European mid-high tier first set

Robust2 · Jul 19, 2013

Hi all,

First of all, I hope this topic hasn't been beaten to death, I tried to search but most topics were about US-based brand I can't find over here. Hopefully there are some Europeans here as well which can give me some advice.

In a few weeks time I'll graduate and start my first job as a computer scientist. Although I don't need tools for that, I do spend quite a bit of my spare-time wrenching on my motorcycles and bicycles and I've decided my first paycheck will go to my own, nice tool set. Up until now I've used my dad's tools which consist of Stahlwille wrenches, Facom screwdrivers, a cheap no-name socket with tons of play and other tools from every sort of quality. Nowadays he spends his time woodworking though, so he doesn't invest in mechanic's tools anymore. :sad:

I don't have much use for planers, band saws, etc!

I've been researching a bit in the last few months, but most online sources talk about a lot of American brands I've never seen in shops here or even heard about before I came across forums like these. I'm a bit in doubt what sort of quality I should buy, a (rather big) part of me likes to do stuff the proper way first time round and is looking at the big names like Gedore and Hazet. But I'm in no means a professional, so this might be a bit overkill?
The other part of me (the one that controls my funds) is looking at 'mid-tier' brands like Proxxon, Teng, Carolus. I assume that these would be enough for most of the work I do?

What would the experts here recommend me? Any brands I've been overlooking that are worth looking into? I know there's a Wurth shop not far from here, but I have no idea of the quality and price. The second hand market in my country (Belgium) isn't that great so I'd have to search around for months to find a good deal on everything I want.
My budget is around 1000€, depending on the quality, I know high quality tools would cost quite a bit more, but they'll probably survive any vehicle I'll ever wrench on.
I'd like to start with a set of pliers, screwdrivers, allen keys, open wrenches, a second set of combination or closed wrenches, 3/8 socket set and maybe a set of bits, a 1/4 socket set or a torque wrench if there's money left.

Thanks in advance!

Nocturnal-G · Jul 19, 2013

Welcome to the forum... I've heard great things about Proxxon hand tools as many shops in Germany use them. They are made in Taiwan I believe... I'd prefer going with either Hazet, Gedore, Stahlwille, etc. but to be honest the Proxxon tools will probably get the job done just as well.

The German brands will be a higher quality, the Taiwan stuff like Carolus, Proxxon, Vigor, Heytec, Heynen, BGS Technik, etc... Will be a lower quality.

wmartin · Jul 19, 2013

What country are you in?
What general family of stuff are you going to work on (European? old US? Japanese?).

In general, I'd go high end and fairly exotic, just to make it interesting...and go quality over quantity since it's for a hobby and you don't need every flavor of fastener undoing gizmo. Maybe start with a really good quality small box and don't plan on getting anything beyond what fits in that, it'll make it easier to move (which I expect you'll do for now).

Hang on, I just saw 'Belgium' in the post.

north · Jul 19, 2013

Welcome to the forum Robust2. I have no experience with Proxxon, Teng and Carolus but I see that Proxxon is often mentioned as a good alternative on some german tool forums. KS-Tools is also a brand that should work for the diy'er. I would spend some extra money on ratchets and screwdrivers though.

If I where to start out on a budget today I would buy Facom ratchets, (cheapest of the high end stuff, at least here in Norway) Wiha screwdrivers and then sockets and wrenches from any of the brands you mentioned. What ever breaks gets replaced with the high end stuff.

Pliers would be Knipex or NWS if you go high end.

If you decide to go with the high end stuff you can contact members jensputzier and Alx who both sell Hazet.

(You know you want the good stuff :evil:

)

Robust2 · Jul 19, 2013

Thanks for the welcome

Most of the stuff I work on are Japanese motorcycles, might buy a Italian/Brittish/Austrian bike as a next one, and European bicycles.

I understand German made tools are better quality than Taiwanese made, but is it that much difference to justify the cost as hobbyist? A german Gedore set can cost almost twice as much as a taiwanese Carolus set.
Brands as Teng and Carolus also offer lifetime warranty, which is reassuring.

I'd prefer buying a larger set from one brand to start with, as I have the impression you get better prices buying complete sets, but often they include stuff like hammers, which I really don't need from an expensive brand.

