Customer Service: You're doing it wrong

[Señor James]

Hey guys,

First I want to say thanks for all of the great advice and great resource this forum has been to me over the past 2 years of home/garage ownership. Although I've been lurking for a while, I've never felt I had any experiences relative to the forum to share, until recently. I do apologize for the length of this initial post...

Some background: I have a 2 car garage and my wife gave me permission to go ahead with epoxy last august. Through research on these forums I decided to go with EpoxyCoat for a number of reasons. Although it's not a cheap option (just over $500 for a color and clear kit to cover a 2 car garage), the supposed durability and warranty made it worth it in my mind. I ordered in September, applied it over a weekend in early October, and kept everything out of the garage for a week after the final coat was applied.

Just over a month later I was pulling one of our cars onto some rhino ramps in the garage for an oil change. As it had rained outside, there was some moisture on the tires from backing out of the garage and the rear tires let out a tiny 'chirp' before they caught and the car went up on the ramps. I was worried when I heard it and got out to see that the split second slip seemed to have peeled up a layer of clear and some color as well (as there were some tan streaks on the tires). These weren't super sticky tires (500 treadwear A/S), and I had the non-slip additive along with TONS of flakes), so I was a bit surprised at the results.

I figured only a small amount of clear was likely need to restore color to the floor and repair the damage, so I reached out to Epoxy Coat on the phone and was given the email of the person whom I should contact. I’ve taken out the names of the employees, but I just wanted to pass this along for anyone else who might be on the fence and considering Epoxy Coat.

From: James
Sent: Monday, January 05, 2015 12:22 PM
To: K
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat


Good Morning K,


I know that it's been a little while (busy, busy December/holiday season), but I had talked with someone over there about some of my clear coat that had come up from my garage floor coating and they had told me you were the person to reach out to.


This happened in mid November, about a month after installing the 2 layer kit (color, then clear). I was pulling the car up onto a ramp and there must have been some moisture on the ground, as the tires spun a bit before biting on the ramp surface. It was just a quick squeak of the tires, but it seems that the clear was stripped right off. The pictures just show the two white-ish looking patches up close, then both from afar from 2 different angles to give you a better idea of the size.



Through the research that I did before deciding on Epoxy Coat, I came to understand how durable these coatings were. So I was really surprised that some of it came up with relatively little abrasion. If it’s not too big of an ask, would it be possible to get a very small kit of clear that I could reapply over this area?


Thanks for your help,

James

From: K
Sent: ‎Tuesday‎, ‎January‎ ‎6‎, ‎2015 ‎3‎:‎30‎ ‎PM
To:


Hi James,


How long did you wait before allowing moisture onto your floor and how long did you wait before driving on the floor.


Sincerely,

K

From: James
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2015 4:59 PM
To: K
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat


Thanks for getting back to me K.


I took extra precaution and kept both cars/everything else off of the floor for a week. And moisture didn't come anywhere near it during that span as the garage was closed. I was paranoid that something would blow in and possibly get stuck in the clear layer.

From: K
Sent: ‎Wednesday‎, ‎January‎ ‎7‎, ‎2015 ‎2‎:‎17‎ ‎PM
To: James


Hi James,


Is your clear fully cured? You can check by taking your thumb nail, is a discreet area, and push into the epoxy. See if you leave a mark or not. If you do leave a mark, check back a while later to see if the nail park is gone. I have showed your pictures to our chemist, and he has never seen the epoxy mark the way it has in your garage.
Is the clear completely peeled off, or is it scuffed?


I apologize about all of the questions, I would just hate to tell you to go ahead and fix it, and the same situation happen.


Sincerely,
K

From: James
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2015 3:35 PM
To: K
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat


No worries, I appreciate your help. I tested it with that same procedure before putting the cars back in and it seemed cured to me. I wasn't able to penetrate the clear at all. As for the 2 white-ish scuffs in the picture, I believe that the clear is completely peeled off. I only say that because there was a bit of tan on the tires afterward. It is also a more coarse texture than the area surrounding it. The other marks you see in the picture are just dirt/oily residue that will clean off.


I can take more detailed pictures Friday when I'm back home if that will help any.

From: James
Sent: ‎Tuesday‎, ‎January‎ ‎20‎, ‎2015 ‎8‎:‎54‎ ‎AM
To: K

Hey K,

I'm sorry for taking so long to get back with you. Things have been really busy and I wasn't able to upload the pictures as soon as I had hoped. Here are some more detailed pictures to give you a better picture of what went on. i have a few more pictures, but am hitting the attachment size cap; so let me know if you'd like to see more. I think these give a good illustration, though.

From: James
Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2015 11:16 AM
To: K
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat


Good Morning K,

Have you had a chance to look at the pictures that I sent earlier this month?

