To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

drywall mudding & taping finishes

gotta56forme

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2007
Messages
136
Location
Seattle
I'm almost finished hanging drywall in my 1000sqft garage plus attached garden shed. At the encouragement of friends & family, I've decided to hire the mudding & taping to be done as I've been slowly finishing this mancave for three years now.

I don't want a texturized finish, but it sounds like I want more than 'fire taping'. My shop walls don't need to be super smooth like what one might expect inside a home, but I still want a nice/decent look to the painted drywall in my shop.

My question: I spoke to my first mud&taper last night and he asked me some questions I wasn't prepared for, and some of what I've described as to what I want, is based on his questions. How do I most effectively and intelligently express what I want for a finish on my shop walls & ceiling? Is what I wrote in the green paragraph, the right way to tell a prospective mud&taper what I'm seeking?

Thanks in advance,

Scott/Gotta56forme
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

lupinsea

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
261
In our office we specify a "smooth wall finish" and all the contractors we usually work with know what we want. It takes some extra effort to achieve this and often requires shimming the framing and other steps to get it to look good. It comes out very flat and smooth with zero texture on it, looks great.

However, I've heard more recently from other contractors where they refer to various drywall grades (Grade 0 - 5) regarding finish quality. This might be a more recent and uniform way to describe the finish level you're looking for.

Take a look at these links:

http://www.nationalgypsum.com/resources/techtalk/revisiting.aspx

http://www.westsidedrywall.com/services/drywall.php

http://www.drywalltips.org/finishing-tips.htm


Basically, the various textures are there to hide or mask lower quality drywall finishing. By having the textures the eye doesn't pick up on any joints or other imperfections that might telegraph through the drywall. The finer the texture (or especially a no-texture smooth wall finish) the more prepwork and care (and usually time (and time is money)) needs to be done done before the drywall is hung or in the taping and mudding process.

Bottom line, it is sounding like you're wanting a Level 4 drywall finish.
 

wbclassics

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 11, 2010
Messages
182
Location
Upstate NY
USG has a massive drywall book that you can download from their website. Absolutely contains everything you'd ever want to know about drywall prep, installation, taping, mudding, skimming, and post-install problems (fixing cracks). Something like 400+ pages if I recall, well worth a read and it is free.
 

ETravis

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 21, 2010
Messages
69
Location
Nashville, TN
Sounds to me like you want a level 3 finish. I don't know if your contractor uses that language but in commercial construction it's pretty standard from my experience (terminology that is). Level one is fire tape and level 5 is skimming the whole wall.
 

bassr38

Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2010
Messages
9
Location
Louisville, Ky
That is right tell him you want a paint ready finish if he knows what he is doing he will know what you are talking about.
 
OP
G

gotta56forme

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2007
Messages
136
Location
Seattle
To be clear, 'paint ready' doesn't mean the mud&taper paints a coat of primer - that's my responsibility. Thanks to all for the answers.
 

Lugnut64052

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 1, 2008
Messages
275
Someone above mentioned Level 3.
Level 3 is ONE fill coat over the tape, and that's it. Level 4 is typically what's done inside a finished home-- tape, a fill coat, then a finish coat, then sanded.

Level 3 is what you see in a Motel 6-- everything is filled once, then textured. Motel 6 splatters the walls and acoustic blows the ceilings. They have to do this because the joints aren't finished good enough to sand off and paint. It's faster and less labor intensive too.

If you choose Level 3 and simply sand and paint you'll probably be able to see all the joints, even with flat paint.

Another thing-- not to make any judgments on your rock hanging skills, but a typical homeowner executed hanging job has many problems. If you find a finisher that'll take it on, don't be too surprised if he spends a few hours going around fixing popped nails and straightening this 'n' that, just to get it to the point it's all down flat enough to take tape. Again, no accusations are being thrown out, but that has been my experience from many years of professional drywalling.
 
OP
G

gotta56forme

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2007
Messages
136
Location
Seattle
I'll be the first to admit that I have made some mistakes, etc when hanging the rock. Some outlet holes cut slightly off; some damaged drywall in a few places; places where I let the utility knife stray and cut the surface paper on the piece I was hanging; empty screw holes from where a screw didn't bite; and a few other little problems. Will I have to pay to have them corrected? I would expect to. When I first started the project I expected to mud & tape it, too. I approached it all as a learning experience, and figured my shop was a good place for that if I ever choose to do this again.
 
