First Barn Build Question

[TreeNinja]

Hey everyone - I finally got the go ahead from the boss to put up my dream pole barn. I've always been a big DIY'er but feel that this might be above my level of ability and have accepted that having it professionally built is probably the smart play. I made some calls today and spoke with one contractor for quite some time - he was polite and extremely helpful but quoted $35-40k for the build. I'm looking at a 40'x56'x12' with a 10' lean-to porch, metal siding and roof, 12" overhang, five windows, three uninsulated overhead doors and one 36" door. I haven't heard back from the other builders yet but curious if that price is in the ballpark (not including concrete, just the building).

After talking to him I am reconsidering the DIY approach (I have friends with the experience and equipment, just didn't want to drag this out scheduling my build around their limited free time). I roughed it out on the Menards website and got about $15k for materials.

Any input or references are appreciated - I'm in St Clair County, Michigan.

Thanks

 

[tjdux]

Double check the menards estimate... i used their wish list function (android app) and even though i put in quantity of items on the list it only added price for 1 item at the "total" so i get to the store and my price more than doubles... This may not pertain to you at all pending on how you came up with your own total though.

Sorry no help with contractor pricing either.

Signiture; Check out my garage progress http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352703

 

[matt_i]

If you are willing to put in the research, there's nothing thats magical about building a post frame or even a stick frame building. Its a really good idea to make drawings of all kinds of things so you make sure its well understood how things are going to go together.

Its a good idea to realize you will likely have to rent or buy some tools that you don't have already, in order to get a good quality job. I would recommend a rotating laser level as one of the first things.

The job that I would hire out is finishing of a concrete slab. You can do all the prep and setup work, but an experienced crew to finish it is worth the expense in my opinion. But that's just a 1 day job.

 

[larry_g]

On my building below, 36x48, the materials package ~$15k and the erection price was near $ 7k. I elected to erect myself with the help of my son who is in construction. Looking back I should have spent the $7k as the build extended out many months, and I did have to pay for some additional laborers and equipment rental. The final cost was ~$30k with the concrete and other things. So with 8 years inflation your in the ballpark.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[kbs2244]

That is a big building.
That means more labor and bigger machines.
And that means money.

 

[rburke65]

Do not forget site preperation....it all starts with a good base/foundation. Be sure to have high enough elevation! Nothing like having a high and dry garage/shop floor. You don't want your money and efforts under water every time it rains. Also a good base for your floor. Not most, but a lot of my money went into the foundation, never to be seen. Good luck!

 

[a52-830]

as rburke65 mentioned: site prep.

does the quote include:

pulling the permit
preparing the site (flattening, bringing in or removing material, as an example)
running utilities out to the site
installing utilities (electricians are expensive)
getting all the inspections done


do you specify where the metal sheets for the walls and the roof come from?

the quote is for about 15$ per square foot. depending on what you are having done, and the level of finish you are looking for (or is required: need conduit everywhere for the power?), it doesn't seem outrageous.

before you compare the costs with other people and their projects, you need to consider what you are having them do, and what you are ending up with. . . . .

 

[why worry]

Price sounds about right. As far as doing it yourself goes it can be done as I built our barn (140' X 108' X 14' eves) monitor style. Strained a few friendships as I was asking for help quite often and then people quit showing up. The project started in 1998 with the basic structure completed in 2001 built in phases. Still working on interior finishes to this day as a working barn is never quite complete and maintenance is on going with animals. I would have done a few things differently if I knew I was going to be here this long.
Dave

 

[lkempf]

That price is about right, maybe a little high. I had a 40'X48'X12' pole barn built last fall and it was $31,000 with a 4" concrete floor. It has 12" overhang, 4 windows, 3 10'X10' overhead doors and one man door. I thought about building it myself, but I was glad I didn't because they had it done in 1 week. Putting in the trusses would have been beyond my capabilities. I did the electric and insulation myself to save a little money. Just my .02

 

[Fordman7795]

My 30x56x14 was just finished a couple months ago
Vinyl siding and shingle roof
2 man doors, three windows
One 10x12 insulated overhead door
With concrete
$30,850

 

[GTFiero]

Just did.

30'D x 60'W x 12'H pole building, with 6"x6" (.70) post on 8'centers

2' spacing on the trusses, scissor trusses 14'4" interior height for 24' shop area, standard trusses for 36' storage area

5/8" plywood roof sheathing w/ 30yr. shingles, 6' ice/rain, synthetic underlayment

18'x10' non-insulated door, 10'x10' insulated door

2' eaves, 36" access door, rigid ridge venting, 30" (.60) of kick boards

4" cement floor/apron, 48'x24' apron area, floor drain in storage area: prepped for electric, water, gas: tyvek wrapped walls

Post are in sand down to 54" with 2'w x 2'L x 1' thick pads at bottom. All structure stressed for northern Michigan winters.

