Is there two different kind of craftsman professional polished wrenches? On the sears website some sets say 'long pattern' and some say just 'craftsman pro'? Is there a difference in length in any of the wrenches? It also seems like the old craftsman pro wrenches are a little different? Anyone care to enlighten me?
Craftsman Professional Wrenches
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ibedayank
Well-known member
only craftman pro ones worth getting are stamped with a K
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00902548000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
This is what you want; the 3/8 is much longer than a standard 3/8" ratchet. Can't find the picture now but someone had a comparison.
Stuey
Well-known member
There shouldn't be any difference. For example, this item: http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00947238000P now says "full polish long pattern." It used to say "Craftsman Professional full polish."
The Craftsman Professional wrenches are being replaced with Craftsman Full Polish wrenches, the difference being that the new wrenches are no longer made in the USA.
There shouldn't be any difference in size between the differently described wrenches that have the same part numbers. In other words, in the set I linked to, the USA-made Craftsman Professional 1/2" wrench is geometrically and functionally equivalent to the Chinese-made Craftsman Full Polish 1/2" wrench found in the newly packaged sets.
The Craftsman Professional wrenches are being replaced with Craftsman Full Polish wrenches, the difference being that the new wrenches are no longer made in the USA.
There shouldn't be any difference in size between the differently described wrenches that have the same part numbers. In other words, in the set I linked to, the USA-made Craftsman Professional 1/2" wrench is geometrically and functionally equivalent to the Chinese-made Craftsman Full Polish 1/2" wrench found in the newly packaged sets.
ibedayank
Well-known member
the new ones are NOT made in the usa... the ones that have the K stamped in them are usa made.... K stamp = made by S&K
ibedayank
Well-known member
I personaly will not pay a usa price for something made in CHINA
muddyjoe15
Well-known member
Now you know why i avoid the mac truck!!!
mixxmstrmike
Well-known member
I'll politely disagree with this assessment/opinion. The current "USA-made" Professional combos are VERY good in terms of design, heft, length and general overall finish. They are longer than raised panel satin finish combos and I'll gladly put them up against my SO set. They are THAT good.
However, I highly suggest you visit your local Sears store to purchase the USA-made combos because I have seen the same Professional Combos being manufactured in China/Taiwan.
-Mike
Long pattern and Professional full polish or any combination of those terms are the same until all the Craftsman Professional stock is depleted. Previously and still currently they're often one and the same. As stated sets are now being made in China which do not say "professional" on them. I've had great luck purchasing online and my local stores still carry USA sets in 9pc and 18pc [std+mm]. Not that the sets i'm talking about are NOT sold as "Craftsman Professional" but were the same wrenches. Basically just find long pattern full polish wrenches that say "USA" on them and they will say "Professional" on the back side.
Older Cman Pro wrenches were contracted out to SK, later switched to Danaher's Armstrong tool division and most recently Danaher's Chinese factories. The SK version can be identified by their bold lettering print and a distinctive flaring out of the wrench beam toward the box end. Heres another members pic, SK combo just to the left of the middle, Cman Pro [Armstrong] just to the right. The Armstrong wrenches are as nice as any brand and shouldnt be dismissed outright. As far as i'm concerned if you want SK wrenches, go buy SK wrenches. A lot simpler than trying to find NOS Cman sets.
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ibedayank
Well-known member
Fedwrench
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Exactly, the USA made Danaher versions are vastly superior to those wide in the hips, bulky SK made wrenches of years gone by.
If you want SK combination wrenches, (why, I don't know) wait for the new ones to come out later this year.
I don't care for the looks of the new PRC made Craftsman polished wrenches as they have those funky fat open ends. However, if you can find nos US made sets, they will serve you well for many years.
ibedayank
Well-known member
Skin... but one would have to find the OLDER s&k not the new ones
ibedayank
Well-known member
the 9/16 i have is THINNER then the proto i pictured...
ibedayank
Well-known member
Skin.. has nothing to do with s&k really its about getting the most for my money
and the flare wrenches i have are so it seems are still being sold online..acording to the pictures match my sets to the T
for $35 ya can't ***** right?
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00942013000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
and the flare wrenches i have are so it seems are still being sold online..acording to the pictures match my sets to the T
for $35 ya can't ***** right?
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00942013000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
ibedayank
Well-known member
just make sure they say made in the usa...