I'm not entirely sure about the price of Facom here, but I always thought they were at least as expensive as Hazet.

decaf · Jul 19, 2013

I think that this site has good prices and a pretty good assortment:
http://www.tbs-aachen.de/

If I were in your situation, I would have put my money on these things:

Pliers: Knipex (100-150 EUR)
Screwdrivers: Gedore (100 EUR)
Open Spanners: Gedore (60 EUR)
Double box : Gedore (75 EUR)
1/4" socket set: Gedore (130 EUR)
3/8" socket set: Gedore (230 EUR)

Then you have a bit over 200 EUR left to buy a torque wrench for.

Good luck!!! Happy shopping... :rocker:

Robust2 · Jul 19, 2013

Yeah, I've been browsing TBS-Aachen quite a lot

I would probably even drive over there if I bought from them, it's not too far from here.

decaf · Jul 19, 2013

Robust2 said:
Yeah, I've been browsing TBS-Aachen quite a lot I would probably even drive over there if I bought from them, it's not too far from here.

Sounds like a good plan!!! :3gears:

Or this site for good price when it comes too Stahlwille?

http://www.werkzeuggigant.com/index.php5?lang=de

N.I. · Jul 19, 2013

Robust2 said:
I'd like to start with a set of pliers, screwdrivers, allen keys, open wrenches, a second set of combination or closed wrenches, 3/8 socket set and maybe a set of bits, a 1/4 socket set or a torque wrench if there's money left.

Thanks in advance!

For pliers, screwdrivers and allen keys go for quality first time round.

Pliers - Knipex or NWS

Screwdrivers - Felo, Wera, Wiha, Witt, PB Swiss.... (pick your favourite)

Allen Keys - Bondhus (well priced and excellent quality)

For open ended wrenches I personally just went for a cheap secondhand set as I rarely use them.

Spend what you can on Combination wrenches. I would recommend Hazet as a first set but you would probably be happy with a set of Facom 440's which would be about 1/3 of the price.

For sockets sets there is nothing wrong with anything made in Taiwan- just pick your favourite and if you want, invest in a better ratchet.

north · Jul 19, 2013

If you have a lot of 'Phillips' screws on your Japanese bikes you might wanna check if they are JIS and if so buy some JIS drivers.

wmartin · Jul 19, 2013

Robust2 said:
I understand German made tools are better quality than Taiwanese made, but is it that much difference to justify the cost as hobbyist?

Oh, good heavens no. I'd buy the good stuff anyway. It's not really that much money in the scheme of things, and you can always resell them if you need the cash. The real cost of anything, after all, is the difference between what it costs and what you can get for it.

Not being in Belgium, I can't say where the deals are there. In the US, I have a funny feeling that we get stuff a lot cheaper than elsewhere, whether it's smokin' deals on Amazon, eBay (maybe the Belgian or German eBay is worth a look), outlet sites like that Gedore USA place, or just plan outliers like nepros.net

In any case, it seems to me that simply buying one of those Hazet tackle box looking boxes and sticking in a set of high end screwdrivers, a socket set, 3-4 pairs of pliers, and a few specialty tools will really cost all that much.

Robust2 · Jul 19, 2013

Good point about the JIS. I do think my dad has normal as wel as JIS bits, so I could use some of his if I ever get in trouble.

I want/need 2 sets of wrenches as I often prefer to use 2 wrenches with the same size for axles etc. I could go for a closed + combination set as well.

Thanks for the suggestions N.I., I know Wera and Knipex but didn't know about the other ones.

Monte · Jul 19, 2013

Robust2 · Jul 20, 2013

After all your posts in the 'old world' thread, I was sort ofexpecting you to turn up here Monte

That is quite a bit cheaper if you buy everything separate, more than I expected so. Big price difference between Bahco and Hazet/Gedore ratchet sets!

Any suggestions for a reasonably tidy way to store these? I really like neatly organised cabinets with foam modules, but that's an expensive way to do so apparently.

Monte · Jul 20, 2013

of course you could upgrade to Hazet and Gedore and invest a bit more since there is a bit from your budget left

for example with these sets:

1/2" Gedore set - very good Price/Performance ratio:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Gedore-1-2-K...n_Heimwerker_Handwerkzeug&hash=item58a1ff409b

1/4" Hazet:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Hazet-856-1-...n_Heimwerker_Handwerkzeug&hash=item5656d68efa

For storage i would buy a used tool box with wheels or something like this: (cheaper + locally of course):
http://www.ebay.de/itm/LISTA-Schubl...pt=Lager_Materialbehälter&hash=item2a256299eb

Foam trays cost about 30 to 50 € each it seems. Available from http://www.toolbed.com/start.aspx?Language=2 for example. I have plastic trays from Gedore (about 10.- € each) so i can exchange the Tools if i want without buying a new tray since most Tools fit.
Here are some pics of someone who ordered there:
http://www.werkzeug-news.de/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22255&start=60

Robust2 · Jul 21, 2013

I didn't know you could buy those trays seperately! Foam or plastics doesn't matter to much, as long as they're not lying loose or each in their own, different box.