From: K
Sent: ‎Thursday‎, ‎January‎ ‎29‎, ‎2015 ‎1‎:‎56‎ ‎PM
To: James


Hello James,

I apologize for taking so long to reply back to you. I had our chemist and our installers take a look at the picture. Both the installers and the chemist said to not worry about the scuff showing through a new coat of clear in that area. To repair it, you will want to clean the area, scuff it up with 100 grit sandpaper, sweep or use a leaf blower to remove any debris from sanding, and go ahead and apply a new coat of clear. The clear should fill in any scuffs from the ramp and will fill in the scuffs from the sandpaper.
I was told that the reason the ramp peeled the clear away from the basecoat when it moved, is that the clear wasn't fully cured throughout. If the clear coat was fully cured, and the coating received force or weight that exceeded the performance that the coating offers, the coating would have cracked.

If you have any further questions, please let me know.


Sincerely,
K

From: James
Sent: ‎Thursday‎, ‎January‎ ‎29‎, ‎2015 ‎2‎:‎04‎ ‎PM
To: K

Thanks for the explanation K. Is it possible for Epoxy Coat to send me a tiny amount of clear to coat these 2 spots?

I appreciate your help,

James

From: James
Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2015 4:07 PM
To: K
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat

Good Afternoon K,

I just wanted to follow up with you on the below.

Thanks,
James

From: K
Sent: ‎Tuesday‎, ‎February‎ ‎10‎, ‎2015 ‎1‎:‎33‎ ‎PM
To: James

Hello James,

The wet sample is $20, plus shipping. What I can do is knock off the shipping charges for the kit.
Please contact me when you are ready to purchase.

Sincerely,
K

From: James
Sent: Tuesday‎, ‎February‎ ‎10‎, ‎2015 ‎3‎:‎51‎ ‎PM
To: K
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat

K,

I decided to go with Epoxy Coat after much research on garagejournal.com and on the urging of friends who have used your product in their garages. Although there are many less expensive products out there, I decided that Epoxy Coat’s performance would be worth the extra up front cost.

I followed all of the installation instructions to a T and erred on the side of caution when it came to dry / cure times. As stated earlier, nothing was placed on the garage floor for a week after the clear coat was applied, and this happened weeks after that. To say that it received a force greater than the performance that the coating offers flies in the face of your advertised performance. I don't know why it didn't stand up to the tires, but I do know that I expected more from the floor.

All I'm asking is for a sample of clear to repair these patches. It's much less about $20 than it is about standing by one's product and good customer service. At this point, I would not hesitate to use Epoxy Coat for the larger garage that's currently under construction as I'm very pleased with the performance of the rest of the floor. Please help me out here and you'll be sure to have a happy repeat customer in the future.

Regards,
James

 

[Señor James]

3 days later I was contacted by the office manager...

From: C
Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎February‎ ‎13‎, ‎2015 ‎12‎:‎52‎ ‎PM
To: James
Cc: K

Dear Mr. James,

Due to the fact that we have no warranty certificate of file for you, the best I can offer is either the cost of the Wet Sample ($20.00) or free shipping. Unfortunately, I cannot offer both. This is beyond what our company policy allows without your warranty on file.
Please let us know what you decide.

Sincerely,

C

From: James
Sent: Monday, February 16, 2015 11:52 AM
To: C
Cc: K
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat

Exactly how does one get a warranty certificate on file and why is it the first time that I'm hearing about it? My order didn't come with any instructions or registration that I was to file with you. I've attached my invoice.

I was hoping this would be resolved rather quickly, as I would have expected from a company with your reputation. I've spent months explaining the situation and sending pictures to K so it could be passed along to your chemists. I'm not sure what your advertised “lifetime guarantee” means when you won't stand behind your product in a situation such as this.

From: C
Sent: ‎Monday‎, ‎February‎ ‎16‎, ‎2015 ‎3‎:‎00‎ ‎PM
To: James

Mr. James,

The warranty certificate is at the back of the instruction booklet.

C

From: James
Sent: ‎Monday‎, ‎February‎ ‎16‎, ‎2015 ‎3‎:‎24‎ ‎PM
To: C

C,

Please see below. I did not receive an instruction booklet or any papers whatsoever with my order. Besides the supplies, the buckets only contained a DVD with an instructional video. If you could tell me what kind of information that you might need in order to register my warranty, I'd be happy to supply it if it would lead to a wet sample of clear being sent my way.

Thanks,
James

From: James
Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 4:33 PM
To: C
Subject: Re: Epoxy Coat

Good Afternoon C,

I just wanted to follow up with you on the below.

