DIY prep options - old concrete - 400 sq ft

[vidkidruss]

I need help deciding or facing reality on what I can do for my floor on a budget. Below is a pic of how most of the 38 yr old floor looks. Very little of it has that smooth quality. Most is rough sandpaper style. Time has not been it's friend. So I was going to just have a professional epoxy flake with polyaspartic top but found out, just too much $$. I considered doing it myself and using pro products but not much savings and still had to do all the prep work myself.

So I came to idea of just doing stain and then a top coat of probably something like one-coat polyurea or similar

Nohr-S® Polyurea Garage Floor Coating | UV-Stable, 1-Part

Nohr-S® single-part polyurea floor coating — UV-stable, never yellows, unlimited pot life, resists fuel & garage chemicals. Clear or 9 colors. Free shipping.

www.legacyindustrial.co

I was going to use https://ghostshield.com/product/lithi-tek-4500 a densifier prior to staining
Also, considered just using a sealer after stain instead of the poly, https://ghostshield.com/product/siloxa-tek-8505

I have never prepped a concrete floor before and after reading various posts, I'm unsure of what I can expect. I was going to rent a wet polisher along with a Diamabrush pad.

Pioneer Eclipse Floor Polisher with Water Tank Rental 225FP16TR - The Home Depot

Rent a Floor Polisher with Water Tank Rental from one of our over 1,200 THD rental locations. Call your local store for same day pickup availability.

www.homedepot.com

Diamabrush Concrete Prep Tool Rental 12570 - The Home Depot

Rent a Concrete Prep Tool Rental from one of our over 1,200 THD rental locations. Call your local store for same day pickup availability.

www.homedepot.com

There is the heavier grinder rental, https://www.homedepot.com/p/rental/EDCO-Concrete-Grinder-10-50200-HD/316822135
but I didn't want to end up with a ton of swirls that would look bad once stained.

The main floor has a mix of the oil/paint stains, old carpet glue and these rough areas. I do have a hand grinder and shroud for small areas.

The question is can I get a surface that will be "ok enough" that once I stain and get the top coat on I won't have rough sandpapery mess? Using the Home Depot rental and Diamabrush pad? I don't need the floor to be perfect. I'm not going to be living out there on it. I'm just going to work on the vehicles, I will be on my knees at times and want to keep it clean. It does not need to be a work of art. I just want to be able to easily find a bolt when I drop it, lol.

I did read this thread and it was good education but I'm still unsure of my situation, https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/has-anyone-used-the-home-depot-grinder.357414/

I have considered just floating the entire surface in Ardex CD and trying to add a color to it.

Any advice that can help avoid wasted rentals and effort is appreciated!
RH
Austin, TX

 

[FJ4FUN]

Well, if time is not a factor and you want the most budget friendly solution, pick up a 7" angle grinder w/ diamond cup and shroud from HF for $170.00 or rent a setup for $80.00 from Sunbelt, pop a couple of Advil* and grind that floor.
Then pour on 1.5 gal of our BondTite 1101 followed with 1.25gal of EnduraShield 2254 you're done for right around $530.00. For another $10.00 bucks add SpheriTex traction additive because it will be slick.
1.5gal of BondTite would be the bare minimum to fully encapsulate the floor, if you bumped that up to 3 gal it should be enough to provide some fill for the gashes that invariably will happen when hand grinding a floor and the small cracks.

*I am NOT a doctor and am not giving medical advise...

 

[vidkidruss]

Well, if time is not a factor and you want the most budget friendly solution, pick up a 7" angle grinder w/ diamond cup and shroud from HF for $170.00 or rent a setup for $80.00 from Sunbelt, pop a couple of Advil* and grind that floor.
Then pour on 1.5 gal of our BondTite 1101 followed with 1.25gal of EnduraShield 2254 you're done for right around $530.00. For another $10.00 bucks add SpheriTex traction additive because it will be slick.
1.5gal of BondTite would be the bare minimum to fully encapsulate the floor, if you bumped that up to 3 gal it should be enough to provide some fill for the gashes that invariably will happen when hand grinding a floor and the small cracks.

I do tend to devalue my time
I was looking at your website and the various products and I'm thinking that maybe I can do this and have the epoxy style floor I wanted. I am going to do some spot grinding this weekend with just my 4 1/2" cup. I did some water tests and the entire floor appears very porous already. Even the lightly smooth (and that's being generous on the description) spots absorb the water within 30-45 minutes. I'm now beginning to think the polisher with Diamabrush will be enough for the bulk and I can spot the rest. In reading some more threads, seems a lot of people have much better concrete than me. Newer, smoother and denser.
The 3 layer partial flake kit seems not a lot more in cost and would make a great look.
If I did go the economy route you mentioned above, could I stain the concrete prior to applying the Bondtite 1101 product?