Last edited:

Lugnut64052

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 1, 2008
Messages
275
Will I have to pay to have them corrected?

Yes, probably a few bucks extra, for the additional time it'll take to fix it enough to tape it. And maybe a bit of a premium just because it won't be as easy a finishing job as it could have been.

I well understand the do-it-yourself mindset though. I'm a rabid DIY-er myself, and have a similar story to tell about a hardwood floor I refinished a couple of years ago. It finally turned out "passable," but I'll have them done by a pro from now on. And you're right-- a garage is a good place to satisfy the DIY itch and cut your teeth on rock hanging. Pay the few extra dollars and move on to enjoying your mancave.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

jhelrey

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 15, 2010
Messages
7,251
Location
MN
It's a garage.... Buy the texturing gun and do it yourself. The gun isn't more than $30.00. Spray it and let it dry for a few days. Knock down the high spots, and then spray on the primer. Roll the paint.
 

rwhite692

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2008
Messages
1,850
Location
Central Valley, CA
It's a garage.... Buy the texturing gun and do it yourself. The gun isn't more than $30.00. Spray it and let it dry for a few days. Knock down the high spots, and then spray on the primer. Roll the paint.



When I did mine, I applied a very light "orange peel" texture, here is a closeup:

2526322880011691741S600x600Q85.jpg


With paint:



2648956630011691741S600x600Q85.jpg


2230080340011691741S600x600Q85.jpg


2032418440011691741S600x600Q85.jpg


2676809130011691741S600x600Q85.jpg
 

Daniel Dudley

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 4, 2009
Messages
3,546
That looks great rwhite. I think we all really want it pretty nice. You are going to be looking at it for a long time. After listening to a couple of clients who said that it didn't have to be perfect, I can tell you they were lying.

What they meant was, I want it really, really nice, for the cost of a cup of coffee.
 

John in OH

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 2, 2007
Messages
2,444
Location
SE Ohio & Eastern Virginia
rwhite, This finish looks great for a garage! How is this, "very light "orange peel" texture" applied and what tools are used? Are joints taped and mudded with one coat first? Is the mud sanded before applying the texture? Is there a description of this technique anywhere?
 

babzog

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 20, 2009
Messages
2,117
Location
Eastern Ontario, Canada
To be clear, 'paint ready' doesn't mean the mud&taper paints a coat of primer - that's my responsibility.

That's right. He'll leave it after final sanding, ready for the first coat of primer.

I don't mind hanging drywall, but I hate mudding and sanding. Takes me three times as long to get a job that looks half as good as a pro. Definately the way to go.

I wouldn't say much more than that to him... as mentioned elsewhere, guys that spec a half-assed job don't really want a half-assed job and that'll probably just piss him off (sounds like it's a small job, anyway, so getting a guy on short notice will be enough of a challenge, methinks, without compounding it). He knows you're painting it and he also knows it's a garage, not the Queen's dining room.. let him work his magic and you should be very pleased with the results.
 

Holedgr

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 21, 2006
Messages
358
Without question the ONLY thing you can be guaranteed.....you will get what you pay for....ALL of the tapers I've ever met or dealt with are egocentric and think NO ONE else can do what they do....Maybe do what they do faster than most, but quality...heh....anyone can learn...I feel (as do most tapers) that most noobs put on too much mud.....and I've had better results with the self-mix as oppesed to the premix....JMO.....Good luck either way...

-T
 

rwhite692

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2008
Messages
1,850
Location
Central Valley, CA
rwhite, This finish looks great for a garage! How is this, "very light "orange peel" texture" applied and what tools are used? Are joints taped and mudded with one coat first? Is the mud sanded before applying the texture? Is there a description of this technique anywhere?


Thanks John, I did the taping / mudding / texturing myself, so since I'm not a drywall professional, I don't really know how to describe it in the correct technical terms standard to the drywall industry, but, I will try.

There are basically two passes with mud, one pass to bed and bury the paper tape, with a standard 6" knife, and then after that is dry, knock down any big ridges or protrusions w/sanding pad, and then do a second pass with a 12" knife over all the joints to smooth it out (since the first pass shrinks back quite a bit when it dries).

I thin the mud more for the second pass to get more of a smooth "flow-out" with the 12" knife. Since I was doing this on weekends and after work, etc, I had plenty of time to let things dry in between.