Appreciate it,
James

From: C
Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎February‎ ‎20‎, ‎2015 ‎10‎:‎11‎ ‎AM
To: James

Mr. James,

Even if we had your warranty cert on file, we would be charging for shipping. Please see our warranty information attached.
As an aside, I checked with quality control regarding the packaging of your kit (purchased 9/20/14) and found through the 3 stage process that all required items were packaged correctly, including the instruction booklet.

C

At this point I'm just tired of arguing. Obviously their quality control is a benchmark for all others. I've dealt with a lot of customer service departments, and I think the righteousness and infallibility of Epoxy Coat rivals AT&T/Comcast. About as low as it gets.

http://66.70.65.198/wp-content/uploads/south-park-1609-raising-the-bar-FDD-clip14.jpg

 

[cruZes]

"As an aside, I checked with quality control regarding the packaging of your kit (purchased 9/20/14) and found through the 3 stage process that all required items were packaged correctly, including the instruction booklet."

So... Their process is perfect and infallible? They should get out of the epoxy industry and start a business consulting firm, sharing the secret of their 3 stage process that allows them to operate at 100% QC constantly.

 

[CNGsaves]

Maybe the Wife really didn't give you permission for epoxy floor after all !!

Does her ex-husband work at the epoxy place ??

 

[Señor James]

Cruzes: Seriously. I have worked on the QC side of a data center but it's all the same; defects are going to happen. I know what came with my kit and what didn't.

CNG: Hahaha! As far as I know, my wife and I are both on our first marriage though... So there goes that explanation :/

Forgot to attach pics of the damage:

 

[97nismo]

Nice lotus?

 

[THEIKM]

Its $20. I am in the customer service industry (we all are somehow) and it seems that the "general public" expects everything to happen for them. From my desk it seems that the reason for the "issue" was YOUR tire. Not the manuf. With that said, pony up the $20. Or, spend the $3k on a prof job. Just my opinion.......

 

[THEIKM]

Also, you probably spent more time posting this issue than it would have taken you to earn $20. Society needs to learn that nothing is perfect. Reverse the rolls. You might have a different response from a different perspective.

 

[Señor James]

TheIKM: I get what you're saying. A lot of me wanted to just pony up the money and move on, but at the same time the flooring really wasn't inexpensive. I guess I expected that given the initial price I paid and the advertised durability of the coating, that they would be eager to remedy the situation. I wasn't anticipating it getting this far or even having a lengthy conversation with them.

 

[Señor James]

97Nismo: Thanks! Dream car from the age of 12 and motivation for getting the garage ready. Also not the car wearing All Seasons/is responsible for this.

 

[CNGsaves]

Looks like floor didn't cure/setup. Also awful bumpy isn't it ??

 

[Señor James]

Bumpy is just the flakes/clear over the flakes. Didn't distribute the flakes all that well (and you can see that right in front of that right scuff, as well as some other places). Had A TON of flakes and felt like I followed instructions and prep guidelines pretty well.

 

[wildbill23c]

Looks like the clear-coat was extremely thin in that area and the bit of tire slip just peeled it lose. Nothing the company is really responsible for. In this case you applied the coating yourself, there really isn't any warranty that would cover not applying the product evenly and/or properly.

If the area somehow wasn't exactly clean when you applied the product it may have been the weak point. I've seen some tire spins on epoxy coatings before and its never done any damage tot he epoxy other than of course leave black tire marks on it which with a bit of scrubbing came off.

Something in that particular area wasn't done right so you'll most likely have to strip it down around that area and re-apply it. $20 for replacement of the coating doesn't sound too bad considering the overall cost of having that stuff done.

 

[Imcrazy]

Also, you probably spent more time posting this issue than it would have taken you to earn $20. Society needs to learn that nothing is perfect. Reverse the rolls. You might have a different response from a different perspective.

Of course Epoxy Coat could have saved many times more than $20 on their future advertising budget by taking care of this promptly. I am sure they will lose more than $20 in future sales because the OP will never use them again and will go out of his way to tell everyone he sees that EC really doesn't stand behind their product. I can't blame him.

 

[amberjack1234]

Of course Epoxy Coat could have saved many times more than $20 on their future advertising budget by taking care of this promptly. I am sure they will lose more than $20 in future sales because the OP will never use them again and will go out of his way to tell everyone he sees that EC really doesn't stand behind their product. I can't blame him.

His fault, company product fault, my fault the result is the same. EC will loose a valued customer over 20 bucks. I see more reasons to go with LI every day. Come on spring time.

 

[FullRaceMerc]

$500 product, lifetime warranty, missing booklet/warranty registration, weeks of drying time, months of delay, alienated customer over $20, stupid company.

Take it further up the ladder. Good product or not, these 2 doofuses have no business being in their business. They had the chance to keep the good will of someone who is already sold on your product, who will tell about how well they resolved the issue, & they throw it away for $20? Or the lack of a warranty registration card on file for a client who clearly bought their product? How much did they spend in advertising to bring you in? Time for them to go back to serving school lunches.

