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detached garage internet access - options?

tff

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My detached garage (if it comes to fruition) will be too far away to get wifi access from my house router. So what are the options to get internet access in the garage?

-Is there such a thing as a amplifier / repeater to boost the signal?
-Do i run a dedicated cable? (Right now i have internet access through cable, what if i switch to telephone lines in the future?).

(Not an expert on this kind of thing).

Thanks for any suggestions.
 
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86turbodsl

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if you live in lightning country, i'm going to suggest a fiber line to the shop with 100bt / fiber converters on each end. it's what i did and it works great.
 

timdgsr

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I've never used the powerline devices before, but I I would be very interested in that as a solution.

Burying fiber is a great solution, but a real pita compared to wireless or power.

What's the distance and line of site look like between your house and your garage? There's a LOT of wireless options available. They do make "extenders" but my personal opinion of them is they kind of stink. I would consider something like a Ubiquiti bridge, or some APs hobbled together as a bridge.


edit: Just re-read the original post. If the garage isn't even in place yet, and you have to trench power, you might consider trenching fiber with it. Fiber will be the most robust and fastest connection. It won't matter if you change internet types/providers in the future.
 
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adrenalinejeeper

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There are a lot of "band-aide" solutions to problems like this on the market, such as the powerline converters or Wi-Fi "extenders". Then there are the permanent fixes, such as a wireless bridge (Ubiquiti) or a wired solution.

The right ways to set it up greatly depend on the situation. How far apart is the building from where you have a wired(cat5e or cat6) connection at the house? Is it line of sight or are there trees or other obstacles? I have used a Ubiquiti wireless bridge to connect a house to a guest house, it was reliable but eventually the speed diminished due to the antenna actually being too close to each other. Their equipment is meant for long range, and even with the power turned down it was too close (about 150'). If you have the ability, I would go with a wired connection. Ethernet (cat5e or cat6) will be sufficient up to around 300'. If you are digging and laying a line anyways, might as well go with fiber as someone else suggested with TX/RX on each end to convert it to ethernet cable. This is the more future-proof method of connecting the garage. This is what I am going to do for our new guest house we are starting soon.
 

Bad Habit

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It sounds like it isn't built yet. Put a spare conduit in back to the house. You can add in connections later for network, security, etc. Having options down the road will be well worth it.
 

justsam

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Since it is not built yet, plan for the future. At a minimum I would place a low voltage use conduit from home to garage. If you are using direct bury I would put in 2 cat 6 cables and one RG6 coax. Why put up with the uncertainty of wireless coverage today, but perhaps interference tomorrow, when you can easily at this juncture place cable.
 

Crazyjake8493

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When you build the garage, run a few extra conduits besides the one for power. I have one for power, one for low voltage (Cat6, RG6 coax, doorbell wire, etc), and another empty one, just in case. You could then run Cat6 to the garage with an access point out there.

I have an Ubiquiti Unifi AP in my garage and I can go all the way back to the woods behind my garage (400-450 feet) and still get at least 1-2 bars of Wifi coverage. They also make a long range model that is 650ft I believe. This would also be a great solution for someone who has existing garage with no means to run wire out there.
 

JRC3

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^
That's exactly what I was gonna say. With an extra cat6 cable you can use BNC connectors for video cameras.
 

ard

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I don't understand the fetish here with 'fiber and lightning'....

House and garage will be decimated by any lightning strikes- WHY do they need to be connected with fiber?!?

OP- lay in a conduit when you build, depth doenst matter. Pull whatever you need- cable,fiber, CAT6, telephone, etc

(Again, for data cables, any depth is fine- you can lay it on the ground if you want. Just need it out of sight and avoid future digging/planting actives.)
 
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nolimits76

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How far away is "too far away"? 100', 200', etc?

You might be able to get there using access points, but I'd just run a hard line if it were me. Actually I'd run two lines, one for data and one for phone. Both Cat 6/7. Check Monoprice for the best prices. You can rent a trencher and slap together a 1.5" to 2" conduit to run the wire in for a little extra protection.