I then went around using the sanding pad, I use the type that screws onto a broom handle (with the black grit screen 80 grit pad on it) just to knock down the fine ridges, etc from the overlapping knife passes.

Then I went in again here and there with a "third" pass, just correcting any little anomalies, as I found them. (I'm sure a drywall pro could do it in two passes, not me, I'm not that good). Then one more once-over with the sander. At this point I was sure that any residual anomalies in the surface would be eliminated by the texture.

I shot the texture using the "Wall-Board" brand hopper gun I had bought, many projects ago, from Home Depot. HD also sells the texture material (it comes dry and you mix w/water). You will need a paddle mixer and a good strong AC-powered drill to drive it - not a battery drill) ....I thinned the texture material mix to about the consistency of thin pancake batter. Getting the viscosity right is actually pretty simple:

You test the viscosity of the mixed material by dipping most of your index finger straight down into the mixed material and when you withdraw the finger, it should take no more and no less than about one second for the material to drip from the end of your finger tip.

Thin with more water (or add more dry material) to get to the ideal viscosity.

An old timer drywall guy taught me this, and although it's not super-scientific, it seems to work just fine.

I use 30 PSI at the hopper gun and use the medium sized orifice tip (hopper gun comes with three tip inserts).

Do a couple of spray tests on some scrap drywall to get your technique down, and you should be good to go.

Don't be alarmed if you see some random texture bits of material here and there on the wall which are higher in profile than the surrounding material. This is normal. After you have let the texture dry a day or so, you very gently go over the dried surface with your 12" knife, at a shallow angle to the wall surface, "knocking down" any little high bits of material, creating a uniform surface. (This is why this process is sometimes called "knockdown texture"...

By varying your gun settings, the amount of material applied, and spray technique, you can go from a "very light orange peel" (which is what I did), all the way up to a "heavy knockdown". I wanted a very light texture, because I did not want so much texture on the wall, that it would actually hold dust/dirt.

It is important to note that the texture material is NOT drywall mud. when dry, it is a much softer material that knocks off the wall quite easily; it only becomes "strong" when it is primed/painted.

There are some more pictures taken during the texturing process, at the link in my sig, below.

Hope that helps,

Rob
 
Last edited:

csp

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Messages
5,719
Location
Franktown, CO
Thinned premix drywall mud also works well for texture via the procedure rwhite mentions.

In this area knockdown is predominant for tract home interior walls, so you see a lot of it. Not sure I'd want in in a garage as it does create dust catchers.
 

rwhite692

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2008
Messages
1,850
Location
Central Valley, CA
Thinned premix drywall mud also works well for texture via the procedure rwhite mentions.

In this area knockdown is predominant for tract home interior walls, so you see a lot of it. Not sure I'd want in in a garage as it does create dust catchers.

CSP that is true, you CAN thin drywall mud to use as texture (I have done it in a pinch when I had the mud available, and just a small repair area to shoot) BUT I wouldn't really want to do a whole job this way, since the texture material is cheaper than drywall mud...

I definitely agree about not using a rough texture in the garage, that is why I went with an orange-peel type of texture.
 

Ron Lombardo

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 20, 2006
Messages
393
Location
New York
Not here in NY ..level 3 is 3 coats and 5 is shear perfection skimming the entire wall ... my advise is pay for 3 coats ..1 to fill the laps and but joints, 2 to blend them in and 3rd coat to skim and feather all the **** , lap and nail holes. We dont sand with 3 coats ...

R
 

trbomax

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 21, 2010
Messages
2,556
Location
starvation lake,mi.
I like to tape and first coat with hot mud,almost no shrinkage and if you get back on it after about an hour, you can scrape anything off/out that would need sanding,I dont like to sand.I only use premix for topping (last coat).Done a few houses and shops this way and usually dont texture,preferring a smooth look.The guy that showed me how to do it this way was a drywall contracter that I worked for part time in the early 70's.Use inside corners too,we never used to have those,had to fold tape with a special head on a "bazooka pump" then knife it off.
 
OP
G

gotta56forme

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 6, 2007
Messages
136
Location
Seattle
Thought I would share the results of my first bid, since I started this thread...

For a level 3-4 taping on my 1000sq ft shop with 9' walls, two-thirds 11'6" cathedral ceiling, and two skylights = $2300+tax.
 
Last edited:
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom