epoxy/polyurea/other question for outdoors

[Jaguar Fan]

For a yet-to-be-built house, I need to decide what to put in the driveway (pretty short driveway) as well as the garage floor. I've read that epoxies will "chalk" and "yellow" over time in the sun, even with a polyurethane clear coat with UV inhibitor.

What do pros do for exterior driveways?

ALSO -- I'm planning an exterior kitchen and eating area. I could just cover the counter bar and food prep surface with flagstone or something (that's what the landscape designer is suggesting) but I thought maybe a concrete surface with appropriate polyurea/other surface might be an attractive alternative.

Have any of you tried this? I do believe some surface coatings are heavily used in food prep areas indoors -- but what about outdoors?

Many thanks for any thoughts or pointers.

Many thanks for any thoughts or pointers.

 

[thegarageguy]

Some polyurea manufacturers claim that it works well in outdoor environments. These are companies from Arizona and Southern Cali. If it works there I guess it'll work anywhere. I guess it depends on the formulation. There are now many many different polyurea-polyaspartic formulas. I can't keep up. Maybe Wolverine can chime in.

 

[Jabberwalk]

I would look at a stained or dyed concrete surface with a good sealer. I think it would look better than a coating. A concrete counter top polished with an integral color might be something to look at also.

 

[menz300]

I would agree with jabber. If the driveway isn't that long and you have the money why not color and stamp the driveway. If nothing else just go with dyed concrete as they can mix it at the plant and will give you a look different than all the other drives. I also would look into concrete counter top as they are becoming big business and look great when they are polished up and have lots of options for colors and the new ones that they are incorporating recycled glass in and such look really cool.

 

[SC-Eric]

For a yet-to-be-built house, I need to decide what to put in the driveway (pretty short driveway) as well as the garage floor.

For the driveway you need to decide what you are looking for. If you just want to seal it with a clear then you can just use a cheap Thermoplastic Acrylic. You can also do stamping... staining... or... maybe even an overlay.

I've read that epoxies will "chalk" and "yellow" over time in the sun, even with a polyurethane clear coat with UV inhibitor.

MOST epoxies will chalk and yellow in the sunlight. A few of us (manufacturers) can hydrogenate an epoxy to make it UV stable. It is also possible to use certain cycloaliphatic amines to increase resistance. So, that is what I said MOST epoxies chalk and did not say all. Typically, when a urethane is used over an epoxy it will eventually delaminate. Although the urethane may be high quality and have UV (Ultraviolet light) absorbers and HALS (Hindered Amine Light Stabilizers), they only slow the process. The UV light goes through the clearcoat (because... duh... it's clear) and begins to chalk the epoxy. If you've ever seen epoxy that has chalked and felt the surface you will notice that some of it comes off on your hands just as if you were to wipe your hand across a chalkboard. Obviously, if the epoxy chalks under the clear and releases the top layer of the epoxy, the polyurethane is going to delaminate.

What do pros do for exterior driveways?

Stay tuned for this one... I'm gonna get there...

ALSO -- I'm planning an exterior kitchen and eating area. I could just cover the counter bar and food prep surface with flagstone or something (that's what the landscape designer is suggesting) but I thought maybe a concrete surface with appropriate polyurea/other surface might be an attractive alternative.

Well, I LOVE natural stone and have alot around my house. If you do it... it will need to be sealed to protect it. But, since you already mentioned that you want something concrete... I'm going to suggest concrete countertops since you mentioned it. If you let me know what state you are in I would be happy to suggest someone unless you are going to do it yourself. And, if you want to do it yourself I can direct you to someone to teach you how to do it (it'll cost money to learn).

Now, almost anything you have asked about and want can be found here:
http://www.koverkrete.com/

If you want more information from them I can introduce you to the owner.

 

[Jaguar Fan]

For the driveway you need to decide what you are looking for. If you just want to seal it with a clear then you can just use a cheap Thermoplastic Acrylic. You can also do stamping... staining... or... maybe even an overlay.


MOST epoxies will chalk and yellow in the sunlight. A few of us (manufacturers) can hydrogenate an epoxy to make it UV stable. It is also possible to use certain cycloaliphatic amines to increase resistance. So, that is what I said MOST epoxies chalk and did not say all. Typically, when a urethane is used over an epoxy it will eventually delaminate. Although the urethane may be high quality and have UV (Ultraviolet light) absorbers and HALS (Hindered Amine Light Stabilizers), they only slow the process. The UV light goes through the clearcoat (because... duh... it's clear) and begins to chalk the epoxy. If you've ever seen epoxy that has chalked and felt the surface you will notice that some of it comes off on your hands just as if you were to wipe your hand across a chalkboard. Obviously, if the epoxy chalks under the clear and releases the top layer of the epoxy, the polyurethane is going to delaminate.


Stay tuned for this one... I'm gonna get there...



Well, I LOVE natural stone and have alot around my house. If you do it... it will need to be sealed to protect it. But, since you already mentioned that you want something concrete... I'm going to suggest concrete countertops since you mentioned it. If you let me know what state you are in I would be happy to suggest someone unless you are going to do it yourself. And, if you want to do it yourself I can direct you to someone to teach you how to do it (it'll cost money to learn).

Now, almost anything you have asked about and want can be found here:
http://www.koverkrete.com/

If you want more information from them I can introduce you to the owner.

Thanks for thie pointers! I'm reading up on "koverkrete" now.

 

[tdickman]

I agree with the others as far as recommending a stain with a sealer.
I have done some outdoor patios with a garage floor coatings, they have been holding up for years with no yellowing, I personally don't like the look on a patio, but we did it because that's what the customer wanted.

As far as the yellowing it really has to do with the chemical composition. Aromatic vs Aliphatic. Most epoxies are Aromatic. The difference between the two is the way the molecules are joined together. Aromatic using benzene rings. Aromatic compounds are more susceptible to UV light, these chains get broken down by UV (light) over time. The chains will break down and fracture from the light, this tiny fracture is what causes the floor to yellow. That’s why epoxy floors that have the front edge exposed to the outside environment usually yellow before the rest of the floor in the garage. Eventually over time the whole floor may turn yellow. Most polyureas are Aliphatic.

If you are in to the chemistry you can read more here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliphatics
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aromatic