover 77204. Should be able to find something. I was able to tap the shaft and bearings out of the spindle but the don’t seem to want to budge from the shaft. I shot some PB blaster around the shaft. Will keep trying.

 

[Outlawmws]

The shaft may need to be pressed off. If it is a press fit, heat the inner races of the new bearings in hot oil and them install them. MUCH easier...

 

[FrankLee]

Hi everyone,

I’m new here and just yesterday picked up a craftsman 150 after reading many posts on this site. It seems I am in thigh to place for expertise on these machines and would greatly appreciate any advise.

I came across a very clean machine with the multi speed spindle. I paid 300, which I know is a bit above market, but I really liked the machine, I live in an expensive part of the country, and the seller was a nice guy who collects classic craftsman tools.

When I arrived, I did some basic checks of the machine. Unfortunately it was not original motor, and it was missing one of the two belts needed for the multi speed. The motor has no markings so I have absolutely no idea what hp or even rpm (hopefully 1750). Seems to run well though.

So now to my questions. This evening I unloaded and reassembled everything. The first thing I noticed was that the spring force on the handle seems to push down instead of up. I thought maybe it was the weight, but it really seems like a spring force. Is it possible it could be installed backward somehow?

Issue/question number 2: the multispeed spindle seems to have a completely shot bearing. There is resistance when turning it and it has sort of a backlash feel when I change rotation directions. Assuming I need to
replace the bearing(s), could anyone let me know the size (and a quality supplier), as well as a good way to remove the current one? I took it apart as well as could already (see pics).

Any help would be hugely appreciated. I’m really excited about this machine and I love the classic American quality.

Edit: for the return spring I realized that the adjustment knob was completely untightened. I dialed it up several turns and locked it. Seems good now.

Firstly, welcome!

That is a great looking machine! The table surface looks perfect! Because the seller is a Craftsman guy, do you think he refurbished it any? IMO, the price was not out of line considering the condition and the MSA.

Good that the spring issue was an easy fix.

I've never replaced bearings on an MSA, but they are very tightly pressed on. My only suggestion is to measure the location of the bearings relative to the ends of the shaft. You'll want to get the new bearings as close to the original location as possible. The bottom of the shaft should be flush with the bottom of its base. The bottom of the pulley should be just above the top of the base.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=4870269



Please post more photos of the motor.

.

 

[Moonshine78]

I don’t think the seller did any refurb, but it’s possible the guy he bought it from did.

I have included more pics of the motor. I pulled it off and took a closer look. It actually does have a plate with info. It’s a 1/4 hp. Would have preferred a bit higher but if it handles my tasks, I am fine with it. Plus I suppose I could change it out in the future if I ever want to. I don’t know how these aftermarket motor stack up to the original CM motors as far as quality.

Back to the multi speed spindle bearings. I don’t have an arbor press to push them off the shaft. I am thinking that the vicious resistance might just be old lube? The rotation is smooth, just not free spinning. My plan now is to try cleaning out and replacing the lube and see if that fixes it. The shields are crimped, so I pried them out with a can opener tool on a multi tool. Now I will try to figure out a good way to degrease. Then apply new grease. I would also need to see if anywhere sells rubber seals to replace the crimped ones, assuming the regressing works. If not, it will be back to the replacement route.

 

[FrankLee]

I don’t think the seller did any refurb, but it’s possible the guy he bought it from did.

I have included more pics of the motor. I pulled it off and took a closer look. It actually does have a plate with info. It’s a 1/4 hp. Would have preferred a bit higher but if it handles my tasks, I am fine with it. Plus I suppose I could change it out in the future if I ever want to. I don’t know how these aftermarket motor stack up to the original CM motors as far as quality.

Back to the multi speed spindle bearings. I don’t have an arbor press to push them off the shaft. I am thinking that the vicious resistance might just be old lube? The rotation is smooth, just not free spinning. My plan now is to try cleaning out and replacing the lube and see if that fixes it. The shields are crimped, so I pried them out with a can opener tool on a multi tool. Now I will try to figure out a good way to degrease. Then apply new grease. I would also need to see if anywhere sells rubber seals to replace the crimped ones, assuming the regressing works. If not, it will be back to the replacement route.

I don't think you'll get free spinning bearings when lubricated. They should free spin when clean and dry if they're good bearings.

If you're going to attempt to clean them, and have been considering a sonic cleaner, now might be the time to get one. Sonic cleaners do a nice job on bearings.

I've never seen replaceable shields/seals for bearings, but I dunno. IMO, I think you're on the replacement route already.

Try placing the bearings/shaft in the freezer overnight. Then see if the shaft will move using a soft faced or rubber mallet.


The 1/4 hp motor may be somewhat anemic, so you should be on the lookout for a more appropriate 1/3 or 1/2 hp.

 

[Cruzan80]

Re: The Classic Craftsman 100/150 Drill Press

I know the auto parts stores generally have a bearing "splitter"/separator/puller. (used for pulling bearings off a shaft). Check out your local place, and it should be able to be cranked off.

Sent from my IN2015 using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[Moonshine78]

Ok, so I shot some PB blaster into the bearing that was sluggish. Gave it a few seconds and turned it. It really loosened up and now spins freely and smoothly. Now the question is whether I should go ahead and replace them since it is disassembled, or put it back together and see how it holds up. Problem is that the crimp shield can’t be reused, so it is open. I could buy some cheap ones off of Amazon and take the rubber seals off. I would think they might fit if it’s same size bearing. If I go the replace route I will look into the splitter/puller as mentioned.