I personaly have a problem paying a usa price for something made in china
The SK rebadged combos and Armstrong version are pretty similar. I wouldnt worry about it....If you have a desire for SK wrenches, which is all the original Cman Pro were, rebadged SK wrenches...buy SK wrenches...
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ibedayank
Well-known member
The SK rebadged combos and Armstrong version are pretty similar. I wouldnt worry about it....If you have a desire for SK wrenches, which is all the original Cman Pro were, rebadged SK wrenches...buy SK wrenches...
and then pay the higher price to
when i started buying tools i bought only craftman because of the warranty and the selection that the warrant covered... and it was made in the usa...not so much true anymore powertools are no longer usa made...
more and more handtools are made in china.. and the price remains the same...
the take pride in craftsman because its made in the USA is now a JOKE
Fedwrench
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I don't think anyone can actually say right now because, the market isn't exactly flooded with new Ideal owned SK tools.
txz28
Well-known member
The current craftsman pro wrenches are made in China. I tried to buy some about Christmas via mail order. When I received my order, they were all made in China. I am not paying a premium for Chinese wrenches. The china craftsman pros went back.
I was able to find the craftsman pros USA made at a local store. There was a significant quality difference. The USA ones had much better machining and a smooth finish on the opening for the open end side of the combo. I would only buy from a local store if you can find the USA made ones. There is a LARGE quality difference.
I was able to find the craftsman pros USA made at a local store. There was a significant quality difference. The USA ones had much better machining and a smooth finish on the opening for the open end side of the combo. I would only buy from a local store if you can find the USA made ones. There is a LARGE quality difference.
I agree completely with the comparison and the quality differences between the USA made sets and those made in China. The same goes for the Cross-Force series.
USA-made Craftsman professional wrenches are still available at most Sears stores in the sets called "full polish" modules:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00934273000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00934274000P?prdNo=24&blockNo=24&blockType=G24
These sets go on sale occasionaly for a very good price, and are actually a much better buy if you need the larger sizes not included in the 13-piece sets.
USA-made Craftsman professional wrenches are still available at most Sears stores in the sets called "full polish" modules:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00934273000P?prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00934274000P?prdNo=24&blockNo=24&blockType=G24
These sets go on sale occasionaly for a very good price, and are actually a much better buy if you need the larger sizes not included in the 13-piece sets.
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I don't believe so, but I agree completely with mixxmstrmike and Fedwrench that the USA made Danaher versions are fantastic.
A few months ago I spent a significant portion of my life going through an obsessive wrench comparison. After asking questions here, I drove from store to store buying wrench sets and comparing them, including:
NOS SK sets (Ace Hardware)
like-new SK set (pawn shop)
multiple used Snap-On sets (Craigslist)
Craftsman Professional 13 piece sets, USA made
Craftsman Full Polish 13 piece sets, China made
Craftsman "Full Polish" 18 piece and 10 piece sets (identical wrenches to Craftsman Professional 13 piece, but different sizes)
Craftsman Cross-Force sets, ratcheting and non-ratcheting, USA made and China made
Craftsman locking flexible sets, USA made
Craftsman Professional 12-piece offset box end set
Gearwrench flexible sets, Taiwan made and China made
Gearwrench X-Beam
Harbor Freight Pittsburgh Pro V-groove
Harbor Freight Pittsburgh long handle
I found the USA made Craftsman Professional wrenches absolutely fantastic in terms of length, weight, feel, and finish. The individual wrenches in the 13-piece sets were identical to those in the 18-piece and 10-piece "module" sets called "full polish".
The SK wrenches were comparable in quality, but IMO no better, and over double the price with warranty replacement being difficult at best.
The (used) Snap-On wrenches had a nice length, weight and feel. Again IMO no better, but even in their extremely worn condition, over triple the price. And, not having the benefit of a Snap-On truck stopping by, no convenience/warranty benefit.
The China made Craftsman Full Polish were similar in length and weight, but the finish was sub-par, with pitting in the chrome and machining marks in the open ends of the wrenches, like on Cman raised panels.
USA made Craftsman Cross-Force wrenches had the same quality finish as the USA made Craftsman Professionals. The smaller sizes were longer in length than the Cman Pros, for more leverage. The quality of the USA-made Cross-Force reversible ratcheting wrenches was also very high. The larger size Cross-Force wrenches were significantly thicker and heavier than the Cman Pros, though, which I personally did not care for as much. Very nice wrenches, though.
