eu plug ?

[alwaysFlOoReD]

I bought a air heat gun to do some welding to repair tarps. I bought it knowing that the item was 10a/240V. I've done a little household wiring for 240V stoves and welders. But I have no knowledge of how the plugs on an EU device are wired. In the following pic, the top terminal has an "E" beside it, Is that "earth" meaning ground? The other two terminals are labeled "L" and "N". How do I wire a new plug to use power from a generator? Is it wired the same as a welder with two 120V hot lines and a ground?

Pic of plug end I want to cut off and replace;

[/URL][/IMG]

Or can I source an end to make an adapter for the L14-30 outlet on the generator so as not to cut the end off?

Thanks,
Richard

 

[rlitman]

E=earth (i.e. ground; wire inside will be green with a yellow stripe)
L=line (wire inside will be brown)
N=neutral (wire inside will be blue)
N.B. the "neutral" terminal will need to connect to L2 (a second line) if you have a 120/240V service, and not a neutral.

No, I would not expect to find an adapter to go from that to L14-30. It is a 10A plug, and should not be run off a 30A breaker.

edit: Somehow, I got my line/neutral colors revered originally. Just corrected that. OOPS!

 

[Norcal]

That plug is a copy of a ancient US design, that is used in OZ, and NZ. You will find conductors that are brown, blue (neutral in the 50 HZ world) and a yellow with a green stripe, just cut it off and replace it with the proper NEMA connector.

 

[ssbtech]

I'm confused. There's one Line conductor and it's 240v.
Does that one Line carry 240V? Don't we get 240V by using two Line conductors here?

 

[rlitman]

I'm confused. There's one Line conductor and it's 240v.
Does that one Line carry 240V? Don't we get 240V by using two Line conductors here?

In North America, yes. Not in Europe, where the plug is from.

Note that where this device was designed to be used, the power is also 50Hz. While the heating element will put out the same wattage, the blower motor will probably run a little faster when powered off the 60Hz power here. That could lower the output temperature, but could be compensated for by a slight obstruction of the intake.

 

[alfredeneuman]

L=line (wire inside will be blue)
N=neutral (wire inside will be brown)
N.B. the "neutral" terminal will need to connect to L2 (a second line) if you have a 120/240V service, and not a neutral.

Having hooked up quite a few imported machines, and read the blueprints.....
The neutral wire will be blue, and the active line is brown.

The closest domestic US breaker to 10A is a 15, so use one of those.

 

[Zeke]

E=earth (i.e. ground; wire inside will be green with a yellow stripe)
L=line (wire inside will be blue)
N=neutral (wire inside will be brown)
N.B. the "neutral" terminal will need to connect to L2 (a second line) if you have a 120/240V service, and not a neutral.

No, I would not expect to find an adapter to go from that to L14-30. It is a 10A plug, and should not be run off a 30A breaker.

I'm confused. There's one Line conductor and it's 240v.
Does that one Line carry 240V? Don't we get 240V by using two Line conductors here?

In North America, yes. Not in Europe, where the plug is from.

Note that where this device was designed to be used, the power is also 50Hz. While the heating element will put out the same wattage, the blower motor will probably run a little faster when powered off the 60Hz power here. That could lower the output temperature, but could be compensated for by a slight obstruction of the intake.

Please, a little more detail on this. I understand our single phase, 2-leg system where if necessary the neutral carries the difference between L1 and L2. So the EU wiring is simply hot, neutral and ground with 240v being carried on one leg.

First, does the service entrance in the countries we are talking about have 3 wires as we do? E.g., 2 legs and a neutral with the 2 legs making double voltage when cross connected. Or do they simply have a 2 wire entrance rated at 240v?
Back to this: where does the OP find 240 to hook up to either the blue or brown depending on who's correct on the identification.

 

[gungatim]

just be careful, I would hate for something to happen reminiscent of this scene from the movie Top Secret!

