Debating on shop sizes.

[imjustdave]

Debating on shop size, been dreaming of a shop for awhile 20ish years and have a 5th wheel now as well that I would like to take care of inside.

So when asked how big in the past I have always said ? 40 X 60 I guess...

But now the dream is hitting reality.... survey is working on a small lot change and then I need to give exact dimension to my engineer to build the plans for me .. yes we are at the beginning.

So the space I have is 87 wide and 126 deep.... AKA land
Keep in mind I still need 2 setbacks at 5 feet an 2 at 15 my choice and the one side towards the home needs to look nice as well. The driveway and shop is filling up the 1/2 acre
Trailer is 36 long
Truck and trailer connected is 53

The reality is the trailer maybe downsized in the near future as it really is a big trailer I'm hoping to maybe do a slide in truck camper and trailer for toys.

SO back to the shop. do to my property being longer then wide I will need to pull in the skinny end of the building vs the long side.

I also have budget and family needs so I have to keep the ratio of shop home yard in check.



I'm thinking 44 X 50 for the shop

55 foot driveway
leave 38 feet between the home and shop for a joint side yard and about 20 feet behind the shop till the neighbors place.

How many hear have the pickup and trailer connected ready to go with the door closed?
If I leave myself a longer drive I can park outside, my street is low usage 1 home, so... no traffic.

Thoughts?

 

[matt_i]

Just on the last point -- building in the ability (the length) to keep truck + trailer connected and ready to pull out seems like a vast luxury to me...

Think of trying to run around inside the building working on or loading the trailer for use vs. having it unobstructed outside.

Think of parking the truck there when you just want to park the truck there with "stuff behind it".

Also would be good to evaluate how often the truck-camper is going to be seated/loaded and how often the truck by itself is going to be needed. Maybe you are using it constantly and I'm envisioning 3x or 4x per year,

Just one persons' opinion. Congrats on working to make the dream a reality! I hope timber prices come down soon!

 

[brainypencil]

It's a good thing to know you've realized your dream. Congratulations!!!

 

[ford33]

Having an extra 4 feet of length to 54 feet long would allow you to park trailer and truck in the garage. You have been dreaming of this shop for 20 years and that extra 4 feet of length is a small price compared to the overall cost of the shop building. I would build it to fit your needs now and in the near future. Get what you want.

Nobody ever said I wish I made my garage or shop smaller.

If cost is a concern, consider reducing the width dimension.

Congratulations on realizing your dream. Many people dream but never get past the dream. Send picture as you progress.

 

[ducksface]

By not planning to have your truck hooked up you're shorting yourself a parking space.
You don't have to be hooked up to PARK the truck there. By parking in front of the lesser used trailer you free that space from clutter you'll have to move to get to the trailer and you don't take up a space inside the garage with the truck, essentially for no reason.
Make it deep enough, then park there.

 

[gfd_703]

Remember truck and trailer hooked up is 53', this will not fit in a 54' building. 54' - 2 6" walls - wall coverings = absolutely zero clearance front or rear. Also think about how convenient it would be to back the trailer in and unhook then pull the truck in front of it for daily use. This will take more room than having them hooked together also, a lot more if we are talking 5th wheel. I would pull the truck hood to trailer with enough room to walk between and measure the overall length plus at least 2 to 3 ft on each end to walk around to come up with length needed for your new building. The slide in camper in the future will be worse for storage. Back trailer in and then put camper in front of it when you unload it. Then you can't get to the trailer for day trips. The camper takes the parking spot where the truck would go. It will be shorter going down the road but will take even more storage space than your current trailer.

 

[bimmer1980]

I think the bigger question is what level of finish are you doing the inside?

Will it be heated or cooled?

How 'done" does it have to be for you the first year?

I would go as big as you can to easily fit the truck and trailer in.....

Hold off on the asphalt or concrete in front of the garage for a year if it means insuring that you can go the extra couple of feet in length....

Will you be doing the building or contracting it all out?

