Excavator issues

[slowTA]

I'm about to give up on getting my garage built this year all because I can't get an excavator to come out and give me a price that makes sense to me.

-I can't remember how many places I've called with absolutely no call back, at least 10 (more like 15)
-one guy with walk behind equipment said $100/hour (which seems fair)... but couldn't comment on how long... a day... a week... a month... it all depends on what he finds.
-another guy said it'll be a $1,500 job and that I should call him back once I have the permits and everything in order so he can come look at the job site. Great, but I'm not doing anything until I get a quote in writing.
-a friend of a friend came out and took measurements, talked with me for about an hour yada yada yada... and it's been 3 weeks with no quote!
-an excavator associated with a pole barn company that I wasn't too crazy about said $2,800. If that quote wasn't sent to me on letterhead from the pole barn company I would go with him.

Except for the next guy... which makes me wonder what he noticed that no one else has.

-the one guy who showed up, talked with me, AND gave a quote priced the job at $13,800!

For reference the barn will be 30x50 and the property probably has a 15 foot elevation change over 200 feet with the barn going at the bottom, at the end of the driveway. (The up hill part of my yard is where my well is and no where near the driveway, so adding the driveway up hill means more coverage that I don't have to spare.) The neighbors' property is higher to the one side, for a couple houses, but there is still runoff area lower on the neighbor's property on the other side. My ground feels to be a bit on the soft side year round but the 2 guys that showed up didn't seem to think that was an issue. Also, they both said that there was a 3 foot difference from one corner to the opposite where the barn would go. Neither thought the runoff would become a big deal once they're done with it. I'm not sure if the others even thought about that.

I've decided on my pole builder and electrician, what's with these excavators?

 

[GMCGarage]

Try some local landscaping companies, they might have the equipment, and be able to do it.

 

[GarageGuy89]

The problem is not the excavators it's you. And I do not mean that in a personal way, and I'm not trying to be a douche. Contractors hate dealing with home owners. Homeowners have specific needs that they WANT which are often times not industry standard, and if homeowners feel cheated they waste everyone's time. Most of the time homeowners are just not familiar with the industry and they waste a lot of time, the contractor also gets questions and changes on top of more questions and last minute changes.

This is why I always get at least 3 quotes when it comes to building. Sounds like you got a "i'm too busy bid" and a couple bids that want the work. It's also not their job to deal with or recognize drainage problems. Unless it is something that increases their cost to do the work, it will always be "not a big deal".

Construction industry is booming right now. Everyone and their brother is building so Contractors are busy and they don't need work. Small projects like yours are fillers or overtime/weekend project for them right now.

I always like to call back to the guys that give a ludicrous price and call them out on their price. Don't make a big deal about it, just give them a reality check.

 

[930dreamer]

Could you rent one and DIY?

 

[TomC750]

The problem is not the excavators it's you. And I do not mean that in a personal way, and I'm not trying to be a douche. Contractors hate dealing with home owners. Homeowners have specific needs that they WANT which are often times not industry standard, and if homeowners feel cheated they waste everyone's time. Most of the time homeowners are just not familiar with the industry and they waste a lot of time, the contractor also gets questions and changes on top of more questions and last minute changes.

This is why I always get at least 3 quotes when it comes to building. Sounds like you got a "i'm too busy bid" and a couple bids that want the work. It's also not their job to deal with or recognize drainage problems. Unless it is something that increases their cost to do the work, it will always be "not a big deal".

Construction industry is booming right now. Everyone and their brother is building so Contractors are busy and they don't need work. Small projects like yours are fillers or overtime/weekend project for them right now.

I always like to call back to the guys that give a ludicrous price and call them out on their price. Don't make a big deal about it, just give them a reality check.

I am retired from the excavation business, and recognizing and dealing with drainage issues is an inherent part of it. How about if an excavator was commissioned to build a pond? Don't you think he would understand water flow?

 

[TomC750]

Could you rent one and DIY?

Big job for a DIY.

 

[djbmw]

Big job for a DIY.

