craftsman quality WOW !

[zendriver]

Yes but....

The problem sears has is that they moved production to China instead of Taiwan. Had they moved to Taiwan, the quality would have likely improved over later years US production. Prices would match the current pricing as well.

Sorry, but IMO, that whole "China" vs "Taiwan" comparison, us just plain absurd.

China manufactures the most precise electronic systems, on planet earth, in large scale and at a low price.

They can't make a good box end wrench?

Snap On has manufacturing plants in China. Are their products junk?

 

[mbshop]

8I just went out and compared the socket set I boughtyesterday to the 10 buck set I bought back in the lste or very early 2000s. Day and night. Sockets have little detents in them so they are held in by the ball. The set was both deep and long sockets. Bothe were just the most used sizes and not complete sets. Came with a 3in extension, ratchet and a driver. It came in a grey case with a clear window. Again the wrenches don't come up to the old standards but will be rarely used so I'm good for the 10 buck price. My concern with tools is that I can replace what I have. Some you can't get that easy service thus myself staying away
from brands from stores that may not be able to warranty or replace what I bought years ago.

 

[FlushingDIYer]

Yeah, don't sell them. People are so cheap; they will offer you like $30 for 250 pieces of quality older USA CM. And when you balk, they will reply: "what, you think you are selling Snap-On!?!?!"

Best to keep them as a back up set. I, too, have SK now, and I keep my CM out in the shed and some in the basement workshop. I have pretty much 2 complete sets of older CM so I have a complete set in the shed and one in the basement. SK stuff is in the garage.

For $30, that's crazy!

Glad to know I'm not the only one thinking this way!

Yeah, they'll stay in the boiler room!

 

[bcradio]

They can't make a good box end wrench?

Compared to Taiwan on average? Nope they can't.

If China put some work into it they certainly could, but as it sits now no. You think sears/ craftsman is going to put in that effort? I don't.

 

[WWheeler]

Sears / Craftsman didn't exactly decide to offshore production of their tools to places like China. Their main problem is that they never really got into the business of actually making the tools with their name on them. They contracted with companies like Danaher that, through mergers and acquisitions went global and took their manufacturing operations overseas. Sears/Craftsman was under contract and didn't really have a say in the matter.

Sears still have a handful of their suppliers that manufacture some of their tools in the US, like a lot of their small tools are made by Lisle. The very few companies that are still making quality tools in the US are not even an option any more for them to sell in their stores as "Made in the USA" in general has priced itself right out of the Dept store market. Sears has tried to keep alive some Made in USA tools available through their Craftsman Industrial line for professional use, but their prices and quality when they are really just a middle-man can't compete with the likes of Snap-On and their industrial line where they actually make the tools themselves.

 

[1950mercury]

Sears / Craftsman didn't exactly decide to offshore production of their tools to places like China. Their main problem is that they never really got into the business of actually making the tools with their name on them. They contracted with companies like Danaher that, through mergers and acquisitions went global and took their manufacturing operations overseas. Sears/Craftsman was under contract and didn't really have a say in the matter.

Sears still have a handful of their suppliers that manufacture some of their tools in the US, like a lot of their small tools are made by Lisle. The very few companies that are still making quality tools in the US are not even an option any more for them to sell in their stores as "Made in the USA" in general has priced itself right out of the Dept store market. Sears has tried to keep alive some Made in USA tools available through their Craftsman Industrial line for professional use, but their prices and quality when they are really just a middle-man can't compete with the likes of Snap-On and their industrial line where they actually make the tools themselves.

You have no idea what you are taking about....

 

[Know Wosad]

Yes they do, they cant or wont sell it for 20, they are aiming at the guy with the 10 in his pocket who would piss and moan someone had it cheaper if it was 20. We have demanded their price be so low they cant make any money.

You nailed it bud. The richest nation on earth filed with the cheapest bastards on earth, hence, the problem. Its disgusting to think a guy bringing in 100 grand is cutting coupons and loitering in places like HF,(insert Depot),Walmart and other such small business(mom/pop) destroying establishments so he can piss more money away on irrelevant nonsense.

 

[fastbike02]

IMO craftsman is the same quality as HF here lately I have found myself buying more tekton that either one, still china based but the fit and finish is better that the other 2

 

[Know Wosad]

IMO craftsman is the same quality as HF here lately I have found myself buying more tekton that either one, still china based but the fit and finish is better that the other 2

At least Tekton(unlike Milwaukee) is an American owned company who buys or has American products produced WHENEVER possible and actually gives a damn about its customers. Tekton is a GREAT company and should be a focus point to those on a budget.
Craftsman/Sears, its employees and customers(victims)should be caned in public.

 

[four.cycle]

"Sears / Craftsman didn't exactly decide..."

You have no idea what you are taking about....

We've had more than one discussion about Craftsman tools since I joined here a year ago, and it seems some people aren't able to grasp one of the hard truths about the retail market, which I mentioned above:
The consumer drives the market, not the other way around.

Sears chose to do what it did because the customer balked at the price of US-made Craftsman, because the customer "could get it cheaper down the street."

