Did Matco change their wrench design

[737mechanic]

I have always liked matco wrenches for there feel and the way they take the extra step to cut out the open end of their wrenches for the actuall hex shape even though I am sure it doesn't make much deference. I just like to see the nut or bolt cradled in the open end and all the flats are butted up too.

I have noticed not all of there wrenches are cut to the hex shape. Did they get cheap and stop doing this step or what. Below are a couple pics showing what I am talking about.

 

[kythri]

Doesn't cutting the hex shape weaken the open end significantly? I'd think the arch would be far stronger...

 

[krusty the clown]

the wrenches with the V-notch were made by bonney. when bonney went out of business matco started selling armstrong/danaher made wrenches. it isn't a matter of changing designs.......it's changing suppliers.

 

[chadster1]

Doesn't cutting the hex shape weaken the open end significantly? I'd think the arch would be far stronger...

Yes it does. The arch design is stronger.

 

[737mechanic]

Yes it does. The arch design is stronger.

LOL coming from a snap-on dealer. Thats funny.

Has anyone here seen a matco wrench break because of the v notch. Me either. You guys crack me up.

Looks like I will be buying all my matco's from ebay now to get the good ones.

My matco wrenches are my favorite wrenches even over my snap-ons.

the wrenches with the V-notch were made by bonney. when bonney went out of business matco started selling armstrong/danaher made wrenches. it isn't a matter of changing designs.......it's changing suppliers

That would explain it then.

 

[chadster1]

LOL coming from a snap-on dealer. Thats funny.

Has anyone here seen a matco wrench break because of the v notch. Me either. You guys crack me up.

I have seen them spread. That is more common than breakage on an open end wrench. I dont think I have ever seen the open end of a wrench break in any brand.

 

[thesilverone]

LOL coming from a snap-on dealer. Thats funny.

Has anyone here seen a matco wrench break because of the v notch. Me either. You guys crack me up.

Looks like I will be buying all my matco's from ebay now to get the good ones.

My matco wrenches are my favorite wrenches even over my snap-ons.



That would explain it then.

it's been noted on here many times that the v notch makes the wrench weaker.

http://garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56185&highlight=v-notch

 

[Mike83]

I have seen them spread. That is more common than breakage on an open end wrench. I dont think I have ever seen the open end of a wrench break in any brand.

I saw someone return a craftsman raised profile wrench (or whatever it is called) to Sears and the open end was busted off.

 

[737mechanic]

I have seen them spread. That is more common than breakage on an open end wrench. I dont think I have ever seen the open end of a wrench break in any brand.

The V notch would not cause one to spread any more than a rounded open end wrench. If anything the V notch adds material and would cause them to be stronger.

What the V notch might cause is a stress point that could in theory cause a crack at the V location and ultimately cause it to break from that point but I nor no one I know have ever seen this.

Every wrench I have had that has spread has been a rounded open end design.

My matco's have been the strongest wrenches I have ever used.

 

[Mike83]

Geez, don't get so bent out of shape about wrenches bending out of shape.

That's fine if you like them and they work well for you.

 

[chadster1]

The V notch would not cause one to spread any more than a rounded open end wrench. If anything the V notch adds material and would cause them to be stronger.

What the V notch might cause is a stress point that could in theory cause a crack at the V location and ultimately cause it to break from that point but I nor no one I know have ever seen this.

Every wrench I have had that has spread has been a rounded open end design.

My matco's have been the strongest wrenches I have ever used.

Ok, I am sure you have seen more broken tools than I have.

 

[daveblank]

Has anyone here seen a matco wrench break because of the v notch. Me either. You guys crack me up.

When I have had to warranty them, that's exactly where they are broken.

 

[shotgunfatcat]

"Hot in the city, hot in the city tonight....tonight"

Tools bend, break, distort, there are flaws in everything, just because you never seen it, doesn't mean it can't happen.

 

[krusty the clown]

ok guy's.......the arch design is stronger, i have seen ALL open ends spread regardless of design or brand (break it loose with the box end for christs sake), and i have seen the V-notch break at the middle of the notch. anymore questions or debate on the matter?jeez......you guys just likie to argue......

i have always liked the MATCO/bonney wrenches better than any other brand based on feel and finish. but i use snap on's because the open end is stronger.