I think its perfect for a DIY! In fact... Renting heavy machinery to do projects just ljke the OP's on our 13 acres is what's allowed us to actually afford these projects. Ps... i ended up buying a tractor with backhoe for some of the lighter work since renting equipment was becoming too costly. Either way... If you DO rent, get a friend who's used the equipmen to come out and teach you how to properly operate it AND be safe with it!

 

[slowTA]

While I agree with what GarageGuy mostly said, I tell the excavators what I want to do and where I want it... then let them take over from there. The 2 guys I've talked to all brought up the drainage issues before I did and they both want to truck in enough fill to raise the floor up to almost the height of the driveway (about 40 feet away). I'm open to all suggestions because I know how much of a flight risk these guys are turning into!

As for renting the equipment, I wish I had the time to! Also I only have 1 open acre so I don't have the room to go play in the woods and keep the mess to unseen parts of the land. With all the fill and compacting in layers etc etc I know I won't be able to do it as quickly or even as well as someone who knows what they're doing.

 

[BillK]

Kind of hard for anyone to really respond without knowing exactly what you need the excavator to do ? In this day and age I would not expect anyone to even show up at a building site with a large piece of equipment for much less than maybe $5,000 a day.

The $1500 and $2800 prices just seem way too low to me.

What exactly are you wanting the guy to do ?

 

[slowTA]

They need to scrape off the grass/top soil, level what's left, lift the level stuff about a foot, slope the hill around the back of the garage, locate/re-locate the underground drain pipe for my gutters so it doesn't run under the garage (but under the driveway I'm OK with), dig a trench for power/gas, and do something for a gravel driveway.

No trees to take down, no large boulders to dynamite, I'll do the permit paperwork...

 

[BillK]

They need to scrape off the grass/top soil, level what's left, lift the level stuff about a foot, slope the hill around the back of the garage, locate/re-locate the underground drain pipe for my gutters so it doesn't run under the garage (but under the driveway I'm OK with), dig a trench for power/gas, and do something for a gravel driveway.

No trees to take down, no large boulders to dynamite, I'll do the permit paperwork...

I would expect to get a quote for at least 5K for something like that in this area and I bet New Jersey is even higher.

 

[slowTA]

... and at this point I'm OK with $5k assuming I have something to compare it to that doesn't cost more than the concrete work!

 

[benjamintmiller]

I think that the $13,800 quote is in the ballpark, and the others are laughably low.

I recently have had this work done in Iowa:
- Gravel driveway of about 200', with some clay to stabilize a hill
- Electrical trench under the driveway of about 200'
- Rough trimming some trees back so equipment can pass under the driveway
- Removal of sod for a 36x56
- Preparation of the base under the concrete, raising the building up about a foot from sod removal

I have about $7,000 just in the materials for this work, and another $10,000 in labor.

I watched my excavator do most of the work, and he and a few guys have worked hard for the better part of two weeks. He itemized the bill, and the rates seem reasonable to me.

Your excavator is going to bring out a skid loader and mini excavator/trencher at a minimum for the work you're asking. That's probably $150,000 in equipment, plus wages, taxes, insurance, advertising, and marketing, and your project is a very small one at a time when homes can't get built fast enough.

 

[6768rogues]

When I built my barn I got some quotes for earth work and decided to spend a little more and buy a used diesel skid steer loader and do it myself. I bought a nice machine from a company that rents them to construction companies. I never regretted it, as I am still using it 25 years later. It has paid for itself many times over.

 

[TomC750]

Kind of hard for anyone to really respond without knowing exactly what you need the excavator to do ? In this day and age I would not expect anyone to even show up at a building site with a large piece of equipment for much less than maybe $5,000 a day.

The $1500 and $2800 prices just seem way too low to me.

What exactly are you wanting the guy to do ?

5K a day? You have to be kidding me. After I sold my business we hired a guy with a brand new Cat machine (large) to do a little over a days work for around $2800 This was recently. He was really good and has been in the business for many years. When in the business I charged $70/hr for me and my 8 ton excavator. Those were competitive rates at that time about 8 years ago. I know about inflation, but the 5K figure still stuns me.