 

[larry_g]

Besides parking a PU+trailer what else does the building have to do for you? Storage, machine shop, wood shop, auto repair etc? All this plays into the the building design. Would a split shop work where the trailer/truck parking is in a lean to on the side of a sealed shop area?

lg
no neat sig line

 

[ZRX61]

50x60

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

My garage is long enough to leave my truck hooked up to my boat. I use the boat at least once a week and 4-5 days a week from late October through Mid December.
Not once have I left it connected in the garage. I usually have something taking up the space behind the boat.

 

[TimbrSS]

I'm doing 50 x 80... 4x20' wide bays. I never once considered leaving the truck hooked up... It really only takes a minute to do, and I use the truck for so many things that it wasn't an advantage for me. What I did consider and ended up at 50' depth was I wanted to be able to park any camper or motorhome I might eventually end up with. My 5th is 34', but 45' is the max motor home length you can get. 14x14 doors to make it easy to back into with plenty of clearance left to right, and 13'6" is the highest motorhome, so 14' has me covered there. I am doing 20' eaves so I can stand on the roof if I need to make repairs.

 

[imjustdave]

Just on the last point -- building in the ability (the length) to keep truck + trailer connected and ready to pull out seems like a vast luxury to me...

Think of trying to run around inside the building working on or loading the trailer for use vs. having it unobstructed outside.

Think of parking the truck there when you just want to park the truck there with "stuff behind it".

Also would be good to evaluate how often the truck-camper is going to be seated/loaded and how often the truck by itself is going to be needed. Maybe you are using it constantly and I'm envisioning 3x or 4x per year,

Just one persons' opinion. Congrats on working to make the dream a reality! I hope timber prices come down soon!

Yeah I don't' need it connected ready to go at a moment notice as I do use the truck sometimes between camping but it does have a cool factor.

I for sure though need a spot where I can park it connected in or out is the debate. But I can't have both inside and outside, so I think outside is better overall.

Wife has pretty much said she wants smaller camper and we have looked at some slide in campers. I think I need to run the math on those items a bit more.

It's a good thing to know you've realized your dream. Congratulations!!!

Well not built yet but it's a reality VS dream, Thankyou.

Having an extra 4 feet of length to 54 feet long would allow you to park trailer and truck in the garage. You have been dreaming of this shop for 20 years and that extra 4 feet of length is a small price compared to the overall cost of the shop building. I would build it to fit your needs now and in the near future. Get what you want.

Nobody ever said I wish I made my garage or shop smaller.

If cost is a concern, consider reducing the width dimension.

Congratulations on realizing your dream. Many people dream but never get past the dream. Send picture as you progress.

Cost is always a concern, and with the price of things these days I might not get anything built. I suspect I can swing the $$ before covid pricing and will do a bunch of work myself but I also don't want to be garage poor.

I figure once I start building I will start a thread Again thank you.

By not planning to have your truck hooked up you're shorting yourself a parking space.
You don't have to be hooked up to PARK the truck there. By parking in front of the lesser used trailer you free that space from clutter you'll have to move to get to the trailer and you don't take up a space inside the garage with the truck, essentially for no reason.
Make it deep enough, then park there.

yeah good point, I did just find out the wife really wants a smaller trailer so I'm guessing at dimension now. DOH 21 truck 21 trailer 4 between so 50+ will work

Remember truck and trailer hooked up is 53', this will not fit in a 54' building. 54' - 2 6" walls - wall coverings = absolutely zero clearance front or rear. Also think about how convenient it would be to back the trailer in and unhook then pull the truck in front of it for daily use. This will take more room than having them hooked together also, a lot more if we are talking 5th wheel. I would pull the truck hood to trailer with enough room to walk between and measure the overall length plus at least 2 to 3 ft on each end to walk around to come up with length needed for your new building. The slide in camper in the future will be worse for storage. Back trailer in and then put camper in front of it when you unload it. Then you can't get to the trailer for day trips. The camper takes the parking spot where the truck would go. It will be shorter going down the road but will take even more storage space than your current trailer.

Well I will have another 30 feet inside and driveway and the house driveway... no shortage of spots, just inside spots. Truck doesn't HAVE to be inside. I have to admit that I will never have enough garage for things I want.