I'll keep my eye out for a tool box locally.

Van Steele · Jul 21, 2013

Go to your local car parts dealer and see if they have a 'Toolspecial' magazine. There's always some good deals on Hazet sets in there - as well as other high-end European brands.

marcone · Jul 21, 2013

Monte said:
example:

1/4" socket set: 30.-€
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Bahco-Stecks...mwerker_Elektrowerkzeuge_&hash=item4602d79bdd

Have it and love it, especially the ratchet, so small and effective in tight places!

richfinn · Jul 21, 2013

Bahco dual 80 ratchets are nice, snap on quality with a euro twist for 1/4 of the price

Wiha drivers are really nice/but the Snap On ratchet driver is tough to beat

I really like Ko-Ken sockets (Japanese)

Facom/Stahlwille spanners are very good

NWS are awesome pliers if you can get them at trade prices

Thor/Thorex hammers are great (British)

CNGsaves · Jul 21, 2013

Welcome to new GJ member from Belguim.

Best answers from GJer's when you Update PROFILE in GJ to at least show country and state.

Also good luck with new endeavor.

Robust2 · Oct 20, 2013

Going to bump this back up as I'm finally buying stuff (or bookmarked the stores where I'm planning to buy) and I wouldn't mind some final opinions or suggestions.

3/8 ratchet (only thing already bought): Gedore 30 GMU 10 (Strange enough this didn't include a 12 socket) - 100€
1/4 rathcet: Bahco SL25 - 30€
Screwdrivers: PB Swiss swissgrip 12pc set (6 slots, 4 phillips and 2 pozidrivs, I'm thinking about PB swiss as apparently they can handle JIS screws quite well? I don't need the Pozidrivs but the price for this set is really low) - 65€
Allen keys: Wera hex-plus L-set - 22€
Open end wrenches: Stahlwille 8pc set from their yearly action folder - 35€
Box end wrenches: Hazet 630/8 set (I might buy one or two larger sizes separately, but I can't really justify spending 100€ more on the 12 set) - 75€
Pliers: Knipex set from eBay probably - 90-100€
Bit set: Carolus or Hazet probably, Wera and PB Swiss are rather pricy
Torque wrench: Carolus or Hazet probably, although I haven't looked into this too much. I'd prefer to have a +- 10-70Nm one with small adjustments as this is the range almost all of my motorcycle bolts are in. (and 3/8 to combine with my sockets I already have)
Flashlight (my previous one died since posting this thread): Led Lenser P3 - 12€

And then I'll search for a cabinet on the local craigslist/ebay/etc. Budget wise this looks definitely doable and as far as my research goes this is all quite decent quality?

Edit: The only thing I'm a bit in doubt for is the Stahlwille set. It's cheap but I don't know if it's really the best choice?

Monte · Oct 20, 2013

Robust2 said:
Edit: The only thing I'm a bit in doubt for is the Stahlwille set. It's cheap but I don't know if it's really the best choice?

Don´t worry Stahlwille is always a good choice

edit: this would be another option for combi wrenches:
http://stahlwille.be/pdf/13_9HN_flyer_nl.pdf

Robust2 · Oct 20, 2013

Yes, I've seen that promotion as well but I feel that double open and double box sets are a lot cheaper in general as you get 2 sizes per wrench. Might still be worth considering and I do like the look.

Any idea why Gedore would choose to include sockets from 6 to 19, only skipping the 12 by the way? For me that's one of my most used sizes so it seems really strange to not include that one.

Duarte · Oct 20, 2013

Any idea why Gedore would choose to include sockets from 6 to 19, only skipping the 12 by the way?

I think it is because European cars, or American cars for that matter, don't use the 12mm size. Japanese cars have lot's of 12m fasteners though.

I am sure you can order just the 12mm if needed, from Gedore, or some other brand.

Dave455 · Oct 20, 2013

Can't really fault the tools you've chosen!

Buying decent quality tools isn't just about how long they last, but how well they work! Even if you only use your tools rarely, there's nothing more frustrating than trying to work with poor quality stuff!

Don't be afraid to buy decent stuff, and if it's European brands you are after that's really Stahlwille and Hazet. The fact that you can sometimes get these brands at good prices is no bad thing. Folks in the US would love to get Stahlwile at those prices!

