Encapsulating VCT & Cutback adhesive with possible asbestos

[75gmck25]

My basement floor is covered with 12"x12" vinyl tile that is held down with a black adhesive. A few tile squares are missing due to plumbing repairs and other issues, but I have about about 400 sq ft of intact tile, and about 40 sq ft of exposed black adhesive. The adhesive does not break down when exposed to hot water, so it is probably cutback adhesive that was formulated with asbestos. The tile that is left is in good shape and generally unbroken.

The recommended process is to encapsulate the suspect VCT tile and adhesive with self leveling concrete (or some other material) and put the new flooring on top. I don't have enough headroom to add any type of subfloor layer as encapsulation, so SLC seems like the right approach. Some SLC products state that they work over cutback adhesive, but then the directions say to soften and scrape the adhesive before pouring the SLC. I thought the whole point was to not disturb the adhesive.

- The product Param looks like it would work well for encapsulation, and it specifically mentions installation over VCT. However, the web site has no pricing and you must call them to find out more info. I'm suspicious that I will find out its a very expensive product.

- I also looked at Home Depot today and they carry the LevelQuik self-leveling product. The instructions state that it will work on top of cut back adhesive or concrete as long as you use primer to ensure a bond, but it does not mention installation on top of VCT.

- The other two products I've seen recommended are Ardex SD-F and Mapei Planipatch with PlaniPlus additive.

Some articles have also suggested using two-part epoxy garage floor paint, but I would have to level the areas first where there is only adhesive.

Does anyone have experience with using one of these products to encapsulate VCT and cutback adhesive before laying down sheet vinyl? My sheet vinyl only needs to be glued at the edges, so all I need in the middle is a flat floor with no bumps or ridges.

Thanks,

Bruce

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

Does anyone have experience with using one of these products to encapsulate VCT and cutback adhesive before laying down sheet vinyl? My sheet vinyl only needs to be glued at the edges, so all I need in the middle is a flat floor with no bumps or ridges.

Thanks,

Bruce

Take a look at this Web article. This fella uses a feather finish from Ardex.

http://www.wnyhandyman.com/encapsulating-cutback-tar-like-adhesive/

 

[75gmck25]

Ardex SD-F definitely seems to be the most frequently recommended product if I do not want to remove/scrape the cutback. All the other products require you to remove the cutback with a cleaner and use the skim coat over the residue.

I found stores locally (within about 30 miles) that sell Ardex, so maybe I will pick some up and try it on my utility room floor before I use it on a larger area.

Bruce

 

[slip knot]

I would have it removed. either do it yourself or hire it done. asbestos cut back is probably something that would require you to disclosure when you sell but if its removed then its not there to deal with later. Most of the cutback I've dealt with is not very hard and I doubt that any skim will hold up well over time if it isn't removed.

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

I would have it removed. either do it yourself or hire it done. asbestos cut back is probably something that would require you to disclosure when you sell but if its removed then its not there to deal with later. Most of the cutback I've dealt with is not very hard and I doubt that any skim will hold up well over time if it isn't removed.

Makes a good point. Here is an example of an adhesive remover that can be used on cutback. It's $20 per gallon.

From the product page: "It can help you easily remove many different flooring adhesives such as sheet vinyl and carpet foam backing, black cutback adhesive and many more."

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Sentinel-Formula-747-Plus-128-oz-Adhesive-Remover-SPI747-1/202523866

 

[SunsetsAndFriends]

Encapsulating VCT & Cutback adhesive with possible asbestos

And the trick with safely removing this is to keep it wet with the adhesive remover. Never scrape dry. Adhesive removers typically work by allowing the remover to soften the material over time, keeping it wet and then cleaning up with a putty blade.

 

[mpraddict]

Good information in this thread
http://garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=133697

 

[SteveL]

Hoping to learn something here as I have a 24' x 24' basement shop with VCT that started cracking and pealing some time ago and need to finally get it taken care of.

 

[stage20]

roll the ardex primer on and use the ardex leveler. that primer is sticky and the leveler has a lot of grab in itself.

only issue is when the rest of the tiles start letting loose it may cause a future issue depending on what you are putting on top for a finished product.

 

[Cakeaholic]

There is product called Bean e doo that we use to remove cut back. Just be sure to get all of it the smallest dot of adhesive can cause failure. If you use Param just be aware that you have to strip the wax off the existing vct and apply a primer.

 

[theoldwizard1]

IGNORE EVERYTHING I HAVE TO SAY ABOUT REMOVING BUILDING MATERIALS THAT MAY CONTAIN ASBESTOS.


Asbestos that is added to "other" materials (like tile or adhesive) is usually very safe. It is the asbestos that can become friable (like in pipe insulation) that is dangerous.

I removed tile that likely had asbestos in it (from a house built in the late 50s) with a heavy scraper. Most of it came up as one piece and the rest as big chunks. I scraped the bare concrete and vacuumed up what little additional I got off (and I am still alve !)

I used Sentinel 747 to remove the cutback. Thoroughly wet an area about 3'x3'. Let it still for 15-30 minutes. Wipe up with paper shop towels. I did the entire area twice (yes, it took multiple days) because part of it was going to get marle tile and part was going to get epoxy paint.

I did etch the concrete before the epoxy and both came out great !

 

[stage20]

IGNORE EVERYTHING I HAVE TO SAY ABOUT REMOVING BUILDING MATERIALS THAT MAY CONTAIN ASBESTOS.


Asbestos that is added to "other" materials (like tile or adhesive) is usually very safe. It is the asbestos that can become friable (like in pipe insulation) that is dangerous.

I removed tile that likely had asbestos in it (from a house built in the late 50s) with a heavy scraper. Most of it came up as one piece and the rest as big chunks. I scraped the bare concrete and vacuumed up what little additional I got off (and I am still alve !)

I used Sentinel 747 to remove the cutback. Thoroughly wet an area about 3'x3'. Let it still for 15-30 minutes. Wipe up with paper shop towels. I did the entire area twice (yes, it took multiple days) because part of it was going to get marle tile and part was going to get epoxy paint.

I did etch the concrete before the epoxy and both came out great !

Dealing with it as a whole is not dangerous. It's when you start scraping, sanding and beating up tiles with a chipping hammer that causes issues when you break the main part up and the dust starts flying that's when it can get you.

 

[garyconn]

I used to do asbestos removal. If the tiles are 12x12 there is a 95% chance they have no asbestos. Its the 9x9 tiles that were asbestos. Unless you are cutting them with a saw manually scraping them up was the removal method. Of course, we put plastic up around the whole room. The mastic most likely has the asbestos in it, but the fibers will not become airborn unless you use a grinder on it. So the removal process was to use a mastic remover in a mop bucket. Spread it out let it sit and mop it back up.