I'm adding on the house and as part of electrical upgrade (to 200 amp) will be running 100 amp (underground) service to a sub-panel in the detached garage, in 2" conduit. I know I've seen this discussed before, but am not sure what search terms to use. I want to be able to run a PC in the garage and am not up on the latest/best type of fiber/cable to make the connection to router in the house. Is it ok to run the data cable in same conduit as electric cable?
Data line and ? for garage
- Thread starter MikeC55
- Start date
No, you cannot combine them. and even if you did, the data line can get corrupted from being close to the high voltage.
the should be separated by at least a few feet I think. Others that are far more knowledgeable will chime in, I'm sure
the should be separated by at least a few feet I think. Others that are far more knowledgeable will chime in, I'm sure
pizza
Well-known member
since you don't know the answer to this already, the answer is probably to run CAT6A. distance matters, btw. you didn't mention distance between equipment.
if, on the other hand, you were knowledgeable about networking stuff and needed more performance, fiber would be the answer. however, you may end up having to go fiber regardless if it's a long enough run.
if, on the other hand, you were knowledgeable about networking stuff and needed more performance, fiber would be the answer. however, you may end up having to go fiber regardless if it's a long enough run.
BombShelter
Well-known member
How far? I ran mine 75' through 1" PVC conduit next to the power line and don't have data issues. I can't remember if the power had it's own conduit or just laid on the ground, I just asked the contractor if it was ok for me to use his trench.
I think there is issues if the data line gets too long.
I think there is issues if the data line gets too long.
pizza
Well-known member
i've never, ever heard of cat6a not doing 10GbE (connection speed) at less than 30m (100ft). often it can do it at 50m or even 100m. also, you probably won't even be using 10GbE equipment. common consumer equipment is 1GbE or maybe 2.5GbE. for 60ft, CAT6A will be a reasonable choice.
then again, if you actually want 10GbE, you might consider fiber anyways.
larry4406
Well-known member
If you are ever thinking of fiber, choose conduit size so that you can pull pre-terminated ends thru it.
This pre-terminated fiber has links that are 3/4" in width, so I am assuming you would want to use at least 1" conduit.
Others will be along soon to say not to use copper data cable between separate structures due to lightning issues and if you do to use surge protectors on the ends.
I want to do this one day as well to my barn. I have 1" conduit. I really didn't study this and I am not sure if it will pass the staggered 3/4" ends that I linked to.
This pre-terminated fiber has links that are 3/4" in width, so I am assuming you would want to use at least 1" conduit.
Others will be along soon to say not to use copper data cable between separate structures due to lightning issues and if you do to use surge protectors on the ends.
I want to do this one day as well to my barn. I have 1" conduit. I really didn't study this and I am not sure if it will pass the staggered 3/4" ends that I linked to.
Innovate1
Well-known member
I second what Larry said. I would recommend optical fiber. 1" conduit should handle termination connectors if the ends are staggered. The other thing to be careful of is minimum bend radius. I made some blocks to go in the LBs to keep the fiber from sharp bends. I initially did CAT cable and had 12" between power and data conduits. No issues with closeness but it was a longer run and I had trouble with the connection - I think it was the length even though it was well within what should have worked. I had some equipment damage due to an electrical storm (didn't have protectors) and ended up going to fiber which has been trouble free.
dcg9381
Well-known member
The other advantage of fiber runs is they are not conductive to "nearby" lightening strikes. I've had CAT5/6 get taken out twice due to nearby strikes. It happens. It is harder to get terminated fiber through conduit. I like leaving "pull strings" in my conduit with AV or network wire.
It's better not to run them near power, but if you look at most residential construction around here they have data lines laid over and nearby 120/240V lines. Twisted pair is pretty resilient to interference, especially if shielded. As mentioned, it's against code to run electrical and CAT 5/6 in the same conduit. Sounds like you need ~1Gb speeds (remember, you're only as fast as the slowest part of your network)...
It's better not to run them near power, but if you look at most residential construction around here they have data lines laid over and nearby 120/240V lines. Twisted pair is pretty resilient to interference, especially if shielded. As mentioned, it's against code to run electrical and CAT 5/6 in the same conduit. Sounds like you need ~1Gb speeds (remember, you're only as fast as the slowest part of your network)...
dcg9381
Well-known member
Agree, twisted pair does pretty well, but it's not an all or nothing thing. Shielded would be better, but go up in any residential construction attic around here and you'll find CAT5/6 laid over romex all over the attic. Just don't run it in the same conduit as power, that's a big no-no.
