fire proof door opening.

[HoosierMark]

I have a 9 foot opening in my new basement garage area that leads to the rest of the basement. The building inspector says I need to close it off (with or without a typical door) or make the area it leads to fireproof also. Fireproof meaning drywall on the ceiling. Any ideas how to create a large door to meet code but be able to open it when desired?

 

[lisiecki1]

Sliding tracks like you would use on a barn?

Or two 4.5' doors that have heavy duty hinges?

 

[HoosierMark]

Building inspector was hesitant about sliding tracks, that was my first plan. He was concerned about the sides not sealing tight enough. May need to ask him if I created a pocket door type set up, would that make him comfortable. He says whatever an architect says meets code he can live with and seems to want to work with me to find a simple solution.

 

[jkwilson]

Steel is the answer.

 

[CNGsaves]

Typical commercial setup is Steel roll-up door.

 

[Nowater]

How about French doors. Some codes (please ask first) only require a 20 minute door, like a solid wood core door, or a steel clad door. Find out if there is a testing standard the door must meet. It may be something like an ASTM number. Select your door from those.

 

[buddyboy]

Typical commercial setup is Steel roll-up door.

+1

like this

http://www.overheaddoor.com/commercial-doors/Pages/fire-rated-doors-631.aspx

not endorsing that link, just one example of what should work for you.

 

[LB-1911]

I have a 9 foot opening in my new basement garage area that leads to the rest of the basement. The building inspector says I need to close it off (with or without a typical door) or make the area it leads to fireproof also. Fireproof meaning drywall on the ceiling. Any ideas how to create a large door to meet code but be able to open it when desired?

One possible source -

http://www.timelyframes.com/

8 foot double door
http://seek.autodesk.com/product/latest/agg/timelyindustries/Timely-Industries/TimelyIndustries005

Good Luck

 

[readhead]

A fire rated roll up door would be possible but very expensive. any rated door will have to be self closing and have smoke seals.
Does the opening have to be 9'? A pair of swinging doors will work but 54" leafs will be pretty spendy.
A sliding door could work if you have enough headroom to slope the track so it is self closing.

 

[readhead]

Remember that just because it is steel does not mean that it is rated.

 

[Voi]

9' wide? How tall?

I was going to do something similar. Barn type sliders or pocket doors were out of the question according the local code.

Widest french type door I could find was 84" and it was available with a fire rated astragal. I started to look into custom options and everything was so expensive.

I got frustrated and just went with a 42" door and framed the rest as a fire rated wall. I'm still not sure I did the right thing.

 

[rockwithjason]

the cost of a fire rated door of any great size may well be more than dry walling the ceiling.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Some codes (please ask first) only require a 20 minute door, like a solid wood core door, or a steel clad door.

True, for most residential applications.

 

[Architorture]

Close the opening and then open it later

 

[HoosierMark]

Architorture, you are reading my mind. The actual garage area is designed to be 20 x40 but it may become 12 x 12 or so to just store my lawn mower in, until right after I get the certificate of occupancy and then I might need more room LOL. I understand why the rules are there but I grew up with a basement garage and know many people who have them. T,hey work fine and are not fire proof in my old house it was just one big unfinished basement with a garage door. Now you are even required to insulate the basement to below the frost line (state law). It is my basement and my money to heat it or to lose heat from. Why does the government need to tell me how to handle my basement. I just want a place to park a couple of sports cars and do minor stuff. A real barn is planned for the next year where the real work and mess will occur.

 

[captain14]

One thought is your insurance will not pay if the U of O is issued with the fire doors there and you remove them later. Petty sure they will deny coverage if needed.

 

[tehach]

Fire assemblies protect lives. Intentionally remove them at great peril. As stated above, insurance won't cover a loss if they're removed. However if a fire starts in the basement, insurance will be the last thing to be worried about.

 

[Architorture]

Okay code thumpers... First off most model codes don't require an "assembly" they require 1/2 or 5/8 gypsum board...one element is not an assembly...and they don't require "rated doors" but they do accept rated doors...although typically a given thickness of solid wood or hollow metal door is prescribed.

 

[RivennHewn]

What fire rating are you looking for?

Are you remodeling or new construction?

What's called out in your plans by the architect?

As far as doors go, if they aren't labeled they aren't rated.

 

[HoosierMark]

The area and doors need to be fire resistant not fire proof. My mistake. It is new construction. There is not an architect, just a designer in the area who draws a lot of house plans. I am my own general contractor. At this point the house is in the dry and the elec/hvac/plumbers are ready to start next week. I do think it is 5/8 inch drywall and typical outside metal solid door between garage and living area to meet code. My issue is I do not like covering my ceiling so quickly as I want freedom to add lights, outlets, air hose etc. I also like the large opening to the room next door as it has a large window and sliding patio door.

I am going to explore more having barn type sliding doors that are either covered with drywall or something like duct work metal and overlap the open area by say 3 inches. It seems to me that this would be sufficient to meet the "fire resistant" rules.

I have a couple of months to solve this puzzle to keep in compliance and happy. I am confident that there is a way to meet the code and keep me relatively happy. I just need to work more with the inspector and something will work out.

 

[bczygan]

the cost of a fire rated door of any great size may well be more than dry walling the ceiling.

this^^^^

 

[wssix99]

You should check the letter of your local code and all the answers will be there. In Chicago, we have to have 1 hour separation between the garage and living space, can have the equivalent of a simple wood door, but... there can only be one door and it can't be larger than 21 square feet. (I assume your local code will spec in a similar way, but may have different parameters.)

Now you are even required to insulate the basement to below the frost line (state law). It is my basement and my money to heat it or to lose heat from. Why does the government need to tell me how to handle my basement.

All of this stuff saves other people money in the long run - this is why their government imposes these restrictions on you. Better fire resistance means less public investment in fire departments and better energy efficiency means lower electric bills. Since the electric industry is regulated, all customers get the screws put to them when the company's costs go up. If the electric company needs to build a new power plant, an extra charge is added to everyone's electric bill - often before the plant is built.

If you operated your own power plant and own fire department on your land, I'm sure your municipality would be happy to give you a variance on these regulations. (There are some entities that actually take advantage of this, but they tend to be very large commercial enterprises.)

 

[rockwithjason]

\ It is my basement and my money to heat it or to lose heat from. Why does the government need to tell me how to handle my basement.

it's not so much about you, it's about controlling the product that builders and developers put out. public safety is a big deal in stuff like this. gas fumes can easily ignite and burn your place to the ground with most of the real damage already done before the fire department gets there. you as a home owner can do what you like after you get thru the hoops.