Finding Underground Electric Help

[mayday0017]

So I have called 811 and everyone came out and did what they do marking everything on my property. Except the gas company who came out and started marking and realized I have a main that feeds all of my neighbors running through my back yard and they told me they would have to come back the next day and finish marking (never to return). But that is a different issue....

Here in TX the electric company will ONLY mark the lines to their main center. They will not mark the private owned lines between the electric meter and their distribution center.

The question is, is there a way I can locate it myself?

How far down should it be? (I will only be digging about 16")

If I locate the distribution center in a neighbors yard and draw a straight line from it to my meter is this 95% or more likely that it will be the correct path? I'm thinking it's more likely they would of dug one trench X far then split the trench to a Y to feed my property and my neighbors that way both lines could be dropped in one trench....

Any feedback would be great, and now with all the problems I had getting everything marked I am on a time crunch (which figures).

 

[Slednut]

Were the phone/cable service drops located? If the phone/cable companies pedestals/hand holes are close to the electrical transformer and they all come up at the same point on you building they probably share the same trench.

 

[mayday0017]

Now that you mention it, the cable & phone line is marked straight to where my electric box is mounted and then they spray painted a long side the house about 3ft to where the phone line and cable line come up to their boxes.... You might be on to something here!

 

[ZRX61]

Dowsing will find the lines I use pieces of wire coathanger.

 

[sanddan]

Dowsing will find the lines I use pieces of wire coathanger.

That's what I'd do also.

 

[Gary S]

Dowsing will find the lines I use pieces of wire coathanger.

Dowsing? I thought the right way was boozing.

 

[Big Bad Dad]

Dowsing will find the lines I use pieces of wire coathanger.

I use two pieces of brazing rod bent at 90 degrees. It works to find a ditch line, but cant be sure what is buried in it. You may be able to hire a private Contractor to use his locator. I use a local guy that sub contracts to the local cable TV company to ditch witch their lines into place. He does locating as a side job and has his own equipment.

 

[Bookworm]

I witched mine. Some call it dowsing, my grandfather called it witching. He did it all the time.
Apparently some can do it, some can't.

 

[diggerrick]

I've seen that done over a bucket of water - never knew it worked over a trench.

 

[Cedge]

Got any friends with a metal detector?

 

[rockwithjason]

if worse comes to worse you would be better off hiring a locator to find them. the locator will be cheaper than repairing a broken line.

 

[wasfuzz]

DO NOT GUESS, I worked as a locator - when I first retired, just for something to do. I have seen too many times when lines, wires, gas pipe, etc. was not run as you would think it was. Lots of times electricans have locating tools as well as propane suppliers, and some of the contract companies will even do it for a fee. Do not guess, one wrong stab with a shovel and at best you or your neighbor has not phone or cable at worst you are dead or you caused a gas leak and now the neighborhood is being evcuated.

 

[mayday0017]

If im diggin a max of say 15" do I even need to worry? I would think there is a code and that for electrical and gas people wouldn't even consider cutting corners on that when building a house, seems like a good way to have someone file a lawsuit and take everything you own if someone was killed...

Cable and phone are marked and I will be a little careful around them but honestly if they get cut it will only be to my house and will be easy to repair so not to worried about it....

Thoughts?

Dug half the yard today and learned A LOT!!! Such as don't listen to the rental place about which tool to get for the job, rent whatever is at least the next bigger unit.

Also be ready to find all sorts of things that don't make any sense.... We found a 4ft x 4ft concrete access point about 3" below the surface which of course is in the worst place possible..... Still haven't figured out how I can pipe around it like needed

Cut through PVC several times that also doesn't make sense, it's not drain pipe & it didn't have any water pressure, It is in the area that the water main runs I'm guessing they threw their trash into their trench or maybe it was a trash pile from when the property was built

 

[Stuart in MN]

If im diggin a max of say 15" do I even need to worry? I would think there is a code and that for electrical and gas people wouldn't even consider cutting corners on that when building a house, seems like a good way to have someone file a lawsuit and take everything you own if someone was killed...

Those things are supposed to be deeper than fifteen inches, but that doesn't mean they always are. I wouldn't take the chance.

 

[CNGsaves]

Not sure what your goal of this digging is anyway?? All that you say is you made some sort of effort to locate and plan on digging something 16" deep but you don't tell us what for? Then say it's only 15 ft of digging but you want to rent equipment for the dig?

Nothing that I can think of goes in at 16" - - - - sprinkler systems generally go in from 12" to 18" so maybe this is sprinkler system?

Buried natural gas lines need to be AT LEAST 18" deep per code in KS and OK, not sure about TX.

More information is needed. Did you make test digs with hand spade first, before you fired up the equipment?

Recent post says you're digging up pipes that you don't know what they go to, sounds like your decision to use power equipment, coupled with incomplete locates, is a recipe for disaster. Please be safe.

Now that we're worried about your safety, tell us how this turned out!