This is all great info and things to consider, I might fudge a few feet. Oh wow dear I told them shorter.. well its permitted now...

 

[imjustdave]

I think the bigger question is what level of finish are you doing the inside?

Will it be heated or cooled?

How 'done" does it have to be for you the first year?

I would go as big as you can to easily fit the truck and trailer in.....

Hold off on the asphalt or concrete in front of the garage for a year if it means insuring that you can go the extra couple of feet in length....

Will you be doing the building or contracting it all out?

In floor heat, AC in the future depending on how it does.

Done "level"
I would like painted finished interior, might end up with metal interior VS sheetrock but undecided today. I was thinking maybe polished or epoxy floor, but I found the porcelain tile thread and that has some WOW factor for me.

This will be a functioning garage VS pretty shop or storage only.

Besides parking a PU+trailer what else does the building have to do for you? Storage, machine shop, wood shop, auto repair etc? All this plays into the the building design. Would a split shop work where the trailer/truck parking is in a lean to on the side of a sealed shop area?

lg
no neat sig line

Auto repair for sure, planing on a lift thinking maybe even in ground but undecided on that one. maybe 4 post to store 2 level of stuff.

Outside under cover, I have debated I could make it work but then it brings the shop really close to the home, sub 25 ish to the home and would get a lot of push back from the other half. be easier to just park in the weeds like I do now.

I also want this to fit in with the home and land.... VS WOW look big *** ugly shop. We have all seen those before you know what i'm talking about.

I may do some wood working but the dust complicates things for keeping storage clean.

I'm wondering if the answer is really there is no right answer just one that seems to work for today and is flexible enough to work for other options.

I think 2 deep is for sure a requirement, if I go to 57 then thats not enough for 3 ... so it's always a moving pointer

 

[imjustdave]

I'm doing 50 x 80... 4x20' wide bays. I never once considered leaving the truck hooked up... It really only takes a minute to do, and I use the truck for so many things that it wasn't an advantage for me. What I did consider and ended up at 50' depth was I wanted to be able to park any camper or motorhome I might eventually end up with. My 5th is 34', but 45' is the max motor home length you can get. 14x14 doors to make it easy to back into with plenty of clearance left to right, and 13'6" is the highest motorhome, so 14' has me covered there. I am doing 20' eaves so I can stand on the roof if I need to make repairs.

What are your plans to get to 20 foot eves?

 

[imjustdave]

I think the bigger question is what level of finish are you doing the inside?

Will it be heated or cooled?

How 'done" does it have to be for you the first year?

I would go as big as you can to easily fit the truck and trailer in.....

Hold off on the asphalt or concrete in front of the garage for a year if it means insuring that you can go the extra couple of feet in length....

Will you be doing the building or contracting it all out?

I will do a lot of work myself, hire hands for some and sub out the rest.

I have a roofing guy as an example that has a awesome crew, figure they can blast out a roof in no time and get me weathered in once the walls are done.

Electrical I will do, plan on some conduit under the floor to shorten some runs.

Site work, I have done before as a contractor. Been thinking of buying an excavator actually to do a lot of the work as rental will add up, and local rates have jump in the past 6 months.

my goal is a foundation by December, leaning towards monolithic 1 less pump truck. But reality is I need to complete my BLA "boundary line adjustment" with the neighbor, get plans finalized and submit for permit still....

Scheduled survey 7/1..... should have BLA to submit Friday

 

[dcg9381]

I have a 37' 5th wheel and truck. Getting that into the shop (with the truck) means 60' shop. I designed it to be "drive through" - which is a luxury, but I have egress on either side of the shop.

Cheapest ways to add capacity to the shop is doing "shed roofs" - you can come back and concrete these later (if money is a concern). The RV is currently outside under one of the shed roofs (we need the interior space for a temporary thing). We often sit on the back porch of the shop, which has a 15x40 shed roof too.

 

[Masaden]

It's great!

 

[TimbrSS]

What are your plans to get to 20 foot eves?

