cross vise vs milling table

[sikfish]

I want to get an X Y setup for my drill press and not sure if i should get a milling table or a cross vise. The cross vises in my price range 1-200 seems to be junk as far as being precise, the milling tables seems to be more. Any recommendations? I am not doing precise milling but do appreciate a tool that doesn't have a bunch of slop.
thanks for any advise.

 

[454ragtop]

Suspect either in older USA made will be fine, suspect either in new Asian import will be a POS. The cross slide tables usually have a swivel top as well. Hope you're not thinking of using a drill press as a milling machine, bad idea usually leading to poor results.

 

[sikfish]

Suspect either in older USA made will be fine, suspect either in new Asian import will be a POS. The cross slide tables usually have a swivel top as well. Hope you're not thinking of using a drill press as a milling machine, bad idea usually leading to poor results.

Yes and No, yes for milling 80% ar lowers, no for any precise milling stuff. The lowers have a jig holding everything in place. My Press has a swivel top already.

 

[larry_g]

Can you link to the units you are considering? and a picture of your drill press?

I always include this video,

, to show one of the issues you may encounter.

Here is one place that I suggest getting a mill/drill. Not a lot more money than your looking to spend and you have real milling capabilities. Leaps and bounds above a xy table on a drill press.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[sikfish]

The slop in a cross vise is easily cured no matter who made it. If you can do the milling, you can surely do the shimming needed to make a cross vise work.

I've milled on a drill press.Some of us are capable of doing a job with the tools at hand. Slow speeds won't kill you. Might cut you up badly though. A thumb missing is probably the tale you'll tell.
It can be done and it can be done very well. I doubt you'll get 15 revolutions before you're in trouble. Runout on drill presses is miserable, by design.

Since you're on a budget, and knowing the cost of those lowers, I don't think you can afford to trash one[or four] trying to side mill on a drill press. You'll trash them, all but guaranteed.

Buy some machinist wax and practice if you insist on doing this. Then move up to pvc, then you'll know not to try the lowers.

I appreciate your advise, but the jig is made for a drill press and literally tens of thousands have been done that way. I know of at least a few hundred done with a press just from buddies in the hobby.
Here's youtube videos and the 80% arms website. There is also an easy jig for use with a router. I felt i could control a press easier than a 20k revolution router. I am not on a budget, per say, I just only want to invest so much into something that has a limited return.But i said that when i paid several grand for my plasma cutter and 4 post car lift, I rarely use them but wouldn't live without them.
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=drill+press+80%
http://www.80percentarms.com/products/80-ar-15-jig

 

[sikfish]

Can you link to the units you are considering? and a picture of your drill press?

I always include this video,

, to show one of the issues you may encounter.

Here is one place that I suggest getting a mill/drill. Not a lot more money than your looking to spend and you have real milling capabilities. Leaps and bounds above a xy table on a drill press.

lg
no neat sig line

I didnt see a link for a mill in your message, i would consider getting one even if its a few hundo more. I have too many i have been looking at on ebay and cant decide, lol. My drill press is below.
http://www.harborfreight.com/16-speed-floor-drill-press-43389.html

 

[Ign]

My cross vise is something non-sensical like .004 per tick mark. Stupid. And difficult.

IOW they phone it in on the thread pitch of the dials and then make you deal with it.

 

[Provincial]

My cross vise is something non-sensical like .004 per tick mark. Stupid. And difficult.

IOW they phone it in on the thread pitch of the dials and then make you deal with it.

.004 inch per tick mark sounds like .1 mm to me. .1 mm is .003937 inches. Your cross vise wouldnpt happen to be imported, would it?

 

[sikfish]

I am actually wanting a cross vise for hole placement when drilling and not necessarily for this milling project. I just don't want sloppy junk.

 

[ptschram]

First off, jigs are for those who have poor layout skills.

Unless your drill press has a draw bar, you're gonna be unhappy when the chuck comes flying out and your mill bit shatters. If you're lucky, you don't get hurt.

