Electric Parking Brake

[theoldwizard1]

So my 2016 Ford Edge has an electric parking brake. Is a special diagnostic tool required to reset/rewind it when you do a rear brake job ?

Segue - When I first heard of electric parking brakes I thought, "Great, another elctro-mechanical thing to fail !" But maybe it is a good idea.

• No parking brake cable to freeze up (also saves weight and installation time)
• Simple/easier method of making certain the parking brake is off when the car is rolling
• Easy one finger actuation (and yes, it does actuate when the car is rolling, but you can not modulate it for "hand brake turns" !)
• The big save would be if you do not require the inside shoes/drum as well as the main disc/pad/rotor as on some vehicles

 

[Tonyuk]

For VW's you need VAG-COM on a tablet or laptop to retract the piston into its service position, i would assume ford is the same for their system.

 

[shawndp]

Yes - we use our handheld obd tool to get the brakes into Service mode, but a lot of cars have a bypass to that requirement. This video may be of help -

 

[WhiffySpark]

You can usually jump the wires to put it in service mode. Specific procedures for each car. I would get a scanner though. Maybe a used maxme on eBay.

Everyone I’ve done he caliper pushes in normally after in service mode. They don’t twist like the cable style

 

[cvairwerks]

VW/Audi/Seat/Skoda all require VCDS or factory level software to retract the calipers. You also have to input the new pad thicknees for the wear monitoring system, or it will fault and give you a constant failure light. Certain models also require you to keep a constant 12 volt source attached to a specific terminal as the car has to be kept on during the entire change sequence. Failure to do so, or allowing the battery to sag below a certain voltage triggers a electrical load sheding and a factory software reset.

 

[WhataTool]

Every EPB i've come across I ran 12V to the disconnected connector terminals and it started to rewind.
Needing Brand OEM OBDII tools for rear parking brakes is a cancer.

 

[clubairth]

I have had several Ford's with the EPB.

The all had cables and just used the electric motor to pull on the cables.
I have found rear calipers require a turning motion while applying pressure to retract the pistons.
.
.
.

 

[bimmer630]

There's a service mode on the BMWs but I just turn the piston in manually. Who wants to hook the tester up just to do a brake job anyway. I wouldn't doubt it if the same company build these calipers for all of the car makers

 

[m3bs]

I did them on a 2012 BMW X3 by removing the actuator and cranking the mechanism out with an allen wrench. Since then, I picked up a Foxwell scan tool, and used it to do my 2016 VW.

Found this on YT for a Fusion:

Perhaps the same trick works for your Edge.

 

[jessesandy]

Just curious,
Do the normal brakes use this electric system, or just the emergency brake?
Is there still a mechanical way to apply some brakes ? (Other than Fred Flintstone style.)
Do the calipers controlled by electric actuators default to "on" and require power to release them ?

 

[m3bs]

Can't speak to others, but BMW and VW use a motor to actuate a ball screw mechanism attached to the rear calipers to apply pressure to the brake pads. The mechanism is self locking, so no power is required to keep it engaged. If the switch is activated with the car in motion, it actually applies brakes to all four wheels via the ABS hydraulics to bring the car to a stop. (Good to know if the driver is incapacitated...) Sorry, but handbrake turns are history.

 

[LXCam]

Worst idea ever. Going beyond what only one guy brought up and one guy acknowledged what is the fail safe operation for these. Power to actuate or power to release.

What happens during a service situation when the parking brake should be applied but you need to disconnect the battery? Obviously the fail safe design will dictate this action.

Or how about this simple little reminder. These are called emergency brakes for a reason. What happens the day you cruising down the road and for some reason you lose all method of normal braking ability and these fail to operate.

Thanks but I'll gladly take at least one good ole fashion mechanical method of applying the brakes any day over the convenience of these.

 

[WhiffySpark]

Worst idea ever. Going beyond what only one guy brought up and one guy acknowledged what is the fail safe operation for these. Power to actuate or power to release.

What happens during a service situation when the parking brake should be applied but you need to disconnect the battery? Obviously the fail safe design will dictate this action.

Or how about this simple little reminder. These are called emergency brakes for a reason. What happens the day you cruising down the road and for some reason you lose all method of normal braking ability and these fail to operate.

Thanks but I'll gladly take at least one good ole fashion mechanical method of applying the brakes any day over the convenience of these.

They aren’t called emergency brakes anymore. They’re called parking brakes now. We were taught in school they will not stop you only slow you down.

 

[LXCam]

They aren’t called emergency brakes anymore. They’re called parking brakes now. We were taught in school they will not stop you only slow you down.

I dun't care, I still want them.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Worst idea ever. Going beyond what only one guy brought up and one guy acknowledged what is the fail safe operation for these. Power to actuate or power to release.

I will bet 90% of the light duty vehicles in the Midwest and Notheast that are more than 3 years old, have NON-FUNCTIONING parking/emergency brakes. Typical issue is rust in the cable.