For those who can't afford Stahlwille or Hazet, I tend to steer them towards Facom, King ****, or Beta, all of whom make decent tools at very fair prices. Watch the Facom though, they are starting to slip in Taiwanese stuff (only a few items, but the proportion is bound to increase).

With regard to your choices, make sure you try the PB Swissgrip before you buy! They have a very soft handle material, and while they are probably fine if you work in IT, you are much better off buying the classic handle, or even the Multicraft, for general workshop use! (The soft handles pick up grease, then grit, then become unpleasant to use and hard to clean!)

You will notice quality in tools such as bit sets more than any others. I'd get a decent bit set if I could, as I have yet to find any from Taiwan that don't twist with just average use!

nowlan · Oct 20, 2013

50 eur for stahlwille spanners sounds like a great price.

I think the HAZET 2240/36, Screwdriver Bit Set is rebadged, so possibly cheaper from oem.

Robust2 · Oct 21, 2013

Thanks for the input. I'll reconsider the bit-set and look for something that's within budget but a bit better quality.
I have no clue however if there are any PB Swiss dealers nearby to test them, I do have the tendency to work in a clean environment.

As far as I've seen, Facom isn't that much cheaper than the German brands actually. Their socket sets for example also go to the 100-200€ price range. I do know it's good quality, my dad has some Ergogrip screwdrivers I really like. In my opinion they are probably the most known tool brand in Belgium, it's always the first brand people will bring up when talking about 'good tools'.
I have one or two Beta tools already and while they aren't bad, I'm not that big of a fan either. When putting a Facom and a Beta ratcheting wrench next to each other for example, the Beta has a lot more play in the mechanism.

nicksnothereman · Oct 21, 2013

Robust2 said:
Hi all,

First of all, I hope this topic hasn't been beaten to death, I tried to search but most topics were about US-based brand I can't find over here. Hopefully there are some Europeans here as well which can give me some advice.

In a few weeks time I'll graduate and start my first job as a computer scientist. Although I don't need tools for that, I do spend quite a bit of my spare-time wrenching on my motorcycles and bicycles and I've decided my first paycheck will go to my own, nice tool set. Up until now I've used my dad's tools which consist of Stahlwille wrenches, Facom screwdrivers, a cheap no-name socket with tons of play and other tools from every sort of quality. Nowadays he spends his time woodworking though, so he doesn't invest in mechanic's tools anymore. I don't have much use for planers, band saws, etc!

I've been researching a bit in the last few months, but most online sources talk about a lot of American brands I've never seen in shops here or even heard about before I came across forums like these. I'm a bit in doubt what sort of quality I should buy, a (rather big) part of me likes to do stuff the proper way first time round and is looking at the big names like Gedore and Hazet. But I'm in no means a professional, so this might be a bit overkill?
The other part of me (the one that controls my funds) is looking at 'mid-tier' brands like Proxxon, Teng, Carolus. I assume that these would be enough for most of the work I do?

What would the experts here recommend me? Any brands I've been overlooking that are worth looking into? I know there's a Wurth shop not far from here, but I have no idea of the quality and price. The second hand market in my country (Belgium) isn't that great so I'd have to search around for months to find a good deal on everything I want.
My budget is around 1000€, depending on the quality, I know high quality tools would cost quite a bit more, but they'll probably survive any vehicle I'll ever wrench on.
I'd like to start with a set of pliers, screwdrivers, allen keys, open wrenches, a second set of combination or closed wrenches, 3/8 socket set and maybe a set of bits, a 1/4 socket set or a torque wrench if there's money left.

Thanks in advance!

My advice is to not buy a "set" at once (as in mechanics set). Up front just buy a decent socket set (with extensions) in 3/8, a set of metric wrenches, a breaker bar, a torque wrench, some metric impact sockets (to torque), a cheap heat gun, a can of pb blaster (penetrating oil), a couple of screwdrivers, an oil filter wrench, and a razor knife. Up front that's about all you're going to need until you have the mechanical knowledge to do bigger projects. Shouldn't cost more than 200 bucks (if you were to buy it in the US) picking up decent quality home use stuff from retail brands. In europe you might expect to spend the equivalent of 300-350 USD at retail. When you need other tools you go and buy those tools.

Build your own set over time by picking up the tools you need when you need them. Just keep a reserve fund (account) if you have critical repairs to make. In europe it's probably less valid than in the U.S. because europe has better public transportation for when your means of transportation breaks down.

