Fed up with Bosch 12volt tools

[never enuf time]

I am a Finish Carpenter, that uses and relies on my tools everyday.

I have a ps20 driver that has been to service 4 times since I bought it. It's now acting up again.

I have a 12v multi tool that is an awesome tool, but it's been serviced for a worn gear.

I have the 12v drill that needs to be sent in for a bad switch or something.

I like the power & ergonomics of each of these tools, the l-boxx are really nice too.

I think I am just about done with Bosch. None of these tools are over 3 years old.

Are Milwaukee's more reliable than this ?

 

[fitz11]

I haven't heard anything bad about the M12 line

 

[Fcvapor05]

Go Milwaukee Fuel and don't look back.

 

[Skin]

In every day use ingesting dust and crud and what not i'd be satisfied with a couple years. Cost of business. Most of the Bosch 12v line retails for $100 with 2 more batteries which works out to 7.3 cents a day over 2 years from a tool that's making you money each and every one of those days as well. I think your expectations of service life from cheap power tools might be a little skewed.

Brushless should cope with debris better but as far as service life, I don't think you're going to do much better for that price range.

 

[cheechi]

First of all I am a huge Bosch fan. I waited for them to offer the same variety as the others, they were behind Makita & Milwaukee basically from day 1. Hell, Bosch owns Dremel and yet you have to go to either M12 or Craftsman Nextec to get a 12v rotary that shares the batteries. Thatand half the Bosch 12v line looks like copies from a handful of others.

The M12 is the tools you should have bought to begin with. Glad I did. I still prefer my Bosch 18v to any others but the 12v they need to get their **** together.

 

[mattyrattypoo]

I think it is time you step up to Festool.

 

[smokey0810]

Not that I am a pro at all, but I enjoy my Rigid 18v drill and impact. Bought them both at Home Depot. Batteries are warrantied for life. Walk into HD with a dead battery, they will test it and give u a new one. Have served me well for the past year. Helped put up a friends metal skinned garage with the drill and it did a kick-*** job putting the self tapping screws through the steel skin.

 

[63spyder]

Use makita 18 volt lithium for 6 years now , I rotate three batteries and use them 6 days a week almost year round. They have been great, though I finally had a batterie die on me the other day. I use a drill ,an impact driver and a trim saw. I got to admit the cost of replacement batteries is a little hard to swallow.

 

[bcradio]

Bosch 12v are great for pro use. I think you need to be using 18v if you are going through them that fast.

 

[BikerDad]

If you're using them daily, on the job, then you're using them outside of their design envelope. The PS20 is the first subcompact 12v Bosch tool, and iirc, the first subcompact lithium ion tool period. It is NOT designed for professional use. Everything is lighter duty in it. It was designed at time when the 12v tool market was seen as the realm of the DIYer, women, and specialized installers. "Real tradesman" used 18v+ tools.

Time has moved on, batteries have gotten better, and more and more tradesfolk have seen the utility of the 12v tools, so current offerings from Bosch, Milwaukee, Makita, etc are more robust. Bosch is now rolling out the third generation of their 12v tools, and you're complaining about shortcomings in their first generation? You know, Hyundai cars absolutely **** too, why, they're barely a step above Yugos.

 

[txinstaller]

I have been using the dewalt 12 volt lithium impact driver and drill every day at my shop here lately and I've had them for four years i think. I love them but i would have gone with the 20 volt series if they had it when i bought them. I build police cars and other emergency vehicles just to give you an idea of what i use them for, the impact driver and crimpers are my most used tools.


Jeremy Latham
Custom Pursuit Outfitters
832-540-3001

 

[ADSR]

go milwaukee fuel and don't look back.

+100000000000

 

[franzdom]

I have been using the dewalt 12 volt lithium impact driver and drill every day at my shop here lately and I've had them for four years i think. I love them but i would have gone with the 20 volt series if they had it when i bought them. I build police cars and other emergency vehicles just to give you an idea of what i use them for, the impact driver and crimpers are my most used tools.


Jeremy Latham
Custom Pursuit Outfitters
832-540-3001

Welcome!!!

+100000000000

+10^100^100

 

[franzdom]

Who wants to click on the link?

 

[JonnyMac]

Oh come on, you sound like such a cynic...

 

[Monte]

I am a Finish Carpenter, that uses and relies on my tools everyday.

I have a ps20 driver that has been to service 4 times since I bought it. It's now acting up again.

I have a 12v multi tool that is an awesome tool, but it's been serviced for a worn gear.

I have the 12v drill that needs to be sent in for a bad switch or something.

I like the power & ergonomics of each of these tools, the l-boxx are really nice too.

I think I am just about done with Bosch. None of these tools are over 3 years old.

Are Milwaukee's more reliable than this ?

upgrade to 14.4 /18 volt/ corded tools.... Fein Multimaster or Super Cut, Festool T15 etc....

Hell, Bosch owns Dremel and yet you have to go to either M12 or Craftsman Nextec to get a 12v rotary that shares the batteries.

it´s here

 

[cheechi]

Yeah but not here. Hater.