Maybe E-brakes will resolve this issue.

 

[jessesandy]

Sorry, but handbrake turns are history.

We called them Starsky and Hutch Maneuvers.

Anyway, mechanical brake vs no mechanical brake got me thinking of those stories about runaway Toyotas from a few years back. At the time, I wondered why they didn't just step on the brakes and/or pull the emergency.

(Or, maybe the runaway car story was just an urban rumor?)

 

[Moto]

They aren’t called emergency brakes anymore.

Yeah, just try telling people that.

They don't want to hear that the brakes are the brakes and that is all they have.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Anyway, mechanical brake vs no mechanical brake got me thinking of those stories about runaway Toyotas from a few years back. At the time, I wondered why they didn't just step on the brakes and/or pull the emergency.

At WOT, no emergency/parking brake would have had much affect.

I know all the car companies reviewed their push button start/stop software in anticipation of a coming safety mandate from the feds (which never happened). In most cases, multiple presses on the button will also such the engine down, nit just press and hold.

 

[honcho]

An emergency brake story: I had a brake job done at a business called Brake and Wheel of Arkansas (motto: "you can bet your life on Brake and Wheel of Arkansas") on a 1977 Toyota Corona and they did something bad wrong on the rear wheels. I lost both brake circuits when both rear wheel cylinders failed while on a road trip. With no brakes on the interstate near Richmond, Virginia right as I was approaching a toll booth I used the emergency brake and downshifting to avoid crashing into the cars ahead of me. Made a believer out of me on the importance of having a functioning emergency brake.

 

[cgaengineer]

We called them Starsky and Hutch Maneuvers.



Anyway, mechanical brake vs no mechanical brake got me thinking of those stories about runaway Toyotas from a few years back. At the time, I wondered why they didn't just step on the brakes and/or pull the emergency.



(Or, maybe the runaway car story was just an urban rumor?)

All those folks had to do was turn off engine and apply brakes.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[cgaengineer]

I did them on a 2012 BMW X3 by removing the actuator and cranking the mechanism out with an allen wrench. Since then, I picked up a Foxwell scan tool, and used it to do my 2016 VW.

Found this on YT for a Fusion:

Perhaps the same trick works for your Edge.

I have the same foxwell unit for my BMW’s and mini...great tool, a must have when you have to replace valvetronic motor!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[bushmechanic]

They aren’t called emergency brakes anymore. They’re called parking brakes now. We were taught in school they will not stop you only slow you down.

You were taught wrong.

 

[Mechanical Noise]

They aren’t called emergency brakes anymore. They’re called parking brakes now. We were taught in school they will not stop you only slow you down.

The parking brake will stop the car. Eventually.

 

[Mechanical Noise]

I liked using the parking brake from a dead stop on a upgrade to keep my manual transmission cars from rolling downhill.

Does that work OK with an E-brake? The on/off action seems like a detriment.

 

[LXCam]

I liked using the parking brake from a dead stop on a upgrade to keep my manual transmission cars from rolling downhill.

Does that work OK with an E-brake? The on/off action seems like a detriment.

It seems like about everyone has a hill brake assist feature now. Heck even my new truck has it with an auto ******. I thought it was a joke when I first got it but within a couple weeks of buying this truck I towed a 8000lb load out to Prescott AZ and while navigating the residential roads up in the hills I'll be damned if that wasn't a convenient feature. Some of the stop/starts where steep enough I would have done the brake/gas deal so the truck won't roll backwards but this feature came to life and none of that was needed.

 

[jessesandy]

It seems like about everyone has a hill brake assist feature now. Heck even my new truck has it with an auto ******. I thought it was a joke when I first got it but within a couple weeks of buying this truck I towed a 8000lb load out to Prescott AZ and while navigating the residential roads up in the hills I'll be damned if that wasn't a convenient feature. Some of the stop/starts where steep enough I would have done the brake/gas deal so the truck won't roll backwards but this feature came to life and none of that was needed.

What's next? Are these damn cars are going to drive themselves!!!

 

[Mechanical Noise]

What's next? Are these damn cars are going to drive themselves!!!

I'm told Studebaker had a hill holder back in ancient times. I suppose most people were fine with using the parking brake.

 

[LXCam]

What's next? Are these damn cars are going to drive themselves!!!

Never happen.



Back in 06 I was the first guy in the nation to swap a 6.1 hemi into a 5.7 car. When working with the one and only tuner in the country that had the ability to modify the PCM one of the options was to turn off all means of torque management. He warned me (with great concern, haha) that by doing so it would also eliminate the ABS system. Oh darn whatta shame, I'll take me chances, disable ALL OF IT!