With the data line ran, I'd hard wire to the router at your house and then terminate in your shop to a jack terminal. In the shop you could then have an option to hard wire your computer, or run a secondary router/access point and connect via wifi.
 
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kwschumm

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Here the shop will be 80 feet from the house.

I'm taking two approaches and will use both depending on circumstances.

First is to add nodes to the Linksys Velop mesh router that is in the house to extend the mesh router over the entire site. Second is to bury conduit during construction and connect via CAT6 with optical isolators and surge protectors.

I have also directed the builder and electrician to construct the grounding system so that both house and shop are at the same ground potential to eliminate ground loops that can damage network, surveillance and security equipment installed in each building.
 

zmotorsports

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When I built mine, I had a couple of extra 1.5" conduits ran in the ground from the back of the house out to the shop. I ran an RG6 coax and two CAT5 cables from the house to the shop.

By the sounds of it you may not have the shop built yet so I have one other item that I did on my last shop as well as my current shop that really added a nice luxury to it. I ran a 12/3 wire in a conduit from my house to the shop for switching my soffit lights at my shop. This way I can turn lights on or off from either the house or the shop. This is nice when going out to the shop in the dark and having the ability to turn on my soffit lights from the house and walk out with lighting. More commonly is the reverse, having my shop soffit lights on and when going into the house late at night in the dark being able to walk back with light and then turn everything off once inside the house.

Just a thought but something I have had a lot of comments on and it is easy to accomplish with a little planning.
 

JRC3

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I don't understand the fetish here with 'fiber and lightning'....

Yep, it's a garage, run cable and toss a wifi router out there. Plenty to use your phone, surf on a computer, stream music, or watch Netflix...All at the same time. A little cable in conduit and a $20 wifi router from WallyWorld. Done and done.


Also, how far is it?
 

chaosracing

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Once mine is built, I plan on running 2 sets of conduit. One for electric and the other for low voltage. I will run CAT5 (I have a lot from a friend) from my house to the garage even though I am well with in the WIFI range. Problem with WIFI and pole buildings is the steel siding interferes with signal (even cell service will ****). I picked up a not to old PC for free that I will use in the garage.
I will also keep a pull string in the low voltage conduit for future pulls as well. Much easier to do now than down the road. I might even pull a RG6 while pulling the CAT5 as well. Probably wont ever need that even with a cable modem. My modem goes into a router and everything that plugs into the router uses CAT cable or WIFI
 

Jeff Ivers

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How much usage do you anticipate in the shop? Have you considered using your smart phone as a wi-fi hot spot?
 

nolimits76

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I noticed several people have mentioned "Cat 5" cables. While many people generically use this term, it is worth noting there is a difference between Cat 5/5e/6/6a/7 cables.

Modern networks should be using Cat 6 as a minimum. To help provide a little future proof, I'd personally spend a few dollars more and get Cat 7 especially if you have fiber/gigabit internet service. Although in fairness, to get those max speeds, all your equipment has to be gigabit compliant and many people will get the connection and then be frustrated because their switches, router and/or cabling doesn't support their max speeds.

Here's a link to help better explain it all:
https://planetechusa.com/blog/ether...t3-vs-cat5e-vs-cat6-vs-cat6a-vs-cat7-vs-cat8/
 

fowldarr

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My shop is detached, but not far away, I plugged an extender into the farthest end of the house, now I have better wifi in the bedrooms and wifi in the shop. My speed in the shop still runs north of 60gb download speeds, which means that when I get more power out there I can watch TV, but if my wife asks, I'm working on a project.
 
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KDubU

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I just ordered a powerline ethernet solution and it works great. I am on satellite internet (Viasat) due to cable companies refusing to extend their lines a couple hundred yards. My Macbook runs great out in the garage, I can stream no problem.
 
OP
T

tff

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Lots of great feedback! Need to digest. Thanks.
(To answer some of the questions that came up... Yes, my garage is not yet started. The furthest corner of the garage would be about 50ft from my house & 100ft or so from my existing router.
 

u3b3rg33k

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I noticed several people have mentioned "Cat 5" cables. While many people generically use this term, it is worth noting there is a difference between Cat 5/5e/6/6a/7 cables.