The China made Cross-Force wrenches, like the China-made full polish wrenches, were significantly inferior to those made in the USA, with pitting all over the chrome, and rough machining in the open ends, like (cheaper) Cman raised panels.
The Gearwrench flexible sets surprised me, as I found the weight, feel, and finish quite nice in both the Taiwan and China sets. The ratcheting mechanism felt more positive and more consistent across wrenches in the Taiwan sets.
The USA made Craftsman locking flex wrenches were thicker, longer, and heavier than the Gearwrench sets, with a nice finish. Side note: They count on you buying both metric and standard, as the sizes that have close standard equivalents are missing from the metric set.
The Craftsman Professional 12-piece offset box end set is only available shipped, not in stores. USA-made, and have the same high quality fit, finish, and feel as the USA-made combination Cman Pro sets. Stores do sell the 5 piece sets.
The Gearwrench X-beam felt a bit cheap to me, and I did not care for the built-in nut detent that only allowed use from one side of the ratchet. The length and finish were nice, though.
The HF Pittsburgh Pro V-groove wrench set, available only in standard (no metric), has a great length, weight, and feel. These are nice, thick, strong wrenches. The finish is sub-par compared to anything USA-made, but better than the finish on most other HF sets. Some of the box end holes were a bit off center. For $22 on sale, though, this set is unbelievably nice.
The HF Pittsburgh long handle wrench set has a nice length, but felt very thin, light, and cheap compared to the other wrenches I looked at. The finish was wavy and horrible.
Sorry for the long post, but hopefully all of this information will help you avoid spending 50 to 100 hours going through the same process.
NOS SK sets (Ace Hardware)
like-new SK set (pawn shop)
multiple used Snap-On sets (Craigslist)
Craftsman Professional 13 piece sets, USA made
Craftsman Full Polish 13 piece sets, China made
Craftsman "Full Polish" 18 piece and 10 piece sets (identical wrenches to Craftsman Professional 13 piece, but different sizes)
Craftsman Cross-Force sets, ratcheting and non-ratcheting, USA made and China made
Craftsman locking flexible sets, USA made
Craftsman Professional 12-piece offset box end set
Gearwrench flexible sets, Taiwan made and China made
Gearwrench X-Beam
Harbor Freight Pittsburgh Pro V-groove
Harbor Freight Pittsburgh long handle
I found the USA made Craftsman Professional wrenches absolutely fantastic in terms of length, weight, feel, and finish. The individual wrenches in the 13-piece sets were identical to those in the 18-piece and 10-piece "module" sets called "full polish".
The SK wrenches were comparable in quality, but IMO no better, and over double the price with warranty replacement being difficult at best.
The (used) Snap-On wrenches had a nice length, weight and feel. Again IMO no better, but even in their extremely worn condition, over triple the price. And, not having the benefit of a Snap-On truck stopping by, no convenience/warranty benefit.
The China made Craftsman Full Polish were similar in length and weight, but the finish was sub-par, with pitting in the chrome and machining marks in the open ends of the wrenches, like on Cman raised panels.
USA made Craftsman Cross-Force wrenches had the same quality finish as the USA made Craftsman Professionals. The smaller sizes were longer in length than the Cman Pros, for more leverage. The quality of the USA-made Cross-Force reversible ratcheting wrenches was also very high. The larger size Cross-Force wrenches were significantly thicker and heavier than the Cman Pros, though, which I personally did not care for as much. Very nice wrenches, though.
The China made Cross-Force wrenches, like the China-made full polish wrenches, were significantly inferior to those made in the USA, with pitting all over the chrome, and rough machining in the open ends, like (cheaper) Cman raised panels.
The Gearwrench flexible sets surprised me, as I found the weight, feel, and finish quite nice in both the Taiwan and China sets. The ratcheting mechanism felt more positive and more consistent across wrenches in the Taiwan sets.
The USA made Craftsman locking flex wrenches were thicker, longer, and heavier than the Gearwrench sets, with a nice finish. Side note: They count on you buying both metric and standard, as the sizes that have close standard equivalents are missing from the metric set.
The Craftsman Professional 12-piece offset box end set is only available shipped, not in stores. USA-made, and have the same high quality fit, finish, and feel as the USA-made combination Cman Pro sets. Stores do sell the 5 piece sets.
