Difference between fluke 87 and 88?

[signcrafter]

So after buying a used meter and having it off compared to my two flukes, http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=203153, I'm looking into my options, one of which is selling my meters and buying a different used meter. I've always used my basic fluke 77 but always keep my eye out for a deal on a more advanced meter. I like electronics and like learning more about them and as cars get more and more electronics I like to try to at least pretend I can trouble shoot electrical problems! Now that I had a "automotive" type meter in my hands but found out it is most likely not accurate I'm thinking about looking for a new meter. Since both my flukes(16 and 77) are at least 10 years old and right on compared to each other I think I would like another fluke. So doing some homework to weigh my options and figure out what I want to do.

I remember a while back there was a thread about the fluke 87 and 88 and which one was "better" for automotive work. I can't find that thread anymore and wondering what the differences are between the 87 and 88? Looks like you can get either on ebay for 150-200. Is one more geared toward auto diagnostics? I'm sure either of them would probably be more then good for me but just want to try and get the one that will offer the most features for auto repair.

 

[bcradio]

How are you able to find these for 150 to 200? The cheapest I see usually is $250 to $300

 

[signcrafter]

How are you able to find these for 150 to 200? The cheapest I see usually is $250 to $300

I searched ebay on completed sales, http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...ct=&LH_SALE_CURRENCY=0&_sop=12&_dmd=1&_ipg=50. Prices vary but if you watch long enough you can find a deal. But I suppose that will change with you looking also!

 

[zkling]

Whats up with all the multimeter threads recently?

IMHO the 87 would be better for general auto work. IIRC GM or somebody specified the 87 as the meter to use.

87 is true RMS, 88 is not
87 is more accurate
87 will do micro amps, can be very handy

just a few off the top of my head. Again I do not make my living working on cars. If I had to depend on my car skills to provide food, lets just say I would be VERY hungry

 

[bcradio]

I searched ebay on completed sales, http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...ct=&LH_SALE_CURRENCY=0&_sop=12&_dmd=1&_ipg=50. Prices vary but if you watch long enough you can find a deal. But I suppose that will change with you looking also!

Ha ha, I've got to get an air hammer first. I plan on getting the 87 myself.

 

[signcrafter]

Whats up with all the multimeter threads recently?

Well, I always keep an eye open for upgrading my meter. After getting my blue point meter that looks to be in accurate I would like to get one that is more accurate. Just trying to do some homework to know what my options are. Guess you can never have to many meters!

 

[signcrafter]

Ha ha, I've got to get an air hammer first. I plan on getting the 87 myself.

Any particular reason for the 87 over 88?

 

[zkling]

Guess you can never have to many meters!

Very true. But I would rather have one nice meter you can trust compared to a few questionable meter. If you want an accurate meter, get an 87V. If you are funds limited get a 27fm and find someone to calibrate it.

Also I forgot to add. The 88 will do RPM.

Just make a list of what features you actually need and will use then shop from there.

 

[rusty65]

88 is meant for a mechanic and a 87 is for electrician.

 

[signcrafter]

Very true. But I would rather have one nice meter you can trust compared to a few questionable meter. If you want an accurate meter, get an 87V. If you are funds limited get a 27fm and find someone to calibrate it.

Also I forgot to add. The 88 will do RPM.

Just make a list of what features you actually need and will use then shop from there.

What I need? Well, I'm just a home mechanic so "need" can be a flexible word!

My 77 has been adequate so far. But I'm always trying to learn more and expand my skills. Since the fluke 87 or 88 is pretty much the industry standard for auto repair I have been looking to eventually get one of those and figure out how to use all the features it has.

 

[zkling]

O, for some reason I got the impression you were a professional in the auto field.

For home and general use, the 87 will be way more than adequate. Save a few bucks over the 88 and gain accuracy.

 

[signcrafter]

O, for some reason I got the impression you were a professional in the auto field.

For home and general use, the 87 will be way more than adequate. Save a few bucks over the 88 and gain accuracy.

No but sometimes I pretend to be!

Is the only thing the 88 has over the 87 the ability to read RPMs? That's about all I can see.

 

[zkling]

I think also pulse width, which can also be calculated on an 87V just like RPM.

