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Find buried wiring without power

rsscoggins

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Sep 24, 2007
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I bought a lake house that was built in 2016. Before 2016, there was a mobile home on the lot. On the property down by the lake is an old pump house that predates the house - probably built into the 80s (possibly earlier than that) and it has a two fuse panel with the old round screw in fuses.

I replaced the fuses in hopes that it still has power - unfortunately no! Previous owner built the house but fell ill and no work was really done on the outside of the property or the pump house.

I would like to find where the incoming buried power cable originates - is there any way for me to backload the system and trace the wiring underground?

If so, what would I need to do that?
 
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BillK

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Aug 24, 2006
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Beautiful Southern Maryland
I dont know what distance you are working with but if the power is fed from the house there has to be some evidence as to where it comes from ? Is there a panel in the house feeding it ? How about where the mobile home was ? There must be some evidence of where it comes from.
 

turbodave

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Apr 30, 2012
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IL/WI
If it's not buried too deep, this method using a small engine ignition to generate a frequency on the line and an AM radio to detect may work. I used it to trace some of the power feed to my garage and it confirmed my suspicion that the wire was under the slab in front of the garage.

 

75gmck25

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Jul 21, 2014
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Location
Alexandria, VA
Sunbelt Rentals used to have the line locators. The still rent the transmitters, but do not seem to have the locators. Kind of weird to have one and not the other.
 

Chuckster in NJ

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Hunterdon County NJ
I use this one. Traced many a wire through control systems with it.
B45B6953-EF77-4995-A9DC-8AD9DA71B9FB.png
^^ Works great for wires in bundles or single wires BUT will not work for a underground wire that is buried more than 6” deep.
TIP! Call your local utility and ask for a "mark out" because you want to dig for a shed footing (BS story) and when the mark out guy comes around ask him to locate your buried line……. Don’t forget to buy lunch.
 

RPH

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Dec 17, 2006
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Michigan Thumb
I found that it can sense a couple feet away. It worked well in steel duct work and out side in the yard. Circuit must be dead but it will sniff it out.
 

PoorUB

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Fargo, ND
^^ Works great for wires in bundles or single wires BUT will not work for a underground wire that is buried more than 6” deep.
TIP! Call your local utility and ask for a "mark out" because you want to dig for a shed footing (BS story) and when the mark out guy comes around ask him to locate your buried line……. Don’t forget to buy lunch.
The typical "One Call" locators will not do privately owned wires, but sure you can call them out for a service locate, then slip the guy $20 and he probably will do the locate.
 

wyliesdiesels

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Aug 14, 2012
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Location
Modesto, CA
I bought a lake house that was built in 2016. Before 2016, there was a mobile home on the lot. On the property down by the lake is an old pump house that predates the house - probably built into the 80s (possibly earlier than that) and it has a two fuse panel with the old round screw in fuses.

I replaced the fuses in hopes that it still has power - unfortunately no! Previous owner built the house but fell ill and no work was really done on the outside of the property or the pump house.

I would like to find where the incoming buried power cable originates - is there any way for me to backload the system and trace the wiring underground?

If so, what would I need to do that?
what does backload mean? you mean energize from the house? no dont do that. definitely dont do that
 

Chumly

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Dec 10, 2021
Messages
124
Location
Alpine, CA
The typical "One Call" locators will not do privately owned wires, but sure you can call them out for a service locate, then slip the guy $20 and he probably will do the locate.
I located lines for digs in order to pick up tickets for the 3rd party locators when there were no line work tickets, I absolutely would spend 30 minutes on a private locate. You get zero flags with the power company's name on it in your yard, but I'd also say that up front and it always seemed like a mutual agreement that it was understood. Keep the $20, but if I smell something on a smoker, you might as well grease the palms.

The 3rd party locators (also did that for a bit) are better at it than I was through the utility itself. They just do it more and can read into the situation, and I think that's who you get for most location calls. Staying on that a bit, if you call in and specify "electrical location only", you won't get all other utilities out there marking up the yard which could really lower the cost over a private dig ticket...less people to pay. I mean, I got electric only tickets at least. We didn't get paid much as locators and the priority were for the utility dig tickets but on slow ticket days, I'll find ya in the stack within the week. We drove all over the place, we kinda noticed "shed being built, I'll probably get a ticket there" and know the lay of the land and what who did what. Worth a shot! If it's too expensive in your mind, turn it down and I'll think of something else.