Modern networks should be using Cat 6 as a minimum. To help provide a little future proof, I'd personally spend a few dollars more and get Cat 7 especially if you have fiber/gigabit internet service. Although in fairness, to get those max speeds, all your equipment has to be gigabit compliant and many people will get the connection and then be frustrated because their switches, router and/or cabling doesn't support their max speeds.

Here's a link to help better explain it all:
https://planetechusa.com/blog/ether...t3-vs-cat5e-vs-cat6-vs-cat6a-vs-cat7-vs-cat8/
if you're going to run something silly out there, run singlemode fiber. there is NO LIMIT on how much bandwidth you can get down a singlemode fiber. Practically speaking, the limit of singlemode fiber for a homeowner would be 100Gb/s. The fiber that will support this costs $38 for 100 feet.

https://www.sanspot.com/30m-lc-lc-o...Lw7L7ZMyjF1i_iLMsGyEj4BuSXs8QKpBoC_9kQAvD_BwE


now that we're done talking about silly things, thanks to 10GigE, we now have a 2.5Gb/s and 5Gb/s standard using cat 5e and cat6, respectively. I'm an absolute nerd, and I can't think of anything I'd do in my garage that needs more than 5Gb/s.

Cat 6 is future proof, especially for a garage.
 

chaosracing

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Its the age old run what you can afford, try to future proof as much as you can conundrum. Same thing happened with electric wire to.

When I said CAT5 earlier, guess I should have specified 5e. But with as fast as technology is changing, what can be done? I remember when RG59 was king for cable, now its RG6. Internet was thru 2 wire phone line. But the interesting thing about running fiber or CAT6 or 7 or RG6 is unless you have a provider willing to run fiber on the street poles, then to your house, its worthless. Verizon has left my area in the stone ages.They are still stuck on DSL (and that was after being forced by the state to upgrade) The local cable outfit just ran new fiber on the street poles, but still have the same cable that was run underground in 1989 when someone built our house from the pole to our house, and its a 200+ foot run. And mobile hotspots thru cell providers.....I would not dare think of that for what the cost is.

In the end, you can run whatever you want, but the best way to future proof is to pull it in conduit and leave a pull string in to pull newer stuff as it deems necessary.
 

86turbodsl

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I don't understand the fetish here with 'fiber and lightning'....

House and garage will be decimated by any lightning strikes- WHY do they need to be connected with fiber?!?

Line voltage devices are more robust to voltage spikes.

Ethernet is not. It'll blow everything connected to both ends of Cat 5 with a strike inside a mile or two.

You may not mind insurance claims, but i do not like them. The insurance company always gets their money back one way or another.
 

u3b3rg33k

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Line voltage devices are more robust to voltage spikes.

Ethernet is not. It'll blow everything connected to both ends of Cat 5 with a strike inside a mile or two.

You may not mind insurance claims, but i do not like them. The insurance company always gets their money back one way or another.

we had lightning strike a security camera at work. surge grounded out through a switch, took out that switch, half another switch, damaged a 3rd switch, and killed 4 connected devices. At least $14k in material damages we've discovered so far. if you're going to use ethernet, put surge arrestors on both sides.

Note that cat7 requires grounding - and in my experience, most people who terminate shielded ethernet cable don't do it properly, and improperly terminated shielded cable usually performs far worse than the unshielded equivalent.
fiber doesn't have any of those problems.
 