For motor, aside from hp and rpm, is there anything in particular I should look for? Like shaft size/type? Split phase variety? I was looking at Dayton potentially, if I go new.

Thanks to all for the help!

 

[FrankLee]

Ok, so I shot some PB blaster into the bearing that was sluggish. Gave it a few seconds and turned it. It really loosened up and now spins freely and smoothly. Now the question is whether I should go ahead and replace them since it is disassembled, or put it back together and see how it holds up. Problem is that the crimp shield can’t be reused, so it is open. I could buy some cheap ones off of Amazon and take the rubber seals off. I would think they might fit if it’s same size bearing. If I go the replace route I will look into the splitter/puller as mentioned.

For motor, aside from hp and rpm, is there anything in particular I should look for? Like shaft size/type? Split phase variety? I was looking at Dayton potentially, if I go new.

Thanks to all for the help!

......

I have included more pics of the motor. I pulled it off and took a closer look. It actually does have a plate with info. It’s a 1/4 hp. Would have preferred a bit higher but if it handles my tasks, I am fine with it. Plus I suppose I could change it out in the future if I ever want to. I don’t know how these aftermarket motor stack up to the original CM motors as far as quality.

......

Because your GE motor runs fine, you have time to look for a period correct Craftsman motor. IMO, your machine is too nice for anything else.

......

When I need a motor, I look for other inexpensive complete Craftsman machines that have motors with the specs I need. For example, last month, I bought this jig saw just for the motor. I paid $40, removed the motor, cleaned up the saw and sold the saw and stand for $40. For a little work, I got a free motor!

Band saws, jig saws, lathes and drill presses all normally use the slower speed motors. Occasionally, you can find a slower motor on some of the other bench machines that traditionally use the high speed motors.

.......

If you want to eliminate that custom-switch-in-a-handi-box, a foot switch is a very nice alternative.



I have actually reused original plastic seals on bearings, but I seriously doubt seals from an import bearing will work on an original vintage US bearing. Just a swag.

I use and recommend shielded bearings for the MSA and the spindle pulley, and sealed bearings for the quill.

 

[Outlawmws]

If you want to try to reuse the old bearings and have mangled the shields, you can try cutting a couple of "Doughnuts" out of felt and oiling those. (you will also need to re-lube the bearing - I would use wheel beating grease - a good one like Mobil 1 (this stuff is sticky and WAY better that other greases) or blue marine boat grease)

 

[Outlawmws]

Looking back at the one pic, those shields don't look too bad? Carefully flatten them and re-install after greasing the bearing.

 

[AtlasRearden]

I believe they were painted from the factory. I always sand them bare on that style table. That ring on tilt tables were not milled, so I leave that painted.

Thanks. It's flat enough that I also think it would look nice sanded.

 

[Moonshine78]

Looking back at the one pic, those shields don't look too bad? Carefully flatten them and re-install after greasing the bearing.

I really like the idea of not pulling and installing new bearings if this is a viable option. I already placed an order on Grainger for a pair of shielded NTN 6204s, but I might cancel it, or keep them in a drawer for future use.

I keep the lucusoil version of the red #2 grease in my gun, which I believe is rated for bearings.

 

[11b30b4]

Frank and Row.inc, that spring worked out nicely, I am glad I ordered a set for myself. Row, outstanding find. I have been looking for a replacement spring for some time.

Also, Frank, the citric acid, worked out nicely. Thanks again for the help.

 

[FrankLee]

 

[Moonshine78]

So I was poking around for used craftsman motors and came across this on CL: https://worcester.craigslist.org/tls/d/worcester-craftsman-2-hp-motor/7289732730.html

It is 1/2 HP, 1750 RPM, but double shaft. Is this something that would work on my 150? Or would I be better of to wait for one of the ones more specific to the drill press? Thanks in advance.

 

[Hoorn]

So I was poking around for used craftsman motors and came across this on CL: https://worcester.craigslist.org/tls/d/worcester-craftsman-2-hp-motor/7289732730.html

It is 1/2 HP, 1750 RPM, but double shaft. Is this something that would work on my 150? Or would I be better of to wait for one of the ones more specific to the drill press? Thanks in advance.

All the CDP 100/150s era motors have double shafts. Typically the 3450 RPM table saw motor has a single shaft, but not always.

 

[Moonshine78]

All the CDP 100/150s era motors have double shafts. Typically the 3450 RPM table saw motor has a single shaft, but not always.

Thanks Hoorn. I will try and grab it. If it runs ok, I think $50 is reasonable.

 

[Hoorn]

The pulley on that motor is not for a drill press though. Unless you have a stepped pulley, as pictured that won't work.

 

[Moonshine78]

I have the 150 drive pulley, but mounted on an aftermarket 1/4hp GE motor. I am hoping to be able to just swap it over.

 

[FrankLee]

Yes, that motor will work fine. The price seems a little high for the condition. Any bearing noises can be used for price negotiating. It has a three-pronged plug, so the cord has been replaced.

Typically, motor pulleys with later drill presses had 5/8 bores with a key slot. I can't get real specific about what "later" is. I suspect your GE motor has a 1/2" shaft. If your pulley has a 5/8" bore, there would be an adapter sleeve installed in the pulley bore to fit a 1/2" shaft.

 

[Moonshine78]

Awesome! I am driving out to pick it up this evening. Even more excited about this machine now, and it will be good to get away from that light switch on the side. Also, I like the idea you suggested of a foot switch. Do you go with momentary (hold down continuously while on), or continuous (tap on/ tap off)? I see HF sells them, but I am open to better sources if warranted.