 

[cruZes]

$500 product, lifetime warranty, missing booklet/warranty registration, weeks of drying time, months of delay, alienated customer over $20, stupid company.

Take it further up the ladder. Good product or not, these 2 doofuses have no business being in their business. They had the chance to keep the good will of someone who is already sold on your product, who will tell about how well they resolved the issue, & they throw it away for $20? Or the lack of a warranty registration card on file for a client who clearly bought their product? How much did they spend in advertising to bring you in? Time for them to go back to serving school lunches.

Exactly. After OP spent more than 500 bucks on a supposedly high quality product I would expect much better customer service. 20 bucks is nothing when you consider their lost customers over this. I have plans to do my garage in the next year or so, and Epoxy-Coat seems like a good product. After seeing this shoddy customer service I'll probably find something else.

 

[bdamico]

I'm not a fan of using forums to try to steer business away from companies when a customer does not get his or her way.

It seems to me that offering a patch kit for not much money is pretty darn good customer service, especially when the problem appears to be your error. Other companies have told customers to pound sand in these situations (only offering to sell another full kit).

 

[Señor James]

I opted for the full kit which has 2 separate layers when applied (a color and then a clear). Both were applied evenly to cover the area and I will say that it wasn't nearly as thick as advertised (or expected). I don't claim to be a professional, but know how to follow instructions and this wasn't my first DIY project.

As many DIY-ers tend to purchase these products (I'm sure many with the same or less experience than I had going in), I would assume that they would be prepared for these kinds of inquiries. It seems I assumed wrong.

I think that had they offered right off the bat to pay for shipping on a $20 patch kit, I'd have been a happy customer. What happened was all sorts of back and forth, then some prodding on my part, before they offered to do ANYTHING. After sending in plenty of pictures and a thorough explanation, I was given a vague 'it must not have cured' and I guess was expected to just move on.

I've never been one to post something like this on a forum, but that's what this site is about. If I can give other people looking at flooring solutions a better idea of what to expect with Epoxy Coat, then I would think that's a valid contribution to the community.

At this point I'm not looking for anything out of Epoxy Coat. I'll live with the marks on the floor (it's still sealed as it just went through the clear and not the color) and use a different product on the next garage.

 

[mnavillus]

Senor!! Sorry to hear about your new garage floor issues. I know it can be frustrating particularly since you have "sweat equity" into the installation process!

To be fair I'm not familiar with "Epoxy Coat" products,chemistry or performance history.

However I'm skeptical of all products claiming a "lifetime warranty".

As a owner/operator with over 25yrs installing epoxy floors. I can tell you "all garage flooring products (Epoxies, porcelains tiles, various other tiles and etc.) have a "sweet spot" and have there limitations. Usually contingent upon usage and budget!

In the future consider hiring a professional contractor who will offer, enhance surface preparations, enhanced application procedures and a reasonable labor and material warranty based on a history of 1000's of garages installed.

Let me know if you have any questions?

good luck!

 

[benwah]

There could be multiple reasons for this failure. With the company I work for, if we have any failures, a chip is send directly to our chemists. They analyze the chip to see what happened. Could have been mis-catalyzed, could have not cured properly / fully, could have been applied too thick, too thin, material could have got too cold, etc etc. This is why I don't like chips on my floor either. Could be an adhesion issue between the poly and vinyl/acrylic flake, that when the tires spun, dug into the rest of the coating. No way to really tell without a sample being analyzed. Or it would be something as simple as, your vehicle weighs a lot and just ate it up. Sorry man, it ***** to be in your situation, you may have to just pony up the $20 and get it over with though, pick your battles wisely. Some just aren't worth the headache. Best of luck

 

[FullRaceMerc]

I guess the thing that stands out the most to me is that they put blame on the OP over the lack of a warranty card. It is clear that he bought & applied their product. He sent them a copy of the receipt. The amount of chasing around, talking to chemists, looking for the card, checking that the guy who puts the books in the box remembers he sent the book months ago, is ridiculous. The man clearly bought their product. It failed. His fault, their fault, the man in the moon's fault, $20 is a cheap way out & whoever chose to not take that option was not good at his job.

There is an old quote attributed to Henry Ford "Don't find fault. Find a remedy". I understand that to mean it is more important to solve the problem than it is to assign blame. People like these guys get too caught up in finding out whose fault it is instead of getting it resolved. Too much of the "it's not my fault" mindset exists in that company.

As for the missing book, was there something in the book that wasn't in the DVD? Is the OP missing a step that the company is responsible for since the complete instructions were not provided? How does the lifetime warranty work? Do they come out & replace it if it fails? Let's not think about all that & get another $20 from this guy.