I'm assuming there's no breaks in the line as well here as the tone ends when the wire you're generating on does as well and you just lose it. However, there's hope if it's just fresh line laid (at the time) and never finalized. Private/Consumer wiring can be all over the place (freaking pools!) regardless of code. This is the same problem you'll get with those Fox and Hound tone ringers like the Fluke or Triplett found at Home Despot...when the line is broke, you lose the tone and I'll just leave a circle there in either situation. That's the point I can't complete the search. You dig that up, maybe I'll drop back by...who knows!? But when the tone is lost, that could be the end of your line very likely. Ha, unless it's lost at a garden's edge where a tiller made it fun.

And I will back the others up in that the Fluke and Triplett Fox-and-Hound locators only see about 4"...6" is being generous IMO even behind drywall. For what it's worth, I believe the ancient probe boxes we used had two of those big lantern-style 6V batteries in the source box.

And I guess my last thought on this was the guarantee of location. Ours were 1ft either left or right of the line max and it's mostly connecting the dots if it gets funky for about 10ft. Private didn't have that due to all the noise so be handy with a shovel when the lines become crosses....or whatever they do in your location. "this is my best guess" is what my crosses meant.
 
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elijahisaac

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May 6, 2022
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An electronic stud finder is one of the most useful instruments for finding wires without power. The majority of stud finders are designed to locate wooden studs in walls, although some can also locate wires. A voltage detector is also required to determine whether a wire is active.
 

nadogail

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Jan 23, 2009
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Location
Coronado, CA
Using static created by Inductive Coupling from a small engine ignition is a Quick & Dirty demonstration of how Telephone Technicians have used Tone Trackers for many years.
 
OP
R

rsscoggins

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Sep 24, 2007
Messages
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Thanks for all of the replies - I just got back over here to check them out.

More details. The mobile home that was on the lot was removed/destroyed and the new house built in its place - I have no other history but would assume that the pump house was connected to the mobile home at some point; however, it was never connected to the house.

There is an old sewer grinder pump that was part of the property that has a meter on it that is still active - that grinder pump is now part of another adjacent plat that was sold off when things were divided up after the original owners death (mobile home owner).

I had hoped that by replacing the fuses in the pump house that I may have power from that grinder pump/meter. Unfortunately no. So now the question is - where was that power originating from? That is the question about "backloading" the pump house circuit and tracing the line. Probably not the right us of words and probably not a good practice in general. I really just want to locate the line and see where and how they routed it from the main house originally as there is a lot of tiered walls on the property (steep hill to get down to the lake.

I will probably end up running power from the main house fuse box to a sub panel in the pump house and get rid of that old fuse box with two screw in fuses (one for the pump and one one for the lights). I will need power to my boat dock anyway (once it is built) so having a sub-panel in the pump house will allow me to feed power to the boat dock.
 
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wyliesdiesels

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Modesto, CA
only thing you can do is a locate using meters. you can buy one on amazon but they are not cheap... $600+

Even if you do find it, it may not be useable

in the end may be cheaper to just dig a new ditch drop some conduit in and run a new line
 

slimpickins

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Mar 27, 2011
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Canada
Bend a couple locate flags over and start walking across the yard.

Absolute shenanigans. Waste of time and effort.
FWIW This doesn't work for everyone. It is not shenanigans. I wasn't a believer until someone gave me a couple of rods and told me to walk across their yard. The rods crossed when I walked over their UG power line. There was no indication where it was. So it DOES work for me at least. Since then I've had other friends try walking across my yard to see if it works for them and I'd say its about 30-50% of people it works for. For me, it works on wires (powered or not - even an extension cord lying on the ground). It also works for me walking over buried pipes, garden hoses, etc.
I was really puzzled one day when I walked into my patio area which has a pergola over it and the rods crossed as I walked in. I knew there was nothing underground. Then I realized there was a string of lights overhead that were stapled to the pergola - not plugged in.
The rods also cross walking over a crack in my asphalt driveway that goes straight across and continues in the dirt in dry years. There's no wires or pipes there that I know of - maybe an underground stream????
For those that it doesn't work for, many consider it to be BS. ... just saying it works for me.
SP
 

Alcap

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Mar 28, 2021
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Northeast Pa
Agree with above post , the bent wires don’t work for everyone. I worked at a electric utility and I wanted to find the wires going to my sons well pump . I asked one of the fellows who did a lot of their underground repairs if I could borrow a tool for finding underground wires knowing they had special equipment in the shop . He walked over to his line truck , opened a bin door and pulled out two copper wires bent with crimp connectors as swivel handles . He said “ here take these I’ll make another set “ I asked to theses work and he said that that’s their “ go to tool “ Yes they worked also located a cast iron drain pipe in the yard too .
 