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haptiq

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First off my ip only provides 10 mb/s so nothing I do will be the limiting factor in speed. I ran a shielded direct bury cat5e from my house router to a jack in my garage wall, 150 ft. Grounded the shield to the jack and to the ground rods on the garage end only. Then plugged in a cheapo wireless router out there. Works great except sometimes my phone will stay on garage wifi with 0 bars when I’m in the house and I have to go to settings and manually switch it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

u3b3rg33k

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First off my ip only provides 10 mb/s so nothing I do will be the limiting factor in speed. I ran a shielded direct bury cat5e from my house router to a jack in my garage wall, 150 ft. Grounded the shield to the jack and to the ground rods on the garage end only. Then plugged in a cheapo wireless router out there. Works great except sometimes my phone will stay on garage wifi with 0 bars when I’m in the house and I have to go to settings and manually switch it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

do you have different wifi network names in both places? set them the same (identical security settings, too), and your devices will auto connect to the stronger signal.
 

Vintage Veloce

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My two garages are separate buildings. I ran dual (redundant) Cat 6 shielded direct burial cable to each, but I did put them in conduit. And I ran a separate empty conduit with a pull string. It's pretty heavy duty cable with solid copper 23AWG strands with a plastic divider and surrounded by a foil shield.
The cable: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002HFKIIA/?tag=atomicindus08-20

It's a pain to connect the heavy cable to the wall jacks, but possible with some care. These are the jacks I used, they pop into the wall plates: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CLVAJCK/?tag=atomicindus08-20

And... it works great. 10 Gigabit Ethernet from the house switch to the garage PC. Should be good for many years... and then there is the empty conduit for when I need the VR holo display in the next gen garage remodel.

PS, as u3b3rg33k said, grounding the cable's shield to the jacks is a pain, but doable. Then you need shielded jumper cables from the jack to equipment (switch or PC) with shielded jacks that are properly grounded (at least on one end). This is probably standard for any 10G equipment.
 
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finn

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My service provider installed a power line device in my garage.

Works fine, and was fast and easy.

No digging or trenching, and they did it at no cost to me.
 

86turbodsl

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Just a data point for my fiber setup- I think it was $65 on ebay for a fiber line long enough for my shop, pre-terminated. And i had $5 on each end in converters. I don't worry about it at all.
 

Ryan

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My shop is about 300' from my house. A cable run would have been a huge pain in the ***... and it's too far for decent wifi... So, I used a couple of these to create a wireless bridge:

https://www.ubnt.com/airmax/nanobeam-ac-gen2/

It has worked flawlessly for about three years now... and it's really, really fast.
 

u3b3rg33k

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My two garages are separate buildings. I ran dual (redundant) Cat 6 shielded direct burial cable to each, but I did put them in conduit. And I ran a separate empty conduit with a pull string. It's pretty heavy duty cable with solid copper 23AWG strands with a plastic divider and surrounded by a foil shield.
The cable: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002HFKIIA/?tag=atomicindus08-20

It's a pain to connect the heavy cable to the wall jacks, but possible with some care. These are the jacks I used, they pop into the wall plates: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CLVAJCK/?tag=atomicindus08-20

And... it works great. 10 Gigabit Ethernet from the house switch to the garage PC. Should be good for many years... and then there is the empty conduit for when I need the VR holo display in the next gen garage remodel.

PS, as u3b3rg33k said, grounding the cable's shield to the jacks is a pain, but doable. Then you need shielded jumper cables from the jack to equipment (switch or PC) with shielded jacks that are properly grounded (at least on one end). This is probably standard for any 10G equipment.

All the 10gig gear i've ever put in is 6A UTP, or fiber. the only STP i've put in went to a radio transmitter room - and of course they used UTP patch cords, so it was pointless.
 

Vintage Veloce

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All the 10gig gear i've ever put in is 6A UTP, or fiber. the only STP i've put in went to a radio transmitter room - and of course they used UTP patch cords, so it was pointless.

Both my PC and Switch have shielded jacks on them, and those have continuity to the chassis ground.
In fact, I just searched Amazon for 1g and 10G switches, and they all have shielded jacks on them.
Now... if someone chooses to use unshielded patch cables, you have to live with the possible lower performance, as I suspect is specified by the standards.
 

zippy99

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I noticed several people have mentioned "Cat 5" cables. While many people generically use this term, it is worth noting there is a difference between Cat 5/5e/6/6a/7 cables.