I don't understand the question. It's a steel I-beam building... I just ordered the building with 20' eaves.

 

[southalabama]

When I built my 40x60 I remembered two pieces of advice that I had been given.

The first by my grandfather. No matter how big you build you will outgrow it and it won’t be big enough.

The second go as tall as you can afford.

 

[CraigStu]

I would have to have a heck of a lot of excess $ to spend it on a building large enough to keep a camping trailer inside. Put a shed roof along which ever side would get the least snow sneaking under the roof and park the camper there. You can close it in some later if needed.

 

[imjustdave]

I don't understand the question. It's a steel I-beam building... I just ordered the building with 20' eaves.

Ok I was thinking wood initially, was wondering if you were doing Red iron, square tube, tilt up, engineered wood.
Debated on doing metal but not sure skinning it to fit in a residential area with Hardi would be workable.

 

[imjustdave]

I would have to have a heck of a lot of excess $ to spend it on a building large enough to keep a camping trailer inside. Put a shed roof along which ever side would get the least snow sneaking under the roof and park the camper there. You can close it in some later if needed.

My biggest issues are land space and rain and security. If I leave space for shed roof to park outside the shop has to shrink a bunch easy 10 feet worth easy, If I'm going to cover it I might as well extend 2 walls to enclose it. Also in the future I could always park the trailer somewhere else and or sell it and then I'll have a bigger shop, VS empty space outside. If I had twice + the land space I would consider a lean to roof and the shop size I want, no brainer but I dont' have the land space. And moving isn't happening as we just moved here and this location is right for a lot of other things in life, I can make this work it's just shop size is important thing to decide today as changes will be next to impossible in the future.

To give you an idea of space, I have 17,500 SQ feet total, and I have a rambler 2100, 3 car garage 640 and driveway for 4 cars next to each other taken up, it just so happens to be on one side of the property, from above it looks like 2 lots with 1 empty, but it's really 1 big lot.
I'm actually buying about 2800 SQ feet from the rear neighbor to push me over 20,000 feet of land, some will help with the shop location but mostly for height restrictions imposed by the city.

Prior to Covid I commuted and the train is less than half mile away, this property is pretty unique in this town, correct side of roads for traffic, the train, space, price, home layout ETC made it pretty difficult to say no to. Looking back I think it was unique find for sure. For all the Yes it had the one NO of abundant space to drive through or drive around the shop was one that I could give up, as getting that one to be YES would mean losing the train. There were weeks I never drove my car, thats hard to beat.

 

[dcg9381]

The second go as tall as you can afford.

If I was doing it over, I'd go up another 2'. I have 16' eves (minimum for 14' doors) and a 1:12 roof slope. I can get a mezzanine into the building, but it's low at on the sides of the building (you'll eat some height in building a floor). I'd recommend an 18' eve...

I was told at some arbitrary height, you start incurring more cost for equipment to lift that high...

 

[imjustdave]

If I was doing it over, I'd go up another 2'. I have 16' eves (minimum for 14' doors) and a 1:12 roof slope. I can get a mezzanine into the building, but it's low at on the sides of the building (you'll eat some height in building a floor). I'd recommend an 18' eve...

I was told at some arbitrary height, you start incurring more cost for equipment to lift that high...

What is your height from finished floor to bottom of rafter inside? I assume 16
I guess you're right 7 1/2 feet clearance, 1 foot of floor support only leave you 7 1/2 on second floor and a 1:12 is pretty shallow. 18 wall would give you 8 + on both levels.

I plan on 6:12 scissor truss so the inside is about a 4:12 pitch. Guy down the way from me is building a shop and WOW that really opens up the inside, I was blown away. City has height rules but I'll see what I can do.

Lifting issues... they make forklifts and all terrain ones too, they go crazy high.

I can see siding costs going up

 

[Sweeet67]

What is your height from finished floor to bottom of rafter inside? I assume 16
I guess you're right 7 1/2 feet clearance, 1 foot of floor support only leave you 7 1/2 on second floor and a 1:12 is pretty shallow. 18 wall would give you 8 + on both levels.