 

[Don 18]

I would find it by dosing. I actually do it all the time at work and its right on for locating electric, concrete footings, buried pipe etc..... BUT you need to be sure that you are right before you dig.

Its pretty funny, we have a guy that swears up and down that it doesn't work, yet he can't explain how I can find stuff and the contractor with the expensive underground transmitter setup can't.

 

[brokenknee]

When I lived in the cities, I hit the gas line, it was only about 6 inches down. Turned out when they ran the line they hit large root from an oak tree. Instead of going around it or cutting through it they just went over it.

I did not have to pay for the repair, thankfully.

 

[P Dubya]

I dig for a living....everyday. I dont dig if its not located. It's just not worth the risk. There are codes for nearly everything and I have dug up nearly everything much shallower that what is 'code'...

 

[sawracer]

See line 8 of US building code service cable depth minimum. So theoretically if they met the "minimum requirements", most utilities exceed, you would need to dig deeper than 18" to even consider hitting it. That being said it's only 120/240 and your shovel handle is likely wood. I wouldn't sweat it. Yes I work in the industry. Now If you are running a backhoe like a drunken sailor that's a different story altogether. As previously stated, code isn't necessarily gospel. So use common sense.

 

[P Dubya]

My last post wasn't much help..... If you can find somebody with locating equipment he should be able to locate and follow your lines using a 60 cycle technique which will allow him to locate w/o even hooking up anything to your house or panel.... I use this type quite often. Works well....

 

[sawracer]

He called dig alert, they let him down which is unusual but not unheard of. Im a lineman and with no USA ( underground service alert) or with a USA the only difference is hand digging with caution. If no power tools are involved he's home free. No dig alert = hand digging with common sense.

 

[rasit]

Here's what you should do:
1) Write down the confirmation number that was given to you when you called in your 811 ticket
2) Rent a large machine. (tracked machine prefered)
3) Paint yourself a centerline where you intend to dig. Since the gas company failed to complete their markout, you should use yellow paint.
4) Start excavating.
5) If you encounter any unknown obstructions remember, "When in doubt, rip it out".
6) When people start showing up at your house, make sure you have that confirmation number handy.
Have fun!!!

 

[mayday0017]

Well I ended up digging with the trencher, dug just over 1000ft, not sure where the guy on here got 15ft looks like he confused my depth of 15" with 15'. Anyways the 811 guys did a total **** job of marking things, I cut about 40 phone lines that they didn't mark running through my property.... Interesting thing is 1 bundle was maybe 1" down, looked like they just laid fresh grass on top of it. The other big bundle I cut was about 6" down, and the phone company makes things very difficult as they will only fix one line at a time instead of coming out and fixing it all at once. Finally put a note on the box to call me before doing any work, I am now refusing them access to my property they can run it through the breezeway behind my property. I allowed 3 lines to be ran and all 3 they just ran them shortest distance so they are all over the yard now and I don't want all of the others to be done the same. I spoke with a supervisor and explained I do not want this stuff all over my property, I offered one bundle of whatever they needed to pass through any point but no more of this all over the place ****. Funny thing is the phone company hires out all the real work they just leave the lines laying on top of the ground and someone will come back with in a week to put it in the ground.

Really disappointed in how these companies work.... Side note 1000ft dug and about 900ft of pipe installed just a little more to go and my sprinkler system is complete, I hope the rainy weather doesn't screw up my trenches to bad before I get back at things.

 

[zuk123]

Dowsing works for me, I use the metal parts of the locator flags.

I was completely sure it wouldn't work, until a guy at the Olympic park in Atlanta showed me. They won't even drive a tent stake without looking because ALL the underground was just 'thrown in the ground' as quickly and cheaply as possible. Once you have an indication of where to look, you can usually see the ghost of the trench.

To the OP, out of curiosity, what type of property/ development/ etc is your house located in? It seems strange to have a yard crisscrossed with lines. Are you in a strange place relative to the rest of the development? The concrete access hatch under the grass sounds especially weird. I've never heard of anything like that (except for a forgotten septic system.) Does your deed survey show any right of ways?

It all sounds like a nightmare to me...

zuk

 

[mayday0017]

To the OP, out of curiosity, what type of property/ development/ etc is your house located in? It seems strange to have a yard crisscrossed with lines. Are you in a strange place relative to the rest of the development? The concrete access hatch under the grass sounds especially weird. I've never heard of anything like that (except for a forgotten septic system.) Does your deed survey show any right of ways?
zuk

I am located in West Houston in a typical cookie cutter neighborhood. It is a culdasack lot, part of how they did things made sense but other parts were just them being lazy (mostly lazy). I am sure most people don't complain when they just string a line out across their yard because they don't realize they have rights or don't even mow their own grass let alone dig a hole in the ground so what do they care? The most disturbing thing is not 1 person with ATT could tell me what code was for how deep the wire needs to be in the ground, not even the guy they sent out to burry it.....