I don't know about european brands but my guess is they tend to import the same stuff from the same factories in china and taiwan then just slap a different name on it. Then there is a better class of tool made by specialty manufacturers in germany and probably some nordic countries. If you're not a mechanic you don't really need to spend the money on professional tools because it's just a hobby. Don't make yourself have to eat ramen noodles for years just because you want some shiny tools that you'll use once every 6 months; buy the basics at a price that doesn't make you feel cheated for the use you get out of them. You won't know that in the beginning (the differences in quality at retail) but it won't matter because your livelihood won't depend on it; you will learn to identify quality the more tools you use.

Some of the stuff you listed (pliers, hex keys) just grab the cheapest okay looking chinese tool you can find in a store because you're not going to use them a whole lot and when you do you're not going to want them in that form; you'll want hex sockets or ball end hex sockets. I've never used pliers on a car...oh wait hose clamps, okay, maybe just get a hose clamp tool if you plan on doing that. Torque wrench is not an afterthought when working on vehicles; it is a priority. :willy_nil

tradesmanschoice · Oct 21, 2013

Well, you can't really go wrong with Wurth tools, they are all very good quality, and since you have a shop nearby, I'd suggest taking a closer look at them to see what they have.

Cheers,
Mark.

Miskin · Oct 21, 2013

Welcome to GJ! :rocker:

I also wrenching in my spare time on my bike and car. I was using a 1/4 Proxxon socket set and I would not recommend it. After few years the bits and the extensions caught rust. Also handle ratchet dried and broke...

View media item 27081
If I were you, I looked at ebay.de auctions. You can get the best quality tools, new or used, at half price. Some examples:
NOS 3/8 Gedore socket set (30 GMU-10). 59 € + 18 € shipping. I believe shipping to Belgium from Germany must be significantly cheaper than shipping to Greece.

View media item 28921Used Gedore TMU 1/2 socket set. 52 € + 22 € shipping.
View media item 33394NOS Witte screwdriver set. 15 € + 10 € shipping. :rocker:

View media item 30224PB SWISS hex keys. 17 € + 5 € shipping. :3gears:

View media item 30566
Because my bike is also Japanese could someone give a link to purchase JIS screwdrivers in Europe? I have ruined several cross head screws with the phillips screwdriver...

Dave455 · Oct 21, 2013

nicksnothereman said:
I don't know about european brands but my guess is they tend to import the same stuff from the same factories in china and taiwan then just slap a different name on it.

Well, I know a little about European brands, and beg to differ!

Most European tool manufacturers are just that - manufacturers! If you buy a wrench from Stahlwille, Hazet, Gedore, King **** or whoever, then it will have been made by them, in their factory, in Germany, the U.K. or wherever!

Now, some of these firms are obliged to offer a huge range of tools for their corporate customers who want to buy big sets from one source. They can't always manufacture all the items in house, so there will often be some items in the catalogue that are rebranded, though with companies such as Stahlwille it's just things like pliers (and they are still German made)! The majority of the tools are made entirely in house.

The importing and rebranding of cheap tools does go on, but generally the big names havn't been so stupid as to engage in the practice! The exception being where European companies have been bought out by American ones, where the practice seems to be common!

Gmonkee · Oct 21, 2013

OP, I live in Mexico and find too that most brands suggested n the forums don't apply to my local market. I too built a budget minded tool kit picking and choosing from what I can get locally.

Wurth ratchets, (the older round Facom style) and Wurth wrenches are my flagship stuff. Sockets and accessories are all better Asain stuff.
The specialty tools, screwdrivers and pliers are from all over the globe, I just chose what fit my budget and needs. From older USA brands to midrange Asain they all play a part.

I don't see Carolus here on the store shelves, but from what I've seen on the forums its worth a 2nd glance when budget is important.

Miskin · Oct 21, 2013

I read that you are not satisfied with Beta, but these prices are very good, i think

http://www.ebay.de/sch/schi-tec/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686

or Koken

http://www.ebay.de/sch/spezi-tools/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686

Robust2 · Oct 21, 2013

@Nicksnothereman: Well, the advantage is I do have some disposable income while I still live at home, so I can splurge a bit one month and have good tools which should last my whole life. Since posting this topic I crashed my bike, so I'm doing a front-end swap (and tuning the internals), installing a new exhaust, a valve clearance check, replacing the sprockets and I have to fix a leak at my front master cylinder too. To me these aren't really 'small' repairs anymore, but it might be compared to some car projects.
I tried buying cheap chinese hexkeys before, didn't work out as I was hoping it too

@Miskin: Hmm, I've been looking at those rainbow PB Swiss hex keys, but I could only find them for +35€, which is rather high if a similar Wera set is only 22. Could you pm me a link? I bought the same Gedore set as your first picture, but brand new 2 weeks ago for 75 + 20 shipping.
From what I've read on here and some other places is that PB Swiss screwdrivers can handle JIS quite well (or better than most) even though they're not really JIS drivers.

