Differences in Nails ?

[Cuda416]

My pole barn supplier sent me 42 lbs of loose 16D hot dipped ring shank nails when collated were specified. I was told I could go ahead and buy some locally and they'd reimburse me the cost. Fair enough but no one locally (that I can find yet) , carries, 3.5" hot dipped 21 deg ring shank plastic collated framing nails. So I've begin looking online.

Prices vary wildly and so my question is fairly basic, what are the differences between...

https://www.mazenails.com/nails/9/4...lty-nails/treated-lumber/ring-shank-ptl-nails

and

https://www.fastenerusa.com/nails/s...-d-hot-dip-strip-nails-21-degree-4m-case.html

Finally, is there a better place either locally (San Antonio) or online to get these? I have a Bostitch F21PL gun so anything from 20-22 deg should work.

 

[Wamsutta]

I don't know what the difference is but the Maze nails are made in USA so I'd go with those; plus they have a much nicer website.

.

 

[toddoky]

If true 16D nails are called out for in the engineering specifications of your building, be aware that their diameter is .162", which is different than the .131" of the collated nails you are looking at.

 

[Cuda416]

that have a much nicer website.

Well that all but cinches it!

Not really and I really have no argument against made in the U.S.A. but I need to be able to justify the cost difference to the company who did not guarentee the nails were domestic. Sadly I have to admit I wasn't even thinking of it. At a 3-4 x cost difference I need to be able to argue the point though.

 

[Trey T]

They're about the same price per nail if you account the quantity difference and American made.

What are you fastening?

 

[Cuda416]

If true 16D nails are called out for in the engineering specifications of your building, be aware that their diameter is .162", which is different than the .131" of the collated nails you are looking at.

Woah, I did not know that. I tried to find some "specs" but wasn't able to. Do you have something I can point to with that info?

 

[Cuda416]

They're about the same price per nail if you account the quantity difference and American made.

What are you fastening?

Pole barn, so 2by lumber. The plans call for 16D nails for general construction and 40D's for the load bearing stuff (top ledger boards etc)

 

[Cuda416]

They're about the same price per nail if you account the quantity difference and American made.

What are you fastening?

The Maze brand is 1000 per box, the other is 4000, Maze, after shipping is 362, the other is 129 for 4000 and free shipping. Both are the .131 size and not the .162.

 

[Cuda416]

If true 16D nails are called out for in the engineering specifications of your building, be aware that their diameter is .162", which is different than the .131" of the collated nails you are looking at.

So, now that I knew what to look for, it appears the plans call for 16D but do not specify "box" or "common", so i have to assume common. Box 16D nails are .135 diameter which is quite a bit less than the .162 common spec.

What they delivered was "box" nails, when it seems those are wrong as well and should have been "common" if the assumption is correct.

I really appreciate you pointing this out to me. I'd have never known.

 

[patchap]

Maze only exists for made in USA requirements.
They make extremely good products, but a nail is a nail in the end.
Im a roofer, and they are the only manufacturer of north American made roofing coil nails. A box of coils from them costs 30x as much as Chinese nails.
I was talking to other guys online, and they mentioned some government projects require domestic made nails to meet the requirements, which is the only reason maze makes regular fasteners anymore.

 

[Cuda416]

Maze only exists for made in USA requirements.
They make extremely good products, but a nail is a nail in the end.
Im a roofer, and they are the only manufacturer of north American made roofing coil nails. A box of coils from them costs 30x as much as Chinese nails.
I was talking to other guys online, and they mentioned some government projects require domestic made nails to meet the requirements, which is the only reason maze makes regular fasteners anymore.

That makes a ton of sense actually, thanks for the info.

 

[Cuda416]

So, I'm finding out very quickly that I very likley cannot get a 16D common nail of any ilk for my framing nailer, which seems very odd, but hey, live and learn.

Next question. Can anyone recommend a good palm nailer that won't break the bank? If i'm using true 16D common nails, then I'm going to need to buy either a proper framing hammer, or a palm nailer. A palm nailer seems like it's going to be faster and easier.

EDIT: I cannot find true 16D ring shank nails, smooth yes, ring, no.

 

[dutchgray]

Just buy a hammer, even a 20oz nail hammer will drive those fine, just be slower than a proper framer, 42 lb isn't even a whole box.
Our nails here that are equivalent to that size are 100 by 4.5mm, which is just shy of 4" by 0.177", I have driven thousands of them by hand over the last few years.

 

[Cuda416]

Just buy a hammer, even a 20oz nail hammer will drive those fine, just be slower than a proper framer, 42 lb isn't even a whole box.
Our nails here that are equivalent to that size are 100 by 4.5mm, which is just shy of 4" by 0.177", I have driven thousands of them by hand over the last few years.