 

[retfr8flyr]

As recommended, just go with the Milwaukee M12 Fuel lineup and you will never look back. If you need any more powerful tools, get the M18 Fuel tools. I have both, in various models and they are absolutely the greatest cordless tools on the market. I think they are better then the vaunted Festool, at half the price.

 

[never enuf time]

I think a tool should last longer than 3 years. My 14.4 DeWalts are still kicking after 15plus years.

I switched to 12v because of the size & weight they have.

Guess it's time to start getting a feel for the Milwaukee's

 

[retfr8flyr]

You wont believe the power in the M12 Fuel lineup. They are almost equal to most other 18 volt tools. Once you try some you will never go back.

 

[Southernbuild]

I've had and loved the 10.8 / 12 volt line since they came out, and have used them extensively. I'd recommend trashing the driver, and get Bosch's latest impact driver, miles more versatility, and stronger. It will drive a 3" deck screw out of sight, no problem.

A few weeks ago I added the mini reciprocating saw to the mix. It looks good, but haven't used it hard yet.

That being said, if I was starting from scratch, I would go with the Milwaukee line, due to great reviews, and more importantly, a much wider tool selection.....

 

[kgorman]

It appears that Bosch now has the PS21 out, I wonder if the OP had problems with the first gen 12v tool? Is the PS20 a first gen 1.5ma tool?

 

[mrvm]

Got my first PS40 back in 2007 which included a free Bosch jacket. The second PS40 got me a PS20. First gen PS20 was a weak driver and almost useless pos that I used for drilling pilot holes. Generally, Bosch makes great cordless/corded tools that are strong, ergonomic, long lasting power tools. My pair of PS40s are used a lot and I finally wore one out after several years. But now Bosch needs to step up their game especially since the regular M12 + Fuel M12 are out there blowing everyone's 12V away. Liking my Milwaukee heated hoodie so going partial red as the Bosch start to wear out. I've had NO Bosch battery failures even after several years of hard use which makes me want to hang with Bosch power tools.

 

[never enuf time]

Yes it the ps20, It's starting to fail again. I had some trigger problems, so I took it apart blew everthing out and it did work a lot better.

 

[Monte]

i like mine

 

[mango_420]

That *****. Never had any issues with mine. And they get left outside in the MN winters. Batteries and all..

 

[kctyphoon]

I have the 5 piece dewalt 12v max ( reciprocating saw, drill, impact driver, screwdriver, flashlight) and 2 piece m12 kit (non fuel). Full disclosure, I have not used either that much - but I personally like the dewalt stuff better. The batteries last a lot longer, they are MUCH more comfortable to hold, and it seems like the drill has slightly more power, and they are lighter.. I belive the milwaukee stuff is built more robust, and might survive a more harsh work environment, but for cleaner finish work like you do, I gotta say I like the dewalt 12v max better.. I de finally like the m18 fuel stuff I have over dewalt 20v line, but I honestly belive the 12v max stuff is a great set.
Unless you need specefic tools in the m12 line up dewalt does not have, I'd go dewalt over big red.. They make 2.0 batteries for the 12v max stuff too.. 4 pice kit on Amazon cost me $220 while it was on sale, and I got the bare tool screwdriver new from ebay for like $35. The lighting on the dewalt stuff is also much better on some tools.. And the dewalt 12v saw is PERFECT for small job like cutting drywall and pipes..

 

[kf4zht]

I have 2 drivers, 2 hex impact and the right angle driver. Had all for at least 3 years with no issues.

I know the m12 stuff is good now, and a lot more tools to choose from, but 5 years ago when I was testing them I had 3 out of 4 m12 batteries die within a year. Went all bosch and I have been happy.

Sent from my D6708 using Tapatalk

 

[ratchet]

I really like my Makita 18V Li-ion tools.

 

[domain]

i like mine

I have a german Bosch 12v LED light that came strait from germany. It also denotes "Professional" on the side whereas the US versions do not. Do you know of any release date on the EC Brushless IMPACT 12V???

 

[TOOL FANATIK]

I think it is time you step up to Festool.

Finish carpenter? Should we point him to Mafell?

 

[TOOL FANATIK]

You wont believe the power in the M12 Fuel lineup. They are almost equal to most other 18 volt tools. Once you try some you will never go back.

No, they are not almost equal to most other 18 volt tools. They are however, very very good and powerful tools.

 

[TOOL FANATIK]

i like mine

Monte,
What do you and your fellow countrymen feel about Mafell tools? Does it sit on the pedestal above festool? A timberframer in my area has been using Mafell since the 1980's, but I see they all have tools for the carpenter, which look to be better than festool...

 

[Monte]

I have a german Bosch 12v LED light that came strait from germany. It also denotes "Professional" on the side whereas the US versions do not. Do you know of any release date on the EC Brushless IMPACT 12V???

I think they put the word "Professional" on tools sold here in Europe because we have 2 lines of Bosch here - The "Professional" line in blue and the hobby line in green. So the customer knows what to choose !?