I'll try to stop by Wurth soon. I know they sell mixed sets of bolts and nuts in different sizes as well, which is quite appealing as a nicer alternative to my 'floor sweepings' box.

Van Steele · Oct 21, 2013

Miskin said:
Because my bike is also Japanese could someone give a link to purchase JIS screwdrivers in Europe? I have ruined several cross head screws with the phillips screwdriver...

Your Toyota dealer has - Toyota branded - Vessel Megadora's in sizes 1, 2 and 3 and a stubby in size 2, or Tradesmanschoice in the UK has them (get the non E-suffix ones).

jfdestree · Oct 21, 2013

Hi Robust and welcome here. Nice to see another Belgian fellow member :beer2:

For 1.000€ you can find lot's of tools in good quality. Try to go to a professional auto parts store and ask the guy behind the counter what he can find for you in your price range. They sometimes got good sales prices.
I bought my first service cart loaded with tools about 10 years ago for about 800€, but without 21%VAT... Brand is Acessa. Good stuff so far.
I would prefer to buy a complete set because tools are designed to fit in the drawers of the tool cart, everything is always where it should be.
I don't have a scan of a recent tools folder, but I scanned this one a few weeks ago. Brands is Stanley Expert. =>Not the Stanley you find in DIY store. Attention, prices are without VAT again. Those 21% taxes just kill all the fun... /!\Prices with the yellow tags are for a bare tool cart.

Over here, there is brand like Fantom, Draper, Sam, Beta, Facom, Hazet, Gedore, Carolus, Airpress, Kraftwerk, Proxxon etc etc.

Robust2 · Oct 21, 2013

Buying everything in one go was my first idea, because as you said it's a lot cleaner. I've gone away from that idea by now, as I feel I can get more what I actually need/want and for a better price by mixing brands/promotions. I don't know if an organized cart is worth several hundred euros to me...

You reminded me that there is actually a small car parts store very nearby who sells Hazet.

Catamount · Oct 21, 2013

Edd China uses Teng, so I'd look into those.

$T2eC16hHJIcFHNm3sIumBSU89HcIEQ~~60_35.JPG

Monte · Oct 21, 2013

Robust2 said:
@Miskin: Hmm, I've been looking at those rainbow PB Swiss hex keys, but I could only find them for +35€, which is rather high if a similar Wera set is only 22. Could you pm me a link?

if you want colored hex keys there is a cheaper alternative:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Original-INB...n_Heimwerker_Handwerkzeug&hash=item4604c98a0a

more color options:
http://stores.ebay.de/INBUS-Das-Ori...6445012&_sid=1113163992&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322

or non colored:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Original-INB...n_Heimwerker_Handwerkzeug&hash=item4604570da7

for the germans

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Original-INB...n_Heimwerker_Handwerkzeug&hash=item43bec950d1

Miskin · Oct 21, 2013

Robust2 said:
@Miskin: Hmm, I've been looking at those rainbow PB Swiss hex keys, but I could only find them for +35€, which is rather high if a similar Wera set is only 22. Could you pm me a link? I bought the same Gedore set as your first picture, but brand new 2 weeks ago for 75 + 20 shipping.
From what I've read on here and some other places is that PB Swiss screwdrivers can handle JIS quite well (or better than most) even though they're not really JIS drivers.

Not currently auctioned any noticeable Rainbow hex keys. But if you are in a hurry try Bondhus as N.I. well said.

View media item 26759
Hex Key Test
Or if you prefer PB Swiss try werk10
edit: Wiha coloured hex keys are also very nice! I like them more than PB Swiss!
View media item 30899

Van Steele said:
Your Toyota dealer has - Toyota branded - Vessel Megadora's in sizes 1, 2 and 3 and a stubby in size 2, or Tradesmanschoice in the UK has them (get the non E-suffix ones).

Thank you Van Steele! So aaalll Vessel screwdrivers are suitable for both JIS and ISO standard Phillips screws? If so, i can purchase some here in Greece! Thanks again for the info!

European mid-high tier first set

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Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member