 

[wafrederick]

Cornwell is the only one that uses the V notch now.Mac did away with this V notch design too

 

[caper]

Has anyone here seen a matco wrench break because of the v notch. Me either. You guys crack me up.

Not a Matco since we don't have them here but I've seen a couple Herbrands,which are the same,do it.Bonney made the Matco's and Bonney and Herbrand were both part of the Triangle tool group and had the same open end design.

 

[krusty the clown]

Not a Matco since we don't have them here but I've seen a couple Herbrands,which are the same,do it.Bonney made the Matco's and Bonney and Herbrand were both part of the Triangle tool group and had the same open end design.

yep....i believe that bonney did in fact make the later herbrand wrenches.

 

[supertooljunkie]

I have seen an open end break. It is usually because someone has put a box end wrench on it for extra leverage, or ground the outside edges off to fit in a tighter space.
I only use an open end when there is no other option. Those are some of the least used tools in my box. I really like the feel of the older Matco wrenches. Wish Bonney was still around.

 

[rayzor32]

I've broken the open end on a wrench before, it was a 1" proto, was trying to get a rusty nut off underneath a truck in the junkyard and I had both feet pressing on the wrench then it broke

 

[X1 Mike]

The V notch would not cause one to spread any more than a rounded open end wrench. If anything the V notch adds material and would cause them to be stronger.

What the V notch might cause is a stress point that could in theory cause a crack at the V location and ultimately cause it to break from that point but I nor no one I know have ever seen this.

Every wrench I have had that has spread has been a rounded open end design.

My matco's have been the strongest wrenches I have ever used.

A sharp corner is ALWAYS weaker than a comprable radius regardless of how much extra stock is there. The sharp corner gives a concentrated area of stress while a radius spreads the load out.

 

[kythri]

When I have had to warranty them, that's exactly where they are broken.

Oh my. Handily settled by the Matco dealer.

 

[kythri]

A sharp corner is ALWAYS weaker than a comprable radius regardless of how much extra stock is there. The sharp corner gives a concentrated area of stress while a radius spreads the load out.

Seems to be what I remember from high school science/maths.

 

[daveblank]

A sharp corner is ALWAYS weaker than a comprable radius regardless of how much extra stock is there. The sharp corner gives a concentrated area of stress while a radius spreads the load out.

Has anyone ever noticed that when a socket breaks/cracks that it almost always happens at the corner? It's the same principle.

 

[a390st]

Man, they haven't had the v-notch design for years. Krusty can probably say for sure, but it has been between 10-20 years I think. After Bonney went by the wayside, Matco had an intermediate line with the v-notch before they went to the smooth radius design. The Bonney wrenches were WCL and the Matco v-notch were MCL series wrenches. I assume Danaher made the MCL wrenches, but I'm not 100% certain.

 

[Flash21]

I assume Danaher made the MCL wrenches, but I'm not 100% certain.

I would like to know who made the MCL series as well...

 

[krusty the clown]

the RCL series had the V-notch and the MCL series which replaced the RCL is the arched design. both were/are made by danaher/armstrong. bonney went away in 94 IIRC so 15 years is right.

 

[matthew]

Stress concentrations occur when there are sharp points in the shape, and cause failure, but even so I'm surprised that:
1) nobody has developed a hybrid V-notch design with some stress relief radiuses in the design, but still some contact surface on the two sides.
2) I do wonder about earlier wrenches with the arched design - some of those had abrupt changes between the arch and the two parallel sides, which makes me wonder about their strength and how it compared to V-notched shapes.
3) Was there no other application that the arched shape was useful for (some fittongs or something that fit better in that shape)?
4) The tool industry seems to have more or less standardized on the arched design. Even if it's the strongest, that's seldom enough of a reason for universal acceptance (there usually is variation in design)...

One other comment - if any of you guys engrave your tools, avoid doing so in the highest stress areas. I have seen cracks in sockets start at engravings. So don't engrave the head of the wrench, engrave the beams. And don't engrave the end of the socket the fastener fits into, engrave the drive end.

 

[Teken]

One other comment - if any of you guys engrave your tools, avoid doing so in the highest stress areas. I have seen cracks in sockets start at engravings. So don't engrave the head of the wrench, engrave the beams. And don't engrave the end of the socket the fastener fits into, engrave the drive end.