"he was found in his hotel room impaled upon a large electrical device. What he did not realize was that, in this country, we use 220 volt current. Our surgeons did what they could, but it took them two hours just to remove the smile from his face"

 

[rlitman]

Having hooked up quite a few imported machines, and read the blueprints.....
The neutral wire will be blue, and the active line is brown...

You are absolutely correct! I don't know how I made that mistake, but I have edited my post to correct it. I remember typing the L,N,G part first, and adding the colors later, and must have not been paying attention to which line I was typing on.

Please, a little more detail on this. I understand our single phase, 2-leg system where if necessary the neutral carries the difference between L1 and L2. So the EU wiring is simply hot, neutral and ground with 240v being carried on one leg.

First, does the service entrance in the countries we are talking about have 3 wires as we do? E.g., 2 legs and a neutral with the 2 legs making double voltage when cross connected. Or do they simply have a 2 wire entrance rated at 240v?
Back to this: where does the OP find 240 to hook up to either the blue or brown depending on who's correct on the identification.

Europe commonly uses 230/400V three phase. Less commonly, there is 240/480V single phase.

http://electrical-engineering-portal.com/north-american-versus-european-distribution-systems

The UK is quite the exception though. They use "ring circuits" with a large amount of power available at the plug, with the plug itself containing a fuse for overcurrent protection of the device, and are largely single phase, single voltage. It makes for a simpler fuse box, and has mainly stuck around I believe for historical reasons.

just be careful, I would hate for something to happen reminiscent of this scene from the movie Top Secret!

LMAO. How apropos!

 

[ssbtech]

In North America, yes. Not in Europe, where the plug is from.

So the device requires 240v on the Line, a neutral and a ground.

On this side of the pond, we get our 240v from the two hot wires. There may or may not be a neutral if the device has 120v needs.

Are you saying that his neutral should simply be connected to the other hot?

 

[dave89iroc]

So the device requires 240v on the Line, a neutral and a ground.

On this side of the pond, we get our 240v from the two hot wires. There may or may not be a neutral if the device has 120v needs.

Are you saying that his neutral should simply be connected to the other hot?

yes


europe is

ground(earth)
neutral (0 VAC)
hot (240 VAC)

here is

ground
neutral (0 VAC)
hot (L1 120 VAC)
hot (L2 120 VAC)

L1 and L2 are phased ~180 degrees apart, so, 120 V+ and 120 V- give a measured voltage of 240

 

[rlitman]

...Are you saying that his neutral should simply be connected to the other hot?

Exactly. ASSUMING the device is double insulated, and does not require a polarized power source.

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

I will take some pics of the unit when I get home and post to make sure of what is what.

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

 

[Two Sheds]

That might fit in a NEMA 10-20 receptacle, if you don't want to cut it off. I have a 240V heater that uses the NEMA 10-20 made back when they were more commonly used in the U.S.

 

[Norcal]

The tool is not going to care if the supply is 240V L-N, or 240V L-L, it' s a Aussie/ New Zealand style plug, not a EU one or UK either. The current US equivalent is a non NEMA 20A 125/250V non grounding device, it used to be a 20A 250V rated device.

 

[rlitman]

The tool is not going to care if the supply is 240V L-N, or 240V L-L...

As I said above:

>ASSUMING the device is double insulated, and does not require a polarized power source.

But plugs are polarized for a reason, and this plug in question has a ground prong, so I cannot say with confidence whether or not the difference matters in this case.

 

[HOTFR8]

Looks like an Australian plug upside down in the photo. Although I have seen Asian fittings made the same way with the lead out on the top.

 

[Smoker]

Looks like it's from Australia/New Zealand. It's not the U.K. They have 3 fat square pins with a longer ground pin at the top and a built in fuse and most of continental Europe it's two round ones (I'm European). Just be careful as it'll be 50hz vs 60hz here in the US.

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

here is a review of the unit;

https://www.reddit.com/r/electronic...ew_gj8018lcd_an_inexpensive_heat_gun_for_smd/

And a pictorial teardown review of the unit;

http://imgur.com/a/yyhHi

It will have better pics than I would get. If that isn't enough to tell if it's polarized please let me know and I will attempt to get the info you need.