 

[FJ4FUN]

I do tend to devalue my time
I was looking at your website and the various products and I'm thinking that maybe I can do this and have the epoxy style floor I wanted. I am going to do some spot grinding this weekend with just my 4 1/2" cup. I did some water tests and the entire floor appears very porous already. Even the lightly smooth (and that's being generous on the description) spots absorb the water within 30-45 minutes. I'm now beginning to think the polisher with Diamabrush will be enough for the bulk and I can spot the rest. In reading some more threads, seems a lot of people have much better concrete than me. Newer, smoother and denser.
The 3 layer partial flake kit seems not a lot more in cost and would make a great look.
If I did go the economy route you mentioned above, could I stain the concrete prior to applying the Bondtite 1101 product?

You could apply BondTite over an acid stain but, quite frankly, I don't think you'd get the results you're looking for. The BondTite/EnduraShield combo will darken your floor (take a look at the primer in Craig's pictures HERE).

FYI, If you went with our 3 Layer-partial flake system I would recommend re-balancing the system a little bit by boosting the BondTite 1101-primer from 1.5gal to 3.0gal ( Tip: you actually get 3 quarts for "free" due to the way Wolverine packages their kits) this will give you enough to tip-off a small amount of BondTite, mix it up with some of the concrete dust that you saved from your grinding prep to make a down 'n dirty concrete patch slurry to fill in those cracks and will still leave you a generous 12mil or so primer coat. Then reduce the LiquaTile 1184 - body coat amount to 3.0gal from the recommended 3.75gal if you want to keep it at the original price and still be above the recommended minimum LiquaTile DFT (albeit ever so slightly... ;-). This re-balancing will net you an additional overall 3mil DFT (from 25.82mil to 28.83mil) and will also put an emphasis on the primer coat which will do more to address the rough condition of your substrate. Oh, and make sure to include the SpheriTex traction additive!

 

[Armorpoxy]

You should be able to hit this floor with just the Diamabrush, and then a coat of our SPGX one part polyurea and call it a day. Inexpensive and super easy to apply to stay on budget.

 

[craigdt]

I hand ground my 400sq ft with a 7" grinder.

It was very.... fulfilling to be done with it. Didn't take as many grinding hours as you might think.

Get nice kneepads, really good dust mask, cyclonic dust filter, dust bags for your shop vac and go to town.

Got all my stuff at Harbor Freight, then sold it to some poor soul after I was done with it.

I'd do it again that way.

Check my post history for my little write up.

Edit-
Here's the link.
I didn't put as much stuff about grinding in that post as I remembered.
Any questions, just ask.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...ngs-hand-ground-quick-review-and-pics.519146/

 

[FJ4FUN]

I know I'm kinda gett'n into the weeds here but I've been known to lay over the top of something similar to this when hand grinding a floor... I've got a bum knee and it's a life saver! They've got purpose built rigs like this for this exact application but they're spendy.

 

[floorman3787]

haha..... These people have you dreaming you can do this and make it look like a professional did it. There is a reason i spent 30k on tools to be able to do these garages. If you hand grind you will get grinder marks all over the floor if you are wanting to just stain it. If you hand grind it you need to do a full broadcast to hide all the bobo's you will make in the concrete. That concrete looks to be pretty soft. If going to do yourself go with epoxy and full broadcast.

 

[Alcap]

Just curious, have you pressure washed the floor yet ? 3000 psi or higher .

 

[FJ4FUN]

haha..... These people have you dreaming you can do this and make it look like a professional did it. There is a reason i spent 30k on tools to be able to do these garages. If you hand grind you will get grinder marks all over the floor if you are wanting to just stain it. If you hand grind it you need to do a full broadcast to hide all the bobo's you will make in the concrete. That concrete looks to be pretty soft. If going to do yourself go with epoxy and full broadcast.

Hand grinding a 400sf floor with a 7" wheel is totally doable, yes there will be some scars but with 28+mil of epoxy it will be just fine and he won't need to add the expense of full broadcast flake and additional flood coat unless it's a high U.V. exposure environment and/or that's the look he's going for (he's not). Case in point is Craigdt's DIY project, I would put his floor up against ANY professionally applied floor any day, anytime. It's not a dream, it's a reality that I've had the pleasure of participating in many, many, many times over the last decade.