I think the new brushless impacts will be released in april 2015 over here. I dunno when they will be released in the US...

Monte,
What do you and your fellow countrymen feel about Mafell tools? Does it sit on the pedestal above festool? A timberframer in my area has been using Mafell since the 1980's, but I see they all have tools for the carpenter, which look to be better than festool...

Mafell is more directed towards carpenters/timber framers whereas Festool is dedicated to woodworking in general, drywalling/painters and automotive.
Mafell offers about a dozen circular saws for example as well as a band saw and chain saw for the big stuff, tools which Festool (no longer) offers. (formerly under their "Protool" brand). I don´t know if there is a big difference in quality between the brands...

 

[TOOL FANATIK]

I think they put the word "Professional" on tools sold here in Europe because we have 2 lines of Bosch here - The "Professional" line in blue and the hobby line in green. So the customer knows what to choose !?

I think the new brushless impacts will be released in april 2015 over here. I dunno when they will be released in the US...


Mafell is more directed towards carpenters/timber framers whereas Festool is dedicated to woodworking in general, drywalling/painters and automotive.
Mafell offers about a dozen circular saws for example as well as a band saw and chain saw for the big stuff, tools which Festool (no longer) offers. (formerly under their "Protool" brand). I don´t know if there is a big difference in quality between the brands...

Sorry for the vague question... They both make track saws, jigsaws, drills, sanders, etc. I Was wondering what brand a pro in Germany would go for first, if money was not an issue? I guess in my mind I think Mafell is a lot better. I have seen a mafell orbital sander in a shop here where I live and didn't know what it was. Same year I met a timberframer who showed me what he used for beams and cutting slabs (as his hobby), a humongous mafell saw. My connection to this brand makes me want it to be the best. Weird I know lol.

 

[Kin Creed]

Monte, I think I get why Festool is popular in Europe and elsewhere. High quality, portable tools. Makes sense.

Just wondering what brands are popular in Germany when it comes to jointing and planing wood? DeWalt and some other brands offer some portable planers.

Not sure if I have ever seen a portable jointer though, at least not in the US. Does such a thing exist in Europe?

Thanks!

 

[kctyphoon]

Here's a question - if you otherwise like the bosch line, and already have batteries, Chargers. why not try one of the 12v brushless tools they also have now.. If you are fed up with the brand and just "done" with them (I feel the same way about Troy Bilt) You could always just grab a few different brands and see how they feel in the hand.. Really - any brand will be a dice roll in terms of longevity and how they will hold up to your type of work..

 

[Monte]

Sorry for the vague question... They both make track saws, jigsaws, drills, sanders, etc. I Was wondering what brand a pro in Germany would go for first, if money was not an issue? I guess in my mind I think Mafell is a lot better. I have seen a mafell orbital sander in a shop here where I live and didn't know what it was. Same year I met a timberframer who showed me what he used for beams and cutting slabs (as his hobby), a humongous mafell saw. My connection to this brand makes me want it to be the best. Weird I know lol.

either...or... ....or both ....or Fein
I think it depends on which trade you are in... Festool has many fans around the world and Festool is a much larger company (700 employees) vs. Mafell (280 employees) so it seems they do something right. That doesn´t say anything, but i think Festool knows better how to market their products which is also easier because of their larger line up and larger dealer base. So i guess if money is no issue or even if money is an issues more people would choose Festool. But that doesn´t mean anything.... Some products are similar (routers - because Festool makes them) some are/were different in quality (Mafell used to sell standard rebadged Milwaukee cordless drills...) and many are simply not available from Mafell (multi tool) or only in a few versions (Orbital/sheet sanders: Festool 19 models/ Mafell 2 models...) ....The Mafell orbitals might be better though So it depends on which tool we talk about ... both have their highlights like the famous "Erika" saw from Mafell or the Festool Rotex sanders...But the question was: is Mafell the best brand ? Sometimes yes, sometimes no...

Monte, I think I get why Festool is popular in Europe and elsewhere. High quality, portable tools. Makes sense.

Just wondering what brands are popular in Germany when it comes to jointing and planing wood? DeWalt and some other brands offer some portable planers.

Not sure if I have ever seen a portable jointer though, at least not in the US. Does such a thing exist in Europe?

Thanks!

portable planers are also available from Festool and Mafell, these are the traditional wood working brands, as well as Makita i think. Dewalt is also a common brand here because they were formerly sold under the german brand "Elu" which was a woodworking tool manufacturer. Metabo also offers portable and stationary planers. I think generally for woodworking Festool is possibly the most common brand here. Portable jointers are very common over here, the Festool "Domino" is very famous, Mafell offers 2 systems, the "Duo-Dowel" for dowels and a standard biscuit jointer. The most famous jointer is probably the "Lamello" from switzerland: www.Lamello.com

 

[Kin Creed]

Thanks Monte! Metabo HC260 looks interesting. Similar to a Jet but perhaps a bit more solid. Good stuff!

 

[TOOL FANATIK]

Yea good stuff Monte thanks. Happy holidays, or as we used to say, have a Merry Christmas and happy New year!!!