Thanks.

 

[ard]

Looks like it's from Australia/New Zealand. It's not the U.K. They have 3 fat square pins with a longer ground pin at the top and a built in fuse and most of continental Europe it's two round ones (I'm European). Just be careful as it'll be 50hz vs 60hz here in the US.

Agreed

It's an oz/NZ plug... Not UK, not eu. As mention above and in this quote.

Also in the reddit image the include an adapter to allow it to plug into a round eu style plug/pin

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

Exactly. ASSUMING the device is double insulated, and does not require a polarized power source.

That might fit in a NEMA 10-20 receptacle, if you don't want to cut it off. I have a 240V heater that uses the NEMA 10-20 made back when they were more commonly used in the U.S.

The tool is not going to care if the supply is 240V L-N, or 240V L-L, it' s a Aussie/ New Zealand style plug, not a EU one or UK either. The current US equivalent is a non NEMA 20A 125/250V non grounding device, it used to be a 20A 250V rated device.

Thanks everyone,
This isn't a priority and will be looked into in depth later. I'll check into the 10-20 receptacle and the other mentioned. As of right now I'm leaning to just cutting the end off and using two hots and a ground. If the magic smoke escapes then so be it, the unit was cheap. I'll take a look inside and see what the soldering looks like first tho.

 

[rlitman]

...It will have better pics than I would get. If that isn't enough to tell if it's polarized please let me know and I will attempt to get the info you need...

Look at where the brown and blue wires exit the cable and are soldered to the board. I don't see a ground wire in with them. I wonder if the ground pin in the plug is connected to anything at all. Though the pictures I saw in the review, appeared to show something with a bi-pin ungrounded plug.

Yeah, to me, this looks like there's no worries about polarization.

 

[wssix99]

Thanks everyone,
This isn't a priority and will be looked into in depth later. I'll check into the 10-20 receptacle and the other mentioned. As of right now I'm leaning to just cutting the end off and using two hots and a ground. If the magic smoke escapes then so be it, the unit was cheap. I'll take a look inside and see what the soldering looks like first tho.

You can do this sort of thing easier with lighting, but using 2 phase 240V on a 1 phase 240V appliance could cause issues, depending on how its constructed. (It looks like one would need to be fluent in Chinese to really do the needed research on this unit...)

Regardless, the 50Hz to 60Hz issue is a big problem for you, as rlitman pointed out. This thing is meant for precision heat control and you probably aren't going to get that by re-wiring the plug.

I'd recommend:
- Buy a proper travel voltage transformer that will convert 120V 60Hz single phase to the appliance's needed 240V 50Hz single phase power.
- Have a fire extinguisher close by. (With this tool, you should probably have one anyway.)

 

[wssix99]

Europe commonly uses 230/400V three phase. Less commonly, there is 240/480V single phase.

http://electrical-engineering-portal.com/north-american-versus-european-distribution-systems

The UK is quite the exception though. They use "ring circuits" with a large amount of power available at the plug, with the plug itself containing a fuse for overcurrent protection of the device, and are largely single phase, single voltage. It makes for a simpler fuse box, and has mainly stuck around I believe for historical reasons.

They use MUCH less copper also! I'm envious of the cost savings over there, but these circuits leave very little room for error...

I was just doing some UK-related facility work and many of the non-manufacturing industrial facilities we were working with only had single phase 240V power. I understand that the three phase service isn't as common as in the states but I don't know if that holds for the rest of Europe, or not. (I'd be interested to know more about this.)

 

[rlitman]

...- Buy a proper travel voltage transformer that will convert 120V 60Hz single phase to the appliance's needed 240V 50Hz single phase power...

A travel converter that changes frequency? That's a good one!