The Gearwrench X-beam felt a bit cheap to me, and I did not care for the built-in nut detent that only allowed use from one side of the ratchet. The length and finish were nice, though.
The HF Pittsburgh Pro V-groove wrench set, available only in standard (no metric), has a great length, weight, and feel. These are nice, thick, strong wrenches. The finish is sub-par compared to anything USA-made, but better than the finish on most other HF sets. Some of the box end holes were a bit off center. For $22 on sale, though, this set is unbelievably nice.
The HF Pittsburgh long handle wrench set has a nice length, but felt very thin, light, and cheap compared to the other wrenches I looked at. The finish was wavy and horrible.
Sorry for the long post, but hopefully all of this information will help you avoid spending 50 to 100 hours going through the same process.
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DavidB
Well-known member
I agree. Thanks for the writeup, obsessive! Though you must have enough wrench sets to run a racecar team.
moronmountain
Well-known member
One thing no one ever seems to mention when trying to chase down, "the last of" the USA made tools is this. If it ever breaks, it will have to be warrantied with a China made tool.
Buckgnarly
Well-known member
The way I see that scenerio is...
#1 That's a big "if"....breaking wrenches (used correctly) is pretty tough to do. If you're using cheaters,... well that's for another discussion....
#2 Replace the broken ones with SO or some other "high end" tool as they break. Odds are only the most used ones will break anyway.
ibedayank
Well-known member
K stamped craftsman pro are older ones i bought the ones i have 15 years ago
I'll add to Bucknarly's comments (to which I agree). But before I start, I will say this:
I am just as upset/angry/disappointed as most other people here with Sears and Dahaner for replacing USA-made Craftsman Professional with China-made full polish wrenches. I think it's absolutely horrible, and is going to be one more nail in their coffin if they don't realize that most people associate Craftsman with Sears with made in the USA. If people stop associating Craftsman hand tools with USA-made, the name brand will become worthless. I truly hope leadership changes and reverts production of Craftsman back to the USA before it's too late.
That said, what is being discussed here is USA-made Craftsman Professional combination wrenches. They are still available, and they are still IMO the best value in very high quality USA-made wrenches. Or any wrenches for that matter.
Since I'm not sure of the exact context of the warranty comment, I'll talk through my own mental model when I was reviewing the different brands mentioned above. Since this is a Craftsman Professional thread, I'll compare everything to Cman Pro.
Craftsman Professional vs Snap-On
At $4 to $6 per wrench (USA made Cman Pros in sets), I am less concerned about warranty than I would be at $20 to $40 per wrench (Snap-On).
If I were that concerned about possible eventual replacement, I would buy 1 or 2 extra sets of the USA-made Cman Pros now, and still be at less than half the price of Snap-On.
Craftsman Professional vs SK
SK went out of business, and is now trying another startup. They made very nice tools, but warranty replacement (if available) will probably cost both money and time (through the mail), will probably be with something slightly different, if not now, definitely in the future, and it's all still unknown. At the same quality but double the price, I don't see any advantage whatsoever.
Craftsman Professional vs Gearwrench or Harbor Freight
I hope it's obvious why the USA-made versus possible warranty replacements from China debate is moot with GW and HF.
If we were discussing sockets or ratchets, I WOULD be concerned about warranty replacement, as I've broken and worn out my fair share. But not combination wrenches at this quality.
2 things destroy combination wrenches. Poor fitting fasteners causing uneven pressure which damages or destroys open ends, and abuse. Use your tools correctly and dont crank on a rounded fasteners and your wrenches will last you decades.
One other thing that no one ever seems to mention is, unless you have a crystal ball, you also have no guarantees what will happen to a brand decades later. For a tool with such a long life expectancy the current trend is entirely moot in my opinion. If you're trully worried about what you're going to do when you break a wrench tomorrow, next week, next year, you're doing it wrong
.W650Mike
Well-known member
Thank you Obsessive. You've expressed my sentiments concerning warrantee vs. initial pricing very well.
Once again, the key for me is overall value, which includes price, quality, warrantee, and now, future expectancy of the company.
Once again, the key for me is overall value, which includes price, quality, warrantee, and now, future expectancy of the company.
found some toady, and bought them. very nice indeed.
honcho
Well-known member
There was some of the larger sizes on Ebay recently, but they have since sold I meant to buy them but spent the money on some other wrenches (damn tool disease!)