 

[floorman3787]

Hand grinding a 400sf floor with a 7" wheel is totally doable, yes there will be some scars but with 28+mil of epoxy it will be just fine and he won't need to add the expense of full broadcast flake and additional flood coat unless it's a high U.V. exposure environment and/or that's the look he's going for (he's not). Case in point is Craigdt's DIY project, I would put his floor up against ANY professionally applied floor any day, anytime. It's not a dream, it's a reality that I've had the pleasure of participating in many, many, many times over the last decade.

Guess you didn't have the attention span to read the whole question. He wants to stain it not epoxy it. Sure put down $1,000 worth of epoxy @ 28mil thick to say on labor cost of someone else doing it. Remember kids thicker is always better haha.... He Einstein if he has done it many, many, many times over he isn't a DIY guy.

 

[floorman3787]

Hand grinding a 400sf floor with a 7" wheel is totally doable, yes there will be some scars but with 28+mil of epoxy it will be just fine and he won't need to add the expense of full broadcast flake and additional flood coat unless it's a high U.V. exposure environment and/or that's the look he's going for (he's not). Case in point is Craigdt's DIY project, I would put his floor up against ANY professionally applied floor any day, anytime. It's not a dream, it's a reality that I've had the pleasure of participating in many, many, many times over the last decade.

So your better than a professional system @ 28mil thick would cost him $1,500.00 just for the materials. This is no extra tools. Why wouldn't he hire someone to do it for him and at the same time save him some money and back ache.

 

[FJ4FUN]

Wow... You join the forum and within one day you break out the flame thrower... Nice form.

floorman3787: "Guess you didn't have the attention span to read the whole question. He wants to stain it not epoxy it."
vidkidruss: "I was looking at your website and the various products and I'm thinking that maybe I can do this and have the epoxy style floor I wanted."
floorman3787: "He [sic] Einstein if he has done it many, many, many times over he isn't a DIY guy."
FJ4FUN: "....that I've had the pleasure of participating in many, many, many times over the last decade."

floorman3787: "So your better than a professional system @ 28mil thick would cost him $1,500.00 just for the materials."
FJ4FUN: Materials would cost him less than $1,000

floorman3787: "Why wouldn't he hire someone to do it for him and at the same time save him some money and back ache."
FJ4FUN: "Hire someone"... Like you? So, you would do a 400SF floor for less than $1,000 including labor and materials??? Or perhaps you meant you'd do it for less than $1,500??? Either way, I'd be really suspicious of the quality of your materials, or, the quality of your labor, or, more likely, BOTH.

Nuff said.

Welcome aboard, thank you for your valuable contribution!!

 

[craigdt]

Hand grinding a 400sf floor with a 7" wheel is totally doable, yes there will be some scars but with 28+mil of epoxy it will be just fine and he won't need to add the expense of full broadcast flake and additional flood coat unless it's a high U.V. exposure environment and/or that's the look he's going for (he's not). Case in point is Craigdt's DIY project, I would put his floor up against ANY professionally applied floor any day, anytime. It's not a dream, it's a reality that I've had the pleasure of participating in many, many, many times over the last decade.

Yep, I left a few scars.

I thought my experience with a DA/Forced rotation polisher on vehicle paint would transfer

For sure, the epoxy totally covered any scars, and I left some pretty bad ones when I was almost done and was tired and lost concentration.
It also filled a few significant pits and holes I missed when repairing.

Here's the type of finish I left when using a couple different type of grinding wheels from Harbor Freight.
This was a very quick, single pass over the area with each. I made a few passes over each area which evened out the finish.

And you can see towards the top of the space, I definitely left a couple grooves.
But those were buried way under the epoxy, and doesn't show thru

 

[FJ4FUN]

Yep, I left a few scars.

I thought my experience with a DA/Forced rotation polisher on vehicle paint would transfer

For sure, the epoxy totally covered any scars, and I left some pretty bad ones when I was almost done and was tired and lost concentration.
It also filled a few significant pits and holes I missed when repairing.

Here's the type of finish I left when using a couple different type of grinding wheels from Harbor Freight.
This was a very quick, single pass over the area with each. I made a few passes over each area which evened out the finish.

And you can see towards the top of the space, I definitely left a couple grooves.
But those were buried way under the epoxy, and doesn't show thru

By the way, just curious, did you ever get quotes for "professional installation"?

 

[craigdt]

Only one place around here, $2300 for full flake.

I could tell they wouldn't be flexible on what I wanted, and I'd probably less than impressed for that amount.

 

[floorman3787]

Only one place around here, $2300 for full flake.

I could tell they wouldn't be flexible on what I wanted, and I'd probably less than impressed for that amount.

Where are you at and how many square ft?