Really I think the 87V will be more than what you need. The 87V has the benefits of RMS and better accuracy which are more useful in an around the house meter than RPM or pulse width would be. IMHO of course.

 

[richfinn]

Although its true GM recommend the 87v for its true RMS feature
The reality is this is wasted on an automotive DVOM (you would probably use a scope if you were going that in depth anyway)

Fluke knows best and the pulse width feature and RPM pick up are more useful to vehicle techs IMO.

 

[mercman86]

I have the 88. Love it, it reads rpm and temperature I believe. I used it the most when tracking down parasitic draws.

 

[signcrafter]

So the main differences are 87 has true RMS and 88 doesn't and the 88 has pulse width and the 87 doesn't?

Where would I use the true RMS on cars? Where would I use the pulse width on cars? Just on injector signals?

Is pulse width all I need to test injector signals like you would with a scope?

 

[bcradio]

Any particular reason for the 87 over 88?

Pretty much for the reasons mentioned above.

You might like this link:
http://www.fluke.com/fluke/usen/products/ProdSelGuide-DMM.htm

EDIT: no fuse access on the 88 is a biggie for me also

 

[signcrafter]

Pretty much for the reasons mentioned above.

You might like this link:
http://www.fluke.com/fluke/usen/products/ProdSelGuide-DMM.htm

EDIT: no fuse access on the 88 is a biggie for me also

I found that link last night but didn't really help much, maybe because I don't know what I "need".

So what's the deal with the fuses on the 88? If I was to blow one how do you replace it?

So you like the ability to measure true RMS over the pulse width? Where would true RMS come in handy on cars?

I also found this after a recommendation from another member, http://www.tooltopia.com/electronic-specialties-590trms.aspx. True RMS and pulse width in one meter and for under 100 bucks. Gets pretty good reviews from what I have found.

 

[bcradio]

So the main differences are 87 has true RMS and 88 doesn't and the 88 has pulse width and the 87 doesn't?

Where would I use the true RMS on cars? Where would I use the pulse width on cars? Just on injector signals?

Is pulse width all I need to test injector signals like you would with a scope?

88 has that 87 doesn't:

• pulse width
• rpm
• 2 lvl back-light

87 has that 88 doesn't:

• better accuracy
• bandwidth measurement
• motor drive measurement
• micro-amps capability
• fuse access

pick your poison

 

[bcradio]

I found that link last night but didn't really help much, maybe because I don't know what I "need".

So what's the deal with the fuses on the 88? If I was to blow one how do you replace it?

So you like the ability to measure true RMS over the pulse width? Where would true RMS come in handy on cars?

I also found this after a recommendation from another member, http://www.tooltopia.com/electronic-specialties-590trms.aspx. True RMS and pulse width in one meter and for under 100 bucks. Gets pretty good reviews from what I have found.

True RMS is only used for AC measurement. If you do any work in your home, then it is critical. On a car, not so much. There are a few AC signals you will find, but RMS isn't too important there unless you need precise measurements for some reason. Almost exclusively I use DC on cars though.

The $100 meter might drop you in the same boat as the Blue Point meter did and lose accuracy over time. If you want to cut costs, look into the 115 or 117 meters from Fluke

 

[kar298]

I got a brand new 88 on eBay for around 150 a couple of months ago

 

[LG63]

True RMS is only used for AC measurement. If you do any work in your home, then it is critical.

I don't have a true RMS meter but use it routinely around the house. What are some situations where true RMS is important? (Admittedly I don't fully understand the meaning of true RMS)

 

[bcradio]

I don't have a true RMS meter but use it routinely around the house. What are some situations where true RMS is important? (Admittedly I don't fully understand the meaning of true RMS)

True RMS measures the ACTUAL voltage/current whereas the non RMS only measures the peak-to-peak and assumes a perfect AC sine wave.

The problem comes when the wave isn't perfect. You will get an inaccurate measurement then.

 

[Lurch67]

I'm in the same boat as OP. What is bandwidth?? Where is bandwidth usefull for a Diyer?

 

[redwrench60]

Lotta misinformation in this thread. People mean well so I'm not trying to be a jerk but does anyone answering questions in this thread actually have either meter in question? I do.

