Dumb question: add down force to manual door

[PCustoms]

So I think I know the answer, but figured I'd ask...

Door is manual (no opener) and has reduced clearance hinges at the top. How can I increase the down force from the top, or increase how the door presses against the header?

I suspect that I can't without an opener, which leads me to last years solution, a block of wood and a clamp on each track. Not fast, but tightens the door and reduces drafts for the winter.

 

[The Cobbler]

so the top of the door needs to press tighter to the top weatherstrip? does the door go all the way down or can it be pushed tighter to the floor, or can the top rollers be adjusted to push it tighter ?

 

[PCustoms]

so the top of the door needs to press tighter to the top weatherstrip?

Yes

does the door go all the way down or can it be pushed tighter to the floor, or can the top rollers be adjusted to push it tighter ?

If I force it down further the bottom seal compresses, but it doesn't bring the top in tighter.

Edit: not my door, but the quick turn brackets look like this:



Seems like no way to get pressure unless you push on the bracket, or push the center of the door (like an opener would)

 

[PCustoms]

I think next year when I rebuild the wall (non-PT framed direct to slab at grade level) and re-mount the track I'll convert it over to a torsion spring and jackshaft setup, then install an opener. Super tight clearances so when I removed the old doors I didn't even try to get an opener in. Previous owner notched all the joists to make the original "fit"...

 

[The Cobbler]

when I had a low headroom door I thing the rollers were more like regular doors, I wonder if you could change the top rollers , agree it seems like the way it is no way to get more pressure

 

[PCustoms]

when I had a low headroom door I thing the rollers were more like regular doors, I wonder if you could change the top rollers , agree it seems like the way it is no way to get more pressure

When I first put this in I had regular rollers. When I started insulating (this is a below a bedroom) and I put strapping in the door bound up, so I had to switch to these.

I think for now I'm going to screw a 2x4 across the header and cut a wedge to push it down/tight. If I need to use the door I can push the door down, slip the wedge out and open it. I don't park inside so it typically gets limited use in the winter.

 

[larry_g]

Yes



If I force it down further the bottom seal compresses, but it doesn't bring the top in tighter.

Edit: not my door, but the quick turn brackets look like this:



Seems like no way to get pressure unless you push on the bracket, or push the center of the door (like an opener would)

Quick look at that picture; can you put a spacer between the door and the roller bracket? Or lower the roller bracket lower on the door so the roller drops further into the curve forcing the door into the jam?

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

Can you adjust the tracks?

 

[PCustoms]

Quick look at that picture; can you put a spacer between the door and the roller bracket? Or lower the roller bracket lower on the door so the roller drops further into the curve forcing the door into the jam?

Hmm, maybe?

The spacer definitely would not work, as there's nothing driving the roller "down". I'm not sure if moving it would work, as the roller would still be in the curve. I'm hesitant to try as the door already has 2 sets of holes now.

 

[PCustoms]

Can you adjust the tracks?

In what way?

Rest of door is tight. See my reply above, the top roller is in the curved section.

 

[The Cobbler]

I wonder if there was an offset on the top rollers ( pushing the bar downwards) if that would push the bar down putting more forward force on the door.
dunno if I explained that very well ...

 

[The Cobbler]

or lower the pivot point on the door?

 

[Wrench97]

Torsion spring door?
Is the door balanced IE if you open it half way does it stay there?

 

[PCustoms]

Torsion spring door?
Is the door balanced IE if you open it half way does it stay there?

No, extension springs

I think next year when I rebuild the wall (non-PT framed direct to slab at grade level) and re-mount the track I'll convert it over to a torsion spring and jackshaft setup, then install an opener. Super tight clearances so when I removed the old doors I didn't even try to get an opener in. Previous owner notched all the joists to make the original "fit"...

 

[PCustoms]

Well I'm not going to post a pic because this is definitely hack work....

As I'm measuring for a block and some sort of wedge, I look down and see one of my quick clamps sitting there. Hmmm....

Set the clamp for expansion, used a screw in the hanger hole (so it can't fall) and mounted it to the blocking to align with the center of the door. Swing it up, a couple squeezes and it pushed the door down/out just like an opener would.

Unless some other project comes up in the spring the plan is to fix the front wall and finish the ceiling, as I said upthread I think I'll convert and install an opener. This will stop the draft until then.

 

[Wrench97]

Take some tension off the springs, with extension springs ig you open the door you can easily unhook them from the holes in the track frame and move them down one.

 

[PCustoms]

Take some tension off the springs, with extension springs ig you open the door you can easily unhook them from the holes in the track frame and move them down one.

Unless I'm missing something that won't do anything...

The door is closed, the lock bars are engaged, and the top is loose to the seal. The springs are pulling on the bottom of the door at that point.

 

[firebirdparts]

In what way?

Rest of door is tight. See my reply above, the top roller is in the curved section.

Up. When you lift the tracks straight up, where's the door gonna go.

 

[PCustoms]

Up. When you lift the tracks straight up, where's the door gonna go.

You saying add length to the verticals?