I just spay paint my tools in the embedded lettering with a color of choice to indicate these tools are mine . . .

 

[jd8850]

I've had a 7/8" Bonney explode on me while tightening a hydraulic fitting. The flying ear cut my arm pretty deep to which I still have a scar. The v-notch Bonney wrenches were beautiful but the open end is prone to breakage.

 

[a390st]

My apologies, I meant to say the RC series had the v-notched open end. I have a set of the MCL wrenches in big sizes with the arched open ends. I have retired my Bonney Matco wrenches since they can't be replaced. I still use my RC series wrench sets, though. Here is a picture of a RC series wrench next to a Mac CW model.

 

[wafrederick]

I had a 9/16 combination wrench I bought on Ebay with the V notch although part of the open end was gone.Matco dealer warrantied it with the arch design as a replacement.

 

[krusty the clown]

I have retired my Bonney Matco wrenches since they can't be replaced. .

me too

 

[otis66]

I thought the Romans settled this years ago. The Romans built everything with arches and most of it is still standing.

 

[otis66]

I've never seen a broken Snap On Socket or wrench. I have seen plenty of MAC wrenches broken at the open end "V". I once tried to break a Snap On socket just so I could get a new socket. This was about twenty years ago. I could not break that socket I put it in a vice and even tried using a 20 ton press but that socket would not breat. The only thing I could do was distort the opening of the socket. Craftstman and SK sockets are easy to break just put them is a vice and use a breaker bar. My Snap On Dealer could not stop laughing at me. He warranted the socket just so he could keep it on his truck for display. You can still see the socket on his truck. I've been a Snap On socket fan ever since. 90% of my sockets are Snap On and I have yet to break one.

 

[comedyman809]

I have seen them spread. That is more common than breakage on an open end wrench. I dont think I have ever seen the open end of a wrench break in any brand.

i will post pics of a broken sk open end 7/8 wrench tonight!
1 jaw came completely off.

 

[Hiball]

The V type open ends might be weaker but its not like they are made out of aluminum foil and they still... Demand a premium in all Used Markets.

 

[00S4Boy]

I've never seen a broken Snap On Socket or wrench. I have seen plenty of MAC wrenches broken at the open end "V". I once tried to break a Snap On socket just so I could get a new socket. This was about twenty years ago. I could not break that socket I put it in a vice and even tried using a 20 ton press but that socket would not breat. The only thing I could do was distort the opening of the socket. Craftstman and SK sockets are easy to break just put them is a vice and use a breaker bar. My Snap On Dealer could not stop laughing at me. He warranted the socket just so he could keep it on his truck for display. You can still see the socket on his truck. I've been a Snap On socket fan ever since. 90% of my sockets are Snap On and I have yet to break one.

i've broken 2 snap on sockets.

My 19mm deep thinwall impact split. And i had a seized lugbolt on a saab so i was using a shallow 17mm chromie on my xt7100 and it peeled the socket right apart.

 

[Underdog]

Here is a old set hiding over in classifieds.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=72072

 

[chadster1]

I have seen them spread. That is more common than breakage on an open end wrench. I dont think I have ever seen the open end of a wrench break in any brand.

When I posted this. I did not mean to imply that open ended wrenches never break. I have seen enough broken tools to realize that ANY tool can break.

 

[TCJ1981]

I've never seen a broken Snap On Socket or wrench. I have seen plenty of MAC wrenches broken at the open end "V". I once tried to break a Snap On socket just so I could get a new socket. This was about twenty years ago. I could not break that socket I put it in a vice and even tried using a 20 ton press but that socket would not breat. The only thing I could do was distort the opening of the socket. Craftstman and SK sockets are easy to break just put them is a vice and use a breaker bar. My Snap On Dealer could not stop laughing at me. He warranted the socket just so he could keep it on his truck for display. You can still see the socket on his truck. I've been a Snap On socket fan ever since. 90% of my sockets are Snap On and I have yet to break one.

Broke the SO chrome 8mm deep metric 3/8" drive twice. Think they were both on a Ford propeller shaft to the front diff. Just need to remember to use my impact socket instead.