 

[signcrafter]

Lotta misinformation in this thread. People mean well so I'm not trying to be a jerk but does anyone answering questions in this thread actually have either meter in question? I do.

I'm still pretty confused as to what meter is better for auto use so I'm all ears if you want to clear things up.

 

[redwrench60]

I'm still pretty confused as to what meter is better for auto use so I'm all ears if you want to clear things up.

Sure, I'll help any way I can. There's been so much discussed some correct and some not so much its hard to know where to begin lol. The 87-5 is the one I want in my hand for auto or home use. I have an older 87-3 at home and a current 87-5 at work. The 88 lacks a couple key features I need. Got a specific question, ask away.

 

[signcrafter]

I guess my question is what features of the 87 would I use where? Could you give some real world examples of where I might use some of the 87 specific features(listed by another member above)? Like true RMS? Where in the house or car would I have to have true RMS? Do you need true RMS for DC measurements? What is bandwidth and where in real life would I use it? Microamps? It was mentioned that the 88 doesn't have fuse access, so if I was to screw up and blow a fuse is the meter garbage? Seems weird they wouldn't put fuse access on the 88.

The 88 has pulse width which seems like it would come in handy for measuring things like injector signals. Although in some of my searching I've read that the flukes aren't fast enough to catch some things, have to use a graphing meter or scope?

As you can tell I'm pretty green with meters besides the simpler voltage, ohm, and amps test. But I do like electrical troubleshooting and want to get a meter that will do all I need and I can learn to use the features it has as I go. I'm just a shade tree mechanic but do like to be able to handle what ever my vehicles throw at me.

Thanks

 

[zkling]

Lotta misinformation in this thread. People mean well so I'm not trying to be a jerk but does anyone answering questions in this thread actually have either meter in question? I do.

I have the 87V as well as a few other meters a scope and the knowledge to use them to their full capacity. What do you mean by misinformation? I know what I put out was factual.

Signcrafter, honestly what you need to do is sit down an start reading some of the theories behind the different multimeter functions. You are asking very basic questions. Or if you enjoy pain, go take a control theory class.

I guess my question is what features of the 87 would I use where? Could you give some real world examples of where I might use some of the 87 specific features(listed by another member above)?

Thanks

The 87 is a very good all around multimeter. It will do everything a common operator will need and then more.

RMS is limited to AC voltage, kinda. It stands for Root Mean Square. Here is a good read on it http://www.bcae1.com/voltages.htm

RPM is just a frequency reading that the Fluke 88 preforms a few basic calcs on. You can state an RPM reading in common frequency units terms such as Hz

 

[signcrafter]

I have the 87. What do you mean by misinformation. I know what I put out was factual.

Signcrafter, honestly what you need to do is sit down an start reading some of the theories behind the different multimeter functions. You are asking very basic questions.

I understand what you're saying and I agree with you. But I'm more of a hands on learner. If I sit down and read about different theories of the functions I won't get much out of it. Once I get a meter I can sit down and read and play around with the meter and learn first hand how to use the features. Will also learn more as the need pops up with vehicle repairs, but can't learn new stuff without a meter that will do that. The problem is with a purchase like this and for the price I want to make the right decision. Don't want to buy a meter and find out I need a different one. Say I get the 87 and find out the ability to measure pulse width would come in handy for something I'm working on. Will probably be the last meter I will buy, at least for a while, hopefully! So while I still have a lot of learning to do I would like to get a meter I can grow into as needed.

 

[zkling]

I understand what you're saying and I agree with you. But I'm more of a hands on learner. If I sit down and read about different theories of the functions I won't get much out of it.

I am the same way, and that is what I don't like about electricity you can't see, hold or feel it in your hand. Well maybe the last one, but lets hope not Unfortunately this is the time to learn by reading first. Unless you enjoy costly mistakes, like blown electrical components.

I think it would help you to read over at least the manual for each meter. They give some pretty good methods on when and how to use the different meters.

http://assets.fluke.com/manuals/80v_____umeng0200.pdf

http://assets.fluke.com/manuals/88______umeng0000.pdf

http://www.fluke.com/Fluke/usen/Support/Manuals/default.htm?ProductId=56135

Also note, you can measure pulse with an 87V, you will just have to calculate the actual value. The manual explains that. Same with RPM. What is nice about the 88 is that it automatically does this calculation for you. In reality the 87V is a much more advanced meter than the 88V. But the 88V MAY be more useful to a mechanic that needs quick auto type readings.