I gave up looking for a used mill/drill and bought a barely used H-F (Yes, the Snap-On man admits to having an H-F mill) knee mill.

You will be far better served by buying a real mill, even a small one from Chi-Com.

 

[454ragtop]

Have a couple USA made cross slide tables I could part with if you're interested. Where are you located?

 

[sikfish]

First off, jigs are for those who have poor layout skills.

Unless your drill press has a draw bar, you're gonna be unhappy when the chuck comes flying out and your mill bit shatters. If you're lucky, you don't get hurt.

I gave up looking for a used mill/drill and bought a barely used H-F (Yes, the Snap-On man admits to having an H-F mill) knee mill.

You will be far better served by buying a real mill, even a small one from Chi-Com.

Even when they were doing AR build parties(Now Illegal, you have to use your own equipment), the same jig i bought was used for the expensive CNC machines that at a machine shop, these were not cheap machines and were commercial grade CNC machines. I personally did a couple back in 2012 and personally loaded the AR blank and Jig attached in the machine and press the button to start milling. So why would you use a jig on an expensive CNC machine bigger than my refrigerator at a machine shop if they have poor layout skills??? The machine shop would probably take offense to that statement, lol

 

[larry_g]

First off, jigs are for those who have poor layout skills.

I don't think you could be more wrong. Have you spent any time in a production shop? One doesn't have time to 'layout' each part or casting and then set it up in the machine. It is fixtured in the jig and then machined.


OP, it sounds like you have a specific task to accomplish. So you have to make the decision on the set up needed yo accomplish it. If you had asked for advise on a specific set up you would have gotten better answers and not wasted so many members time.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[ptschram]

Yes, I've worked in a production shop-making satellite receiver components and aircraft parts.

I also do all of the machine work needed to support the activities in my shop.

I don't need the jig and when using a jig, I boogered up an AR lower because of a systemic shortcoming of the jig. I now dye them, scribe them, and machine them.

 

[Dave455]

Mate - if you can get a decent price on a milling table, go for it! It will be more rugged than a simple x - y table!

But, and it's a big 'but' don't even think about trying to do any milling with a drill!

First off, your drill chuck won't be able to hold a milling cutter properly so you will cut uphill as your cutter slips!

Secondly, drill chucks are usually held by a taper. As soon as you touch a milling cutter to a workpiece it will vibrate the taper loose and the chuck, cutter etc will bounce off the table, probably trashing the cutter!

Finally, if you do manage to overcome the above, your drill will not have bearings designed for side load, so you will trash them pretty quickly too!

 

[nine4gmc]

Side question halfway on topic, is that the cheapest/best place for 80%-complete kits? You guys can pm me if you'd like, I've been wanting to build one for a long time coming and now have access to the right tools for the job.

 

[sikfish]

Yes, I've worked in a production shop-making satellite receiver components and aircraft parts.

I also do all of the machine work needed to support the activities in my shop.

I don't need the jig and when using a jig, I boogered up an AR lower because of a systemic shortcoming of the jig. I now dye them, scribe them, and machine them.

So a defective jig was the problem, not the jig in itself. IDK about poly lowers, I wouldn't get one. Maybe you should have bought a 3d printer, lol.

 

[ptschram]

So a defective jig was the problem, not the jig in itself. IDK about poly lowers, I wouldn't get one. Maybe you should have bought a 3d printer, lol.

I've been making gun parts for more than 40 years. I think I know how.

But, go ahead and try to mill with a drill press, your education will begin shortly thereafter.

 

[sikfish]

I've been making gun parts for more than 40 years. I think I know how.

But, go ahead and try to mill with a drill press, your education will begin shortly thereafter.

I am not doubting your experience but, how do you explain the countless people that have done it successfully with a drill press? There's literally hundreds of youtube videos and thousands of people that have done it on Calguns.net. You have been the first i have even heard of having an issue since 80% er's begun. I like you have 30 plus years of gun collecting, but i may not have the smithing experience on your level, but i have done my share. So, once i am done with my lowers and all goes well like countless others, what will be the answer then?