I plan on 6:12 scissor truss so the inside is about a 4:12 pitch. Guy down the way from me is building a shop and WOW that really opens up the inside, I was blown away. City has height rules but I'll see what I can do.

Lifting issues... they make forklifts and all terrain ones too, they go crazy high.

I can see siding costs going up

I have this exact truss system in my shop. 16’ wall with the 4/12 scissor truss and 40’ wide, It is a lot of open space. On my mezzanine, I can stand against the wall and barely duck my head. I’m 5’10”. In the center of the truss, it’s plenty of room.
I have to admit it’s been some pain to get it all up(doing it myself), but now that it’s up, I love it.

 

[Joemctag]

What Craig and larryg said. Lean-tos are great. Roof can be lower and flatter than main bldg. If it’s not connected, you might be allowed to have it be a carport and go mainly in the side lot setback, maybe just a couple feet from the line. Where I am, they have full bldg and zoning, but pretty much carports are “ no permit required”. Of course, check if they’ll let you fully enclose it later or not.
Glad you’re starting. Would be great to see pics of the yard.

 

[dcg9381]

What is your height from finished floor to bottom of rafter inside? I assume 16
I guess you're right 7 1/2 feet clearance, 1 foot of floor support only leave you 7 1/2 on second floor and a 1:12 is pretty shallow. 18 wall would give you 8 + on both levels.

16' - so you're about spot on. Which is why the next one will be 18'

 

[corneredge]

I have never heard someone say "I wish my shop was smaller"

 

[finn]

Just a question....Why are you sizing a shop to house a fifth wheel that you are going to get rid of shortly?

My way of looking at it is that the building should be designed for future needs. You are downsizing your rev, yet confusing the final design with needs for something that will be gone from your life in the not so distant future.

 

[imjustdave]

What Craig and larryg said. Lean-tos are great. Roof can be lower and flatter than main bldg. If it’s not connected, you might be allowed to have it be a carport and go mainly in the side lot setback, maybe just a couple feet from the line. Where I am, they have full bldg and zoning, but pretty much carports are “ no permit required”. Of course, check if they’ll let you fully enclose it later or not.
Glad you’re starting. Would be great to see pics of the yard.

Well like I said it's just a big open space next to the home. It's 87 wide fence to home and 126 deep road to back fence. The private road boarding the entire 87 side. Photo attached taken where the 2 x are for reference.
So out of the 87 I need min of 5 on the fence side and then on the home side I could go to 5 feet by city rules but the wife says NO too close and it would just be ugly.
So 87 - 5 for setback, -shop 40-45 ish leaves me about 37 feet. give me a nice side "middle" yard for grass, dog, family fun, wife would be happy ETC our backyard behind the home is pretty short 35 deep.
I could install a lean to
but reality is I would need 20 feet on the side in order to park and reality the roof and supports would have to be 5 feet back, if done right could make it work I used to park in a 17 wide spot so 20 would be a upgrade.
Leaves about 22feet between pretty close when you consider the height.
could narrow up the shop to 40 and get to sub 30 yard, not sure that would pass wife test. There is a tree near the home and she loves this tree.
Front to back figure I would put it back 50 feet.
Yes the property looks like 2 lots but its 1

But hey if others have some ideas im all ears to at least listen...

I have never heard someone say "I wish my shop was smaller"

For sure, look at renting a warehouse once.

Just a question....Why are you sizing a shop to house a fifth wheel that you are going to get rid of shortly?

My way of looking at it is that the building should be designed for future needs. You are downsizing your rev, yet confusing the final design with needs for something that will be gone from your life in the not so distant future.

Are you married? My wife literally surprised me with this idea the day I started this thread. so half my brain was current 5th wheel camper half my brain was all confused debating on what is to come. I do have an idea of what I would get if we change but the push is from her not me. But this thread is bringing up good points so it is of value to me. biggest one is having it deep enough to double park, be it a trailer and truck or 2 cars.


I do want to thank everyone for the questions and ideas it is helping greatly.