 

[WhiffySpark]

5K a day? You have to be kidding me. After I sold my business we hired a guy with a brand new Cat machine (large) to do a little over a days work for around $2800 This was recently. He was really good and has been in the business for many years. When in the business I charged $70/hr for me and my 8 ton excavator. Those were competitive rates at that time about 8 years ago. I know about inflation, but the 5K figure still stuns me.

I charge at least 75 an hour. 400 minimum. But I price the job don't work hourly.

The 299d is over 6 figures now. Machines are not cheap

 

[Skunkape]

I did something almost exactly what you are wanting.... 30x50 post. However, I got the skid steer from work on weekends. I had to take it down to level, then brought in 12 dump truck loads of clay shale to build it up. I work for an environmental company, and can use the equipment, just have to replace whatever fuel I used. I actually put pen to paper on how much I saved doing it myself. I estimate I saved approximately 10K on dirtwork, backfill, trucking and trenching. Word of advice... bring it up higher than you think you need. With the base I brought in, it came up around 12". Hindsight, I should have doubled the amount of shale to bring it up higher. hell of a lot easier to slope it to get water away from it the higher you get it. Good luck!

Think about the use of retaining walls as well

 

[Skunkape]

5K a day? You have to be kidding me. After I sold my business we hired a guy with a brand new Cat machine (large) to do a little over a days work for around $2800 This was recently. He was really good and has been in the business for many years. When in the business I charged $70/hr for me and my 8 ton excavator. Those were competitive rates at that time about 8 years ago. I know about inflation, but the 5K figure still stuns me.

Man, that is dirt cheap! I charge out an excavator at $200/hr with operator, $500 mob/demob fee each way.

 

[RWorth]

I would buy a cheap used skidsteer and sell it when your done.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

PM Sent!

Tommy

 

[grkmec]

Question - so what is the going rate for excavation? For example, I am going to be building a 30x58 garage and need to hire excavator to dig footings. Area is fairly level. What can I expect for cost. Footings need to be 42" deep.

 

[GarageGuy89]

Man, that is dirt cheap! I charge out an excavator at $200/hr with operator, $500 mob/demob fee each way.

Sounds like your getting work from outside the private sector, or a more specialized area of dirt work? What type of work do you do for $200/hr?

That number would buckle some knees around here...

 

[Skunkape]

Sounds like your getting work from outside the private sector, or a more specialized area of dirt work? What type of work do you do for $200/hr?

That number would buckle some knees around here...

Yeah, we're a bit specialized. I run a hazmat team. We do a lot of environmental remediation, spill clean up, etc. We're definitely not the guys you call to build a pond. I know what the equipment, maintenance, fuel, and good operators cost.. I'm amazed at how cheap some of these guys work for. I suppose little to no overhead costs help considerably in that regard.

 

[brownbagg]

rent a bobcat, get a teenage boy for the day, Its done, couple hundred dollars and a pizza

 

[bczygan]

Like any other bid, how accurate the pricing is, depends on how clear and concise the scope of the work is.

A grading plan and some bore holes to see surface and subsurface conditions would help.

Someone should set the building finish floor elevation.

Quantities of cut and fill and removals from the site or uses of spoils on site should be determined.

Type of fill and method of installing should be specified as well as required compaction.

This should get bids that are relevant and closer to each other.

There are programs and devices that will calculate but so can a good field investigation. Grade stakes are also helpful.

Earthwork was always the biggest variable in any of my estimates. You must do some of the above to realistically tie it down.

You could also pay a retired excavation estimator to do a site survey and estimate. He could also tell you to best way to do the job re equipment, methods and materials.

One goal is to balance the site so no removals.

Bill

 

[Orionrising]

proper site prep, subslab gravel and compaction are what will make the difference between a shifting cracking foundation and a stable solid one. Never mind site elevation grade and drainage. Dont cheap out on what your hole building stands one

 

[TractorJeff]

$175 an hour