Innovate1
Well-known member
Armored cable is not the same as electrically shielded cable. Shielded power cable isn't something you are going to see much of for residential garages either. Differential twisted pair like CAT cables is very good at rejecting most nearby fields so minimal separation is likely plenty without shielding. But just go with fiber it's better in several ways.
KSJeff
Well-known member
Yep. In every office building with cubicles, power and data have been running down the same power poles together for 30 years.
No, but the aluminum armour is bonded back to the supply, so it has the same effect for my purposes. I cannot do this successfully with Romex.
Edit: crossing the odd Romex run with cat5/6 usually not an issue. Running alongside - not so much.
I have a cobbled together system. My data plan is for 400mbps using the supplied providers modem and router. I can usually pull at least that on wifi with my phone on a speed test when I'm close to the equipment.
Here is where it gets interesting. I have a cat6 line run from it about 80 feet to a old router that im using as a splitter where my security camera system is for the house. I then have a line run from it that goes out to my shop thru an existing run of conduit that feeds the shops alarm system back to the house. Total lenght of that line is likely about 200 feet. The line in the shop is fed into a old cheap ethernet splitter that feeds a cheap $25 wifi extender that is turned into an access point that gives me wifi. Last time I checked I could get about 75mbps on my phone in the shop and I use the wifi for a ROKU to stream without any issues.
Here is where it gets interesting. I have a cat6 line run from it about 80 feet to a old router that im using as a splitter where my security camera system is for the house. I then have a line run from it that goes out to my shop thru an existing run of conduit that feeds the shops alarm system back to the house. Total lenght of that line is likely about 200 feet. The line in the shop is fed into a old cheap ethernet splitter that feeds a cheap $25 wifi extender that is turned into an access point that gives me wifi. Last time I checked I could get about 75mbps on my phone in the shop and I use the wifi for a ROKU to stream without any issues.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
One thing that people frequently do wrong when they install shielded data cable is terminate both ends of the shield. Only one end should be terminated.
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Hmm.. I didn't think about lightning strikes. But I do have a fair number of tall trees (and roots are not that close to route of cable. I'll have to think about rollong those dice. I see you can get shielded Cat6A. Maybe I can ground the shield.
pizza
Well-known member
the main difference between cat6a and cat6 is that cat6a is shielded. that shielding is intended to be grounded at both ends, typically via the jack/receptacle. a cat6a termination (male plug) has a metal face on it that connects to the cable shielding. that metal face is what grounds against the jack.
in real performance, cat6a and cat6 are the same, but cat6a buys you some extra insurance. it protects against interference, especially at higher link speeds or longer runs.
in a normal house, i would suggest cat6 instead of cat6a because it's easier to work with. the cable is thinner and more flexible. further, the run lengths in a normal house usually don't get closet to the limits, so the shielding kinda doesn't help.
however, if you want to run copper between buildings, i say just 'go big' and do cat6a.
as mentioned, there are advantages to fiber, though. if it were me personally, i would go fiber no question ("go big!"), but i assumed you didn't want to shop for fiber networking equipment and learn about how that stuff works. i was more imagining you would just plug into your existing, ISP-provided wifi router or something and get some cheap switch in the other building.
CraigStu
Well-known member
I don't know the correct terminology but I'd use whatever Comcast uses to feed a house from a pole. When they ran mine, they had a tool that inserted the cable maybe 6" down below the grass. Like a pair of discs that just shoved below the surface. I didn't get to see how they ran it under the gravel drive but the grass portion was done at a slow walking speed. No PVC or other pipe just the correct cable.
The speed choke point is usually the ISP connection. 3-4MB/s is my real sustained speed and supports all that. Quite a bit slower than the 100/1000mbit wiring and network hardware I use after the modem.
Fwiw, i needed an extra ethernet drop in my shop the other day. Found a 50' piece of old Cat 4 cable and put ends on it. Linked up at 1gbit regardless.
67CarGuy
Well-known member
Good info, all. Thanks - combining the details here with the Ubiquiti thread (and likely a few other networking threads) and I'll foolishly think I know enough to set up my own multi-access point home network! 
1/4atatime
Well-known member
Fiber or 6a shielded with properly grounded plugs on your switch side