Looking at the teardown video, here is how I am assuming this works.
The line AC is fed to the heating element through a triac "dimmer" that is thermostatically controlled (probably PWM or the likes).
Line AC also feeds a switching power supply that gives low voltage DC to the control board as well as the universal DC brushed blower motor.

Nothing I see in there is going to care about frequency. My original assumption was that we were talking about a hair-dryer style heat gun, where the heating element only cares about input voltage, but a shaded pole blower motor cares about frequency. This is all thermostatically controlled. Plug it in and have fun. And remember that it's cheap for a reason, and if it blows up (which I'm sure would surprise neither me nor the OP), it was caused by crappy construction and not the plug you put on it.

 

[Zeke]

Europe commonly uses 230/400V three phase. Less commonly, there is 240/480V single phase.

The UK is quite the exception though. They use "ring circuits" with a large amount of power available at the plug, with the plug itself containing a fuse for overcurrent protection of the device, and are largely single phase, single voltage. It makes for a simpler fuse box, and has mainly stuck around I believe for historical reasons.

So the device requires 240v on the Line, a neutral and a ground.

On this side of the pond, we get our 240v from the two hot wires. There may or may not be a neutral if the device has 120v needs.

Are you saying that his neutral should simply be connected to the other hot?

yes


europe is

ground(earth)
neutral (0 VAC)
hot (240 VAC)

here is

ground
neutral (0 VAC)
hot (L1 120 VAC)
hot (L2 120 VAC)

L1 and L2 are phased ~180 degrees apart, so, 120 V+ and 120 V- give a measured voltage of 240

Beginning to understand.

 

[wssix99]

A travel converter that changes frequency? That's a good one!

Looking at the teardown video, here is how I am assuming this works.
The line AC is fed to the heating element through a triac "dimmer" that is thermostatically controlled (probably PWM or the likes).
Line AC also feeds a switching power supply that gives low voltage DC to the control board as well as the universal DC brushed blower motor.

Nothing I see in there is going to care about frequency. My original assumption was that we were talking about a hair-dryer style heat gun, where the heating element only cares about input voltage, but a shaded pole blower motor cares about frequency. This is all thermostatically controlled. Plug it in and have fun. And remember that it's cheap for a reason, and if it blows up (which I'm sure would surprise neither me nor the OP), it was caused by crappy construction and not the plug you put on it.

Good catch/points. I guess they don't put geared gerbil wheels (and the needed gerbils) inside the converters anymore to sync the frequencies...

Must get larger fire extinguisher for this one, then!

 

[HOTFR8]

Looks like it's from Australia/New Zealand. It's not the U.K. They have 3 fat square pins with a longer ground pin at the top and a built in fuse and most of continental Europe it's two round ones (I'm European). Just be careful as it'll be 50hz vs 60hz here in the US.

Agreed

It's an oz/NZ plug... Not UK, not eu. As mention above and in this quote.

Also in the reddit image the include an adapter to allow it to plug into a round eu style plug/pin

Going on the way the lead comes out it is Asian. In China and other parts of Asia the Aust/ NZ plug is fitted upside down.

http://www.tour-beijing.com/blog/beijing-travel/beijing-tour-reviews/plugs-and-sockets-in-china

 

[ard]

Going on the way the lead comes out it is Asian. In China and other parts of Asia the Aust/ NZ plug is fitted upside down.

Indeed.

If you go here: http://internationalconfig.com/power-cords-for-china-ac-power-cords.asp

you can look up AUS and CN, they are flipped

(Was in Oz three months ago...China more like 15 years ago!)

 

[HOTFR8]

Indeed.

If you go here: http://internationalconfig.com/power-cords-for-china-ac-power-cords.asp

you can look up AUS and CN, they are flipped

(Was in Oz three months ago...China more like 15 years ago!)

As most leads come straight out or in some cases on the bottom of the plug (like the photo above) and not on the top of the lead, you would have to then take it the fitting is Chinese.

I have a similar adapter made in China and having the lead on the top is very annoying.
I got that in China in 2007 and have seen the plugs (upside down to Aust /NZ) in travels recently.