Jim greengo

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Agree with above post , the bent wires don’t work for everyone. I worked at a electric utility and I wanted to find the wires going to my sons well pump . I asked one of the fellows who did a lot of their underground repairs if I could borrow a tool for finding underground wires knowing they had special equipment in the shop . He walked over to his line truck , opened a bin door and pulled out two copper wires bent with crimp connectors as swivel handles . He said “ here take these I’ll make another set “ I asked to theses work and he said that that’s their “ go to tool “ Yes they worked also located a cast iron drain pipe in the yard too .
From what I was told many years ago, it's something to do with disturbing the magnetic field of the earth when you dig a trench.
No matter how good you backfill/compact the trench it will still pick it up.
It doesnt always work,but it works for me the majority of the time anyway.
 

ycgoat

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S.E. Va
I have traced lines manually with a shovel. Start where you feel most confident the utility is and dig it up to get a direction. Repeat every 20’. Its not ideal but it is 100% accurate and free.
 

David0858

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Oct 30, 2016
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Tx
Interesting

Well he cant spin the wires with his palms so i dont see how this could be minipulated.

There was a million dollar bounty for years (I think the guy offering the bounty has since died) to someone that could prove this worked in a double blind test. The bounty was never collected collected and it has never been proven to work in an impartial test even though thousands of people claim they can do it.
 

mitusa

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SW Oklahoma
There was a million dollar bounty for years (I think the guy offering the bounty has since died) to someone that could prove this worked in a double blind test. The bounty was never collected collected and it has never been proven to work in an impartial test even though thousands of people claim they can do it.
Are you sure you're not talking about dousing for water wells??

I have located underground wires and lines using the wire trick. I use copper wire and have always found what I was looking for.
 

slimpickins

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Canada
Well, here's another weird oddity that may or may not be connected to the above "phenomenon". Anyone ever have a situation where you're listing to a radio or the tv (has to be an over the air broadcast and with a weaker signal) and the signal starts going to static. Then you get up to adjust the antenna, and the signal clears up? So you sit back down and the static returns? You get up again and the static disappears. etc. This does not happen for me, nearly as much nearly as much as it used to say 30 years ago. (I think this is because the tuners have improved significantly.) Anyway, this "phenomenon" is fairly repeatable when it happens, but it usually doesn't last. That is, it probably won't do the same thing tomorrow, or an hour from now. But sometimes its as sensitive as changing the position of my arm, or leaning slightly one way.
Nowadays, this only happens a couple or three times a year. But damn, it's as repeatable as heck while it's happening. I have no explanation for it but I believe it is a real phenomenon.
Now I'll really be labelled a heretic.
Are you sure you're not talking about dousing for water wells??

I have located underground wires and lines using the wire trick. I use copper wire and have always found what I was looking for.
I heard of a rumor about the challenge to find water and I don't know if that rumor is true or not. I don't claim to be able to find water. Never tried, and don't really care to try to find water or if I could.

Also, I just use coat hanger wire, like in the video, not copper. The wires I use don't have to be the same length, or bent in any precise way. Just approximate is fine.

If you think it doesn't work, just try it. If it doesn't work for you then you've proven it doesn't work for you but it doesn't mean it doesn't work.

"That's all I've got to say about that." - Forrest Gump
 

Dagny

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Northern Wi.
come on you have a pole with a meter and disconnect and an underground wire to the house where there is a pvc pipe coming out of the ground and a lb going into the house. pretty sure the wire dont head directly away from the house make three loops around the barn over to garage then the outhouse and on to the home.
 

David0858

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Messages
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Location
Tx
Are you sure you're not talking about dousing for water wells??

I have located underground wires and lines using the wire trick. I use copper wire and have always found what I was looking for.

I'm talking about ANY kind of dowsing. If you can do it in a impartial, double blind test you can make a mint. Go for it, you'll be the first success and be wealthy.
 

ycgoat

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S.E. Va
Dousing vs Devining. I have never been able to get either to work for me and I have tried copper, coat hangers, willow branches, and local branches
 

Jim greengo

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Behind my house
There was a million dollar bounty for years (I think the guy offering the bounty has since died) to someone that could prove this worked in a double blind test. The bounty was never collected collected and it has never been proven to work in an impartial test even though thousands of people claim they can do it.
Well come hang out with me for 10 mins,I'll bet you I can get as close if not closer than our local utility co locaters can get with their machines.
 

durk_2007

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May 31, 2019
Messages
58
Location
GB Kansas
I'll throw out another it works!!! I bought a house out in the country last year only thing mapped is the septic. My father-in-law grabbed some coat hangers found the water well line including where it curves 180° into house, old cistern, pipe coming from the old windmill, and where a building used to set wth only the knowledge of where the well cap is located.
 
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