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Deflection in ceiling

i09046

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Nov 4, 2010
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Raleigh, NC
I am purchasing a home that was built in 1961, which shows very noticeable deflection in the ceiling (no living area above ceiling and is only supporting the weigh of the celing material and garage door w/opener). Currently ceiling has 2x6s on 2 foot centers spanning 21 feet. It appears that once a previous owner installed a gaage door opener for a solid wood 16 ft door, serious deflection occurred. Tracks for door are on one joist while the opener is on another joist. I am thinking of installing LVLs between the current joists or replacing current joists on 16 in centers. Any thoughts on options and WAG costs? Area of deflection is 10 ft long over 6 current joists.
 
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ishiboo

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Oct 27, 2010
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Oshkosh, WI
I am purchasing a home that was built in 1961, which shows very noticeable deflection in the ceiling (no living area above ceiling and is only supporting the weigh of the celing material and garage door w/opener). Currently ceiling has 2x6s on 2 foot centers spanning 21 feet. It appears that once a previous owner installed a gaage door opener for a solid wood 16 ft door, serious deflection occurred. Tracks for door are on one joist while the opener is on another joist. I am thinking of installing LVLs between the current joists or replacing current joists on 16 in centers. Any thoughts on options and WAG costs? Area of deflection is 10 ft long over 6 current joists.

I believe our house is similar, but with 2x8's on 16" centers.

The joists have two purposes - one, to hold up the ceiling (probably added later than the house was built) and two to hold the ends of the rafters from splaying out.

The cheapest and easiest fix is to turn these into a "truss" system by tying the joist to the rafter just like a pre-built truss. You could just use a couple vertical members nailed to the outside of the joists, and use a nailer plate on the rafters, after using a come along or ratchet strap to pull the joists back straight.

There is no need for LVLs unless you are storing a LOT of stuff on the floor. Our garage's 2x8's span 21-22', have some large lawn stuff stored on top (trellises, pipes, etc) and don't sag even where the opener is.
 

PAToyota

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South Central Pennsylvania, USA
2x6s spanning 21 feet is pretty spindly - 24" o.c. and you're just asking for trouble.

But I agree with ishiboo - no need to go to LVLs.

Without seeing it, it is hard to say. But I'd consider sistering in 2x8s where they are needed along the door tracks and opener locations.
 
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tcianci

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Feb 7, 2009
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Walpole, Ma
If I'm understanding your description correctly, the tracks and the opener are mounted to different joists and the joists are prependicular to the tracks and opener? Think about the forces applied to the door in order to open it... the door operator is mounted to the header over the garage door. That's the surface that takes the stress of the forces applied in order to open the door. If you dont believe it, disconnect the opener from whatever its hanging on, hold it up there in your hands and operate the door...there is no force applied to the ceiling other than the weight of the opener itself.
The weight of the door, when it is open is indeed bearing on the track which in turn transmits the force to the track hanging hardware and to the associated ceiling joist. Again, there are no forces applied to the track hanging hardware in a direction parallel to the door travel or laterally. It's all gravity.
While the weight of the opener hanging on a joist certainly will apply forces in the direction of the observed sag, The majority of your deflection is no doubt simply the result of a really long piece of wood spanning 20 odd feet for fifty years.
The weight of the door is putting much more weight on the other joist than the opener is putting on its associated joist but the door tracks are closer to the exterior walls of the building...closer to the point where the joist transfers its weight to the wall. You can hang a lot more weight in that case than you can at the mid point if the joist.
In any event, your least expensive and quick way to stabilize things would be to tie several joists together with steel angle lagged into the top surfaces of the ceiling joists, at least one bay ahead of and one bay beyond the joist with the weight applied to it. this will distribute the weight over 3 joists in that case. Don't expect this to remove the sag that's already there...it won't go away even if you took all the hardware off the ceiling, too much time has passed on those poor joists. If you do want to make the ceiling flat, consider sistering a beefier framing member along side the joists. You would need to jack the existing joist until it was "crowned", attach it to the sister joist which should be installed crown up and when you take away the jack, the forces will be transmitted to the sister joist and if you're lucky, it should flatten out. Admittedly it's kinda a **** shoot because you're taking a SWAG at how much you need to jack the existing joist and how much the new joist will sag just of its own weight givein the span.
Tying the ceiling joists into the roof rafters may help also, especially if the roof sheathing is 1x boards as opposed to plywood. The mechanism that comes into play here is two-fold. The weight of the ceiling is now assumed by the ceiling joist and the rafter. The good thing is that the rafter, no matter what its dimension is a little more than half as long as the ceiling joist and the force you are adding to it is not being applied perpendicular to it. Couple that with the fact that any deflection of the rafter is somewhat transferred to the adjacent rafters by the sheathing and you may find this to be an acceptable remedy.
I know this is kinda wordy but I hope it helps.
 

rodnok1

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Jan 27, 2005
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NC
I would consider adding a double beam above them in the center running from wall to wall, then jack up ceiling and attach the rafters to the beam(hang them with straps). That should effectively half the span. That would be cheapest and easy since you have to jack them back up anyways.
 
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i09046

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Nov 4, 2010
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Raleigh, NC
Again, I appreciate all of the responses and suggestions.

rodnok1 - considered your idea, but concerned with additional weight being distributed to header above garage door opening.
 

Sebringer

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Nov 2, 2010
Messages
17
Sounds like your ceiling beams are running parallel with the garage door. If the garage door header isn't stout enough, I would consider beefing it up. Bolted Lam beam maybe. Then flying a beam up the center, either above or flush bottom. Cut or strap beams as needed. If your ceiling beams are that undersized then your roof rafters probably are, too, so strapping the beams to your rafters (truss type) will probably just give you a saggy ceiling and roof. Add the beams. Distribute the load. And you could even help support the roof if needed.
Post pics if you can.
 
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