You're probably right. I don't do this for a living so my swinging arm aint going to be very accurate that's for sure. Might do me some good though. I might stop by the box store and check out framing hammers.

 

[dutchgray]

Look at the nail head and dont try to hit hard to start with.

 

[Cuda416]

Look at the nail head and dont try to hit hard to start with.

 

[Hawk]

You're probably right. I don't do this for a living so my swinging arm aint going to be very accurate that's for sure. Might do me some good though. I might stop by the box store and check out framing hammers.

I would practically guarantee that using a palm nailer would make your swinging arm sore as well. lol

 

[lakeroadster]

I had a deja vu moment... Framing nails

 

[matt_i]

I just bought a big box of Maze hand drive 16d HDG for my build and went after it.

I have an old Douglas framing hammer that's my fave. Its slower of course but what like 1 day slower over the course of the whole project? I understand why crews trying to make money need them but I find hammering therapeutic until I smashed my index finger lol

 

[Cuda416]

I had a deja vu moment... Framing nails

Yeah, I wanted to start clean since the question had turned to the type of nails etc. probably should have just used that same thread. It's been a learning experience so far and I've not even started the build really.

 

[Cuda416]

I just bought a big box of Maze hand drive 16d HDG for my build and went after it.

I have an old Douglas framing hammer that's my fave. Its slower of course but what like 1 day slower over the course of the whole project? I understand why crews trying to make money need them but I find hammering therapeutic until I smashed my index finger lol

Good point.

 

[Farmall450]

Maze only exists for made in USA requirements.
They make extremely good products, but a nail is a nail in the end.
Im a roofer, and they are the only manufacturer of north American made roofing coil nails. A box of coils from them costs 30x as much as Chinese nails.
I was talking to other guys online, and they mentioned some government projects require domestic made nails to meet the requirements, which is the only reason maze makes regular fasteners anymore.

Hey, I buy them

 

[Tennessee Cattleman]

Driving in 2x oak will separate the nails from the nail shaped objects from China.

 

[Cuda416]

Driving in 2x oak will separate the nails from the nail shaped objects from China.

I can believe that. Good thing I'm just nailing pine. That said, my first home was almost 100 years old and was built with boards that were a real 2x4 and much of it was oak. Old oak is hard as hell and I bent lots of nails in that house.

 

[BDT/NWMN]

Treated lumber? Not just any nail will do. The chemicals used to treat some of that lumber will turn certain nails into rusty stumps after a few years..

More homework may be required.

 

[Cuda416]

Treated lumber? Not just any nail will do. The chemicals used to treat some of that lumber will turn certain nails into rusty stumps after a few years..

More homework may be required.

I'm getting hot dipped nails which, as i understand, are required for treated wood. That sound right?

 

[patchap]

Hot dipped at a minimum, double hot dipped if you can find them.

 

[Cuda416]

Hot dipped at a minimum, double hot dipped if you can find them.

How about triple dog dipped?

 

[patchap]

Never seen triple dipped nails, if they keep making PT more and more corrosive it might be necessary.
Since these nails will be inside and hopefully not exposed to too much rain, regular hot dipped nails probably serve you fine.

 

[Cuda416]

Never seen triple dipped nails, if they keep making PT more and more corrosive it might be necessary.
Since these nails will be inside and hopefully not exposed to too much rain, regular hot dipped nails probably serve you fine.

Sorry I was kidding about the triple dog dipped. It was a reference to old ralphie boys adventures... "Christmas Story"... yeah, it's been one of those days.

 

[Handyfarmer]

in most instances when using a nail gun one can and many times will put a lot more nails in a project than by hand nailing, thus many times better nailed than if it was hand nailed, and I think they make stainless steel nails for nail guns to be used in treated lumber,

if one is using double dipped ring shanks there will be very little ring shank left on the nail as the galvanizing will cover most of it up,

The S10A350CNJ, 3-1/2" x .134 ring shank, 304 stainless steel nails are designed for use in 20-22 degree round head framing nailers. These round head stainless steel framing nails are excellent for framing, sheathing, truss building, subflooring, decking and much more
https://www.nailgundepot.com/312-x-134-ring-304-stainless-details.html

 

[wolf_from_wv]

As you're starting to swing the hammer, if someone says "Watch your finger.", don't.

Don't be like lightning with a hammer, and not hit the same spot twice, unless you watched your finger and hit it the first time.

 

[Jbullfrog]

You just need a bigger gun.


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