 

[Mechanical Noise]

It seems like about everyone has a hill brake assist feature now. Heck even my new truck has it with an auto ******. I thought it was a joke when I first got it but within a couple weeks of buying this truck I towed a 8000lb load out to Prescott AZ and while navigating the residential roads up in the hills I'll be damned if that wasn't a convenient feature. Some of the stop/starts where steep enough I would have done the brake/gas deal so the truck won't roll backwards but this feature came to life and none of that was needed.

I did not know that. Seems OK with an automatic but half the fun of driving a manual is getting those details coordinated as smoothly as possible.

 

[LXCam]

I did not know that. Seems OK with an automatic but half the fun of driving a manual is getting those details coordinated as smoothly as possible.

Agreed. My sons first car was a 96 Z28 with a 6 speed. I would not allow him to drive it until he nailed a hill start every time without issue. I bet my neighbors must have thought I was nuts since we spent several nights working on this right around the corner from my house on a road that has about a 20 degree incline for a couple hundred feet. In over 40yrs of driving I've had a half dozen instances being behind someone who could not do this and rolled into the front of my truck. Two of those times results in some pretty ugly arguments about who hit who.

I'm not much of a car nanny fan but some of these advances can be darn right handy. Hill assist is certainly one of them for a stick car.

 

[WhiffySpark]

I just let the clutch out until it holds the car. Every car is different and when you drive 100 cars a week it’ll do lol

 

[Hilltopmasonry]

All those folks had to do was turn off engine and apply brakes.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

And put it in neutral...the engine could rev all it wants then


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Hilltopmasonry]

Agreed. My sons first car was a 96 Z28 with a 6 speed. I would not allow him to drive it until he nailed a hill start every time without issue. I bet my neighbors must have thought I was nuts since we spent several nights working on this right around the corner from my house on a road that has about a 20 degree incline for a couple hundred feet. In over 40yrs of driving I've had a half dozen instances being behind someone who could not do this and rolled into the front of my truck. Two of those times results in some pretty ugly arguments about who hit who.



I'm not much of a car nanny fan but some of these advances can be darn right handy. Hill assist is certainly one of them for a stick car.

If you're not used to the hill assist feature it is annoying. my new SS Camaro has it and every time it activates it always throws me off because you have to give it a little more gas and several times I have actually killed the car. I've been driving stick shift for 25 years now and it's just something that I'm not used to.

Otherwise yes it is a nice feature when you learn how to drive with it especially because on the steepest hills the car behind you pull right up to your rear bumper for some reason


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Pantsfall_McFixit]

I don't like electric parking brakes, electronic throttle, etc. We're relying on computers not to get stuck, and cause the throttle to stay open, or not apply the parking brake. Computers are only as good as their code and manufacturing, either one or both is bad then you get logic errors causing unexpected behavior. Most computer code is terrible due to time constraints, management failure, or inexperience.

In my opinion safety systems should always be able to be actuated manually.

 

[WhiffySpark]

I don't like electric parking brakes, electronic throttle, etc. We're relying on computers not to get stuck, and cause the throttle to stay open, or not apply the parking brake. Computers are only as good as their code and manufacturing, either one or both is bad then you get logic errors causing unexpected behavior. Most computer code is terrible due to time constraints, management failure, or inexperience.

In my opinion safety systems should always be able to be actuated manually.

Throttles fail closed

 

[WhiffySpark]

The parking brake will stop the car. Eventually.

As long as it doesn’t rip apart from the backing plate or such. Just stating that’s what we were taught. I’m sure it depends on the vechile as well. I don’t see a shoe in rotor system stopping a suv from70 mph but it’s possible I assume

 

[theoldwizard1]

I liked using the parking brake from a dead stop on a upgrade to keep my manual transmission cars from rolling downhill.

I have not "stirred the gears" in quite awhile, but I can not recall actually using the parking brake to get rolling up hill. Quick off the brake and on the gas while releasing the clutch. Maybe a bit of roll back. Of course there ar no really big hills around here either.

 

[Pantsfall_McFixit]

Throttles fail closed

Even if the computer is telling it to be open? I'm not talking about a mechanical throttle failure, but a computer logic error.

If there is some kind of safety built in I'd like to know about it.

 

[jessesandy]

Even if the computer is telling it to be open? I'm not talking about a mechanical throttle failure, but a computer logic error.

If there is some kind of safety built in I'd like to know about it.

I found this seven year old discussion about the runaway Toyota issue.
Make of it what you like. It's just an on-line forum, after all.

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f37/c-d-tests-toyota-brakes-full-throttle-87714/

Part of the discussion is that Toyota started (quietly) rushing to upgrade the software in their drive by wire systems in response to the fatal crashes. The software update automatically closed/reduced the throttle whenever the brake pedal is pushed even if your foot was also on the gas.
A feature that was common among other manufacturers.

 

[theoldwizard1]

BACK ON TOPIC !

There has to be a Ford tech out there with the definitive answer ! Is it the same as the Fusion or not ? BTW, the Edge has push button start, if that matters.