Less site prep total was $50,000

It all turned out well. Really don't see need to have done anything different. Will insulate, electrify, gas soon the shop area.

 

[tricountytrail]

Question on the final elevation? I would probably like to install 2" insulation and pex in the concrete, what should I be looking at for wall elevation above grade?
Should I erect pole barn then dig out extra stone. I probably wont do concrete right away.
I am unsure of my wall and concrete elevation in relation to final grade. Any explainations would be appreciated.

 

[Farmall450]

Sounds a touch steep, we had Morton put up a 42x80 for that.

 

[tricountytrail]

Question on the final elevation? I would probably like to install 2" insulation and pex in the concrete, what should I be looking at for wall elevation above grade?
Should I erect pole barn then dig out extra stone. I probably wont do concrete right away.
I am unsure of my wall and concrete elevation in relation to final grade. Any explainations would be appreciated.

Any thoughts?

 

[astroracer]

Question on the final elevation? I would probably like to install 2" insulation and pex in the concrete, what should I be looking at for wall elevation above grade?
Should I erect pole barn then dig out extra stone. I probably wont do concrete right away.
I am unsure of my wall and concrete elevation in relation to final grade. Any explainations would be appreciated.

From grade, specify top of concrete at 6" above grade. This will keep most ground water/runoff out of the shop.
How much topsoil you have to peel out will determine the amount of fill required to set the concrete at the 6" dimension.
Calculate building height from there. Basically add that 6" from grade to your inside truss height.
Mark

 

[lakeroadster]

.. quoted $35-40k for the build. I'm looking at a 40'x56'x12' with a 10' lean-to porch, metal siding and roof, 12" overhang, five windows, three uninsulated overhead doors and one 36" door. Thanks

Sounds like a fair price to me.

Some ref. data.. Picking a Pole Building Contractor

 

[tricountytrail]

From grade, specify top of concrete at 6" above grade. This will keep most ground water/runoff out of the shop.
How much topsoil you have to peel out will determine the amount of fill required to set the concrete at the 6" dimension.
Calculate building height from there. Basically add that 6" from grade to your inside truss height.
Mark

So if I understand you correctly scrape topsoil then level stone keeping is slightly above grade. Then have the bottom of the skirt board 6" above the stone. So 2" xps and a 4" concrete with 2 x 8 pressure treated skirt board I'm level with my concrete at the bottom of the skirt board. That doesn't sound correct unless I am not understanding it correctly.

 

[astroracer]

Put the bottom of the skirt board at grade. Back fill and compact until you get 2" above grade. Pour your 4" floor on top of that, using the skirt boards as your form. The height you set (or trim) the posts to should put the trusses 12' above the finished floor.

 

[a52-830]

From grade, specify top of concrete at 6" above grade. This will keep most ground water/runoff out of the shop.
How much topsoil you have to peel out will determine the amount of fill required to set the concrete at the 6" dimension.
Calculate building height from there. Basically add that 6" from grade to your inside truss height.
Mark

if you are waiting for the floor, put several 3" PVC sleeves in the perimeter wall.
when it is time for the stone, dig them out, and fill around them with the stone also. this way, you can put drains in the floor, and it will drain out of the foundation.

when we built the barns, this is what we did. the town had no issue, since the buildings were for animals.

these are also useful if you decide to put in utilities later.

 

[tricountytrail]

Put the bottom of the skirt board at grade. Back fill and compact until you get 2" above grade. Pour your 4" floor on top of that, using the skirt boards as your form. The height you set (or trim) the posts to should put the trusses 12' above the finished floor.

What about the 2" xps foam I need under the concrete. Should the top of the concrete be level or underneath the the top of the skirt board?

Any diagrams out there to clear this up?

 

[kj_mustang]

My concrete was level to the top of the skirt board after gravel, 2" XPS, and 4" concrete. Don't forget to put 2" XPS on the slab edge too, I nailed it to the skirt board.

 

[rburke65]

The concrete ....usually....butts up against the skirt board. If it were under the board it would be exposed to the weather...no? On the perimeter of the floor, foam is usually used. Some folks bevel the edge of the foam so the concrete covers it. Use a vaporbarier under the concrete, then foam. You can put down the pex under or on top of wire mesh.

 

[lakeroadster]

The concrete ....usually....butts up against the skirt board. If it were under the board it would be exposed to the weather...no? ....

And if the concrete is under the splash board, and the slab heaves, the slab tries to lift up the entire building.

One must be cautious on a pole building to isolate the building from the slab.