 

[LG63]

Here's the manual for the 88V if you are looking at the current version of the 88:
http://www.fluke.com/fluke_www/manualsdownload_web2.asp?location=88v_____umeng0100.pdf&Manual_Ver_ID=1187&language=English&UserLanguage=en&Supplement=false

 

[gte718p]

True RMS measures the ACTUAL voltage/current whereas the non RMS only measures the peak-to-peak and assumes a perfect AC sine wave.

The problem comes when the wave isn't perfect. You will get an inaccurate measurement then.

Please review RMS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Root_mean_square Peak to peak is the actual voltage. When you go to compute power RMS take into account the round nature of the sine wave. You don't instantly jump from peak to peak.

 

[JTH]

I have both. The only time i really need RMS is working on DC to AC inverters as they have a square wave and voltage is off w/o true RMS feature. Work on gensets for a living and find both useful. Either meter will do more than most folks will use in an automotive arena. I find Power Probe 3 the fastest on cars which means more money on flat rate. My.02$

 

[LG63]

So what's the deal with the fuses on the 88? If I was to blow one how do you replace it?

Comparing the 87V and 88V manuals, the fuses and fuse placement look identical. To me the 87V doesn't seem any more advanced than the 88V -- just different for different usage.

 

[redwrench60]

I guess my question is what features of the 87 would I use where? Could you give some real world examples of where I might use some of the 87 specific features(listed by another member above)? Like true RMS? Where in the house or car would I have to have true RMS? Do you need true RMS for DC measurements? What is bandwidth and where in real life would I use it? Microamps? It was mentioned that the 88 doesn't have fuse access, so if I was to screw up and blow a fuse is the meter garbage? Seems weird they wouldn't put fuse access on the 88.

The 88 has pulse width which seems like it would come in handy for measuring things like injector signals. Although in some of my searching I've read that the flukes aren't fast enough to catch some things, have to use a graphing meter or scope?

As you can tell I'm pretty green with meters besides the simpler voltage, ohm, and amps test. But I do like electrical troubleshooting and want to get a meter that will do all I need and I can learn to use the features it has as I go. I'm just a shade tree mechanic but do like to be able to handle what ever my vehicles throw at me.

Thanks

True RMS comes into play with AC volt and amp measurements. A real world example would be measuring AC voltage from a wheel speed sensor. Readings on these are often very low (millivolts) so accuracy is required. A non true RMS meter simply averages readings. True RMS provides a true accurate reading. 87 is true RMS, 88 is not.

The 88 has the same fuse access as the 87.

The 87 does have frequency and duty cycle measurements.

The 87-5 does have a two level backlight. 87-3 has one level.

 

[redwrench60]

Really the major differences between the 87 and 88 are the 87 is true RMS and the 88 is not.

The 88 has RPM and the 87 does not.........But the RPM feature kinda *****, it's not very fast reacting in real time. It'll show a steady slow nonchanging reading but may totally overlook a quick blip of the throttle.

Love the min/max record feature. This feature doesn't get enough attention. I find the nasty intermittents with this. And it is fast.

Love the auto hold feature for where I can't actually look at the meter while measuring.

I use the relative mode often for low ohm measurement to zero out the resistance in the meter and leads.

I use the DC millivolt setting with an optional amp clamp to enable the meter to read high amps (up to 400 amps AC or DC)

87-5 for the win.

 

[bcradio]

Please review RMS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Root_mean_square Peak to peak is the actual voltage. When you go to compute power RMS take into account the round nature of the sine wave. You don't instantly jump from peak to peak.

Please review learning how to read... I said NON rms, and it's calculated with the assumption of a perfect sine wave

 

[iBuckethed]

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123982

Someone in this thread mentioned "remembering another thread." Maybe this is it?

 

[LG63]

This may be an error on the Fluke web page but when I use their product compare page for the 87V and 88V they both show as True RMS. It seems like if the 88V were indeed true RMS, they would have that all throughout the literature. Overall, the comparison showed them to be very similar meters. Unless you're working on VFD's it seems like either would work well for both home and auto.