Modern networks should be using Cat 6 as a minimum. To help provide a little future proof, I'd personally spend a few dollars more and get Cat 7 especially if you have fiber/gigabit internet service. Although in fairness, to get those max speeds, all your equipment has to be gigabit compliant and many people will get the connection and then be frustrated because their switches, router and/or cabling doesn't support their max speeds.

Here's a link to help better explain it all:
https://planetechusa.com/blog/ether...t3-vs-cat5e-vs-cat6-vs-cat6a-vs-cat7-vs-cat8/

The average guy who needs that explained to him (and many who do not) will have neither the proper tools or expertise to terminate CAT7. 6 or even 5e would be fine for a AP in a garage and can be done with a $10.00 crimper and a diagram from Wikipedia
 

u3b3rg33k

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Both my PC and Switch have shielded jacks on them, and those have continuity to the chassis ground.
In fact, I just searched Amazon for 1g and 10G switches, and they all have shielded jacks on them.
Now... if someone chooses to use unshielded patch cables, you have to live with the possible lower performance, as I suspect is specified by the standards.

Yes that's normal for gear to have shielding - it's as much to provide continuity for shielded cabling as it is to shield the signal from the noise made by the device itself (or the device from neighboring devices). The possible lower performance is really a non-issue, because the cable's analog bandwidth is so much in excess of what's required for digital data transmission that 100MHz (or less of performance difference just isn't relevant.

for example - here's some panduit cat6 cable:
http://www1.panduit.com/heiler/CatalogCutSheets/PUR6004BU-UY Product Page.pdf

UTP - certified to 550 MHz. 250Mhz is what you need to be rated for gigabit. That's 300 MHz of bandwidth beyond what the standard requires. even if it's done by a hack, and they wire it wrong, 9 times out of 10 it will still pass bandwidth testing. I know because I was the guy with the $10k+ Fluke meters certifying cable for 5 years - state orgs, private companies, private datacenters, etc. I almost never saw shielded cabling, to the point were I was the only one who did it when it was called for.

One of my favorites was the non-contiguous "foil" layer in someone's cabling, because it rejected a lot of crosstalk but was non-conductive down the cable, and all it required was trimming. got good results and wasn't hard for guys to handle.


sometimes you actually get reject 6A supplied as cat6, because it failed/was marginal on testing so they slap cat6 on the jacket and sell it. I've never bought name brand (panduit, systemax, belden, etc) cable/jacks that failed to pass with flying colors. I have seen ebay wire/jacks be extremely marginal (not to mention hard on the hands to work with, poor finish, casting/mold flash, etc).

Those little dividers in the cabling (X or H shape, or a ribbon) make a big difference. usually the interference you're looking to escape isn't outside sources, but from the other pairs themselves. They put a lot of tricks into the insulation (even offsetting the wire from the center of the insulation on individual pairs), to get lower crosstalk out of it.

The environment I would be looking for shielded cabling in would be an industrial plant with lots of high frequency electrical equipment (e.g. manufacturing plant with lots of VFDs) with ethernet wire run right up to/inside the gear. this is where shielding starts to shine. otherwise it's generally not worth the trouble or the expense.
 
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laser3kw

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Lots of great feedback! Need to digest. Thanks.
(To answer some of the questions that came up... Yes, my garage is not yet started. The furthest corner of the garage would be about 50ft from my house & 100ft or so from my existing router.
That's nothing for a wifi. My garage is at least 80' from my router, through two concrete walls and the garage wood wall. No problem with signal. Look at a new router such as the Linksys WRT1900ac. It has a 1 watt transmit power, about the highest I've seen ( and is what I an using).
 

u3b3rg33k

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That's nothing for a wifi. My garage is at least 80' from my router, through two concrete walls and the garage wood wall. No problem with signal. Look at a new router such as the Linksys WRT1900ac. It has a 1 watt transmit power, about the highest I've seen ( and is what I an using).

actually 839mW @2.4GHz and 608mW @ 5GHz upper, per the FCC :)
https://fccid.io/Q87-WRT1900AC
 
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