These are the right length for this door, but more importantly I'm out of headroom. If I raised the track I'd hit the ceiling.

 

[PCustoms]

Let me ask the question a little different, how tight do manually operated doors usually seal?

 

[The Cobbler]

how right do manually operated doors usually seal

mine is daylight proof. but not a low head set up . pretty sure my previous low head door was daylight proof tho

 

[PCustoms]

mine is daylight proof. but not a low head set up . pretty sure my previous low head door was daylight proof tho

This was with no opener?

Mine wasn't daylight proof, which is how I caught it. I assumed the weatherstrip had fallen off or was flat, but when I went to change it today saw what was going on.

 

[The Cobbler]

no opener , it was a bit tough to get going from closed position . that was about 25 yrs ago , so I am a bit foggy on it

 

[PCustoms]

no opener , it was a bit tough to get going from closed position . that was about 25 yrs ago , so I am a bit foggy on it

With all the suggestions here I was looking closer at things tonight, and it looks (like everything else in this house) the original framing was botched. The summer I bought the house I walked in one door and replaced this one with the same size and didn't put much thought into it with all the other projects.

I think the door should have been installed 4" to the side and set in further, which would have left room for a side mount opener.

 

[Wrench97]

The weight of the door holds it down tighter, less tension the weight of the door will hold it down thus pulling the top in tighter.

 

[PCustoms]

The weight of the door holds it down tighter, less tension the weight of the door will hold it down thus pulling the top in tighter.

Doesn't work.

I can press down on the door (either at the bottom or about halfway up where the lock bars are) as much as I want and the top does not get tighter.

 

[Snip's]

When the door is in the closed position, the location of the top roller in the curved part of the track sets the panel sealing position...
If the short link (in the picture example) were made longer, you will close the panel gap...
If you can't make that link longer, can you make / add some shim spacers on the pivot plate that mounts to the panel face?

 

[PCustoms]

When the door is in the closed position, the location of the top roller in the curved part of the track sets the panel sealing position...
If the short link (in the picture example) were made longer, you will close the panel gap...
If you can't make that link longer, can you make / add some shim spacers on the pivot plate that mounts to the panel face?

I could, but that's just going to push the roller back/up more in the track.

What is the roller supposed to push against in your scenario?

I'm starting to wonder if I had to cut the straight tracks shorter when I put them in. Seems like the radius is too close to where I need to seal

 

[Snip's]

With my senaro the bottom panel would stay tight to the floor...
Are you saying there is no weight keeping the bottom panel from lifting?
Widening the top of the geometric wedge should push the top door panel, but the bottom panel can't lift off the floor for it to work...

 

[PCustoms]

With my senaro the bottom panel would stay tight to the floor...
Are you saying there is no weight keeping the bottom panel from lifting?
Widening the top of the geometric wedge should push the top door panel, but the bottom panel can't lift off the floor for it to work...

Huh?

My top panel is loose at the top, not making a good seal. The bottom 3 panels, and half the top panel, fit great. Pulling/pushing the bottom of the door doesn't pull the top half of the top panel and tighter

 

[Firebrick43]

The track needs to be lifted/curved section higher to get the rollers further down in the curve. Probably wouldn't take much.

 

[Sno-Pro]

Agree with above post. Try raising the track 1”, that will “wedge” the top roller into the more vertical part of the 90*.

 

[rlitman]

The track needs to be lifted/curved section higher to get the rollers further down in the curve. Probably wouldn't take much.

+1 That adjusts how tightly the top door section fits. But if you don't have the height...

What about sprung hinges that push the door forward? https://www.amazon.com/Energy-Saving-Garage-Hinge-Residential/dp/B00AAHVIYA?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[Wrench97]

Are the top roller brackets adjustable?

 

[welder4956]

This might be another option: https://thermotraks.com/?gclid=CjwK...dVPEJNPySKjKC1kXWjTrM8pWV4mxZnMBoCJPgQAvD_BwE

 

[PCustoms]

+1 That adjusts how tightly the top door section fits. But if you don't have the height...

What about sprung hinges that push the door forward? https://www.amazon.com/Energy-Saving-Garage-Hinge-Residential/dp/B00AAHVIYA?tag=atomicindus08-20

Thanks for actually reading my posts, you're correct that I don't have the height.

Those hinges might help, never thought about that. I think if I can't get an opener on it next year this might be a good permanent option

Are the top roller brackets adjustable?

They were, but I don't have the original brackets anymore. I showed an example of the quick turn brackets I had to use to to the lack of headroom.

 

[PCustoms]

This might be another option: https://thermotraks.com/?gclid=CjwK...dVPEJNPySKjKC1kXWjTrM8pWV4mxZnMBoCJPgQAvD_BwE

Can't see how that affects anything but the straight section, which is already adjusted and sealing correctly.

 

[Firebrick43]

Clopays instructions on that style of hinge says you may need to relocate the holes(drill new ones) on the garage door itself in step 4. Unbolt the hinges from both sides and push the quick turn brackets down until the door section top edge is in the correct position and mark were the new holes will be.