If the product doesn't sell, you drop the product line and switch to something else. That is, of course, if you want to remain competitive and stay in the game.

For the exact same reason, we dropped several of our "blue chip" premium brands and went with "cheaper" because the customer demanded it. The proverbial "Catch-22" is that the next time they come in and you offer them "cheaper", they ***** about the product quality.

Premium quality. Low price. Choose one. You can't have both.

If you're a manufacturer (or retailer) in a niche market catering to buyers who will settle for nothing but the best, you don't have to jump into the fray and play that game. Good examples are Snap-on and Wright Tool, the C.C. Filson Co. and Marmot (outdoor clothing), and Nordstrom (ladies shoes.)
But if you're targeting a broader market, you have to offer to the masses what they want, and what the American consumer wants is cheap cheap and cheaper. Ergo: WalMart, Harbor Freight, HomeDepot (Chinese Husky), and Lowes (Chinese Kobalt.)

What I see in common in these "What happened to Craftsman?" threads is that there seems at times to be a collective case of myopia; as though the only option for US-made tools is Snap-on, which is hardly the case.
There are all kinds of US-made tool brands out there - it's just a matter of doing the research and finding out who they are. (A few of them are listed HERE: http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=345229 )

 

[Wakefield]

I think the worst "Made in China" stuff is based on buyers for U.S. importers looking for the absolute cheapest bid/contract. If the price offered to them (Chinese) were higher they would probably make something a little bit better

 

[openwheelracing88]

For the average home owner (less skilled DIYer than ever before), all PRC made tools are perfectly good. Why should 500 people buy SO, SK or Wright just to wrench twice a year? Seriously? So some single mom in Illinois can make $14/hr inspecting ratchets? That won't even cover one year of her salary.

Companies need to make money so they don't lay people off. USA is about working hard to get ahead, not asking for hand outs.

 

[mbshop]

Didn't mean for this to get this deep. But even on the cheap you would expect a socket to stay on the ratchet. As to quality, I doubt it really takes a lot to make a wrench with centered holes. The philosophising about american manufacturing I'll leave up to you guys.

 

[mbshop]

As a point I made earlier, has anyone dealt with lets say hd and lowes when trying to warranty a socket or wrench or replace a missing item you lost that was bought years ago ?

 

[Know Wosad]

I think the worst "Made in China" stuff is based on buyers for U.S. importers looking for the absolute cheapest bid/contract. If the price offered to them (Chinese) were higher they would probably make something a little bit better

I gots a shop full of Evul Chineze tools. Milwaukee, Bosch, Makita, Metabo,DeWalt
I dont give a damn who makes it, nor where. The QC management has a job. DO IT.
Makita is the best on earth assuring the product quality is the same///no matter where the facility is.I'll make a stretched assumption Metabo does the same. Germans in general do NOT screw AROUND. They aren't the best. They ARE proud and consitant

 

[four.cycle]

Didn't mean for this to get this deep.

Yes, but we haven't had a good "bash Craftsman" thread here for at least a week or so!

 

[Know Wosad]

Yes, but we haven't had a good "bash Craftsman" thread here for at least a week or so!

Bash Craftsman is a relevant response to a failed company. Unfortunately they dont gibbachit. Move on.

 

[Teenager with old tools]

Didn't mean for this to get this deep. But even on the cheap you would expect a socket to stay on the ratchet. As to quality, I doubt it really takes a lot to make a wrench with centered holes. The philosophising about american manufacturing I'll leave up to you guys.

My $5 3/8 drive set from harbor freight is better quality from the sounds of the original post


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[mbshop]

Well, today I went and got the socket exchanged for one that stayed on the ratchet.
but this is the funny part, before I left I was looking for another tool in my throw it in a pile pile. Oh, no, I recognize that black case ! Dang, forgot about that case. Pull it out and sure enough, it has a full set of 1/4 in sae six point sockets ! And a bunch of other sockets. These are the usa made ones. Well, thought about returning the china set but decided to keep it. The ratchet already is worth the money and the case helps me carry the sockets around when I need them out of the shop. So in the end I'm good. Still doesn't change the fact of the drastic change in quality though.

 

[XxToolAholicxX]

Craftsman been going down the hill for years now.. I go to the flea markets and find the old ones from the 1970s or earlier and they are good.. I think S-K made their sockets back then...

 

[guy48065]

Craftsman been going down the hill for years now.. I go to the flea markets and find the old ones from the 1970s or earlier and they are good.. I think S-K made their sockets back then...

Funny you should mention flea markets. Those sellers often price CM the same as Mac & SO because they know you can go trade it in for a brand-new socket. Ignorant bastards (and the suckers that buy used CM from them) have no idea if you DO go trade in for new you will walk out with HF-or-less quality.

 

[anndel]

Well some corporation bought the Craftsman - Kenmore - DieHard brand and Sears as going to announce it end of October but so far I haven't seen anything. Nonetheless, I don't think the new buy will bring Craftsman manufacturing back to the USA, maybe a few but nothing significant.