 

[floorman3787]

Only one place around here, $2300 for full flake.

I could tell they wouldn't be flexible on what I wanted, and I'd probably less than impressed for that amount.

I need help deciding or facing reality on what I can do for my floor on a budget. Below is a pic of how most of the 38 yr old floor looks. Very little of it has that smooth quality. Most is rough sandpaper style. Time has not been it's friend. So I was going to just have a professional epoxy flake with polyaspartic top but found out, just too much $$. I considered doing it myself and using pro products but not much savings and still had to do all the prep work myself.

So I came to idea of just doing stain and then a top coat of probably something like one-coat polyurea or similar

Nohr-S® Polyurea Garage Floor Coating | UV-Stable, 1-Part

Nohr-S® single-part polyurea floor coating — UV-stable, never yellows, unlimited pot life, resists fuel & garage chemicals. Clear or 9 colors. Free shipping.

www.legacyindustrial.co

I was going to use https://ghostshield.com/product/lithi-tek-4500 a densifier prior to staining
Also, considered just using a sealer after stain instead of the poly, https://ghostshield.com/product/siloxa-tek-8505

I have never prepped a concrete floor before and after reading various posts, I'm unsure of what I can expect. I was going to rent a wet polisher along with a Diamabrush pad.

Pioneer Eclipse Floor Polisher with Water Tank Rental 225FP16TR - The Home Depot

Rent a Floor Polisher with Water Tank Rental from one of our over 1,200 THD rental locations. Call your local store for same day pickup availability.

www.homedepot.com

Diamabrush Concrete Prep Tool Rental 12570 - The Home Depot

Rent a Concrete Prep Tool Rental from one of our over 1,200 THD rental locations. Call your local store for same day pickup availability.

www.homedepot.com

There is the heavier grinder rental, https://www.homedepot.com/p/rental/EDCO-Concrete-Grinder-10-50200-HD/316822135
but I didn't want to end up with a ton of swirls that would look bad once stained.

The main floor has a mix of the oil/paint stains, old carpet glue and these rough areas. I do have a hand grinder and shroud for small areas.

The question is can I get a surface that will be "ok enough" that once I stain and get the top coat on I won't have rough sandpapery mess? Using the Home Depot rental and Diamabrush pad? I don't need the floor to be perfect. I'm not going to be living out there on it. I'm just going to work on the vehicles, I will be on my knees at times and want to keep it clean. It does not need to be a work of art. I just want to be able to easily find a bolt when I drop it, lol.

I did read this thread and it was good education but I'm still unsure of my situation, https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/has-anyone-used-the-home-depot-grinder.357414/

I have considered just floating the entire surface in Ardex CD and trying to add a color to it.

Any advice that can help avoid wasted rentals and effort is appreciated!
RH
Austin, TX

So what did you do for your garage

 

[vidkidruss]

Ok, well I completely forgot about posting this as other house issues (septic ) got me distracted and Winter arrived. Ok so an update and thank you for all the comments. I'm back now in the garage and I managed to do some spot grinding with 5" wheel and dust shroud and my dust collector/vacuum setup. Truthfully just the little bit I did, went pretty fast! And I learned a lot about grinding wheels from Amazon and dust shrouds, lol. This weekend I'll be finishing up the grinding and I don't think I'll even bother with a HD machine rental. My knees and back are ok and I'm looking at the results and it's good enough for me. And even though seems like a 5" wheel might take some time, that doesn't seem to be the case for me.

As to the coatings, this week I'm in the camp of doing a solid color tint in the coating material. I have to do some spot repairs and I think the solid color will mask those repairs as opposed to the stain treatment. So that's a change from what I originally thought.

I'm considering the Nohr-S in tan with anti-slip or the Armorpoxy SPGX in tan with anti-slip. AlphaGarage, I'd be curious if you have a similar option? These put me just under $600 or so for the product. Doesn't include the tools but that's a wash in all the products as they go on basically the same. My grinding setup was minimal cost, just mainly time.

I checked the floor all through Winter and into this Spring and there is no moisture issue. I think the concrete is going to drink up the first coat of whatever goes down, be it the Nohr-S or SPGX or similar.

I'm right now not considering any flakes as when I'm working on the cars, etc, and you're laying on your back looking up under a car, a nice smooth floor is kinda nice. Plus I think every flake is the bolt I just dropped, lol

Oh and I did get a quote from a franchise of one of the national chains and it was around $2,200. And yes that would've included a warranty and me not having to do any grinding (or anything obviously), it was $2,200 I didn't have to spend at the time.

Thanks for any other advice, recommendation!
RH
Austin, TX